"Necessity Defense" Sinks in Abortion Case

(AP)  A judge ruled Tuesday that Kansas law doesn't allow a so-called "necessity defense" in the trial of a man charged with killing one of the nation's few late-term abortion providers.

The decision was another blow to lawyers for 51-year-old Scott Roeder, who has confessed to shooting Dr. George Tiller on May 31 and says it was necessary to save unborn children.

In his ruling, Judge Warren Wilbert cited a 1993 criminal trespassing case involving an abortion clinic in which the Kansas Supreme Court said that to allow the personal beliefs of a person to justify criminal activity to stop a law-abiding citizen from exercising his rights would "not only lead to chaos but would be tantamount to sanctioning anarchy."

But he noted that that case dealt only with a property rights issue, whereas the case involving Roeder has elevated the argument to whether it is justified to take one life for another.

"That is certainly not a position I want to be in - because I am not God," Wilbert said.

However, the judge told attorneys he would "leave the door open" to consider later whether to allow specific evidence on the use of force for the defense of another person before letting the jury hear it.

"That doesn't mean it is wide open ... we can discuss it," Wilbert said.

The decision came during a hearing that mostly dealt setbacks to Roeder's defense. The judge rejected a change of venue request and a motion that would have kept prosecutors from making peremptory jury strikes based on potential jurors' beliefs about abortion.

While Wilbert denied the motion to prohibit the strikes, he said he would deal with such issues on a person-by-person basis during the trial, which is scheduled to begin Jan. 11. He refused to move the case out of Wichita, where pre-trial publicity has been intense.

Roeder, 51, of Kansas City, Missouri, is charged with one count of premeditated, first-degree murder in Tiller's death and two counts of aggravated assault for allegedly threatening two ushers during the May 31 melee in the foyer of the doctor's Wichita church.

Roeder, who has pleaded not guilty, on Nov. 9, telling The Associated Press he had no regrets about killing Tiller and suggesting the necessity defense should be the only contested issue at his trial. He declined to say when asked if he would kill another abortion provider if he were acquitted.

The "necessity defense" has rarely been used successfully in abortion cases. Roeder's attorneys - while arguing that their client has a right to present his theory of defense - have so far kept their own strategy secret.

Prosecutors have overwhelming evidence against Roeder, chiefly the witnesses who identified him during a July preliminary hearing as the shooter. Legal experts have said prosecutors likely will want to keep the trial limited to a straightforward murder case and avoid a discussion of abortion.

[formrusmcsgt]

"...to allow the personal beliefs of a person to justify criminal activity to stop a law-abiding citizen from exercising his rights would "not only lead to chaos but would be tantamount to sanctioning anarchy."
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Precisely what the defendent wishes to accomplish, obvously.

[P0STING_AWAY]

by eyesopenwide December 22, 2009 6:44 PM EST
Im sorry P0STING_AWAY, but you've allowed your prejudices to prevail and sunk to such a low realm of communication I can only feel sorry for you, as I'm neither religious nor any of the juvenile labels you choose to argue with instead of analytic discussion. When you grow up, or get educated, you can try again.
====================================================================
"eyesopenwide" ... and yet you only see what you WANT to see.
You are everything I said and more.
You have NO right to tell ANY women what she shall do OR not do.
DONT WANT AN ABORTION ??? THEN DON'T HAVE ONE.
WHY DO I GET THE FEELING THAT YOU ARE A MALE ...... AND DON'T HAVE
TO WORRY ABOUT THIS ANYWAY ??????

[ibsteve2u]

lollll...a defense? Man, this guy...what a hypocrite.

If you feel you have the moral grounds to commit murder, you should have the moral courage to die for your wrong-headed action.

[P0STING_AWAY]

by eyesopenwide December 22, 2009 6:00 PM EST
If you kill to prevent the death of another, such as the police killing folks that present a danger to the public, then apparently, at least some of the time, it's considered justified by many.
=====================================================
Do you remember the fellow who killed the anti-abortion protester???
I guess it works both ways.
I think it is time to rid America of our version of the Taliban -
Morongelical christians. You cockroaches are a waste of good air.

[mnbrant]

This is the reasons that 420 woman gave for why they waited 4 months or longer before they aborted. You can see right at the bottom that 2% had some kind of pregnancy problem. 98% of them got it late because they either didn't care or were inconvenienced in some way. Yeah I got this from the same wiki late term abortion article. You pro-choice shouldn't really be letting all the legit info out if you want to win. Obviously I can't convince a crocodile not to eat small children so I won't even try. The last comment did read a little like Mein Kampf if you ask me. saying that all babies aborted after 4 months are deformed or brainless in some way is a little crazy if you ask me. I personally think that you are the one who is probably deformed and brainless.

71% Woman didn't recognize she was pregnant or misjudged gestation
48% Woman found it hard to make arrangements for abortion
33% Woman was afraid to tell her partner or parents
24% Woman took time to decide to have an abortion
8% Woman waited for her relationship to change
8% Someone pressured woman not to have abortion
6% Something changed after woman became pregnant
6% Woman didn't know timing is important
5% Woman didn't know she could get an abortion
2% A fetal problem was diagnosed late in pregnancy
11% Other

[superdem1]

Every problem we have the world over is the result of overpopulation, if you trace it to its cause. And the "Pro-Life" movement weeps over the deformed and defective, the brainless, the unfortunates unwanted by the child mothers, they want every child born, no matter the cost to families or the planet, every acorn is an oak tree to them. Nature knows better, nothing is cheaper than flesh, it can always be replaced, individuals don't matter, it is survival that counts, and even that is meaningless in time. We should keep our numbers low, so we can have the highest quality of life for the longest possible time. That is what our brains give us - rational reason. If our sisters need abortions, by golly we should let them have them.

[mnbrant]

oh geeze I forgot to add all that up. according to the wiki god 11.8 of all abortions are late term abortions. I.e. after 3 months. I suppose the pro-choice people are right that the number of viable babies (able to live outside the womb) aborted are probably small. I would have to weigh the dozens of viable babies killed this way versus the one abortion doctors life killed by a bullet? I mean look at all this crying over the doctor who murdered and not a word about all the babies who were viable he killed. The can't even sell bibles to raise money for the guys defense. This is not the accused this is just average citizens trying to raise money to defend the guy. I am not sure this is a fight choice people want to win. I sure wouldn't.

[dcgonz]

Do you have any other "facts" other than the ones you got from Wiki? I wouldn't use them as an accurate source of information since anyone can go in and enter "facts".

[mnbrant]

In 2003, from data collected in those areas that sufficiently reported gestational age, it was found that 6.2% of abortions were conducted from 3-3.999 months, 4.2% 4to 5 months, and 1.4% after 5.25 months or later. or later Because the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention's annual study on abortion statistics does not calculate the exact gestational age for abortions performed past the 20th week, there are no precise data for the number of abortions performed after viability.
hmm, there are three definitions of late term abortion. 1. after 3 months 2. after 4 months and 3. after 7 months. Keep in mind that a baby comes to term after only 9 months. Since Tillman mainly did late term abortions it is likely that he performed abortions after 7 months. I.e. after the baby was viable. So in that light I can not condemn that actions the the man took. Its pretty obvious that they are hiding something if the definition of later term abortion runs from just after 3 months to just before giving birth. The data is from wiki. Oh I just read that late-term abortions have been banned since 2003. Sorry all you pro-choice people. You lose.

[SusanStoHelit]

No shock this disgusting killer thought he was justified - so many spread the lies about abortion and Doctor Tiller - some of them belong right up there on trial with him.

Doctor Tiller helped women who would die without his aid, women who were in the worst possible situation - they'd gone through most of their pregnancy, all of the hardest bits of it - only to find they could never have the baby - that they would die first, that the baby would die too, or was to damaged to survive childbirth. He helped these women, even as others used threats and violence to intimidate other doctors into refusing to help.

Late term abortions are incredibly rare - and incredibly limited - only when the mother's life is at risk, or the fetus has a problem that will not let it survive - the laws where Doctor Tiller practiced are quite strict and very limited. Political hacks put him on trial to try to say he was violating those laws - and the conservative religious jury found that every single case he worked on was indeed within the laws - he only did the abortions that were absolutely necessary. These are abortions done to preserve life - not ever because someone just wants an abortion. They are incredibly rare - a small fraction of a percent of all abortions. They're for women who were through the worst of pregnancy, had not wanted an abortion until they got the horrible news that sent them to Doctor Tiller.

A woman who suddenly was told she had cancer - an aggressive cancer that would kill her before her baby would be viable, who had to have chemo, but could not while pregnant - the only choice was to have an abortion - and a chance at life, or for BOTH her and the baby to die. That was a Doctor Tiller case. If the anti-abortion faction had their way, both of them would be dead. That's the type of case Doctor Tiller accepted threats, violence, attacks, to be able to save.

[sean56v]

Scott should admit to vigilantism. He could accuse Tiller of eugenics and fascism. The Jury might accept an argument that Tiller was a neo-nazi doctor who performed the procedure for profit by eliminating inferior fetuses. The Jury might reject Tiller's theory of a master aryan race.