Gay Marriage Ban Ballot Backlash
CBS Evening News: Californians Who Opposed Proposition 8 Are Outraged Over Its Passage
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Prop 8. Protests
Protests continue along California's coastline with the passage of Proposition 8, which bans gay marriage statewide. John Blackstone reports.
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Protesters against California's Proposition 8, which banned gay marriage, marched the weekend after the ballot initiative was passed by voters. (CBS)
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Taking The Plunge In Calif.
Festive atmosphere as gay and lesbian couples take their marriage vows.
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Same-Sex Marriage Debate
State-by-state coverage, opinions, history, photos and a look at the amendment process.
Some voters who joined forces, just last week, to elect the President, now find themselves on opposite sides.
For the third straight day thousands of people marched in California, protesting the election night passage of Proposition 8 - banning same sex marriage.
Crowds continued to target the Mormon church, which poured millions into promoting the same-sex marriage ban and encouraged members to cross state lines to join the campaign. Governor Arnold Schwarzenegger - who opposed the bill - says gay rights supporters were outmanned.
"They had a very strong campaign, the pro-proposition 8 people, and I think, they people who tried to defeat it and they did not have as good of a campaign or as much money behind it," Schwarzenegger told CNN's Late Edition.
But the breakdown of who voted for the bill is starting to raise concerns for some in the gay community. Exit polls show that while blacks made up 10 percent of the total vote, 70 percent of African-American voters supported Prop. 8. Whites, Hispanics and Asians were virtually evenly split.
African-Americans are historically more socially conservative and proponents of the ban tapped into that sentiment by seeking out black church leaders for support.
"It's not a civil rights issue, because as African-Americans we can't change the color of our skin," says pastor Edward Smith, who supported the ban on gay marriage.
The fact that African-Americans turned out in record numbers to vote for Barack Obama while overwhelmingly voting yes on Proposition 8 created personal conflict for some.
"I think the basis of my conflict comes from my upbringing in the church," says Jacquelynn Hawthorne, an Obama supporter.
That frustrates some civil rights leaders - they compare the struggle to the 1967 Supreme Court case of Richard and Mildred Loving, who were arrested in Virginia because interracial marriage was illegal in 16 states.
"Once we present this in the right way and we do the education we should do, I'm not worried at all because African-Americans believe in justice," says Alice Huffman of the National Association for the Advancement of Colored People.
Gay rights advocates say they'll fight all the way to the Supreme Court, meaning protests like these may not end anytime soon.
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See all 733 CommentsPosted by bmcgiffin at 11:28 PM : Nov 09, 2008
Religions should be taxed like any other business...
http://www.sltrib.com/news/ci_10842051
I thought the LDS church believed in everyone''s right to live and worship as they see fit. Furthermore, the Doctrine and Covenants (A Mormon Holy Scripture) Says they believe in NOT GETTING INVOLVED in civil matters with the influence of any religion (D/C 134-9). And the LDS church didn''t sink their own money in, just asked members to do so, to the tune of 22 MILLION according to the SL Tribune.
In summary, a church founded on Immorality, should be the last to judge people. See Polyandry of Joseph Smith.. (He Married others mens'' wives in secret,(at least 10) as well as underaged little girls__several as young as 14.
Meanwhile the economy tanks and countless women are raped in the Congo.
The planet melts, the stock market tanks, unemployment soars.
And we roll in the mud over this one.
Sad.
Very sad.
Posted by doorgunner2
_______________________
If have often considered this very sentiment you have expressed and always arrive at the same conclusion, which is that people feel very inadequate and small to address the overwhelming needs of the world.
It is so much easier to identify gay marriage as a moral issue and to attack it, than it is to deal with the injustice in Darfur, Congo, Rwanda, China, etc. If only folks with such moral conviction put their energy into delivering food, safety, and a future to individuals around the world something could actually be accomplished. Instead they focus on tearing down people because they do not "approve" of a lifestyle someone has.
Wives of Brigham Young= 52
Gay man marries???=0 only wants 1
Seems fair doesn''t it???
Sad :(
BTW Mormons who say that they no longer practice or believe in Polygamy?? LIARS
According to Doctrine and Covenants 132!!
You STILL BELIEVE IN POLYGAMY. Until 132 is removed from your scripture, you are not kidding anyone.
As Brother Brigham said----Monogamy is evil and those who don''t accept Polygamy will be damned.
good morals! way to go!
And whether or not they believe in gay marriage is irrelevant - if you don''t believe in it - don''t have one! Jews don''t believe in eating hot dogs - should they be able to ban the evil hot dogs for the rest of us? Mormons believed black people were evil - should their beliefs have lead to a ballot issue to put all black people in jail?
Your religious beliefs don''t belong in laws that apply to all of us.
The allegation that the Church encouraged people to "cross state lines" in support of the measure is a new one -- and ludicrous. Next they''ll be invoking the Mann Act?
The Church has 740,000 members who reside in California, and they exercised their rights as individuals to speak freely on the issue.
As for hints of "outside" influence, the facts are also inconvenient to the mob in the street:
"No on 8" raised $38.4 million, with $12.0 million (31.2%) coming from out of state.
"Yes on 8" raised $36.1 million, with $10.7 million (29.6%) coming from out of state.
So "No" raised $2.3 million more than "Yes," with $1.3 million more than "Yes" coming from out of state.
http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-moneymap,0,2198220.htmlstory
Where are the cries of outrage about outside influence on the "No" side of the issue?
I''m disappointed, but sadly not surprised, at such irresponsible reporting from CBS.
Tracy Hall Jr
hthalljr''gmail''com
And whether or not they believe in gay marriage is irrelevant - if you don''''t believe in it - don''''t have one! Jews don''''t believe in eating hot dogs - should they be able to ban the evil hot dogs for the rest of us? Mormons believed black people were evil - should their beliefs have lead to a ballot issue to put all black people in jail?
Your religious beliefs don''''t belong in laws that apply to all of us.
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Posted by SusanHelit at 12:18 AM
Unfortunately in our country free speech means free lies with no consequences. What would the Mormon Church say if those lies went the other way, against them, accusing them of conducting secret polygamous marriages or doing nasty things in their Temples ceremonies? They would be screaming to the top of their lungs. Sad that they want to play such games.
The Mormon Church got involved in something they should have stayed out of. It would have been one thing for the people to vote as they pleased, but for the Church to come all the way from Utah and spend millions to influence a vote speaks very poorly of an organization that is tax exempt, and just might end up losing that tax exemption in the future.
It is hard to believe that State and Local governments that are not allowed to discriminate by ***, religion, race and such enshrine in their Constitutions discrimination.
Its not being a bigot to not approve of homosexuals.
That''s your common attack on people who still believe in God. Its a waste of your time because it doesn''t intimidate me.
I read Prop 8 which defines marriage as a union between a man and a woman and Cal Family Code 297-297.5 which defines domestic partners as two same *** adults in an intimate and committed relationship of mutual caring. Marriage and domestic partners have the same rights with designations that accurately represent their relationships.
I read the California State Constitution Art 18 Sec 4 which allows constitution amendment via the proposition process.
The biggest irony is that the "No on 8" group cries discrimination because they can not use an opposite *** relationship designation for their same *** relationship designation. The "No on 8" have adopted "storm trooper" mentality and are forcing the public to submit to their cause through the media, court (California Supreme Court Case No. S168047) and marching in communities.
Many years ago, the ACLU won the right in court for the Nazi party to march in a Jewish Community in Skokie, IL. I didn''t think that was right because the holocaust surviors didn''t deserve to have a Nazi march. I see the "No on 8" group doing the same thing.
"No on 8" should accept the following: They already have the same rights with the right designation that celebrates their same *** relationship. They need to take a moment of pause and thoughtful reflection, instead of acting in an emotional state of rage and anger.
This is going to be interesting.
Remove the beam from your own eye before you attack another group of people!!!
George Lee (Mormon General Authority) molested a little girl and plead guilty!
Stake Pres Clayton Hildreth Teen *** Crime (14 year old girl)
Bishop Arlo Atkin gets 14 year old teen pregnant
John D. Parkinson, M. D., Fairfield Stake President molested women and children__ also misdiagnosed them so he could "Cure" them and claim it was a miracle
Lloyd Gerald Pond __ church Spokesman *** with 11 year old girl
Timothy McCleve Bishop -molested 3 little girls under the age of 8
just a few examples of how LDS church should CLEAN HOUSE FIRST before judging others.
Obviously most people that voted yes did so on the basis of their religious beliefs. I have more faith in God than to really believe that God is a prejudiced, bigot. By the way Jesus never made any mention of homosexuality. I''m sure people can come up with all kinds of convoluted explanations for their pro 8 votes, but the FACT is that it results in bigotry and prejudice against a minority group. There will always be homosexuals, there always has been, even in other species. It''s time for people to put aside their archaic beliefs that lead them to believe that it is ok to discriminate against another group.
So a NO vote on 8 would have kept it a private, personal matter and parents could talk to kids when they wanted. YES on 8 makes it public policy, current events, and forces it to be taught in schools.
This is going to be interesting.
Where is it written that *** have a right to marry? There is no such right. Gay marriage has not been recognized for thousands of years as a right by most societies. However, in America, it has been recognized that citizens have a right to determine whether something becomes a right through their state constitutions. The voters of California have spoken loud and clear. They have said no to gay marriage.
Those who are in the majority want to create a minority with fewer civil liberties than they have. it is disgusting, but America has done it over and over again
Chinese
Blacks
Catholics
Hispanics
Italians
Jews
Germans
Irish
All were treated as second class citizens by the majority- they were denied everything from basic freedoms to the right to own property. Whites and hispanics were killed for getting married in the 1800''s. Blacks and whites were killed for marriage in the last century. Bigotry, fear, ignorance, and hate abound.
Yet today we again have people who, based on their "religion", will do away with the life , liberty, and pursuit of happiness of others who are "different" in their eyes.
Shame on my country. Shame on those who mistakenly consider themselves "Christian". For they are neither true to Christian ideas or good Americans. They are the worst of humanity- the fearful and the bigoted.
"Separate but equal" is the shame of America.
Stop trying to rewrite history of marriage being one man and one woman. You have civil right granted to same *** partnerships so stop trying to take away the true meaning of marriage.
You''re just using this as a way to get the USA to recognize same *** marriage and then force your way into the churches by saying they are violating your rights because they will never recogize same *** marriage. It is just your way of getting rid of any opposition to your sick lifestyle. This will never work and you are just making it harder on yourself by shoving it down peoples thoats.
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Posted by dj03081955 at 01:24 AM : Nov 10, 2008
well, you will never have naturally born children like hetrosexuals do. Jamming sexual organs together from same sexes does not make babies.
You''re not the same so just accept the fact that you are different and not entitled to the sacrament of marriage.
not in California. the purpose of the Constitution is to ensure equal rights for all, and has been consistently interpreted to protect minorities from majorities in securing rights. No amendment that changes that is valid.
There is nothing to "get passed." The right of marriage is guaranteed in every state and all adults have that right. There is no doubt it will be recognized in the near future. However, what is at stake is the special treatment of so-called churches and religious groups trying to encode their values in to state law.
These traditions are thousands of years old and include several types of marriage both monogamous and polygamous. In the time of these traditions it was not understood that sexual orientation is a core part of personality, which does not change. With our current understanding of personality, our definition of marriage must be expanded. Recognizing same-*** marriage does not restrict or harm heterosexual marriage.
You talk about equal right... Civil Unions grant you those rights. Why is it your goal to destroy the definition of marriage? Why must you impose your views over marriage? If your goal is equal rights you already have all the civil rights as those under traditional marriage through civil unions.
These traditions are thousands of years old and include several types of marriage both monogamous and polygamous. In the time of these traditions it was not understood that sexual orientation is a core and unchanging part of personality. With our current understanding of personality, our definition of marriage must be expanded to include same-*** partners. Recognizing same-*** marriage does not restrict or harm heterosexual marriage.
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Posted by andor3 at 01:35 AM : Nov 10, 2008
And that is your true goal. To destroy churches and religion because they oppose your lifestyle. Your goal is to destroy the last moral stance in this country and destroy the family unit and blur the line between sexes and ruin what little we have left in this country as far as a family unit is concerned anymore. We are supposed to just accept your lifestyle without question when we oppose that way of life. Why should we be forced to accept something that is against our religious views? We actually have religious freedom granted by our constitution. Nowhere is the sacrament of marriage granted to homosexuals in the constitution.
These traditions are thousands of years old and include several types of marriage both monogamous and polygamous. In the time of these traditions it was not understood that sexual orientation is a core and unchanging part of personality. With our current understanding of personality, our definition of marriage must be expanded to include same-*** partners. Recognizing same-*** marriage does not restrict or harm heterosexual marriage.
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