The Public Eye Chat With ... Allison Davis O'Keefe
Matthew Felling: What do you do on Capitol Hill for CBS News?
Allison Davis O'Keefe: You could call me an off-air reporter. I run back and forth to various events on Capitol Hill, chasing people down and talking to people in the hallways and conducting interviews at the drop of a hat.
There's always set things I know about, things that are scheduled -- like press conferences or hearings. Then there are things that just come up. Like yesterday, I spoke with Senator Lamar Alexander (R-TN) for a piece that's airing tonight. I get a call, saying 'Can you do this? Here are the topics and some questions…' and I work it into my schedule.
Matthew Felling: What has the climate been in the Larry Craig story?
Allison Davis O'Keefe: It's been tense. Really tense. It's been one of those stories that everyone is talking about, but you don't want people to hear you talking about it in the hallways – since the details are very unseemly. There's a palpable tension among Republicans that they desperately want this story to go away.
Matthew Felling: It's an inside baseball journalism question, but how did [Capitol Hill newspaper] Roll Call this story and others not?
Allison Davis O'Keefe: Roll Call got a tip. That's an interesting sidebar story. When this broke, I thought to myself 'How is this possible that a Senator was arrested, pled guilty in June and we didn't know about it? What are we doing wrong?' But at the same time, I think one of the reasons he thought he'd get away with it was that it happened in a state he doesn't represent, it wasn't in Washington, it sort of flew under the radar. And as a journalist that covers Capitol Hill, it wouldn't occur to me to go through the Minneapolis airport police logs on the off chance that they'd arrested a Senator.
And Roll Call didn't do that. They got the anonymous tip and they took it from there.
Matthew Felling: When the Roll Call story came out, it opened up the story – including some unsubstantiated claims that have been floating around on the web. How did you balance documented police charges with faceless, anonymous claims that have been in the ether for months?
Allison Davis O'Keefe: It's very tricky. What he pled guilty to, he didn't plead guilty to homosexual activity. So those claims are still just rumors. And as a conservative Republican, those claims are very hard to manage. And it's been one of charges that's been attached to his name since he was in college. It's tricky.
Matthew Felling: Different scandals seem to measure differently on the sex/media richter scale – the Vitter story, the Foley story. Have you noted different levels between Vitter and Craig?
Allison Davis O'Keefe: Yes, absolutely. I know that Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell (R-KY) was accused of a double standard in this situation. Why was it less of a scandal that Vitter was involved in a heterosexual affair – he was a Republican and a champion of family values who cheated on his spouse. But in the Craig instance, there's no evidence that he cheated on his spouse, regardless.
What I think is so difficult about the Craig situation is the innuendos that go along with it. All we're talking about it is a tap of the foot, a hand under the divider, these things are all way below the radar. And I think they touch on something that is not mainstream. And I've heard a number of gay activists making the point 'Look, not all gay activity is done in secret in public restrooms. This is a terrible stereotype to be tossing out there.'
It's bringing to light some things that would never be associated – the idea of 'cruising for sex' and Congress – and putting them in the same paragraph. That's very difficult for people to discuss openly.
Matthew Felling: Any sense of why Vitter wasn't pushed out of office, but Craig was 'thrown under the bus,' as it's been characterized?
Allison Davis O'Keefe: Yes. There's a distinct difference. The Republicans think that what happened with Vitter was a personal situation between him and his wife, and that what happened with Craig was illegal activity. And I think the biggest mistake that Senator Craig made, period – period, above all else – was pleading guilty.
A number of the members of Congress I spoke with yesterday indicated that with Craig, we're not talking about someone that's uneducated about the law. He knows his rights, he knows the law, he knew exactly what he was doing and he signed his name and knowingly pled guilty.
Regardless of anything that happened in the bathroom, regardless of any rumors that had been circulating for years and years, that single-handedly was his biggest mistake.
With the Vitter situation, it was an extramarital affair – something he didn't want to go into – and he hadn't pled guilty to a crime, or paid a fine or anything. And Craig literally handed over money to pay the fine for his offense. That's as clear an admission of guilt as you can get, signing your full name on a piece of paper, pleading guilty and paying money.
Matthew Felling: "Morale" is a nebulous term, I know. But what's morale like on Capitol Hill in a week like this? We focus on the faces in front of the camera, but does it have an effect on staffers and aids?
Allison Davis O'Keefe: No question. None at all. And it has the biggest effect on Senator Craig's staffers. I don't know what it feels like, since I'm not a staffer, but they work for members of Congress because they believe in them. It's not a high-paying job. They're from their state, they believe in what the Senator stands for. They believe in the legislation he's working on. They consider it an honor.
So it's toughest on Craig's staffers, as the Foley scandal was most difficult on his employees. Foley's Chief of Staff, in the middle of that story, literally came out into the hallway and was this close to breaking down. It was so hard to handle all of the unexpected news.
But on the larger political landscape, they're back to work. It's Fall. It's a back to school type of feeling on Capitol Hill. And so much of the climate is tough, because so many people are talking about the Craig story behind closed doors. To be sure, they discuss it in public, but they discuss it a lot behind closed doors.
Matthew Felling: As a journalist, you're taught to ask probing and tough questions when it comes to legislation or stances. But is it more difficult to do that with questions of a sexual nature? Is there a hesitancy to go as deeply as you do with the political questions?
Allison Davis O'Keefe: No. You don't want to leave it be. As a journalist, it's an exercise in asking questions a certain way. You still need to ask them, but you need to use a certain amount of decorum. But they're not off-limits. Specifically in this situation, Larry Craig went into a bathroom that is well known amongst a certain group for specific things, and it was part of a sting. And he pled guilty. And now that's public record. So there's no way that those questions are off-limits. No way.
Matthew Felling: If this Craig story happens with a Congressman who's been a supporter of gay rights, is it reported differently? How much does the hypocrisy angle ratchet up the coverage?
Allison Davis O'Keefe: That's an interesting question. I don't know. I haven't covered a situation where something like this happened to someone who was openly gay or pro-gay rights, so I don't know the difference. I think politically, the hypocrisy is huge. And I think that – while it might not have been discussed openly when this whole thing happened – I think the hypocrisy made up much of the political pressure for him to resign.
And it's so hard. He's been in public life for a long time. It's hard to let this go. ANdyou can see that he's grasping onto every last string he can. Fellow politicians might understand that, but the understory is the deeper challenge that Republicans face with their positions on family values and gay marriage. Larry Craig was the perfect example of someone who was for family values and against gay marriage. So when you're that far on a certain issue, in addition to views of the state he represents, the word 'hypocrisy' might not be at the top of the headlines, but it's certainly there.