At Shanghai Forum, Obama Stresses Freedoms

Speaking to Chinese University Students at Town Hall-Style Event, President Criticizes China's Restrictions on Internet Use

(CBS/AP)  President Barack Obama gave China a pointed, unexpected nudge to stop censoring the Internet access of its own people, offering an animated defense of the tool that helped him win the White House - and telling his tightly controlled hosts not to be wary of a little criticism.

"I think that the more freely information flows, the stronger the society becomes, because then citizens of countries around the world can hold their own governments accountable," Mr. Obama said Monday in a town hall with students during his first-ever trip to China. "They can begin to think for themselves." (Read the transcript of the entire town hall.)

Just hours ahead of talks with Chinese President Hu Jintao, Mr. Obama tried to find a political balance, couching his admonitions with words of cooperation, praise and American humility.

As Mr. Obama arrived for the state visit, police detained dozens of activists and petitioners in Beijing and elsewhere in China, friends,
family members and a human rights group said Monday.

At the Shanghai forum, Mr. Obama said few global challenges can be solved unless the world's only superpower and its rising competitor work together, and he insisted: "We do not seek to contain China's rise."

But in his opening statement and in answers to the wide-ranging discussion with university students, Mr. Obama spoke bluntly about the benefits of individual freedoms in a place known for limiting them.

The meeting with students was broadcast locally, but not nationwide. Most of the eight questions, from students and the Internet, were polite expressions of chinese government policy," reports CBS News senior White House correpsondent Bill Plante.

Read more about Obama's comments on Internet freedoms
Access to Obama Remarks Blocked in China

"We do not seek to impose any system of government on any other nation," Mr. Obama said. Then he added that freedom of expression and worship, unfettered access to information and unrestricted political participation are not principles held by the United States; instead, he called them "universal rights."

The line offered echoes of Mr. Obama's predecessor, George W. Bush, who often talked of the "universality of freedom." Mr. Obama talked at length about the Internet, which he said helped him win the presidency because it allowed for the mobilization of young people like those in his audience in Shanghai.

"I'm a big supporter of non-censorship," Mr. Obama said. "I recognize that different countries have different traditions. I can tell you that in the United States, the fact that we have free Internet - or unrestricted Internet access is a source of strength, and I think should be encouraged."

Given where Mr. Obama was speaking, such a comment carried strong implications. And he appeared to be talking directly to China's leaders when he said that he believes free discussion, including criticism that he sometimes finds annoying, makes him "a better leader because it forces me to hear opinions that I don't want to hear."

China has more than 250 million Internet users and employs some of the world's tightest controls over what they see. The country is often criticized for having the so-called "Great Firewall of China," which refers to technology designed to prevent unwanted traffic from entering or leaving a network.

Mr. Obama's town hall was not broadcast live across China on television. It was shown on local Shanghai TV and streamed online on two big national Internet portals, but the quality was choppy and hard to hear.

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Mr. Obama is in the midst of a weeklong Asia trip. He came with a vast agenda of security, economic and environmental concerns, although always looming was how Mr. Obama would deal with human rights while in China.

The president left Shanghai for Beijing, where was to spend Monday night after meeting with his Chinese counterpart.

Mr. Obama's China visit features the only sightseeing of his journey. He will visit the Forbidden City, home of former emperors in Beijing, and the centuries-old Great Wall outside of the city. Aides have learned that finding some tourist time calms and energize their boss amid the grueling schedule of an international trip.

U.S. ambassador Jon Huntsman called Mr. Obama's event the first ever town-hall meeting held by a U.S. president in China. Yet former presidents Bill Clinton and George W. Bush also spoke to students and took questions from them during stops in China.

China is a huge and lucrative market for American goods and services, and yet it has a giant trade surplus with the U.S. that, like a raft of other economic issues, is a bone of contention between the two governments. The two militaries have increased their contacts, but clashes still happen and the United States remains worried about a dramatic buildup in what is already the largest standing army in the world.

Amid all that, Mr. Obama has adopted a pragmatic approach that stresses the positive, sometimes earning him criticism for being too soft on Beijing - particularly in the area of human rights abuses and what the United States regards as an undervalued Chinese currency that disadvantages U.S. products.

The two nations are working together more than ever on battling global warming, but they still differ deeply over hard targets for reductions in the greenhouse-gas emissions that cause it. China has supported sterner sanctions to halt North Korea's nuclear weapons program, but it still balks at getting more aggressive about reining in Iran's uranium enrichment.

Mr. Obama recognizes that a rising China, as the world's third-largest economy - on its way to becoming the second - and the largest foreign holder of U.S. debt, has shifted the dynamic more toward one of equals. For instance, Chinese questions about how Washington spending policies will affect the already soaring U.S. deficit and the safety of Chinese investments now must be answered by Washington.

The White House hoped Monday's town hall meeting with Chinese university students would allow Mr. Obama to telegraph U.S. values - through its successes and failures - to the widest Chinese audience possible.

But those hopes had their limits in communist-ruled China.

[nowhiningallowed]

Hmmm, let's see, the president advocates freedom of speech and no censorship, but he and his buddies are trying to do exactly that with talk radio and Fox? Aren't we being just a wee bit hypocritical there now Mr. President? What, another do as I say and not as I do routine? Laughable.

[veteran71]

by nowhiningallowed November 16, 2009 7:40 PM EST

Hmmm, let's see, the president advocates freedom of speech and no censorship, but he and his buddies are trying to do exactly that with talk radio and Fox? Aren't we being just a wee bit hypocritical there now Mr. President? What, another do as I say and not as I do routine? Laughable.
*****************************************

Last time I checked, Dullards and Mouth-Breathing Droolers were STILL free to dial up and watch both the Fact-Free Nooz presented on Faux, or tune in for a daily dose of Bloviating Drug-Induced Nitwittery supplied by their favorite Anal-Cyst Deferred Chickenhawk.
(No need to get your panties all wet for no good reason).......

[Brokennews]

The whole time the Chinese are going:
"Hey! Who hired the comedian? This guy is great!!"

[ibsteve2u]

http://news.idg.no/cw/art.cfm?id=F8ADF7C8-1A64-6A71-CE073A625C5A81C3

[bq]
An anti-censorship group holding an event Sunday at the United Nations-sponsored Internet Governance Forum (IGF) in Sharm El Sheikh, Egypt, was disrupted by UN officials who demanded removal of a poster that mentioned Internet firewalls in China.
[...]
"We condemn this undemocratic act of censoring our event just because someone is trying to impress or be in the good graces of the Chinese government. It is ironic that while people are allowed to gather here to discuss freedom of expression online, censorship and surveillance practices on the Internet, we are being restricted in expressing our views," said Al Alegre of the Foundation for Media Alternatives, a member of the ONI Network.
[eq]

I guess it should give me a warm fuzzy that it ain't just our Republicans and neoliberals who kowtow to the Chinese?

For some reason, it doesn't.

[brian1920]

Obama says he is the first Pacific president because he spent some time as a child in Indonesia. What an idiot. Roosevelt, Kennedy, Bush senior, and Nixon were all Pacific presidents. Obama is a narcissistic personality with a propensity to ignore history. He is not qualified to be dog catcher.

[veteran71]

At Shanghai Forum, Obama Stresses Freedoms

Speaking to Chinese University Students at Town Hall-Style Event, President Criticizes China's Restrictions on Internet Use

(Obama failed to mention how he instructed the justice Department to fight any opposition to policies begun under the Bush/Cheney Regime in regard to Illegal Domestic Spying and Eavesdropping, Extraordinary Renditions and Detentions without Council and in opposition to Habeus, Secret Torture and Hit Squads, and all plans to reverse ANY policies under the Patriot Act, or Presidential Signing Statements and Secret Directives designed to continue subversion of the Constitution and Rule of Law, and anything that might require accountability of any government official past, present, or future)......Hey, you can't expect these Chinese to appreciate the value of a good Facade/Fake Democracy.....they still practice that old-school method of Authoritarian Dictatorship right out in the open for everyone to see..........

[Void_Master]

by hungry1968-17 November 16, 2009 2:07 PM EST

Can you please show me in the US Constitution the right to "not have health care insurance"?

***

Let's start with the Tenth Amendment to the U. S. Constitution (hint: it's in the Bill of Rights).

"The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people."

Nothing anywhere in the Constitution grants the United States the power to require anyone to have any kind of insurance. Given that fact alone, that pretty much says that the citizens of the U. S. have the freedom to *not have* health insurance, car insurance, home owner's insurance or any other kind of insurance. Insurance is a choice -- like any other *product*.

That's just one of the many points that will get that individual mandate overturned once it hits the Supreme Court. There are others. Meanwhile, I still don't intend to play along while it's being decided upon.

[Mokkie57]

The President wants to talk Freedom in other countries. But in america we are loosing ours. With the Health care reform tax payers are going to pickup 1 Trillion Dollars Plus. Our government wants to bring 5 terrorists to New York. It also wants to buy a prison in Thomson Ill. to turn into a Supermax prison for Guantanamo detainees.
Of those charged with marijuana violations, approximately 89 percent, 754,224 Americans were charged with possession only. The remaining 93,640 individuals were charged with "sale/manufacture," a category that includes all cultivation offenses, even those where the marijuana was being grown for personal or medical use.

Commenting on the 2008 figures, NORML Director Allen St. Pierre said: "Federal statistics released just last week indicate that larger percentages of Americans are using cannabis at the same time that police are arresting a near-record number of Americans for pot-related offenses. Present enforcement policies are costing American taxpayers tens of billions of dollars, ruining the lives of hundreds of thousands of Americans, and having no impact on marijuana availability or marijuana use in this country. It is time to end this failed policy and replace prohibition with a policy of marijuana regulation, taxation, and education."
Our founding fathers had something better in mind for this country then becoming a prison nation. I really don't think we want to have this country fill it's unemployment roll's with prison guards for the world? Or is that the plan?

[Void_Master]

If you wish to opt in to the umbrella of state, pay your taxes, obey the law and shut up about those of us who do not do the same. If you happen to get my hospital bill in the mail, pay it or throw it away. That is your choice.

Everyone else going along with something does not oblige me to be that stupid.

[Void_Master]

Government does not exist to help you. Government does not exist to protect you. Government does not exist to provide for you.

Government exists to control you. And the more you imagine otherwise, the more you are controlled.

[erb0087]

"Freedom to NOT have h'care."
by Skirt-Lifter November 16, 2009 1:06 PM EST
===============================

You mean, "freedom not to have health insurance," don't you ?

That's not a freedom. That's infringing on other people's freedom.

If you don't have insurance, the hospital emergency rooms still have to treat you when you're sick, and that cost gets passed back to responsible taxpayers and people who do have insurance.

That drives everybody's costs up.

That's not being "free" -- that's being shiftless and irresponsible.

[hungry1968-17]

by Skirt-Lifter November 16, 2009 1:46 PM EST
The fine. No h'care, the gov't fines you. that's how!






That's a freedom that you've lost?

Can you please show me in the US Constitution the right to "not have health care insurance"?

[chrisbieber]

Government shill/frontman the POTUS stresses "freedoms"????????????????

Government ALLOWED and DEFINED and CIRCUMSCRIBED and MONITORED freedoms -

which one do YOU get to "enjoy" as a "proud to be an Americun...where at least I know I'm "free"?

POTUS, The Government, that "G*D piece of paper(as good GOP "conservative" W referred it as)" Constitution DO NOT GIVE ANY!!! "rights"...those rights referred to in the Constitution('s PREAMBLE) of life liberty and OMITTED private property are NOT "gifts" or "presents" or debatable subjective opinions - they are inalienable HUMAN rights endowed on each of us by God.
the POTUS is a former lawyer?? professor? and ELECTED OFFICIAL who has had to learn study and TAKE OATHS to honor AND OBEY the rules and purpose of the said Constitution of the United States of America.

Wonder if he NOT coming across ALLOWABLE actions by the Fed Government in "Education" DoEd, "Communication" FCC, "Medicine" HHS and "Empire"...all over the world and INTANGLING with governments all over the world....

The POTUS is defending the Empire to the best of his ability...doing a "good" "job" of it....

soon.....MORE bread....and MORE Circuses.....

[IrishWench01]

I had difficulty following your rant. Of one thing you can be sure. Your right to rant regardless of accuracy, intent or level of emotion and accusation and to do so on a public forum without reprisal, is still firmly in place. There are more, but I will leave it at that. This is one that you can also rest assured is not avaiable to all of the world's people.

[daffy64]

Americans invent the free enterprise system. Perfect it. Show it to the world. Then are soundly beaten at their own game by people from other countries who are willing to work for a FRACTION of the wages Americans get. All because of their love of "the lowest price", and decadent lifestyle.

Remember when the USA actually made products instead of just breeding billionaires and the lowly serfs who serve them?

Unless the USA was to completely isolate themself from the rest of the world with a total trade ban, this will continue indefinately. And if there was a trade ban, the standard of living Americans think they deserve would drop dramatically.

Face it. Things are NEVER going to be the same as in the "golden age of Camelot" (the fifties) again. And pointing one finger at politicians is easy to do. But three fingers still point back at us.

[AOCGUY]

We can fix this. We need to become a manufacturing nation again. And BTW if you were referring to the Kennedy years (commonly called Camelot) that was in the early sixties.

[daffy64]

If you are to become a manufacturing nation again, the average person is going to take a hit. Foreign competition means lower wages and expensive goods.

I think the western empire (more than just the States) is headed for decline but that's not a shock. If history has told us anything, it's that empires that rely on dominating the world are doomed.

Oh and thanks for the reality check on the "Kennedy-esque" era.

[daffy64]

It's nice that the President is stressing "freedom" over there. But one can't help wonder if the Chinese aren't giggling under their breath thinking "we've got you guys by the 'nads" and you're trying to get us to adopt YOUR system?".

BTW, this isn't President Obama's fault or even Bush's alone. This has been coming for decades because of American' love of cheap plastic foreign made junk. Thank you Wallmart shoppers.

[ToolMangler1]

Shopping at Walmart comes with the territory and the territory consists of no job, no wealth, over your head in debt just trying to have a place to live and food to eat. If you or others want to put to quietus on Walmart, then "share the wealth"!!!!!!!!

[hungry1968-17]

by Skirt-Lifter November 16, 2009 1:06 PM EST
Freedom to NOT have h'care.






How is that a "freedom" that you're losing?

You don't have to go to the doctor or hospital if you don't want to.

[Skirt-Lifter]

The fine. No h'care, the gov't fines you. that's how!

[hungry1968-17]

by choptopford November 16, 2009 1:16 PM EST
Obama Stresses Freedoms: but yet he is trying to take ours away






Name ONE freedom of yours that is threatened.

[daffy64]

Well, he can't. But it sounds cool.

[choptopford]

Obama Stresses Freedoms: but yet he is trying to take ours away

[daffy64]

Which one, exactly?

[hungry1968-17]

by Skirt-Lifter November 16, 2009 12:24 PM EST
In an earlier post, I essentially called Mr. Obama a hypocrite, and no one has come to his defense! That's surprising.






LOL!!

You're SURPRISED that everyone ignored you?

No surprise here!

ROFL!

[Skirt-Lifter]

I wasn't ignored...others chimed in, but no one defended the POTUS. And really isn't that funny bro.

[hungry1968-17]

by excop1949 November 16, 2009 12:30 PM EST
"I'm a big supporter of non-censorship," Mr. Obama said.

UH...EXCEPT FOR FOX NEWS AND TALK RADIO?






When were they censored?

[hungry1968-17]

by leeanna59 November 16, 2009 11:32 AM EST
I can't believe that Obama is in China lecturing them on freedom. This at a time when he and his administration and other Chicago cronies are working overtime to take away our freedoms. What a hypocrite he is.







Name ONE freedom that you've lost, or are going to lose, because of Obama.

[Skirt-Lifter]

Freedom to NOT have h'care.