Political Hotsheet
April 14, 2009 12:01 PM

Hot Topic: Is U.S. A "Christian Nation?"

(iStockphoto)
Late last week, the polling organization Gallup announced that "the percentage of Americans who identify with some form of a Christian religion has been dropping in recent decades, and now stands at 77 percent." In 1948, the percentage of Christians was 91 percent.

Another poll, the American Religious Identification Survey, found that 15 percent of Americans now claim no religious affiliation, nearly double the percentage in 1990.

Those figures suggest that Christianity is on the decline. Yet it remains a major force in American life: More than three in four Americans identify as Christians, and religion – Christianity in particular – is connected to many aspects of our lives.

It influences the debate over social issues and plays an important role in many families and communities; it touches everyone from death row inmates to the president, who Monday oversaw the traditional White House Easter Egg roll.

So is the United States, in the end, a "Christian nation?" And what does that mean, anyway? President Obama, as part of an effort to reach out to the Muslim world, explicitly rejected the formulation in Turkey last week.

“We do not consider ourselves a Christian nation or a Jewish nation or a Muslim nation," he said. "We consider ourselves a nation of citizens who are bound by ideals and a set of values."

Not that the president is averse to using Christian imagery: In what the White House billed as a "major" speech Tuesday, the president invoked a parable from the Sermon on the Mount.

(iStockphoto)
Newsweek, meanwhile, recently printed a cover story entitled "The End of Christian America" – which prompted complaints and a call for the firing of the author of the piece, Editor Jon Meacham.

"As crucial as religion has been and is to the life of the nation, America's unifying force has never been a specific faith, but a commitment to freedom—not least freedom of conscience," he wrote.

Newsweek polling found that 62 percent of Americans believe theirs to be a Christian nation – which, despite being down from 69 percent last year, is a formidable number.

Yet the separation of Church and state remains relatively strong. Despite the efforts of many Christian evangelicals, prayer is generally kept out of schools, as is, by and large, the teaching of Creationism. The popular elected president supports abortion rights. And on one of the key social issues of the moment – gay marriage – the traditional Christian perspective appears to be losing ground, with increasing support for gay rights among the young and more states legalizing same-sex marriage.

(CBS/istockphoto.com)
One would not expect a "Christian nation" to move toward gay marriage; New York's new Catholic archbishop, Timothy Dolan – who suggests gay marriage would be a "detriment to civilization" – said Monday that Catholics are "above the times, we're timeless in our beliefs in our values and in our ethics and in our morality."

Yet Americans, more generally, are not "timeless in our beliefs," as evidenced by a consistent pattern of social change virtually since the nation's founding. Perceptions about everything from slavery to alcohol to women's rights have changed dramatically over the years.

Ultimately, the question of whether America is a "Christian nation" depends in large part on how you define the phrase. If a "Christian nation" is simply a nation made largely of Christians, then America is undeniably one. Despite the increase in non-religious Americans, they are still outnumbered more than 6-1 by Christians, according to Gallup.

But if a "Christian nation" is something else – a nation on which laws, behavior and policy are fundamentally tied to Christian ideals – then the question is more complex. The legal system has an undeniable basis in the Christian conception of morality, as does our societal conception of right and wrong.

Yet the phrase "Christian nation" can also be problematic. Domestically, it suggests the possible sublimation of individual rights in favor of a unified and inflexible worldview. Internationally, it creates an "us vs. them" as the U.S. fights for hearts and minds in countries with overwhelmingly Muslim populations.

There's much more to discuss on the issue, of course. But we're leaving the rest to you. Do you think the United States is a Christian nation? How do you define the phrase? And do you believe that it's useful? Let us know below.
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by fastlan3 October 24, 2009 7:54 PM EDT
Basic answer... Our "Nation" (not the people with in it) is in direct defiance of biblical laws, and therefore can not be accepted as a "christian nation".

Consciences view...
We are part a world with many views of itself. One can not talk for the rest, and the rest can not talk for the "ONE". As a "freethinker" I feel obligated to respect each others choices and if people must feel certain attribution should contribute to the "whole" then, this must be. So in my view "we will be what were will be, and if we change, we change." I can only agree with freedom of religion for the serenity one must posses to allow the people to come to a collaborative census we can all find accepting.
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by rationale July 12, 2009 10:49 PM EDT
In my opinion, it is highly unnecessary for professing Christians to believe that Jesus Christ was promoting nation building theology. The notion of a ?Christian nation? is not taught in the New Testament Bible at all. Jesus Christ came on earth to save mankind from their sins and not to create theocracies.

I believe that we are one nation under God with religious freedom.
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by myloveisgod May 15, 2009 10:36 PM EDT
When we all are drained all of our life's wonders on our selfish selves and we turn around and you are alone, that is when you will call on the Almighty, by whatever name you might have called "it" before, in the hope that you will get an answer. Never forget GOD's many names. You may need it one day.
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by willyn3 May 6, 2009 5:32 PM EDT
The entire story in the old testament was plagiarised from much older, "religious" beliefs. The story of Jesus too, is much older than 2000 years.
The concept worked to control people 10,000 years ago and smart leaders knew how to use a good thing. Still do!
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by AgentGGG May 4, 2009 1:34 PM EDT
"The legal system has an undeniable basis in the Christian conception of morality, as does our societal conception of right and wrong."


Please, could you possibly be more vague?

What I find curious about these so-called Christian values, is that it has yet to be precisely articulated, what those values exactly are, and then, why they are Christian values. Certainly some of the founders of our nation came from a Christian background, but the USA was founded in a spirit of deep mistrust of religous doctrine. Religous fervor was seen then as being politically destructive to the health of nations (as we are seeing now in the USA after 30 years of the Christian right.)

However, I am still waiting to learn what specific Christian values and morals our democracy was founded on. My guess is that these are not exclusively Christian values, but that they are universal values that are espoused by all faiths. Then, why is the US is not founded on humanistic values, rather than Christian values?
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by christy75rk April 21, 2009 10:37 AM EDT
First, this country was founded on the priciples that there is a supreme being, and that there should be FREEDOM of religion, not that ONE specific religion (or belief system about God) should be instated.

Second, do we not realize that when we call this a "Christian Nation" we are disregarding the Jewish people, and faithful Muslims who are citizens of this great country? These people are peaceful, believe in God, and have strong morals. Just because you call yourself a Christian does not mean you are GOOD, or JUST, or MORAL.

Let us remember and honor our forefathers, AND our respective religions by realizing that this country is for ALL people (no matter what religion) that are seeking to better themselves, their environment, and their nation WITHOUT disrespecting others. Isn't that what the United States is about?
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by aeconnelly April 16, 2009 7:29 PM EDT
These articles perpetuate the problems. never doubt that our nation is in fact the only country in the world to be strictly founded on morals. Hence the reason we are so successful. And, the religion (Christianity) is what our forefathers based the morals of the Constitution on. So, taking away religion in our schools, off of our currency, and essentially out of our country a good thing? Hell no it isn't. We shouldn't be so naive to think that religion doesn't matter in our country. It may not matter to you, and it doesn't matter to me at all. But, trust me. When it comes to the fate of our society, it means more than some may realize. Way more.
We need to preserve what we are as a whole, and stop worrying about every little individual. We need to look at the big picture. The only way to preserve the way we live is by preserving the place we live in and what it was founded on. It's common sense. We don't have to believe in Jesus or go to church, but by recognizing those things as part of the culture and heritage of our forefathers, and therefor ourselves, isn't begrudging other religions. We're only preserving our history and our values and ideals as a society. If you think the Constitution is impenetrable, think again. And, what do you think is keeping its essence in tact? Religion, whether or not people recognize it, plays a major role.
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by fastlan3 October 24, 2009 8:07 PM EDT
Can we agree that your term "christian" is used vaguely. That the constitution is in direct violation of biblical laws, and in no way is attributed to Christianity, but universalism. As in our Founding fathers own words -

"As the government of the United States is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion; as it has in itself no character of enmity against the laws, religion or tranquility of Musselmen [Muslims] ... it is declared ... that no pretext arising from religious opinion shall ever product an interruption of the harmony existing between the two countries....
"The United States is not a Christian nation any more than it is a Jewish or a Mohammedan nation."
-Source- Treaty of Tripoli (1797), carried unanimously by the Senate and signed into law by John Adams (the original language is by Joel Barlow, US Consul)

Further clarified-

"The founders of our nation were nearly all Infidels, and that of the presidents who had thus far been elected [Washington; Adams; Jefferson; Madison; Monroe; Adams; Jackson] not a one had professed a belief in Christianity....--President Wilson
-Source- The Reverend Doctor Bird Wilson, an Episcopal minister in Albany, New York, in a sermon preached in October, 1831. One might expect a modern defender of the Evangelical to play with the meaning of "Christianity," making it refer only to a specific brand of orthodoxy, first sentence quoted in John E Remsberg, Six Historic Americans, second sentence quoted in Paul F Boller, George Washington & Religion, pp. 14-15

So, please respect each others intellect and be sure to accept when you may be mistaken. Thank you.
by technologist3 April 16, 2009 3:59 PM EDT
Speak for yourself. Salvation is for slaves, not free men

Nope, you have inverted morality. You are slaved to your sin, and refuse to call it such. Arrogance and intellectual idolatry befuddles your judgment,
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by fastlan3 October 24, 2009 8:41 PM EDT
what is sin, but what one or a lot think is wrong? And how can it be that another may feel such may be "right"? Why are so many things considered "sin" in Christianity, and many things we now in present time feel are wrong are not mentioned and even allowed in biblical reference (god's own words)?

We have change, but has god?

Of course Christianity is a contributing factor as are many other faiths and ideals. But, what would be the christian notion of rule of law, if Christianity were to assume control and power over our nation and its laws? As the Ten commandments of Moses and other contributing Mosaic laws would surely be detrimental and destructive towards peace of any kind. And the following laws the character jesus pronounced had nothing to do with individual happiness and equality for all.

May I ask if you have wife or a girl friend, did you find her or others pretty and may have found yourself with them? Do you own "anything"? Or is there anything you "want"? All forms of lust and greed (deadly sins). So, if you want to live, is not life a sin?
by honestabe8 April 16, 2009 5:47 AM EDT
We all must repent.
Posted by technologist3

Speak for yourself. Salvation is for slaves, not free men
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by toldyouso29 April 16, 2009 1:24 AM EDT
You can separate church and state but you cannot separate religion from society, and that is the burr in the atheist/secular humanist saddle.
Posted by CLoverNYC1 at 2:46 PM : Apr 15, 2009


Can you really? As long as preachers can tell church members wo to vote for or what issues to vote for or against from the pulpit--or large churches deliver edicts or dictates contrary to law (or face excommunication) there is NO separation of church and state.

Most people do not even realize WHY the 2 should be separated or what it was like when churches or the papacy ruled the masses. Most people think their own church leaders or goers are actually pious and not capable of heinous corruption.
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by toldyouso29 April 16, 2009 1:20 AM EDT
If you people would look around you and put 2 & 2 together, you would see this economic disaster is part and parcel of your average Joe's rejection of God in this country.

We all must repent.
Posted by technologist3 at 4:50 PM : Apr 15, 2009


Revelations 18. If America (like Nineveh) does not repent from the evil of wars and torture based on lies--we are all toast==you can take THAT to one of our failing banks.
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by technologist3 April 15, 2009 7:50 PM EDT
As is usual the MSM runs a story pretending to suppose a debate on the religious identitiy of this nation.

In truth, CBS and Newsweek are scallywags pushing the humanist/athiest agenda and outright attacking Christianity under the rubric of journalism.

We all see through this and will fight the fight if it comes to us. Yet no genius at the MSM has bothered to write an article linking the "increasing secularization of America" and "the progressive destruction of America". If you people would look around you and put 2 & 2 together, you would see this economic disaster is part and parcel of your average Joe's rejection of God in this country.

We all must repent.
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by slownewsday05 April 15, 2009 7:36 PM EDT
Wrong. Read the Constitution of the United States and study the lives of the men who wrote it.
Posted by CLoverNYC1


Actually, it's you who is wrong in that case.

Thomas Jefferson plainly said that one's beliefs should be between themselves and their god, and not inflicted onto the public.

Also, try reading the first 10 words of the First Ammendment.
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by CLoverNYC1 April 15, 2009 5:48 PM EDT
Judaism and Christianity introduced NO principles which were not already commonplace. Therefore "Judeo-Christian principles" do not exist.
Posted by hower4 at 1:31 PM : Apr 15, 2009
-------------------------

Wrong. Read the Constitution of the United States and study the lives of the men who wrote it.
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by CLoverNYC1 April 15, 2009 5:46 PM EDT
No. America is a secular nation.

The paradox is that our laws are based on Judeo-Christian principles (i.e. the ten commandments).

You can separate church and state but you cannot separate religion from society, and that is the burr in the atheist/secular humanist saddle.
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by CLoverNYC1 April 15, 2009 5:43 PM EDT
No. America is a secular nation. The paradox is that our laws are based on Judeo-Christian principles which make religion inseparable from American life.

You cannot separate church and state but you cannot separate religion from society and that is the burr in the atheist/secular humanist saddle.
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by whosaid1 April 15, 2009 4:16 PM EDT
I absolutely WOULD argue with it, because "Judeo-Christian principles" do not exist......... or would you like to explain what these principles are?
Posted by hower4

They "do not exist"....that is your OPINION ....But, you need to educate yourself on the development of this country. Based on your past comments, I can see, you like to play word games...sorry, I don't have time to "play" today.
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by VirginiaPatriot April 15, 2009 4:01 PM EDT
First off, this topic is just inflammatory, and the majority of commentors haven't even read enough American History to hold a descent discussion. However, I submit the following facts, followed by my assessment in hopes that you will all chime in.
http://www.adherents.com/gov/Founding_Fathers_Religion.html

Lists the religeous affiliations of the Founding Fathers.

This assessment will show that the OVERWHELMING totality of these men were God fearing, and all but two avowed themselves Christian, not merely Diestic.

They were brilliant men, and they understood the important difference between the way France created 'freedom' and they way THEY knew freedom needed to be established. ( In order to understand the French concept of religeous freedom, analize this statement: " An individual has the freedom of relegion inasmuch as it does not interfere with the law." (french concept.. bah.. I spit upon it in disgust. It presumes that your right to your beliefs is fine, as long as you don't **** off the ruling mob of the day. Otherwise your rights will be removed under the "law".)

Our Founding Fathers new that morality cannot be legislated. But it equally cannot be abandoned. They understood that your Rights, are given to you by an authority that cannot be overreached by any government, and without that respect... that nod to the higher authority, rulers become tyrants. What YOU think is right and wrong is ethics... Morality is abiding by what your/an/some Authority has defined as r&w and whether or not you decide to abide by that morality determines whether society will tolerate you. When a nation loses its concept of morality, it is doomed. "Religeon, is the conscience of hte State." You cannot codify morality.

That said, this nation does not attempt to force you into ANY belief, it merely demands that you respect each persons right to believe as their hearts are called. This respect is built into our Nation BY CHRISTIAN MEN. It is the ONLY nation that has enabled the coming together in this fashion. It is a CHRISTIAN PRINCIPLE. No other religeon has this level of freedom inherent in its structure. It is a reflection of God's desire that He wants you to want him because you want to, not because you must/have/are-forced to.

That is true freedom. So, YES. I find in favor of the affirmative. That this nation, this freedom, this tolerance for beliefs that are otherwise hostile to our very core... defines our center tenent as a Christian one.
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by honestabe8 April 15, 2009 3:08 PM EDT
"Don't know who your "those" are..... but if I'm included, the BRAND of Christianity is not important." - whosaid1

I suspect to many Christians, the BRAND of Christianity is important. Otherwise, there would be no need to identify with a particular sect. The evangelicals would likely not want to adopt the Catholic rituals, or the Orthodox would not want to be beholding to Pentacostal or Baptist ways of thinking.
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by whosaid1 April 15, 2009 2:02 PM EDT
I suspect that those who want us to "return" to being a "Christian Nation" would want it to be their brand of Christianity.
Posted by honestabe8

Don't know who your "those" are..... but if I'm included, the BRAND of Christianity is not important. However, I don't think anyone can argue against the fact that the very "foundation" of this country was based on Judeo-Christian principles......"In god we trust ".....and all that great stuff...........
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