Lindsay Clancy trial's final witness: she said a voice told her "you have to kill your kids and then you have to kill yourself"

Testimony in Lindsay Clancy's Massachusetts murder trial neared its end Tuesday afternoon as prosecutors called final rebuttal witness Dr. Gregory Saathoff, a professor of emergency medicine and forensic psychiatrist who has worked with the FBI.

Saathoff's testimony focused on the voice Clancy reported hearing in her head on Jan. 24, 2023, the night she killed her three children. Saathoff testified that there were inconsistencies in Clancy's recollection of that night and the voices in her head.

When court ended for the day, Saathoff was still on the stand. Once his testimony is finished on Wednesday, both sides will discuss the next steps in the trial. Closing arguments are expected to happen Thursday.

"Fireworks," defense attorney Kevin Reddington said when asked what to expect during his closing. "I don't know what I'm going to say until I say it. I don't write them out, I don't type them out. I don't run them by anybody. I just say what comes to my mind."

Dr. Kirk Heilbrun, a forensic psychologist for the prosecution, was first on the stand Tuesday, a day after his testimony was cut short when he started talking about Clancy's Catholic religion. Reddington immediately called for a mistrial. Plymouth Superior Court Judge William Sullivan denied it, but he reprimanded the prosecution for the testimony.

Reddington cross-examined Heilbrun Tuesday after the psychologist said it's his opinion that Clancy was criminally responsible for murdering her three children.

Dr. Gregory Saathoff

Dr. Saathoff interviewed Clancy in May and June of this year and talked to her about the voice she heard that she said told her to kill the children.

"She said it was a man's voice, it was very clear, it was external," Saathoff said. "In other words, it came from outside her head."

He said that according to Clancy, the voice repeated, "This is your last chance, you have to kill your kids and then you have to kill yourself."

Clancy said the voice stopped when she finished strangling the children, Saathoff testified.

According to Saathoff, Lindsay Clancy said the voice started on the evening of the murders, just after Patrick Clancy left the house. He said it would be unusual for someone in psychosis to hear a voice only one time and act on it. He noted that Clancy told another doctor that the voice had started much earlier.

Saathoff also said he asked her about sending Patrick Clancy out to pick up takeout food. He said records show she did "a lot of searching" before talking to him about how far the restaurant was from the home. 

Saathoff said it was notable that Lindsay Clancy added another errand for Patrick - picking up medication for Cora at CVS.

"It lengthened the trip," he said. "It added one extra obligation for Patrick and that would make for a longer time that he was away."

Heilbrun cross-examination

Reddington started his testimony by getting Heilbrun to agree that it would have been better to interview Clancy sooner rather than three years after the murders. He read through the psychologist's lengthy resume but noted that he had never written about postpartum psychosis.

Reddington asked if he would agree that Clancy was incredible at taking care of her kids.

"I would describe her as a very good mother," Heilbrun said. 

Reddington asked if Clancy was a "happy woman" before being prescribed medication from her psychiatrist Jennifer Tufts.

"In September, she was anxious about returning to work," Heilburn said. "She had not yet started taking the medications that Dr. Tufts had prescribed, though."

Reddington and Heilburn went back-and-forth about why Clancy was not admitted to a program at a Rhode Island hospital for postpartum mothers. Reddington said it was because the hospital said she was overmedicated, while Heilburn said it wasn't clear that her struggles were related to being postpartum.

"Did you really read those records?" Reddington asked.

"Yes I did," Heilburn said.

Reddington put his hands on Clancy's shoulders as he talked about her struggle to find the right support.

"Are you trying to tell the jury that she was avoiding help?" Reddington asked.

He also asked Heilburn about Patrick Clancy's testimony that Lindsay said she tried to kill herself when he found her on the ground.

"If I suggest to you, sir, that if you listen to the 911 tape as it relates to Clancy interacting with her, that she could only make grunting noises, would you be surprised at that?"

"I would be surprised, yes," Heilburn said.

During re-direct questioning, prosecutor Jennifer Sprague asked if it was accurate that Clancy never told any doctors that she had thoughts of harming her children. 

"That is my recollection, that she did not share that information with any medical providers," Heilburn said.

Heilbrun also told Sprague that someone experiencing psychosis with command hallucinations can still know the difference between right and wrong.

Dr. Kirk Heilbrun testimony

Continuing his testimony on Tuesday, Heilbrun said Clancy told him there was no decision-making involved in the murders and that she was just responding to a voice. But he said, "there's many ongoing decisions that have to be made to accomplish a killing like this in 18 to 20 minutes," such as the location and what to say to the children.

He said in his clinical opinion, Clancy is criminally responsible for killing her children.

"She retained an awareness of the illegality of killing others, including killing her children," Heilbrun said. "Her moral awareness of the wrongfulness of the killing was influenced by her strong desire to die and if she were dead, not to leave her children behind."

Reddington says judge made "good effort" with jury instruction

Speaking to reporters outside court Tuesday morning, Reddington says he believes Judge Sullivan made a "good effort" in telling the jury to disregard the religious testimony. Sullivan told jurors that Heilbrun's remarks about Clancy's Catholic faith were "immaterial, irrelevant and to be disregarded" before sending them home for the day.

"The judge made his ruling and instructed the jury," Reddington said. "I think it's pretty apparent these jurors are dedicated, they'll listen to his instruction and i have no doubt that we'll finish the case out today."

Reddington also lashed out at a commentator asking him a question outside court, calling him a "biased weasel."

Lindsay Clancy trial

Clancy, 36, has pleaded not guilty to charges of first-degree murder in the deaths of her three children - 5-year-old Cora, 3-year-old Dawson and 8-month-old Callan - in their Duxbury, Massachusetts home on Jan. 24, 2023. She has admitted to the killings, but her attorney said she should not be held criminally responsible because she was overmedicated and suffering from postpartum psychosis.

Prosecutors said Clancy planned the murders. If she's convicted of first-degree murder she faces life in prison without parole. If the jury determines Clancy was not criminally responsible, she will be sent to a state psychiatric hospital in Massachusetts.

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