Club That Ousted Blacks May Let Them In

But State Agency, U.S. Senator Threaten Civil Rights Investigation of Overwhelmingly White Pa. Swim Club

(AP)  A private suburban swim club accused of racism after it canceled the memberships of dozens of minority children says it will seek a meeting with the kids' camps to work out an agreement for them to return.

Amy Goldman, a member of The Valley Club, said those able to attend a hastily called meeting Sunday afternoon voted unanimously in support of reinstating the memberships of the Creative Steps day camp and two other camps as long as safety issues, times and terms can be agreed upon.

The Creative Steps camp had arranged for 65 mostly black and Hispanic children to swim each Monday afternoon at the gated Huntingdon Valley club, which is on a leafy hillside in a village straddling two overwhelmingly white townships. But after the group arrived June 29, camp director Alethea Wright said, several children reported hearing racial comments and some swim club members pulled their children out of the pool.

The camp's $1,950 was refunded a few days later.

The president of the swim club's board of directors, John Duesler, has said the decision was made out of safety considerations, not racial concerns.

"We have near-unanimous approval from our membership, so at this point we'll be figuring out ... how to approach all the camps and see how we can move forward," Duesler told WPVI-TV at the club's entrance on Sunday.

The swim club has claimed it has a diverse, multiethnic membership, but Goldman, a member for two years, said she couldn't remember seeing a black member this year.

Goldman said members were told that the Pennsylvania Human Relations Commission, which has opened an investigation, is to make a fact-finding visit to the club July 30. U.S. Sen. Arlen Specter said Friday he had asked the U.S. Department of Justice to investigate "to determine what action, if any, is warranted by the Civil Rights Division."

Others to criticize the club include the National Association for the Advancement of Colored People and the United States' highest-profile black swimmer, Olympic gold medalist Cullen Jones, who said Thursday that "hearing about what's happened to these 65 kids is both disturbing and appalling."

Chuck Wielgus, executive director of USA Swimming, the governing body for the U.S. swim team, said he was stunned by the accusations against the club.

Wright, the camp director, didn't immediately return a telephone call seeking comment Sunday evening. She said earlier that other institutions had offered to host her group at their pools for the summer.

Camp parent Silvia Carvalho said she hadn't heard about the club's action but didn't believe her 9-year-old daughter, Araceli, would be willing to return.

"She has already said so," Carvalho said Sunday night. "She doesn't want people to look at her the same way."

[woodstiger38]

Give the director of Valley Swim Club a call; he loves to hear from you.
John G Duesler
74 Radburn Rd
Huntingdon Valley, PA 19006-6755
C-215-913-0569
[phone]

[koko98-2009]

Maybe Clarence Thomas would like to accompany these kids when they go back and maybe get some "empathy" on what goes on racially in the real world.

[mswolfestock]

Those idiots at the swim club have created 65 angry young kids. Some of these kids will stay angry, and THAT is the real crime here. When a young mind is filled with anger and resentment, learning and growing will not happen.

THANKS A LOT HUNTINGDON VALLEY SWIM CLUB AND CONGRATULATIONS ON TAKING US BACK TO THE DAYS OF JIM CROW.

[blog_fever2]

Makes you say hmmm... If this pool thought they did NOTHING wrong, why hold such a meeting? They knew it was racist and now they are feeling the pressure. If I were the camp, I wouldn't go back. The kids would not enjoy it and neither would the club members. The administration at this facility already made their choice... They just need to suffer the consequences.

[toldyouso29]

What was the OFFICIAL reason given for the cancellation of the day camp's membership? And was that official reason completely valid, or easily verified as being invalid?

I'll let the investigation proceed and I won't automatically assume that a dispute between two groups of people who happen to be different races MUST be racially motivated."

THE "OFFICIAL REASON" GIVEN FOR revoking the temporary membership was that the pool lacked capacity. Too bad the Director did not think that through.

The fees charged to the camp computed the amounts based on how many kids would be attending and for how many sessions. The camp director has released her emails with the club director to CNN which shows that the amount of kids was known and accepted by the director prior to accepting the funds from the camp. Anymore stupid --"evidently-failed to read the article" questions?

[willcad]

Let's not immediately jump to the conclusion that just because one group is white, and the other is not, that the motivation behind the cancellation of membership was racial, wholely racial, and nothing but racial.

Some of the kids reported hearing racial remarks at the pool from other members. But did the kids make any racial remarks themselves?

Some of the members pulled their own kids from the pool when the 65 minority kids jumped in. But was it because they were minority kids, or were the minority kids being loud, disruptive, and intimidating towards the members' kids?

The Creative Steps' Day Camp had its membership revoked and its dues refunded. But was it because the camp is mostly made up of minority kids, or was it due to the kids' behavior at the pool?

What was the OFFICIAL reason given for the cancellation of the day camp's membership? And was that official reason completely valid, or easily verified as being invalid?

I'll let the investigation proceed and I won't automatically assume that a dispute between two groups of people who happen to be different races MUST be racially motivated.

[toldyouso29]

Some of the kids reported hearing racial remarks at the pool from other members. But did the kids make any racial remarks themselves?

Some of the members pulled their own kids from the pool when the 65 minority kids jumped in. But was it because they were minority kids, or were the minority kids being loud, disruptive, and intimidating towards the members' kids?


Have you actually read the article and been following the story? Even the director of the club and members of the club have affirmed that the kids behaved themselves admirably and were very polite and did not cause trouble. REading comprehension. It's a beautiful thing--esp since most cases of bigotry and racism are due to "not knowing" better known as IGNORANCE. lol

[amateurradio]

What people seem to be losing sight of is that this is a private club. They do have that fabled "right of association" (see the First Amendment to the U.S. Constitution). Their behavior might be idiotic, absurd or bigoted - but it isn't illegal.

[toldyouso29]

What you are forgetting is the circumstances--the right to freely associate flies out of the window and is dictated to by state and federal laws when any organization enters into transactional services with the public. When they do that, they are held to the same standard/laws and rules as everyone else.

This means the club has the right to exclude blacks as long as they do not take public money OR money from the public--the minute that is done and the transaction includes a minority; then the laws applying to discrimination and other civil issues apply.

This is why members of Congress asked for the investigation--because once they entered into an agreement, their behavior and conduct was governed by the state and country's rules in the matter at large and not by their personal rules.

[gramto8]

Once they accepted the money for those kids to become members, YES, it was illegal to harass them for being of a different ethnicity. Harassment can take many forms, including the verbiage and actions mentioned in this case.

[woodstiger38]

the Pennsylvania Human Relations Act prohibits racial discrimination in "public accommodations" like "swimming pools" unless those entities are "distinctly private." Odds are, the Valley Swim club is not "distinctly private" because the PHRA and the case law imply "distinctly private" applies only to bona fide fraternal organizations that do not let nonmembers use their facilities at all, not the simple paid-your-membership-dues-and-swim system the Valley Swim Club used.
How The Valley Swim Club Racial Discrimination Lawsuit Will Go Down
http://www.litigationandtrial.com/2009/07/articles/litigation/news/how-the-valley-swim-club-racial-discrimination-lawsuit-will-go-down/

[Newster1]

Wo cares? if a PRIVATE club or business doesn't want you, for whatever reason, go spend your hard-earned money and time at one who DOES!

[skyk-2009]

No because that is NOT the law and NO club or business for that matter should be above the Law.

[toldyouso29]

by tmittelstaed July 12, 2009 10:38 PM PDT
I hope that the club allows the camp to swim for free, that would be a nice gesture and I'm sure the camp could use the money better than the swim club. While I understand the apprehension of the children my guess would be that the day the children come back that all of the non-racists in the swim club would be there to make absolutely sure that the racists in the club put a sock in it. I would think that the camp bringing the children back to the club would be a fantastic lesson in teaching the children that it is important to stand up against racists.


Are you a white person?

I polled at least 10 blacks the other day about your comment that being asked about WElfare was racist and disrespectful and found NONE who did not think it was racist. In fact, they said it was one of the many stupid things even well meaning white did to them--that, and expect them to know famous blacks or ask them to sing or dance (because everyone knows blacks do those things so well) all are denigrating--because they reduce a person down to their skin color and the expectations for that skin color--now you make the comment that the blacks should get free swimming--why? so whites can say they are moochers. it does not show the price of racism--it plays into the same stereotypes that angers whites and justifies their resistance to affirmative action and other attempts to level the playing field and it underlines the concept of shiftless, scheming blacks, who make up stories looking for a handout.

only a white person or a very indoctrinated sort of Clarence Thomas personality would be thinking that way--are you one of those?

[Stormy500]

"Club That Ousted Blacks May Let Them In"

That's mighty white of them.

I hope the parents give them a resounding NO.

[toldyouso29]

It would be fitting, that no matter what they offer..NO minorities touch them with a 10 foot pole--that way, when they try to show that they are not racists--they find it hard to find tokens willing to front for them.

The move was advised by the club's attorney and its sole purpose was to soften the investigation by showing the "willingness of the club to negotiate and meet the people halfway. It is a joke and a sham--it fools no one. I would not allow any kids of mine to go there and would pull them out of the camp if the director was so weak and stupid that she allowed her camp and the kids from that camp to be used this way.

They made this bed--let their racist butts lay in it--and if they don't want to "appear" so racist when their excuses for their acts are found to be lies--let them find the going hard to redeem themselves. the campers owe them nothing and certainly, what fool wants to go to a place where it has been made blatantly clear that they are not wanted? What is the point to that? As for "free swimming" stop trying to get stuff for free--blacks are prouder than that and are NOT the freeloading schemers that racist whites like to say that they are.

[tmittelstaed]

I hope that the club allows the camp to swim for free, that would be a nice gesture and I'm sure the camp could use the money better than the swim club. While I understand the apprehension of the children my guess would be that the day the children come back that all of the non-racists in the swim club would be there to make absolutely sure that the racists in the club put a sock in it. I would think that the camp bringing the children back to the club would be a fantastic lesson in teaching the children that it is important to stand up against racists.

[toldyouso29]

Bad idea--because people will use that to say the minorities made up the accusation to get special favors. No self respecting black person would WANT to go there after the way they acted. Not even if they Paid them to return. Have more self respect. To want "freebies" is sad and pathetic it is a bad as people who always complain at restaurants or always seem to find a 'hair' in their food--after a while they become cariacature for being moochers or free loaders. Many already think of blacks that way--so instead of capitalizing on the obvious self serving gesture of the club, the campers' spokesperson should politely tell them to stick it where the sun don't shine.

don't become fodder for whites to claim all the whining and hype was for moochers who wanted a freebie. At some point, some blacks need to learn the games that are constantly being played on them and stop being pawns. They should swim somewhere else and let the club take their lumps from the investigators and find their tokens somewhere else. Because you can bet that if the people were hostile before, inside they are seething and still are--

For new blacks stupid enough to attend--don't eat or drink anything there and if someone leaves their clothing unattended--immediately vacate the area lest they try to set you up and say you stole something so their racism about all blacks being theives is validated. it is time for blacks to stop being so easy to manipulate and set up.

NO--to the pool offer--because though the offer may now have changed the attitudes and people making it have not--don't lower yourselves to play that game with them.

[toldyouso29]

They may let them back in? Well maybe the kids and their camp have too much self respect to return. The Director said why should she submit the kids to the trauma of returning to that place--but then...here comes the PC attorney saying they will give audience...why should they? If the whites want their club to themselves--so be it--but don't take people's money , then mistreat them, then claim there were too many AND the kids changed the complexion of the club.

you betcha--and if the number of kids were not known --then how was the amount to charge reached? As a matter of fact, Alethia Wright released the emails back and forth from her to the club about the number of kids (released to CNN) so the number was known--now they will look into the capacity issue--as for the lying director--a member says they do not presently have any black members and so the "diversity claim is BS) looks like the director is caught in lies left and right
The reason they are offering to let the kids back in is due to their lawyers telling them to do so or face lawsuits and possible closure.

I say, f(8& them and let them fry--as for those who say they have a right to their racist views--sure they do--but the minute they transact with the public, the little racists need to learn to behave like human beings instead of the racial dregs of the white race--if you open your pool to the public for money--then "TRAIN" your members to have manners and keep their ugliness in check or get sued.

I hope they close the club--pool and all, fill in the pool, pave it over and put a plaque there that says "racism destroys more than morale--it took our club and beat us over the head with it. RIP" LMAO

[Solarrays247]

Amen! You certainly said it much better than I ever could! :=)

[gramto8]

if you open your pool to the public for money--then "TRAIN" your members to have manners and keep their ugliness in check or get sued.

by toldyouso29 July 12, 2009 9:41 PM PDT

Wouldn't it be wonderful if we were to a point in our country's history that no one HAD to 'train' anyone to be non-racist? The way things are going, I don't picture us getting there anytime in the next three centuries.

[cantstandit]

I think you all should be allowed to be racist but just remember it is a violation of the interstate commerce law. That is why the FEDS get involved. So Pay up RACISt.

[cantstandit]

I think you all should be allowed to be racist but just remember it is a violation of the interstate commerce law. That is why the FEDS get involved. So Pay up RACISt.

[toldyouso29]

You don't have to "allow" racism. It is inevitable. It is where the weak, confused and economically threatened lash out at anyone or anything different that they fear they must now compete with--the easiest way to single out people to hate is by differences. Then the first group whines about the second group who whines about the first and maybe a 3rd group who whines about the 2nd and 1st group until there are more whiners and hating going on than solutions and compromise.

When you dissect the socioeconomic strata of racists, you find them invariably to have been from the lower eschelons of society who have taken their hatred and mistrust and prejudices with them, no matter how far they have advanced later economically. In other words--you see a racist--you see the dregs of any race--hoping to deflect from their own fears and deficiencies by continually pointing out the differences and problems in others and blaming them for what is wrong in their own world/lives.

[rwsmith29456]

Take note that the south does not have a corner on racism.

[skyk-2009]

No but the South has SO MUCH more than everyone else... what was it? I believe it wasn't more than 6 months ago that the SPLC had a trial against the Klan and two of their leaders in Kentucky? LOL Oh no, when it comes to Racism NO other part of the Country can hold them a light.

[toldyouso29]

Actually this is not true. The KKK was purported to have originated in Indiana--that is in the midwest and parts of rural America no matter where you are can be very, very racist. The South has been criticized due to their actions during the Civil Rights era, but in large swaths of the north, there have been heinous racist crimes with blacks and others being lynched. Four states with horrendous records of racism are Texas, W. Virginia, Pennsylvania and Indiana.

There have been at least 2 dragging deaths of black men behind pick up trucks in Texas within the past few years. Indiana was notorious for hangings (like the famous hanging of blacks that were depicted in Life Magazine --Marion, Indiana) and the Klan routinely holds court there.

Two incidences stand out in my mind about racism and the "North"

A sign hanging on a gasoline pump in W. Virginia--in 1978--"No ni66er restrooms"

A sign on a BILLBOARD in West TerreHaute, IN 1979--"Ni66er don't let us catch you over here when the sun goes down"

I have traveled all over the US and can say that it appears Southerners are more comfortable with and can live side by side with minorities with far more grace than many in the North. The accusation that the South is more racist has to do with a certain point in time and now the stereotyping--but in all honesty, there appears to be far more racism of a far more overt and ugly nature in the North--esp the midwest or small Northern towns. Kansas is rife with racism--even among the teenagers.

[clarkalex]

Pretty blatant racism if a 9 year old picks up on it and doesn't want to return. And it's not 'whining' as someone put it. Since when was it wrong to speak out against something that shouldn't be happening? Heck, I'm ---- (doesn't matter, does it?) and I wouldn't use a racist facility.

[rhs648]

So many assumptions. How do we know if the nine-year-old child heard these things from someone at the pool or from the camp director or someone else from that group. If someone from the camp group thought it was a racist incident, you can imagine the buzz and talk and remarks both made and heard on the bus ride away from the pool. We just don't know at this point what happened other than the he saids and she saids. We are basing our opinions on what may or may not have happened and almost sound bite articles and broadcasts. Have you ever answered a question wrong because you didn't hear what was was actually asked? Happens all of the time.

[skyk-2009]

I don't know what all the complaining is about. The LAW is the LAW and it's been around for way over 30 years. When the Club agreed to allow those kids to swim in that pool, they should have been allowed to do so regardless of the color of their skin. The Law in this case is so clear that we should just allow the Justice Officials proceed with their jobs and let the Club deal with this in Civil Courts.

[toldyouso29]

So many assumptions. How do we know if the nine-year-old child heard these things from someone at the pool or from the camp director or someone else from that group. If someone from the camp group thought it was a racist incident, you can imagine the buzz and talk and remarks both made and heard on the bus ride away from the pool. We just don't know at this point what happened other than the he saids and she saids. We are basing our opinions on what may or may not have happened and almost sound bite articles and broadcasts. Have you ever answered a question wrong because you didn't hear what was was actually asked? Happens all of the time.
**************

We know what the camp director has confirmed in interviews:

1. That the children were very well behaved
2. That at issue was the capacity of the pool and safety
3. That several racial incidences occurred and the director said he would handle them
4. That the director stated on the record during radio interviews that the decision was made to cancel the agreement because the minority children changed the "complexion" of the swim club. This was amended in later interviews to "atmosphere"

We also know via emails shared by CNN:that the director lied about not knowing the capacity as evidenced by emails back and forth between him and the camp director

and according to the director the club has a diverse membership--but according to actual members, they do not remember a black person being a member within the past year.

Some of what we know is the direct result of what the club said--also we know that the latest offer to reinstate the kids was not because the club wanted to do the right thing or was remorseful (some voted against) but as the director said--the club was subpoenaed and advised to take this route by their attorneys.

That means it is a ploy and all of this means there is more than enough information to blow the directors claim of capacity out of the water, to blow the claim of diversity out of the water and to blow his claim that he did not know the amount of kids until they arrived out of the water--which makes the director a liar.

A liar and a racist club going into at least 2 Federal investigations and in dire need of some good PR like the kind one can get by having some blacks pose as tokens of the tolerance of the club--preferably, the very ones who might sue you (to nullify the complian) if not--then a Clarence Thomas or Condi like person to walk around and claim they got to come on in and that the water is "fine".

[rhs648]

Even if some of the club members were racists, they paid their dues to use the pool. Should membership be based on a person's racist views. Further, it is not illegal to be a racist or to have racist views. It only becomes illegal if you act on racist views. For example, you refuse to hire someone because of their race. How do you regulate or legislate thinking. You don't. Only actions can be regulated or legislated.

[cantstandit]

No one said you could not have racist views. But you don't let kids in to swim and then decide to call them names and insult them. If you do
then you deserve to be punished. I hope they get a big pay day.

[brianbwb-2009]

A part you missed son, the victims also paid their fees, $1950, in full. Since the club originally accepted the money, for the express purpose of letting the victims use the pool, then the subsequent cancellation of the delivery of the paid for services, based solely on the ethnicity of the victims, is indeed illegal.

No, it is not illegal to be a racist, as it is also not illegal to boycott, demonstrate, and otherwise apply the appropriate civil and legal sanctions to those who are known to be so.

Shout it from the rooftops if you are a racist, I have no problem with that, but don't then turn around and whine that you are adversely affected in civil society as a consequence. After all, freedom of speech is finally becoming welded inextricably to responsibility of speech.

I invite all racists to unmask, and state their racist views, not as anonymous cowards, but as named individuals, those with the courage of their convictions.

After all, in war, it is always easier to defeat the enemy if the enemy is not camouflaged.

[toldyouso29]

" It only becomes illegal if you act on racist views. For example, you refuse to hire someone because of their race. How do you regulate or legislate thinking. You don't. Only actions can be regulated or legislated."

How right you are, Oh clueless one. When the club kicked the camp out after they had paid and after racist remarks were heard and after the Director knew of these remarks and after the director said the pool could not meet the capacity and did not know so many kids would be there--the club had ACTED.

The problem? If the roster shows that the combination of the club members at the pool that day and the camp kids did not exceed pool capacity and if it is true that Alithea Wright shared emails from the club advising them of the 65 campers and the club accepting that number and charging a certain amount--the club Bigot has a problem.

Here's some advice--before engaging psuedo intellect--check to make certain your potential comments do not make the other side's point.

[rhs648]

Once accusations or questions are made about whether an organization is racist, it is all over for that organization. Every group and government agency comes down on an organization accused of being racist. There really isn't any way to defend yourself even if the accusations aren't true. This is how we do things in America. We do things through intimidation and the threat of litagation and punishment. Some people might liken this to a police state. Of course, these truisms will imediately cause posters to condemn me as a racist even though they know nothing about me. They will do so not knowing my race, religion, occupation, or anything else about me. As someone once said, only in America ....

[toldyouso29]

Liar. Exxon, Crackerbarrel, and Walmart have all faced multi pronged lawsuits for racism--last we heard they were all still in business. Stop hiding behind a post--that you would even apologize for this says more about you and your own mindset than your professed adoration of Sarah Palin ever did. LOL

[skyk-2009]

No rhs648, I have SEEN a police state... Alabama in 1963? THAT was a POLICE STATE! That was a State where Nazi's felt right at home, citizens were dragged from their burning homes in the middle of the night and lynched, bands of armed self appointed vigilante road around administering the STATES idea of justice at will, fully backed by the Government and police. Now THAT was a POLICE STATE.

[toldyouso29]

NO--that as not a police state. In a policed state the ordinary citizen does not run wild and mobs do not rule--in a police state, it is the government and the military and police doing all the killing while the citizens either spy for them and lie for them or keep their heads down and hope that they are not noticed.

The civil rights era was mob rule--plain and simple. Chaos and mayhem condoned by and encouraged by the state--but acted on and/or excused by both state and ordinary citizens.

[toldyouso29]

Blacks and Hispanics should not return to that pool. Let the civil rights agencies do their jobs. This club is just trying to save face and mitigate potential law suits and closure or censure that may be a result of all those agencies who are planning to investigate them.

if the kids already have a more receptive place to swim, the camp director should say "Thanks but no thanks" to the racist club and let them stew in their own juices.

That "near unanimous vote" was most likely the result of the director telling his club members that if they did not make amends, that after all the agencies and Congress got through with them and the courts got through with them--they would not only NOT have a swimming pool--they would also not have a club. But since it was not unanimous--we can take that to mean that some would rather lose their club entirely than ever share it with minorities.

What a commentary on today's racist cadres.

[tmittelstaed]

"...But since it was not unanimous--we can take that to mean that some would rather lose their club entirely than ever share it with minorities...."

That is almost certainly the case. In the last article from CBS on this I blogged that it is likely a vocal minority who pushed the club director into closing the pool. Looks like I was right.

[thomderr1]

You are so correct.
My family is now a mix of Irish, Native American, German, Hispanic and Polish blood. Our jaws dropped when we read the original report. The new acts of the club are nothing more than, "Closing the barn door after the horses got out!"

[mswolfestock]

I'll bet y'all a nickel that the club will shut down in order to avoid admitting non-whites. Just wait until the Department of Justice gets done with them.

[Solarrays247]

Marcus Allen, hearing you speak in that video, and seeing your innocent, sad, little face was heartbreaking! What a terrible experience for young children!

Marcus, please believe that not all white people are so hateful and crass! And you, young man, have more class in your tiny, little finger, than those nasty club members have in their entire bodies!

I'm happy to hear that you now have somewhere new to swim!
Wishing you and your little friends a wonderful, fun-filled summer!

[Solarrays247]

CarlR609, political correctness run wild? No....this is not "political correctness" on my part.....I MEANT every word! I believe in equality for all, even poor bigots like you! You are entitled to hate anyone as much as you want. This is a free country after all.

[airboatboy]

Hey, come on, let all the kids swim in the pool! White kids swim in the front, black kids swim in the back!

[skyk-2009]

CarlR609, To compare what YOU think would have happened to a bunch of White Kids, with NO evidence of ANYTHING such as that EVER happening to a group of White Kids shows YOU ignorance. To answer your question NO it would NOT have happened to a bunch of White Kids and if it had you'd have had a bunch of screaming parents at the door wanting to know WHY their kids were denied the service they'd paid for. Time for YOU to put away the Hood and Sheet, America has changed.