Face the Nation transcripts June 30, 2013: Hayden, Olson, Perkins, and Davis

(CBS News) Below is a transcript of "Face the Nation" on June 30, 2013, hosted by CBS News' Bob Schieffer. Guests include: Ted Olson, Tony Perkins, Michael Hayden, Clarissa Ward, Texas state senator Wendy Davis, Benjamin Jealous, Jan Crawford, Fernando Espuelas, Dr. James Peterson, and Michael Gerson.

BOB SCHIEFFER: And good morning, again. We are going to begin in Cairo this morning, which has been very tense over the last few days. People have been killed, people have been pouring into the streets, protests trying to get the Egyptian president Mohammed Morsi to resign. Clarissa, what's going on there today?

CLARISSA WARD (CBS Foreign Correspondent): Good morning, Bob. Well, the streets are very tense as these protests get under way. You can probably see behind me some people starting to gather outside the presidential palace. They are also gathering in Tahrir Square and they are expected to be joined by tens of thousands, even hundreds of thousands of others who are going to demand that President Morsi step down. They say that one year into his presidency, he has failed to deal with Egypt's very serious economic problems, its crime problems and they say that he has essentially put the Islamist agenda of the Muslim Brotherhood ahead of the greater good of the Egyptian people. Now, meanwhile, just a couple of miles that way, pro-Morsi Islamist supporters have gathered. We went to see them earlier. They were carrying sticks and bats. They were wearing hard hats. They say that these are just defensive weapons that they don't want to see any violence today, but they said that they are willing to defend the presidency that Morsi was democratically elected and that he has a right to see through his term. So the concern today, really, is that both sides are going to converge on the presidential palace behind me, that there will be more clashes and more lives lost possibly.

BOB SCHIEFFER: All right. Well, we may have to come back to you, Clarissa, later in the day, thank you so much. And there were new developments overnight in the National Security Agency story, the story of those leaks. The latest is now Der Spiegel, a German magazine is reporting that the United States spied on-- on the European Union. One person, a top official in the German government, is now charging that the United States is using the kind of Cold War tactics on its allies that were used by its enemies during the Cold War. Here to talk to us about this the former head of the National Security Agency, General Michael Hayden. General, what about this latest story? Have we been spying on the European Union?

GENERAL MICHAEL HAYDEN (Former NSA Director/Former CIA Director): Well, first of all, Bob, I've been out of government for about five years, so I really don't know and even if I did I wouldn't confirm or deny it. But I-- I think I can confirm a few things for you here this morning. Number one: The United States does conduct espionage. Number two: Our Fourth Amendment, which protects Americans' privacy, is not an international treaty. And, number three: Any European who wants to go out and rent their garments with regard to international espionage should look first and find out what their own governments are doing.

BOB SCHIEFFER: Well, a-- as I understand it, we were-- we were corralling something like a billion e-mails a-- a-- a month from Germany?

GENERAL MICHAEL HAYDEN: Well, I-- I have-- I have no idea, Bob. I really don't. And-- and let's keep in mind that in a global telecommunications infrastructure, geography doesn't mean what it used to be. Things of a place may not be in a place and things in a place may not be of a place. I mean the internet actually lacks geography, and-- and so I-- I wouldn't draw any immediate conclusions with regard to some of those numbers that have been put out there as to who's being targeted and who isn't.

BOB SCHIEFFER: In the meantime and between time Edward Snowden, this former employee of the National Security Agency, who got out of town, headed first to China, we now think he's in the airport--

GENERAL MICHAEL HAYDEN: Right.

BOB SCHIEFFER: --in Russia, had four computers full of stuff, but the President seems fairly sanguine about all of this. I noticed this morning he said, look, I'm not going to, you know, launch jets to chase down this hacker.

GENERAL MICHAEL HAYDEN: Right.

BOB SCHIEFFER: We'll follow the usual law enforcement channels. Should we be more aggressive about this?

GENERAL MICHAEL HAYDEN: I-- I personally think we should be and I think the President's trying to limit diplomatic and, perhaps, even political damage. But the leadership of the American intelligence community has caused the damage from these leaks so far-- and it's very clear there's going to be some more here so far has been significant and irreversible. That's a big deal.

BOB SCHIEFFER: You-- you think there has been significant damage done by Edward Snowden?

GENERAL MICHAEL HAYDEN: Yes, I do.

BOB SCHIEFFER: Just because it's been exposed and we're getting this kind of publicity from Germany now or because of operational things that have been disclosed?

GENERAL MICHAEL HAYDEN: Three-- three-- three things. Number one: Operational things have been disclosed. I mean you're a newsman, you know about protecting sources and methods and here now our sources and methods have been made public, so that's one. Second: Look, we cooperate with a lot of governments around the world. They expect us to be discreet about that cooperation. I can't imagine a government anywhere on the planet who now believes we can keep a secret.

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