In Senate, When 60 Doesn't Equal 60

AP Analysis: Franken Win, Filibuster-Proof Number Meaningless If Democrats Don't Unite

(AP)  Al Franken's victory in the marathon race to elect Minnesota's second senator gives Democrats control of 60 seats, the number needed to overcome any Republican delaying tactic aimed at blocking elements of President Barack Obama's ambitious agenda.

But numbers are not the same as votes in the Senate. And to enact administration priorities on health care, energy and other issues, Democrats will have to remain as united in support of legislation as Republicans are in opposition, no easy task in an institution where lawmakers weigh regional concerns, ideology and narrow political self-interest as well as party loyalty.

The delaying tactic, called a filibuster, requires three-fifths of the Senate to close debate and bring legislation to a vote. The Senate has 100 members, meaning 60 are required to stop a filibuster.

"At 60, every member has a veto," says Eric Ueland, who was chief of staff to former Senate Republican Majority Leader Bill Frist. Meaning that any of the 60 senators - 58 Democrats and two Democratic-leaning independents - gain added leverage in negotiations with the White House or even their own leaders.

In the current lineup, Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid can be certain of success only to the extent that he can hold together Sen. Bernard Sanders, a Vermont liberal, and Sen. Ben Nelson, a Nebraska conservative, along with 57 other strong-minded, senators of varying views and priorities.

Pragmatically, there are other complications confronting Senate Democrats, in the form of prolonged illnesses of two Senate veterans. Sen. Robert C. Byrd, 91, of West Virginia, was released from the hospital Tuesday after treatment for a staph infection, and Sen. Edward M. Kennedy of Massachusetts was operated on more than a year ago for brain cancer.

Neither man has been in the Capitol for weeks, and it is not known when, or even whether, either or both will return. Without them, Democrats can count only 58 votes in their own ranks.

Franken's victory was sealed on Tuesday when the Minnesota Supreme Court rejected former Sen. Norm Coleman's challenge to last fall's election. Franken, a former "Saturday Night Live" comedian, said he was "thrilled and honored" with the outcome. The loser e-mailed his supporters as he was conceding publicly, a possible step toward a gubernatorial race next year.

"Sen.-elect Franken's presence will not mean that Democrats will just be able to jam through our agenda. Nor does it make it any less critical for Democrats and Republicans to work together," said Jim Manley, spokesman for Reid.

He added that the Democratic caucus is diverse. "No one's vote is ever automatic, and of course, up until now we have gotten very little to no help from Republicans, who are simply saying no to everything and betting on this president to fail," he said.

Republicans argue the opposite, that Democrats have made little attempt to seek common ground and look only for a small number of converts, as they did in passing the $787 billion economic stimulus legislation last winter.

Sen. Mitch McConnell, the Republican leader, warned of the impact of a 60-vote majority when Sen. Arlen Specter, a former Republican, switched parties in April, leaving Democrats with control of 59.

"What this means, if we are not successful in Minnesota, as you know, is that the Democrats, at least on paper, will have 60 votes. I think the danger of that for the country is that there won't automatically be an ability to restrain the excess that is typically associated with big majorities and single-party rule," he said.

"So I think the threat to the country presented by this defection really relates to the issue of whether or not in the United States of America our people want the majority to have whatever it wants without restraint, without a check or a balance."

If that sounds like a theme for the 2010 congressional campaign, so be it.

In fact, to the extent that individual Democrats believe they will be judged at the polls in 2010 on how well they can govern, the 60th vote is of significant advantage. But to the extent that any one of them fear being attacked as the deciding vote for legislation that is intensely controversial - a health care bill that taxes some medical benefits, for example, or an energy bill that Republicans allege includes a new tax on consumers - it will be anything but that.

An early test may come next month, when Democrats hope to have health care legislation on the floor of the Senate. Democratic Sen. Max Baucus, chairman of the Senate Finance Committee, has been seeking agreement on a bipartisan plan with a handful of Republicans. If those talks falter, Democrats may need 60 votes to advance one of the administration's highest priorities.

Which may explain why the White House said in a statement on Tuesday that Mr. Obama looks "forward to working with Senator-elect Franken to build a new foundation for growth and prosperity by lowering health care costs and investing in the kind of clean energy jobs and industries that will help America lead in the 21st century."

[hungry1968-15]

by Joe_NY_15 July 1, 2009 1:06 PM PDT
by notblue July 1, 2009 1:02 PM PDT
it does no good to provide examples of acomplishments to a purposely ignorant troll that refuses to acknowledge them. Enough said.
_______________________

Precisely, when you are an ignorant troll, no amount of information is sufficient.

I gave the moron two examples, but still didn't meet her Liberal agenda, so they were dismissed by the Lib, the dikwad was still asking for more






You gave $1.40 gas prices, and a 10,000 Dow Jones average as "proof" that Bush did something positive?

Those $1.40 gas prices were gone within 2 MONTHS of him assuming office, and they've NEVER been back there again!!!

The Dow Jones went DOWN 6 months after he took office, and it didn't recover until October 2007. And then it turns out that those gains were all built on the economic scams perpetrated because Bush and the regulatory agencies looked the other way, allowing the stocks to be built on BS and garbage. I suppose you consider AIG, GM, Chrysler, and Citi Group to be all-American success stories under Bush too, don't you?




Better yet, why don't you offer proof that Bush left office while the Dow was at 10,000 points, and gas prices were $1.40 a gallon, to PROVE how successful his regime was.

This should be funny.

[andejack]

Speaking of clowns, we've got another one now and MN will become an even greater laughing stock than when we had Jessie. I understand and accept the decision, but sure wish somehow we had had an alternative that wasn't an offensive commedian, a clown, or a politician. Believe it or not country, MN does have reasonable, talented, respectful, intelligent citizens. Unfortunately, we never seem to be able to convince any of them to join the circus of national politics!

[Joe_NY_15]

by johndevinejr July 1, 2009 6:29 AM PDT

That's the way a democracy should be.
______________________

Unfortunately, stupid libs don't even know that America is NOT a democracy, but a Representative Republic....

[Joe_NY_15]

by notblue July 1, 2009 1:02 PM PDT
it does no good to provide examples of acomplishments to a purposely ignorant troll that refuses to acknowledge them. Enough said.
_______________________

Precisely, when you are an ignorant troll, no amount of information is sufficient.

I gave the moron two examples, but still didn't meet her Liberal agenda, so they were dismissed by the Lib, the dikwad was still asking for more

[hungry1968-15]

by DaBroiler July 1, 2009 12:26 PM PDT

Anything that keeps the Dem's out of office is a success.






Please - rant on about all of the "successes" from the republicans reign of failure from 1/2001 - 1/2007.

I asked notblue to name ONE thing that the Bush regime did right, and he couldn't come up with ANYTHING, except a pathetic attempt at revising history.

[notblue]

it does no good to provide examples of acomplishments to a purposely ignorant troll that refuses to acknowledge them. Enough said.

[notblue]

hungry, conservatives are fellow Americans, diversity and tollerance of oppssing view points is what makes America great, your prejiduce is un-American. NO true be it liberal or conservative american has anything in common with a radical Islamic dictator, this exemplifies your profound hatred and ignorance. Amnesty for illegals was not Bush's plan, wrong again of course. Hindsite is a beatiful thing and idiots like you who cling to it and pretend to have forseen it, just makes you appear self absorbed and irrellevant. If there was any proof bush ordered the CIA to lie to congress and America it would have been discovered by one of the countlees partisan investigations performed by the Dems, since no charges were brought since they have the majority and now a super majority your allegations are completley false and without proof of any kind, just more of the same lies you continue to spew. In case you didn't know congress is compriosed of both parties and niether had a super majority until now and your Dems werein the majority for the last two and one half years so it appears you are the one that truly needs to learn how government works, enough said, hateful, ignorant trolls like you are not worth the effort to educate.

[hungry1968-15]

by Joe_NY_15 July 1, 2009 10:46 AM PDT
Stuart Smalley is a member of the Senate ? I guess the Democrat party has become such a joke, so why not have comedians making your major decisions.....that's the best you libs have, Stuart Smalley as your leader......LMAO !!!! LOL !!!






Stuart Smalley is a FICTIONAL CHARACTER, junior.

I would take the FICTIONAL CHARACTER, Stuart Smalley over 3/4 of the republicans that you clowns still have in the Senate.



By the way, how many GOP senators have graduated *** laude from Harvard in political science, like Al Franken did?

[hungry1968-15]

Are you kidding?!?!

Hey CBS CENSORS: C U M laude is a Latin honor - I'm not talking about a porn flick!!

[Joe_NY_15]

How many other parties have Stuart Smalley as their leader....none

a Comedian is your leader.......the country is laughing at your pathetic party....Barney Fwrank and Stuart Smalley are your leaders....LOL

[hungry1968-15]

See my post from 11:10. It still applies, so there's no point in repeating myself.

[Joe_NY_15]

Stuart Smalley is a member of the Senate ? I guess the Democrat party has become such a joke, so why not have comedians making your major decisions.....that's the best you libs have, Stuart Smalley as your leader......LMAO !!!! LOL !!!

[koko98-2009]

If the Democrats need the votes they will get them. I was at the Capitol the night Bob Dole rolled Pete Wilson into the Senate in a wheelchair with an IV tude sticking out of his arm to vote. Nothing is too crazy for these guys.

[hungry1968-15]

by notblue July 1, 2009 8:19 AM PDT
hungry, success is perspective and you have none, your biased daily false diatribes are utter nonsense , wht good would it do to point out acomplishments if idiots like you refuse to recognize them? Brainwashed ingrates like you are waste of time, one has to recognize reality to have an intelligent debate, which of course leaves you out.






Success like failure IS perspective: His "amnesty for all illegals" failed miserably (THANK GOD!!), his "privatizing social security" failed miserably (THANK GOD!! Can you imagine if social security was tied into the stock market like he wanted?!?!), we're mired in two wars - one forgotten, the other unnecessary, our financial regulatory agencies were gutted resulting in our economic collapse, our safety agencies (FDA, USDA, CPSC, CDC, etc, etc) had their budgets gutted resulting in MANY food recalls and dangerous products, and our foreign policy alienated MOST of our allies, all while destroying our military.




THAT is the legacy that YOU defend.

[notblue]

The Dems wanted amnesty for illegals, guess you don't remember. Social security will be bankrupt and any ideas are better than none, at the time that was presented the stock market was flying high. The two wars we are fighting were started and funded by both parties. It took both isdes to establish budgets, see everything you spew is your own twisted version of reality which of course is false and neccessary to make sense of your idiotic diatribes and fantasy existance of hate for fellow Americans.

[hungry1968-15]

I don't hate "fellow Americans" - I hate CONSERVATIVES. Conservatives and their twisted, polluted, holier than thou views, have NOTHING to do with America. They are out for themselves, and their big business buddies that are trying to rape every last nickel and dime out of the American taxpayer / consumer. And if America sinks / dies / dissolves while trying to achieve those views, then so be it.

Conservatives have MUCH MORE in common with Ahmadinejhad and the "Grand Ayatollah" than they do with the founding fathers.




Amnesty for illegals was BUSH'S plan, and he pushed for it to pass, very, very hard.

His social security plans would have ENSURED that our entire financial system collapsed - not just the mortgage, credit, insurance, and automotive industries - but the WHOLE DAMMN THING!

Yes the dems voted to go into Iraq. Based on the FALSE INTELLIGENCE that BUSH told the CIA to fabricate!! You still can't blame them for voting on what they THOUGHT was the truth. How were they supposed to know that Bush was lying?

The budgets are created by the WHITE HOUSE, and submitted to congress for appropriate funding. (At some point, you really should learn how your government works.)

[nikosk11]

"What this means, if we are not successful in Minnesota, as you know, is that the Democrats, at least on paper, will have 60 votes. I think the danger of that for the country is that there won't automatically be an ability to restrain the excess that is typically associated with big majorities and single-party rule," Sen. Mitch McConnell, the Republican leader, warned said.

But it was OK when George W. Moron was in power and both houses controlled by the republiscums. Hypocrite.

[rjstolba]

I read Inhofe"s clown comment about Franken's win. Coming from Inhofe, this has got to be ironic. Franken was a comedian and a good one at that. Inhofe"s carreer has been COMICAL: his performance isn't even considered good by his own party. Jim--take a look in the mirror. Those big, colored eyes and mouth looking back at you should tell you something about yourself!!!

[hungry1968-15]

by notblue July 1, 2009 8:05 AM PDT
hungry you ever get tired of making it up as you go? Guess not, there was not one bit of truth in your statement. Somehow libs likeyou have been able to convince yourselves that the Dems were absent or in comas when these governemt agencies were established, utter nonsense from the mind that has invented it.







The BIGGEST truth in my statement is that you STILL cannot name ONE positive thing that Bush did for America.

As for the rest of my statement, simply compare the hurricane response between hurricanes Andrew and Katrina. During Andrew, the emergency supplies were driving through 80 MPH winds in the tail of the storm, and during Katrina, "Brownie" didn't even know that there were people in the Superdome, while CNN was SHOWING him the LIVE VIDEO FEED!!!!

[notblue]

hungry, success is perspective and you have none, your biased daily false diatribes are utter nonsense , wht good would it do to point out acomplishments if idiots like you refuse to recognize them? Brainwashed ingrates like you are waste of time, one has to recognize reality to have an intelligent debate, which of course leaves you out.

[jodyrae4]

I hope he changes his snarky condensending attitude. Jerk

[hungry1968-15]

by Joe_NY_15 July 1, 2009 7:12 AM PDT
by johndevinejr July 1, 2009 6:36 AM PDT
Can you name one thing that the Bush Administration did right?
One success?
_____________________

A 10,000 Dow and $1.49/gallon gasoline.....let's see the Spendicrats match that, John






Laughable!!!

You give him credit for the Dow and gas prices when he TOOK office, but ignore the $4 gas prices that existed for a year, $3 gas prices that existed for MOST of his presidency, and the 8,200 Dow average when he left office?!?!



You're such a revisionist!!!

[hungry1968-15]

by notblue July 1, 2009 7:03 AM PDT
johndevine, not as amazing as not being able to recognize the fact that it required both sides of the isle to make policy. My statement is the truth yours is selfinduced, brainwashed rationalization. Unfortunately when one is able to ignore truth and fact and hate based on falsehood then tany intelligent debate is not possible.






Translation: "No, I cannot name ONE positive thing that the conservative republicans - particularly Bush - accomplished during their six year reign of failure."


quickly101: Homeland security is the BIGGEST bureaucratic nightmare EVER conceived. It took fully functional agencies, (like FEMA and Border Patrol), and made them completely dysfunctional, while causing their budgets to SOAR through the roof!!

[notblue]

hungry you ever get tired of making it up as you go? Guess not, there was not one bit of truth in your statement. Somehow libs likeyou have been able to convince yourselves that the Dems were absent or in comas when these governemt agencies were established, utter nonsense from the mind that has invented it.

[babooph]

In the US fake democracy,the democrats must sell out to the lobbyists when they are the majority-The Reagan dems put his tax cut for the rich in& later under Bush,when a minority,claimed they could not stop more tax reductions for the rich.

[Joe_NY_15]

by johndevinejr July 1, 2009 6:36 AM PDT
Can you name one thing that the Bush Administration did right?
One success?
_____________________

A 10,000 Dow and $1.49/gallon gasoline.....let's see the Spendicrats match that, John

[notblue]

johdevine,your proof that "success" is nothing more than perspective.

[pubsnomore]

All fabricated numbers that came crumbling down around the house of cards it was built on.

[jwesel1]

Calling that an improvement from 13,000 Dow and $0.99/gallon gasoline is hardly an improvement.

[hungry1968-15]

by notblue July 1, 2009 6:25 AM PDT
It is sooo tiresome to come to these posts every day and read the brainwashed libs claim it was all one sides fault when in reality this is the first filibuster proof congress with a sitting president in many decades, in fact the senate was only seperated by a couple of votes through recent history. It has taken both sides of the isle to make policy, fund and start wars but the ingrates at these posts have been able to convince themselves the poor dems had nothing to do with anything. The only question that remains is how long these same simpletons will continue to wrongly blame the repubs for policy they truly have nothing to do with any longer.






The democrats didn't filibuster anywhere NEAR as much as the republicans did, when they were in the minority.

I'm sure that they regret not using that anti-democratic process that the republicans used like a battle-axe, but it doesn't mean that the democrats were wrong for NOT using it.

The "filibuster" needs to be permanently eliminated, and this would be the perfect opportunity to outlaw it - now that the republicans don't have enough votes to save their "crutch".

[Joe_NY_15]

Are you insane ??? Why do you think the founders of this county included the fillibuster ? where do you get off suggesting a constitutional procedure be "eliminated" now that you have a dictatorship in control.....It doesn't need to be eliminated, you have a fillibuster proof majority, so go ahead and pass whatever you want......oh wait, not all 60 Democrats want to join Obama in destroying this country....sorry, your problem...your party

[notblue]

hungry, why is it you can't even realize your own words contradict your statement. America had a democracy right up until today, now complete control rests with one party, get it? Guess not!

[hungry1968-15]

Since when is it a "constitutional procedure"?

And why in the world do you think that OBSTRUCTING A VOTE, could EVER be more democratic than putting an issue to a majority vote?!?!

You two clowns have heard of VOTING, haven't you?

It's amazing how you guys will SH** all over this country and every principle it was founded on to uphold your destructive neo con policies.

What's next - are you going to scream and cry because I say that lobbying and lobbyists should be outlawed?

[notblue]

It is sooo tiresome to come to these posts every day and read the brainwashed libs claim it was all one sides fault when in reality this is the first filibuster proof congress with a sitting president in many decades, in fact the senate was only seperated by a couple of votes through recent history. It has taken both sides of the isle to make policy, fund and start wars but the ingrates at these posts have been able to convince themselves the poor dems had nothing to do with anything. The only question that remains is how long these same simpletons will continue to wrongly blame the repubs for policy they truly have nothing to do with any longer.

[johndevinejr]

It always amazes me that republicans refuse to recognize their responsibility in the totally failed policies of thier party.

Can you name one thing that the Bush Administration did right?
One success?

[quickly101]

He along with Congress in the aftermath of 9-11 pushed the Homeland Security Cabinet position through. Other than that I cannot think of a thing he did for the common man. He was a representative of the wealthy elite as are all republicans. I don't know how a person of average means could ever vote for one. Their stands on social issues are a sham to get the common man to vote for them. Obama one upped them when he instructed his justice department to defend the Defense of Marriage Act.

[notblue]

johndevine, not as amazing as not being able to recognize the fact that it required both sides of the isle to make policy. My statement is the truth yours is selfinduced, brainwashed rationalization. Unfortunately when one is able to ignore truth and fact and hate based on falsehood then tany intelligent debate is not possible.