June 17, 2009 3:31 PM

Bodies Suggest Plane Broke Up In Air

(AP)  Bodies recovered in the Air France disaster show multiple fractures in the legs, hips and arms, a Brazilian official said Wednesday. Experts said such injuries suggest the plane broke up in the air.

A spokesman for Brazilian medical examiners told The Associated Press that autopsies on an undisclosed number of the 50 bodies recovered so far showed the fractures. The official spoke on condition he not be named due to department rules.

The description of the bodies and large pieces of the plane recovered point to the jet breaking apart in the air, said Frank Ciacco, a former forensic expert at the U.S. National Transportation Safety Board.

"Typically, if you see intact bodies and multiple fractures - arm, leg, hip fractures - it's a good indicator of a midflight break up," Ciacco said. "Especially if you're seeing large pieces of aircraft as well."

On Wednesday, the O Estado de S. Paulo newspaper - citing unamed investigators - reported the pattern of fractures and said some of the victims were found with little or no clothing. The newspaper earlier reported the bodies also showed no signs of burns.

Jack Casey, an aviation safety consultant in Washington, D.C., who is a former accident investigator, said the lack of clothing could be significant: "In an in-air break up like we are supposing here, the clothes are just torn away."

He also said multiple fractures are consistent with a midair breakup of the plane.

"Getting ejected into that kind of windstream is like hitting a brick wall - even if they stay in their seats, it is a crushing effect," Casey said. "Most of them were long dead before they hit the water would be my guess."

When a jet crashes into water mostly intact - such as the Egypt Air plane that hit the Atlantic Ocean after taking off from New York in 1999 - the debris and bodies are broken into small pieces, Ciacco said.

"When you've had impact in the water, there is a lot more fragmentation of the bodies. They hit the water with a higher force," he said.

Lack of burn evidence would not necessarily rule out an explosion somewhere outside the passenger cabin, said John Goglia, a former member of the U.S. National Transportation Safety Board.

If something caused the lower fuselage to burn or explode, "passengers would not be exposed to any blast damage" and the plane would still disintegrate in flight," he said. "These are scenarios that cannot be ruled out."

© 2009 The Associated Press. All Rights Reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten, or redistributed.
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by Gpawilli June 27, 2009 9:39 AM EDT
I too received the two photos mentioned above. I received them from my brother who works for an airline. I am not sure how he got but I doubted their validity immediately because of the daylight.

Turns out they were from the series "LOST"

Dont always beleive what you see or read...... I plan to post the photos and the debunking of them on my blog... www.2288beckleyrd.blogspot.com
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by erasmus111 June 18, 2009 5:20 PM EDT
by goeswest June 18, 2009 6:04 AM PDT

I really do truly feel sorry for you and the millions of others who are afficted with this phobia.


Hey, you don't need to feel sorry for me. I'm happy driving wherever I need to go, in my car.: )

The people I feel sorry for are the ones that are in the next plane crash.

It's actually a miracle that there isn't more. I know people that work at the airport. They say that there are "incidents" and near misses everyday that the public doesn't hear about. Also, one works on the planes, and he says that if we knew how badly they are maintained, none of us would fly.
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by goeswest June 18, 2009 9:04 AM EDT
erasmus

So unfortunate that you have such a stong case of flying phobia for you show the classic sign.As you said YOU WANT TO BE IN CONTROL
I was once that way too,had a terrible flying phobia,but overcame
that in 2005 and flew for the first time in my life and since then now I've flown to Europe and to Australia and many other places that you will probably never see for your irrational fear keeps you firmly planted on the ground.One more thing even when you drive,you are not really in full control.You still have to be aware of the idiots on the road in their cars.Yes another plane could hit my plane but the chances of that happening are just SO REMOTE,yes my plane could crash but it takes multiple failures to bring down an aircraft,while it takes just one drunk driver in another car to kill you.

I know that my words here will not persuade you.I really do truly feel sorry for you and the millions of others who are afficted with this phobia.

Best wishes
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by mick7744 June 18, 2009 4:06 AM EDT
On the day following the crash of Flight 477, right after watching news coverage of the disaster, I happened to watch a broadcast on the National Geographic Channel of 'Earth Investigated' dealing with the rapid loss of the planet's magnetic field. They seemed to be using the same maps that were being used on the news broadcasts to provide crash coverage.

It was mainly concerning an area east of Brazil in the South Atlantic known as the 'South Atlantic Anomaly' that covers 2 million square miles where the magnetic field is much weaker. An area that is growing rapidly.

The report said that satellites like the Hubble Space Telescope are powered down when orbiting over that area so as not to sustain damage to their delicate instrumentation and even went on to comment that commercial aircraft might be the first to suffer the effects of this bombardment of the solar winds without adequate protection from the magnetic field. The report mentioned instrument failure and possible structural damage.

This would seem to indicate that at least NASA was aware of the potential danger.

Is this possibility being investigated, or is everyone too worried about the loss of passenger revenue? Perhaps the various powers-that-be made the same callous, greed-inspired decision that Ford made when confronted with the Pinto?s penchant for bursting into flames when rear ended. It was decided that it would be cheaper to settle the resulting lawsuits for death and injury than to make the vehicle safer.

The well publicized phrase that was attributed to Ford when the scandal broke was, ?Let `em burn? or in this case, ?let `em suffer sudden, fatal lung decompression in -50 C temperatures a few miles up over an icy ocean.?

Maybe the plane and the crew were OK and it was the area they were flying in that was at fault.

I really hope that this posting doesn?t disappear from the CBS forum as quickly as my last one did.
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by erasmus111 June 17, 2009 11:24 PM EDT
by goeswest June 17, 2009 7:42 PM PDT
You wont fly but yet you will risk your life by driving.
That sure make a lot of sense.


Well, it makes sense to me. I don't give a rat's ass whether it's a big plane or little plane. All I know is that there have been MANY plane crashes lately.

And when I am driving, I AM IN CONTROL. Not some drunken pilot or some freaking computer.

AND when you are in a car accident, you really don't have time to think about it. Whereas in a plane, you have a LOT of time to think about it. It's a long ways down.
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by erasmus111 June 17, 2009 11:07 PM EDT
by charlie877 June 17, 2009 6:42 PM PDT
People trying to get money for phoney pictures maybe


No one asked for money.
Reply to this comment
by goeswest June 17, 2009 10:42 PM EDT
That is why I dont fly,there are just too many crashes lately.
posted by erasmus

Here is something for you.How many other commercial airline accidents has there been since the Air France crash

ZERO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


How many car accidents have there been with loss of life since
the Air France crash

HUNDREDS UPON HUNDREDS OF THEM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

You wont fly but yet you will risk your life by driving.

That sure make a lot of sense.
Reply to this comment
by cattlekate1 June 17, 2009 9:53 PM EDT
http://www.flightglobal.com/blogs/unusual-attitude/2009/06/af447---the-air-caraibes-story.html
Reply to this comment
by timbby June 17, 2009 9:52 PM EDT
It's hard to believe anyone would believe those pictures are real. They are from the TV show LOST. Geeeeez, c'mon use your brain!

http://www.snopes.com/photos/accident/brazil737.asp
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by cattlekate1 June 17, 2009 9:15 PM EDT
Pics are probably as phoney as the first reports in a UK Tabloid of cell messages such as "I am so scared!" Fake. No cell coverage.

But the awful facts are leading to Pitot/static tubes plugging from ice (WHY DID THE HEATERS FAIL?), and resultant incorrect (THREE PITOTS?) air speed, verticle speed, and altimeter messages. And auto pilot disengages, then pilots are dealing with mach buffeting because they are going too fast, but possibly thinking the clogged Pitot tube "slow air speed" messages are correct. They add engine thrust which matters worse and subsonic aircraft annot operate like supersonic plane. Torque from wind? or too much yaw tail wagging and composite materials cause vertical stabilizer (and tail?) to shear off.

We shall find out soon - the seat assignments of the bodies found will tell alot.

The poor people who were victims of the initial depresurrization were probably asleep, and then instantly had their lungs lungs decompress, and, with the -50 degrees farenheight, plus the lung-sucking winds of 120 mph (or whatever they were in the turbulence), did not know what hit them. I am still concerned about the 170-plus people in the main, forward, and cockpit cabins. Where are they?
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