In S.D., Abortion Debate Rages (Again)

CBS Evening News: Despite Low Abortion Rate, Pro-Life Groups Seek A Ban

(CBS)  At the Planned Parenthood Clinic in Sioux Falls, S.D., an 18-year-old patient had come to end her pregnancy. CBS News correspondent Kelly Cobiella reports she hasn't told her parents, and asked not to be identified in this story.

"I'm too young to have a child. It's not the right time for me," she said.

She's one of about 700 women in the state who will have the procedure this year - one of the lowest rates in the country.

But for anti-abortion crusader Leslee Unruh, "One abortion is too many."

Unruh is the driving force behind Initiative 11 - a measure that would make abortion a crime, with narrow exceptions for rape, incest or the health of the mother. Her group, Vote Yes for Life, collected 46,000 signatures to put the measure on the November ballot - three times more than they needed.

"[Abortion] is being used for birth control and South Dakotans do not like that," Unruh said.

They haven't been willing to ban it outright. Two years ago, when the state tried to outlaw nearly all abortions with no exceptions for rape or incest, 56 percent voted against it.

But most of those who voted against the last measure would have supported it if it had included the rape and incest exceptions, said Patrick Lalley, managing editor of the Argus Leader in Sioux Falls.

That has abortion rights advocates worried.

They say that if the South Dakota measure passes, it could have a domino effect, fueling efforts to pass abortion bans in other states.

"If this is passed in SD it will have a very significant effect on national politics," Sarah Stoesz, president of Planned Parenthood for Minnesota and the Dakotas said.

Four other states tried to make abortion an issue this fall but only Colorado succeeded, putting an amendment on the ballot that would define a fertilized human egg as a person.

For Unruh, the ultimate goal is to reverse the Supreme Court decision legalizing abortion.

"I believe the Supreme Court judges will see the information we have this time and Roe v. Wade will be over," Unruh said.

Opponents say that view is naïve.

"Leslee Unruh and others have this utopian view that if they ban abortion it will never happen," said Stoesz. "And that's just not true. It will happen; it's just that women will die from it."

Or, as the 18-year-old patient told CBS News, women will just go to a neighboring state where abortion is legal.

[truthislife1]

The only question I have is do babies deserve to live or die?

[zykracosmos]

The only question I have is do babies deserve to live or die?


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Posted by truthislife1 at 07:57 PM : Oct 31, 2008
--------------------------

Let me re-phrase the question for you... Is A fertilized egg really a baby? Drop the idea that a supernatural being put a soul in there for a second, and see what you come up with.

[jonathanw20]

Why is Sarah Palin not releasing even a summary medical record? Is it drugs? abortions? Why did she fly 8 hours to Alaska after her water broke not taking immediate and on flight medical attention?

[barackhobama]

Reember, The One, A HArvard Educated lawyer, said abortion opinions were above his paygrade....

[stopsocialis]

"Hug a tree, save an Eagle egg, kill an unborn baby"

-The Liberal mantra

[stopsocialis]

yeah, the Righties like to wait until they''''re 18, then kill them in a war to protect their corporate masters
Posted by johnbrown888 at 08:27 PM : Oct 31, 2008

Tell that to this brave American hero who fought for your freedom you traitorous liberal whiner:


This is the MOST WATCHED election video on youtube! This is AWESOME and will move you! If it doesn''t bring you to tears you aren''t an American.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TG4fe9GlWS8

[lmartink]

The Republicans are all for reducing the role of big government in our lives --- except for when it comes to a woman''s most private parts.

[stopsocialis]

Let me re-phrase the question for you... Is A fertilized egg really a baby?
posted by ZykraCosmos

Are the roots of a tree really a tree dummy liberal? Is an eagle egg with the eagle embryo inside really an eagle?

You communist liberals think just like Hitler and Stalin did, since you want to get rid of the Almighty.

You want to defeat God. Not happening wackos. Keep dreamin!

[stopsocialis]

The Republicans are all for reducing the role of big government in our lives --- except for when it comes to a woman''''s most private parts.
Posted by LMartinK at 08:31 PM : Oct 31, 2008

What about the baby inside of her womb''s private parts?

No rights for the baby heh lib?

Go hug a tree and save the planet, but keep on murdering the unborn you demented lib.

You people are twisted and evil.

[lmartink]

yeah, the Righties like to wait until they''''re 18, then kill them in a war to protect their corporate masters

Posted by johnbrown888 at 08:27 PM : Oct 31, 2008

John Brown has a point. At what age does "right to life" end? Certainly it''s not for life.

[stopsocialis]

Liberals don''t believe in the Declaration of Independence, especially the part that says:

"The pursuit of LIFE, liberty, and happiness"

[dadhere-2009]

Check out www.ChoiceInAmerica.com

[element51]

StopSocialis...First I''ll dispense with the insults. You seem to have that very well covered. OK...If abortion is outlawed and R v Wade is repealled, what do you propose to do to women who have abortions anyway? Do you think that by making it illegal it will just stop? I guess you want it to go back like it was before. Poor women went to back alley butchers and many bled to death, had their insides pulled out or died of infections. Rich women went to clinics, got a "D&C" and went on with their lives. I guess as long as the wealthy are protected that''s all that matters to you. And who is going to take care of all those unwanted babies who will come into a world of hunger, abuse and neglect. You? I hardly think so. And don''t give me that c r a p about libs love abortion. Nobody that I ever met thinks abortion is a good thing. But it happens and will continue to happen whether it''s legal or not. This is an issue that is between the woman and her conscious, not something for you to stick your hypocritical nose into. I''m sure if your wife was beaten and raped and became pregnant as a result of that rape you would be thrilled to force her to have the baby and then have to live with the horror the rest of her life. Or would you just walk away blaming her for letting it happen?

[element51]

StiopSocialis....Man, you have it all figgured out don''t you? People like you are so full of themselves that they never stop to think that just because we may be different than you we have a right to our beliefs just as you do. You want me to think exactly like you and behave exactly like you or I am classified as a dirty liberal. Well get this...I am a liberal and even worse I am an atheist. Now, I have given you enough there that you can post all night and call me every name in the book. Guess what....I don''t give a ***** about you or what you think. I think for myself and I don''t need some holier than thou putz to tell me what''s best for me. So you go right on believing that you are better and that your God has a special place for you. But stop trying to judge me.

[noboundary]

The solution to the abortion problem has been around for a long, long time - it''s called contraception. But people would rather push their ideology than really solve the problem.

And by the way, a fertlized embryo is not a person - it has no central nervous system until the third week. Would you be a person without a central nervous system? I don''t think so! They''d take you off life support. It seems that irrational minds prevail while children suffer. Instead of pro-life or pro-choice, why not be pro-children and see to their education!

[lh11]

It is not the Roe v. Wade law that causes women to resort to abortions, but the unwanted pregnancies, and hence, we have to focus on the measures that prevent such pregnancies.

I''m a person of faith and am pro-Obama/Biden ticket because both Obama and Biden are ACTUALLY pro-life since they support such pro-life and moral measures like health care coverage accessible to all pregnant women and children, empowering of women through prevention of unwanted pregnancies or through turning those unwanted pregnancies into wanted by providing the care women and their children need, as well prevention of STDs, prevention of promiscuity and date rape through comprehensive and age-appropriate *** education. Those who are against such measures are not really pro-life, but merely hypocrites who label themselves as such.

I''m not pro-abortion, but I''m against criminalizing abortion because:

1) there is no way to tell a spontaneous abortion (miscarriage) form an induced abortion, and criminalizing abortion would invite abuse of women who suffered miscarriages.

2) this question remains unanswered: who has the right to decide whose life is more valuable -- that of a woman or a child in her womb -- when a pregnancy threatens woman''s life?

[swift2--2008]

I''m sorry, I cannot see this as other than a theocratic desire to enforce your views on all others. For myself, viewing a fertilized egg as a human is absurdity. But the ignorant armies will insist that people like me accept their second-class citizenship, with the FAITHFUL taking first place in society.

It''s happened before, of course; I spent much of my youth in Quebec, when it was a thoroughly priest-ridden society, when ignorance was strength and science was satanism. A plague on all these people''s houses.

Taking the Thomistic view of ensoulment is all right. It''s theology. It should never be passed as law.

[ybotheratall]

The solution to the abortion problem has been around for a long, long time - it''''s called contraception. But people would rather push their ideology than really solve the problem.

Posted by noboundary at 09:10 PM
-------------------------------------
For a long, long time _ it''s been called "broken condom" as well. Even properly using a condom gives you what a 15-20% chance of getting pregnant under realistic statistics? Give me a break. Your assumption is pompous. They want to legislate pregnancy and then they want to legislate being able to feed the baby when it''s hungry. This country is a bunch of prudes and idiots. Abortion is a private issue that has nothing to do with religion. If an atheist decides they don''t want to proceed with the pregnancy, that''s there business, not mine. Stay out of my body.

[lmartink]

Why save the babies to grow up in an impoverished land, with little food, ravaged by greed, and on a planet that is spinning out of control?

We have a lot of really big problems to face. We should get people and government out of the most private parts of a woman.

[kjejj]

Leslie "Untrue" does not speak for a majority of South Dakotans. I live there and know South Dakotans are sick of the issue and her. The language of the bill is very subjective and it could be the DA or the Police Chief who decides if a woman get''s to have an abortion if her health is in jeopardy. If she''s raped, she has to prove it first. The government would have access to personal medical records. It victimizes women and attempts to turn a physician into a criminal for making a medical decision. We will vote this initiated measure down.

[lh11]

YBother..., I would agree with you if you meant to say that they want to legislate against abortion, but do not care to legislate for the welfare of children once they are born.

They idiotically pretend that legislating for the welfare of children once they are born is a liberal sin they label as "socialism," and not a matter of moral obligation.

[soldat44]

Why save the babies to grow up in an impoverished land, with little food, ravaged by greed, and on a planet that is spinning out of control?

We have a lot of really big problems to face. We should get people and government out of the most private parts of a woman.

Posted by LMartinK at 09:44 PM : Oct 31, 2008

Well Hell - Let''s abort and kill all the babies and children under the age of 5. Would that satisfy your morbid view of life?
Give it a rest.

www.priestsforlife.org

[ctla567]

Conservatives and Republicans want to deregulate industries but to regulate freedom of individuals. How many of those bible hugging antiabortion church goers have adopted unwanted children without accepting some kind of monetary compensation?

[tangouniforn]

At the time of Jesus, abortion was commonplace in the Roman Empire. Was Jesus opposed to abortion? Evidently not since he said not one word against it. But I suppose that Jesus did not know as much about Christianity as the modern day Christians do.

[tangouniforn]

Tell that to this brave American hero who fought for your freedom you traitorous liberal whiner:

For what freedom did you fight? And when? It seems that you are somewhat selective on what you consider to be freedoms. But then that logic does not seem to be you long suite.

[tangouniforn]

Is the soul supposed to be created at the time of conception? If so, what happens when the cell devides and identical twins or triplets or ?? are formed? Does the soul divide so that each set of cells has one half of a soul or one third of a soul or one ??? of a soul. Does a clone have a soul when it is not derived from a fertilized egg? Please give us a rational, consistent answer to these questions.

[tangouniforn]

Well Hell - Let''''s abort and kill all the babies and children under the age of 5. Would that satisfy your morbid view of life?
Give it a rest.

www.priestsforlife.org

I think that I know why priestsforlife want more children brought into this world. They are getting very lonely.

[hissteps4u]

The sad part for me is that Young Women having unprotected *** and the Ignorant parents not stepping in and being a parent.....To D-A-M many kids are having s-e-x and unprotected s-e-x at that.

Where are the parenting skills of yesteryear???? Why are Kids just children in truth yearning to have sexual relationships with Boys and sometimes Men and then when the inevatle happens they want to go behind the parents back and have an abortion our society is getting sicker by the Minute no doubt about that.

It is time to teach kids about S-E-X and to force parents to Parent.

i agree abortion is Death and ought not be a solution so easily used by children who''s moral makeup is at best suspect and who''s absent parents do not teach their children the kinds of values.

Let them Give BIRTH and then Let the Babies be adopted I would certainly adopt many in such a situation and would not want a penny from the state....

[vafrommn]

For me, it is rather simplistic. Life begins at conception. Therefore, an abortion stills a human life. It is no different than shooting a 2 year old child ... a life is a life.

I think the end result of the many years of Roe are quite evident. The young girls giving birth and throwing the baby in the garbage. Their reasoning is really quite logical .... if it''s OK to "dispose" of a baby at one point, why should it make any difference if they "dispose" of it after it''s born. After all, it is just a bunch of cells!

[lh11]

To those who think that undoing the Roe v. Wade law will stop abortions, think again.

Understand that it is not the Roe v. Wade law that causes women to resort to abortions, but the unwanted pregnancies, and hence, we have to focus on the measures that prevent such pregnancies.

If you really want to prevent abortion as birth control, than you must vote for those who will fight for such measures like health care coverage accessible to all children and pregnant women, empowering of women through prevention of unwanted pregnancies or through turning those unwanted pregnancies into wanted by providing the care women and their children need, as well prevention of STDs, prevention of promiscuity and date rape through comprehensive and age-appropriate education.

Where I stand: I''m for the above measures and, hence, for Obama/Biden ticket.

I''m NOT pro-abortion, but I''m against criminalizing abortion because:

1) there is no way to tell a spontaneous abortion (miscarriage) form an induced abortion, and criminalizing abortion would invite abuse of women who suffered miscarriages.

2) this question remains unanswered: who has the right to decide whose life is more valuable -- that of a woman or a child in her womb -- when a pregnancy threatens woman''s life?

[tangouniforn]

I will agree that at some point, abortion should not be available except to save the life or health of the mother. We readily accept that it is acceptable to kill and intruder who threatens the life of our loved ones. But what about a 6 year old child that has a gun and will shoot a loved one. Do you take the life of the 6 year old to save the life of a loved one. Once that is said, we are saying that it it permissable to take one life to save another or to prevent any harm to the loved one. It is not any easy choice and the line between taking a live or not is very fuzzy.

[siobama]

NO ONE WANTS TO STOP A PREGNANCY. IT IS A VERY PAINFUL ACT.

THAT IS WHY A WOMAN THAT ENDS UP DECIDING TO STOP A PREGNANCY SHOULD BE RESPECTED.

WOMEN SHOULD NOT GO TO JAIL FOR STOPPING A PREGNANCY.

NO JAIL FOR WOMEN WHO EXCERSISE THEIR RIGHT TO CHOOSE.

[billpl-2009]

"For me, it is rather simplistic. Life begins at conception. Therefore, an abortion stills a human life. It is no different than shooting a 2 year old child ... a life is a life."

I like to see the day a woman is charged for murder when taking a morning after pill.

abortion is not murder, never has, never will be

[eroosevelt08]

The hard truth about abortion bans is that some women and girls still get them, only from butchers who kill or maim some of them in the process. Is that what we want? What if the victim already has three children who will be left motherless, or orphans? Is THAT what we want. It is a tough subject.

[tangouniforn]

I have never met anyone that is pro abortion. Abortion should be the last option. Any one that wants to stop an abortion that would save the life of a woman is no different than a person standing and watching a person being beat to death and not taking a stand to save that person. They are not worthy of being considered to be a compasionate individual. They are an unfeeling robot.

[markmazza]

Abortion is never an easy situation and the vast majority of women that face it are in some degree of personal turmoil. It is a huge responsibility to bring a child into this world and there are many consideration to be made before doing that. We are fast moving to maximum sustatinable population levels among our species. At some point we will have to start curtailing population growth through education and birth control. If we don''t the fundamentalist belief that life is sacred will slam head long into the stark reality of a very meager existance on this planet for a struggling overpopulated humanity.

The lack of consciousness and the fanatical religious overtones in the anti-abortion crusaders will continue to cause pain, conflict and difficulty for women in this country until the majority stands up to them and tells them. Stay the hell out of our personal lives!

[mick7744]

Since my doctor has advised me that I can never get pregnant (I''m a grandfather) I don''t think my views on abortion are very relevant...but if it turns out she is wrong, and some mealy-mouthed bible thumper like this Unruh thingee tries to impose her self-rightous views on me and tells me what I must do and what I cannot do, I will respond by cancelling HER right to choose whether she lives or dies.

These hypocrites insist that a fetus is imbued with all rights of a living being at the moment of conception, than completely ignore, degrade, mistreat and exploit them from the moment of birth.

These are not Christians...these are not good people.

[sivalleyguy]

"For me, it is rather simplistic. Life begins at conception. Therefore, an abortion stills a human life. It is no different than shooting a 2 year old child ... a life is a life."

One out of 5 pregnancies ends in miscarriage. Name me one church in the US that has funerals for those unborn?

On a more serious note, it should be obvious that outlawing abortion does not end abortion. Pre-1973 I knew high school and college students who had abortions.

Having seen the personal crises friends went through, I learned it is not up to me to judge other people''s choices.

Helping prevent unintended pregnancies through a wide range of means has NEVER been attempted. Why don''t we?

I''m a pragmatist, not a fundamentalist. The abortion issue is a guaranteed fundraising method for certain religious groups, as well as certain secular groups. More Republican voters can be counted on to be single issue voters on abortion than any other issue, even when Republican policies are antithetical to the real life challenges facing these voters. If you aren''t going to choose an abortion, why should you care that others make that decision? How does that personally affect your life? Does another''s circumcision personally affect you? Does a Christian Scientist who refuses a life-saving transfusion personally affect you?

In a more cynical political vein, why would the GOP want abortion to go away as a wedge issue?

[robert2237]

Abortion is murder no matter how you try to justify it. So since murder is illegal punishable by death in most states the same should be true in the case of a un-born child. But I do think that in the case of a danager to the mother that it would not be murder since the mother might die if she carrys to child to term. Incest is something that I will need to think a lot about. Now the late term abortions are more than murder, they also consist of cruel and un usual punishment which should carry the maximum sentence. Some in our senate have called these babies that are born alive after a attempted abortion, unviable fetuses due to the fact if you called them live babies then letting the die in a broom closet would be murder. Just my thoughts and has nothing to do with regilion just the knowledge of whats right and whats wrong.

[robert2237]

billpl- If we were following our laws a women who took a morning after pill with the intent to kill a live baby would be guilty of murder and should be brought to court for it. Not anything but what the law says. Somehow we let a court set our law on this and the courts are law making bodies they are to enforce the law as written not make law.

[robert2237]

TangoUniforn- Go to planned parenthood and you can meet pro-abortion people. Their jobs depend on women getting pregant and then going to them for a abortion. And the sad thing is that my tax money goes for this murder.

[mandy7441]

A fetus or embryo can not survive outside of the womb. How is it anyone business what I choose to do with my uterus? We have so many people on welfare here in the US. We can not afford to feed the children in our country or provide medical care for the children that are alive already. If abortion is banned who is going to raise these children that were not wanted? We live in a free country, but yet there are people who want to take a womens right to chose away from her. Why don''t we just make it a law that birth control is illegal, masturbation, vasectomy''s and tubal ligation''s. That way we can all be on welfare and overpopulate our country even more.

[countslapula]

Single-issue voters (abortion!) would enjoy letting the country continue its slide into the toilet under Bush. For this reason, they are treasonsous retards.

[clew37]

Right to life people always seem to think that LIFE is the answer to everything. It isn''t. Quality of life matters just as much. How many of these 40 million kids that are unwanted would end up tortured, raped, sold into prostitution, become pedophiles and criminals themselves later? Unwanted children that are conceived anyway don''t have a LIFE. They have an existence, and it''s a living hell. You don''t give a *** about them after they''re born. The woman is just a breeding machine for the next set of tithe takers. If you cannot affford one, don''t want one, don''t have the mental capacity to accept the responsibility for ( and this is a lot of people) for Gods sake don''t have them! And do be prepared to have lots of pregnant kids under 14. If you''ve never seen a 10 yr. old give birth(and yes it can happen) you don''t see the joy of motherhood. They explode. Bladders rupture, uterus'' prolapse, severe malnutrition since the baby is feeding off them in the womb. Idiots out there don''t forget why Roe vs. Wade was made in the first place. Knitting needle sales, and back alley abortionists would just be the start. In the real world, most unwanted children scream an awful lot, but the religious right always seem to not see them...

[lixxygirl]

When MEN can get impregnanted and give birth...is when they have a right to speak their opinions on abortion!

[catlady1412]

I often wonder what people who believe that a first-trimester pregnancy is a baby believe happen to that soul if the fetus is miscarried? Does it stay in Heaven? Does it get another chance to be born? Where is the soul when the embryo is frozen for later fertilization after in vitro procedures? Does that embryo then become a baby with no soul? How long does the soul hang around waiting for the embryo to thaw and be implanted in the uterus? Is there an answer for these questions? How do people have certainty of their belief that life begins at conception? Isn''t the sperm and egg alive before they merge and then divide and multiply? Does that mean that any accidental discharge of either component is an abortion too? Does each individual sperm or egg have a soul since they are living organisms that could become a baby? If theological questions are so easy to answer, why do so many people think so many different things and yet are so sure their own belief is the right one? How big is an ego that believes they know God''s plan and God''s wishes and others do not?

[catlady1412]

What if abortion is a test of that woman''s soul by God to see what she does? What if it were for the sin and redemption that God wants of her? Should the anti-abortion people be interfering in that in case that is what God is doing? Surely the soul of the fetus is safe in God''s arms, right? So many see this as a religious and moral issue, but do they really know what God might be doing in these cases? It takes a huge ego to decide what God wants done in this situation considering that He has allowed abortion to become safe enough for the woman to survive it. Should the government be responsible for interpreting God''s word when they have enough trouble interpreting the Constitution?

[nativewoman]

Let them Give BIRTH and then Let the Babies be adopted I would certainly adopt many in such a situation and would not want a penny from the state....
Posted by hissteps4u at 12:10 AM : Nov 01, 2008

http://www.acf.hhs.gov/programs/cb/stats_research/afcars/trends.htm

As of 09/30/07, there were 496,000 children in foster care and 130,000 waiting for adoption.

So step right up and adopt those "many". They''re waiting for you.

[pirmin3]

These Bible thumping idiots are no different than radical Muslims. It''s "do it my way or else!" They both make me sick.

[brianbwb-2009]

"CBS Evening News: Despite Low Abortion Rate, Pro-Life Groups Seek A Ban"

Almost to a person, these people are anti-abortion, but pro death penalty, support unnecessary war, and tolerate, if not practice personally, the corruption that wastes lives.

The last thing we should call them is pro life, pro hypocrisy is a more accurate fit.