Vermont Nixes Veto, Legalizes Gay Marriage

Becomes 4th State To OK Same-Sex Marriage After Legislature Overrides Governor's Veto

(AP)  Vermont on Tuesday became the fourth state to legalize gay marriage — and the first to do so with a legislature's vote.

The House recorded a dramatic 100-49 vote — the minimum needed — to override Gov. Jim Douglas' veto. Its vote followed a much easier override vote in the Senate, which rebuffed the Republican governor with a vote of 23-5.

Vermont was the first state to legalize civil unions for same-sex couples and joins Connecticut, Massachusetts and Iowa in giving gays the right to marry. Their approval of gay marriage came from the courts.

Tuesday morning's legislative action came less than a day after Douglas issued a veto message saying the bill would not improve the lot of gay and lesbian couples because it still would not provide them rights under federal and other states' laws.

House Speaker Shap Smith's announcement of the vote brought an outburst of jubilation from some of the hundreds packed into the gallery and the lobby outside the House chamber, despite the speaker's admonishment against such displays.

Among the celebrants in the lobby were former Rep. Robert Dostis, D-Waterbury, and his longtime partner, Chuck Kletecka. Dostis recalled efforts to expand gay rights dating to an anti-discrimination law passed in 1992.

"It's been a very long battle. It's been almost 20 years to get to this point," Dostis said. "I think finally, most people in Vermont understand that we're a couple like any other couple. We're as good and as bad as any other group of people. And now I think we have a chance to prove ourselves here on forward that we're good members of our community."

Dostis said he and Kletecka will celebrate their 25th year together in September.

"Is that a proposal?" Kletecka asked.

"Yeah," Dostis replied. "Twenty-five years together, I think it's time we finally got married."

Craig Bensen, a gay marriage opponent who had lobbied unsuccessfully for a nonbinding referendum on the question, said he was disappointed but believed gay marriage opponents were outspent by supporters by a 20-1 margin.

"The other side had a highly funded, extremely well-oiled machine with all the political leadership except the governor pushing to make this happen," he said. "The fact that it came down to this tight a vote is really astounding."

Also in the crowd was Michael Feiner, a farmer from Roxbury and gay marriage supporter, who took a break from collecting sap for maple syrup-making to come to the Statehouse.

"I'm taking a break to come and basically make sure that I was here to witness history," he said.

The House had initially passed the bill last week with a 95-52 vote.

[honestabe8]

somewhere i had read that the first couple to be shown in bed on a prime time tv show were fred and wilma flintstone

[endurorob]

i was going through the TV series DVD aisle at Best Buy, and was a bit amused to see those for "The L Word" (Showtime series about lesbians) being right next to "Leave It To Beaver"
Posted by honestabe8 at 7:06 AM : Apr 8, 2009

Ypu do know what the dirtiest thing ever said on t.v. was (before cable and premium channels) don't you. June Cleaver says "Ward, you were a little hard on the beaver last night?"

[honestabe8]

i was going through the TV series DVD aisle at Best Buy, and was a bit amused to see those for "The L Word" (Showtime series about lesbians) being right next to "Leave It To Beaver"

[honestabe8]

i find committed sex (no matter what the gender) to be less deviant than "wham-bam-thank you ma'am (or thank you dan)" sex. that is one of the reasons that i am celibate between relationships. i don't go out chasing sex. in that sense, i guess i am a deviant in this "get as much as you can" sexual culture.

[endurorob]

endurobob: also, thanks for keeping the discussion civil. that is sometimes a rare thing on these boards.
Posted by honestabe8 at 7:00 AM : Apr 8, 2009

I do my best.

[honestabe8]

endurobob: also, thanks for keeping the discussion civil. that is sometimes a rare thing on these boards.

[honestabe8]

endurobob: with the lesbian sex, there is always a "boom chicka boom boom" soundtrack in my mind

[endurorob]

endurobob: i guess then i disagree with you. as a straight man, the idea of two men doing it sort of sickens me. on the other hand, two women (in my mind hot cheerleader types) is sort of invigorating
Posted by honestabe8 at 6:51 AM : Apr 8, 2009


I forgot to mention that is one of my personal conflicts. Although i consider lesbian sex to be deviant and not equal to hetero sex I also find it to be erotic.

[endurorob]

endurobob: i guess then i disagree with you. as a straight man, the idea of two men doing it sort of sickens me. on the other hand, two women (in my mind hot cheerleader types) is sort of invigorating
Posted by honestabe8 at 6:51 AM : Apr 8, 2009

Which is one of the problems with this issue. Many people find male male sex to be abhorent, disgusting, completely offensive but lesbian sex is widely consodered erotic. Why this is I don't know. Maybe just the way wea re wired. I have known many women that view male male sex as disgusting but have no problem with lesbian sex.

[honestabe8]

endurobob: i guess then i disagree with you. as a straight man, the idea of two men doing it sort of sickens me. on the other hand, two women (in my mind hot cheerleader types) is sort of invigorating

[endurorob]

DO believe that same gender sex belongs in the same category as beastiality? no credit as to one being consentual and with the same species?
Posted by honestabe8 at 6:37 AM : Apr 8, 2009

Yes I do believe that same gender sex belongs in the same category as beastiality, pedophelia, sibilng sex, parent child sex. The consent issue i believe to be a criminal issue and seperate from the sexual behavior issue.

[honestabe8]

Kinkyness and adultry (I assume adultry is what you meant by the pool boy thing) are not in the same category as same sex sex, same family sex, pedophilia, or beastiality.
Posted by endurorob

i must have misunderstood when you said that all deviant sexual behavior belonged in the same category. what you meant was that some deviant sexual behavior belongs in the same category. so, you DO believe that same gender sex belongs in the same category as beastiality? no credit as to one being consentual and with the same species?

[endurorob]

Posted by honestabe8 at 6:21 AM : Apr 8, 2009


Kinkyness and adultry (I assume adultry is what you meant by the pool boy thing) are not in the same category as same sex sex, same family sex, pedophilia, or beastiality.

[honestabe8]

endurobob: i guess that i don't put consentual sex between people of the same gender (or different genders) on the same level as bestiality or pedophilia. whether it is "deviant" is not really my call. what is "deviant" anyway? whips and chains? catholic school girl outfits? the "housewife and the pool guy" fantasy? they are all likely deviant from a statistical viewpoint. do you think they are on the level of a guy mounting his neighbor's sheep?

[endurorob]

No but gay sex is that low.
Posted by endurorob

You know this how?
Posted by honestabe8 at 6:08 AM : Apr 8, 2009

How do I know that gay sex is on the same level as beastiality and sibling sex and parent child sex and pedophilia? I wouldn't necessarily say I know because I have not tried any but lets just say it is a belief that all deviant sexual behvior is on the same level.

[endurorob]

Personally I could care less if they want to marry, even though, as what I've seen and heard gay males on the average have the morals of a dog in heat.

What bothers me here is that the Judicial branch can override the executive branch veto. In other words ANY bill can pass if they load the judiciary and congress with one party. Absolutely no checks and balances in Vermont. Vetoes are not just used to block laws but to bring around compromise and that is what has helped make this country great. For without compromise we are nothing but a fascist state.

I now see Vermont is controlled by Fascists.
Posted by louiville2 at 6:06 AM : Apr 8, 2009

That is how the fed works and as far as I know how all the states work. The legislative branch generally needs a 2/3 vote to over ride an executive veto. This prevents all power going to one person.

[honestabe8]

No but gay sex is that low.
Posted by endurorob

You know this how?

[endurorob]

i do find it somewhat distrubing that some of those against these unions go to the "allow this and next think you know there will be a guy marrying his goat" argument. is sex with animals that high up in these people's minds?
Posted by honestabe8 at 5:54 AM : Apr 8, 2009

No but gay sex is that low.

[honestabe8]

Religion is stagnant and unchanging, like a algae filled pond.
Posted by curse914

I knew a woman who had relations in an algae filled pond. Next thing she knew, she was 3 months stagnant

[endurorob]

I think they should force the governor to convert his marriage to a civil union. What a jerk.
Posted by jcnbma1 at 5:42 AM : Apr 8, 2009

He disagrees with your view of the world so that makes him a jerk? I think you are the jerk for failing to understand not everyone agrees with your views.