Speeches Underscore "Great Dividing Line"

Obama And Cheney Offer Stark Ideological Differences On Interrogations Of Terrorists And How To Keep America Safe

(CBS)  It was a debate separated by an hour in time, ten blocks on the map, an election, and profound ideological differences.

America heard President Obama this morning from the National Archives and former Vice President Dick Cheney, a half mile away at the offices of the American Enterprise Institute.

They laid out the stark differences in their approaches to the interrogations of terrorists and the treatment and trial of detainees at Guantanamo Bay.

They both renewed their commitments to keeping America safe, but made it clear they thought the other's strategy would have the opposite effect.

It’s hard to imagine a more elevated setting for the President’s remarks. He spoke from the Mt. Olympus of American democracy - the great rotunda of the National Archives - surrounded on three sides by the Declaration of Independence, the Constitution and the Bill of Rights (though documents in the display cases today were facsimiles, to protect the originals from the harsh TV lights).

He was bluntly critical of his predecessor’s policies calling them "a series of hasty decisions...based upon fear rather than foresight."

In an ordinary conference room at AEI, the conservative think tank, Cheney said made no apologies for what he called "the comprehensive strategy" he said the Bush Administration developed "to make certain our nation never again faced such a day of horror."

To Obama, that strategy included breaches of America’s core values in the methods of surveillance, interrogation and detention of terror suspects.

To Cheney, the policies reflected powers derived from Article II of the Constitution and from the Joint Resolution of Congress authorizing the use of "all necessary and appropriate force" to protect the American people.

More analysis:
Daniel Farber: Mr. Spock Vs. Jack Bauer
Andrew Cohen: Humility And Oversight

Cheney admitted the dispute represented "the great dividing line in our current debate over national security." And it was evident their minds would not be changed by the arguments of the other. Especially on the use of interrogation techniques that Mr. Obama called harsh and Cheney called tough.

"I know some have argued that brutal methods like water-boarding were necessary to keep us safe," said the president. "I could not disagree more."

"They were legal, essential, justified, successful, and the right thing to do," said Cheney of the interrogation methods.

Cheney again called for the release of still-secret CIA memos that he says will show that the interrogation techniques "prevented the violent death of thousands, perhaps hundreds of thousands of people." While admitting to the use of water-boarding, he said “torture was never permitted."Every method used was in full compliance with the Constitution, with our statutes, and treaty obligations," said Cheney.

But an hour before Cheney spoke those words, President Obama made it clear he doesn’t buy them.

"As Commander-in-Chief, I see the intelligence, I bear responsibility for keeping this country safe, and I reject the assertion that these are the most effective means of interrogation."

He said those methods undermine the rule of law, alienate the world, serve as a recruitment tool for terrorists, and increase the will of our enemies to fight us.

There were similar clashes on the use of Guantanamo Bay as a detention facility and the methods for putting the captives on trial.

"Guantanamo became a symbol that helped al Qaeda recruit terrorists to its cause," said President Obama. "Indeed, the existence of Guantanamo likely created more terrorists around the world than it ever detained."

But Cheney countered that it may be easy to receive applause in Europe for closing Guantanamo, "but it's tricky to come up with an alternative that will serve the interests of justice and America's national security."

And the former republican vice president even sided with those democrats who voted to block the transfer of Gitmo detainees to prisons on U.S. soil.

America heard arguments today that fall into the category of irreconcilable. We heard the most articulate spokesmen for the different strategies.

The argument was settled at the polls last November 4. But don’t think for a moment the debate has ended.

---

Mark Knoller is a CBS News White House correspondent. You can read more of his posts in Hotsheet here. You can also follow him on Twitter here: http://twitter.com/markknoller.

[cbsantispin]

PRESIDENT AXLEROD ...

Posted by globalcoolin at 11:43 AM : May 23, 2009,,,

I would view Axelrod more as an edititor than a decision maker, there is a big difference! Axelrod is not Pres. Obama's Dick Cheney, Axelrod just makes sure Pres. Obama's message is attack proof as much as possible, Axelrod is not making any decisions, Pres. Obama is making the decisions.

[globalcoolin]

PRESIDENT AXLEROD PRESENTS A CHALLENGE IN THAT HE POSSES HIS BLACK SOCK PUPPET TO DEFLECT CHALLENGE, CALL HIM ON HIS LIES, OR MAKE ANY RELAVENT COUNTERPOINT.
PRESIDENT AXLROD IS GOING TO HAVE TO ACCEPT THAT HE IS GOING TO BE CHALLENGED AND ON HEALTH CARE AND HIS MAINTENANCE OF OUR NATIONS SECURITY--WHICH HE DON'T KNOW MUCH ABOUT.
BLOW MONEY--HE KNOWS..AND EVEN SAYS WE CAN'T AFFORD THIS AS HE DOES IT!
IT'S LIKELY PRESIDENT AXLROD WILL BE A ONE TERM PRESIDENT. HE'S GOT A SOCK PUPET AND BIDEN TO HAVE TO MANAGE! THE REST OF THE COUNTRY WILL HAVE TO GET BY ON LUCK!

[cbsantispin]

Dick Cheney has been characterized as the most powerful and influential Vice President in history, so powerful in fact that Dick Cheney said the Vice President was now it's own Branch of Government, the 4th Branch of Government and was not connected to the Office of the President. Cheney said the Vice Pres. was its own World! LOL

[cbsantispin]

Dick Cheney has invited Pres. Obama on a hunting trip, if I was Pres. Obama I would decline! On February 11, 2006, Cheney accidentally shot Harry Whittington, a 78-year-old Texas attorney, in the face, neck, and upper torso with birdshot pellets when he turned to shoot a quail while hunting on a southern Texas ranch. It's rumored that Harry Whittington has informed Dick Cheney he was thinking about becoming a Democrat! LOL

[cmongetreal]

Ibesteve2U: See you in court. This "administration" cherry picked for the controversy and amen chorus of the "marching orders" far left. Cheney knows the law and what is permissible for release. Obama opened the barn door, not him. Any chance the ACLU backs him in court? Regardless, the courts WILL rule on it. Good luck w/ that.

[ibsteve2u]

How's that transparency working with the document releases? Cherry-picking for political partisanship points isn't being a public servant. It's being a self-servant. Dear leader, think for us.
Posted by cmongetreal at 10:04 AM : May 22, 2009

You might take a moment to consider the fact that the law specifically forbids the release of intelligence information gathered from any kind of interrogation.

Cheney knows that, too - it is why he is arguing for it, because he knows that if Obama complies, he immediately becomes trapped in the law-breaking precedents of his predecessors.

Cheney is a scoundrel, a piker, and an unconvicted felon...but a patriot? No more than Benedict Arnold was.

For Cheney betrays the ethics, morals, and the very Constitution of this nation with every breath he takes before uttering another collection of his CYA lies.

[cmongetreal]

As stated earlier: "Justifiable" had 2 hrs. of cyber-ranting from his internet soapbox. It's obvious what side of the divide he's from. Too bad the silencers of the left got, wait for it.....Offended! Tired & typical, but certainly NOT tolerant.
How's that transparency working with the document releases? Cherry-picking for political partisanship points isn't being a public servant. It's being a self-servant. Dear leader, think for us.

[ibsteve2u]

Wow...is it me, or are the righties beginning to imbue their comments with a certain manic tone suggestive of a disassociation from reality?

[evilbusheviks]

by partagus7:
I'm getting sick of people blaming USA behaviors as a cause for increase terrorist. Are you actually saying that they are somehow justified in their attacks on us?

***************

Typical republiCON lack of reading comprehension.....

Nobody JUSTIFIED anything, only stated that Guantanamo torture and confinement, much like the atrocities in Abu Ghraib that the bushevik cabal authorized, only created more terrorists and hatred of America around the world. That's a FACT jack, no matter what YOU "think."

[blog_fever2]

I am so thankful someone is pressing our government not to drop our guard just because the last 7 years we have been sucessful in preventing these attacks. I do not want to see another 9/11 or worse. Don't throw the baby out with the bath water just becuase you politically hate Republicans.
Posted by partagus7 at 8:33 AM : May 22, 2009
**************************************************
Only God can prevent/allow these attacks. Period.

"No king is saved by the multitude of an army; A mighty man is not delivered by great strength. A horse is a vain hope for safety; neither shall it deliever any by its great strength. Behold the eye of the Lord is on those who fear Him, on those who hope in His mercy, to deliver their soul from death, and to keep them alive in famine."

"Our soul waits for the Lord; He is our help and our shield, For our heart shall rejoice in Him, because we have trusted in His holy name. Let your mercy, O Lord, be upon us, just as we hope in You." Proverbs 33: 16-22

[partagus7]

I'm getting sick of people blaming USA behaviors as a cause for increase terrorist. Are you actually saying that they are somehow justified in their attacks on us?

Before we got tough with terrorist they successfully attacked the United States almost every year from '95 forward until 9/11. Since 9/11, there have been no successful attacks!

I am so thankful someone is pressing our government not to drop our guard just because the last 7 years we have been sucessful in preventing these attacks. I do not want to see another 9/11 or worse. Don't throw the baby out with the bath water just becuase you politically hate Republicans.

[mrzerato]

"The W admin. will go down as one of the greatest

1. Embarrassments?
2. Tragedies?
3. Dangers?
4. Criminals?
5. Manipulators?
6. Liars?
7. Sadists?
8. Greed-fueled?

....in our nations history."

...
Posted by justifiable

I will say

9: All of the above

Did I get the answer right?

[drbsmithmd]

Rowdy appears to be one of the children I spoke of earlier. Take it easy, no need to damage her further.

[drbsmithmd]

justifiable,

Here,here!!

[evilbusheviks]

by chitown639:

So the oval office WAS authorizing torture....it's nice to see you neo-cons finally owning it....instead of blaming low ranking servicemen.....

***************

Of course they were since the orders came from the very top, and the entire bushevik regime should be on trial for WAR CRIMES in a very nice public affair, followed by a first-rate hanging for treason.

[blog_fever2]

Come now....darth cheney, kindasleezy rice and bozo gonzales all authorized illegal torture and should be on trial for WAR CRIMES!
Posted by evilbusheviks at 7:38 AM : May 22, 2009
******************************************************
Darth Cheney.... lol too funny! I can see him in the Darth Robe too.

[evilbusheviks]

by vistavermin1:
.........the wisdom of Bush's choice.

****************

Now there's a true oxyMORON, since the bush monkey never had any wisdom whatsoever....only knee-jerk partisan opinions while wearing his religion on his sleeve as voices kept telling him to attack, attack, attack.....endless WARmongering and TORTURE! A true moron!

[evilbusheviks]

Gonzales did NOT AUTHORIZE WATERBOARDING!
Posted by Rowdy7701
**************

Come now....darth cheney, kindasleezy rice and bozo gonzales all authorized illegal torture and should be on trial for WAR CRIMES!

[auto1234abc]

Lawyers don't authorize....

Posted by Rowdy7701 at 7:21 AM : May 22, 2009

Are you in denial concerning the numerous opinions from many sources that the legal opinions FROM THE JUSTICE DEPARTMENT REGARDLESS OF HOW FLAWED protect those that followed them -- What do you think is among the attributes that AUTHORIZATION includes? Certainly at a mininum legal protection for actions undertaken in accordance with the opinion rendered,

[td1138]

Thanks but no thanks, Dick. I'd much rather live in Obama's world.