For Average Joes, Mixed Feelings On Wealth

Debate Over "Spread The Wealth Around" Comment Reveals Complicated (And Contradictory) Feelings

(AP)  The war of words waged by John McCain and Barack Obama for the votes of plumbers and other average Joes is a reminder of the nation's long-standing doubts about concentrated wealth - and its qualms about doing something about it.

Americans have voiced concerns about putting too much wealth in to too few hands since the country was founded, but the public's views also come with contradictions.

Now it's clearer than ever - thanks to Obama's much scrutinized talk about taxes with a certain Ohio voter and McCain's dogged criticism - that these mixed feelings about income inequality are a long way from being resolved.

"I think that when you spread the wealth around, it's good for everybody," Obama told the man - maybe you've heard of him - Joe the Plumber.

The remark may have sounded pretty innocuous. But McCain has lambasted his rival's words as sounding "a lot like socialism," and turned the criticism into a central theme of his campaign's final round. Obama's remarks, McCain says, are emblematic of a tax plan to confiscate wealth and give it to the poor that would make the IRS "into a giant welfare agency."

The comments of both presidential candidates touch nerves in American politics - longtime concern about too much concentration of wealth, but also about the role of government and the individual. More than two centuries after Alexander Hamilton, Thomas Jefferson and other early leaders warned about the hazards of too much in the hands of too few, Americans have developed complex views on the intertwining issues.

A substantial majority of Americans say the rich don't pay their fair share of taxes, opinion polls show. A growing number say the U.S. is becoming a nation of haves and have-nots.

The public's concerns reflect a shifting dynamic in recent years, as an increasing share of the wealth has gone to people at the top of the income scale. The top tenth of U.S. households now earn an average of 11.2 times what those in the bottom tenth make, according to the Census Bureau. That's up from a ratio of 8.7 three decades ago. The wealthiest fifth of U.S. households now take in 50 percent of all income, up from 44 percent in 1977. The differences are even more pronounced in analyses of incomes for the top 1 percent of households.

"The income gap between the rich and the rest of the U.S. population has become so wide, and is growing so fast, that it might eventually threaten the stability of democratic capitalism itself," then-Federal Reserve Chairman Alan Greenspan said in 2005.

But Americans are divided on whether government should be heavily taxing the rich in order to benefit those with less.

"It's a complicated area to try to understand American attitudes," said Frank Newport, editor-in-chief of the Gallup Poll. "It's kind of like, in some instances, conflicting medical research ... There's no one answer."

A majority of Americans - 51 percent in a poll by Gallup this past April - said they support "heavy taxes" on the rich to redistribute wealth. That is significantly higher than when the same question was asked in 1939, at the tail end of the Great Depression, when 35 percent agreed.

But people's support for higher taxes on the wealthy are tempered by their own aspirations.

"Most Americans hope to some day be wealthy and as a result, the idea of kind of redistributing income is not as popular as (government policies resulting in) making a bigger pie so everybody does better off," said Dennis Jacobe, chief economist for Gallup.

[misha128-2009]

Choose the candidate and choose the means you desire to distribute wealth. McCain offers welfare=like refundable credits for health insurance even available to those that do not work and Obama chooses to concentrate revised tax rate decreases to the middle class. You get wealth redistribution with wither candidate.

[homespunlady]

This was an interesting bit of statistics cited on Bill Moyer''s Journal:

"the 30-nation Organization for Economic Co-operation and Development - or OECD - is out this week with a new report on global gaps between rich and poor. Guess which great industrial nation had the fourth highest inequality in incomes - behind Mexico, Turkey and Portugal? Right. Us.

Here''s precisely what the report says: "Rich households in America have been leaving both middle and poorer income groups behind. This has happened in many countries but nowhere has this trend been so stark as in the United States." Now there''''s some real spreading around of the wealth - in one direction: up."

To Check out the report I believe this will get you there:

http://www.oecd.org/els/social/inequality

[boosterprez1]

It is not the government''s job to make everyone wealthy...it is ONLY their job to make OPPORTUNITY available to everyone...and that they have done!

The key word in the key phrase of this article:

"The top tenth of U.S. households now EARN an average of 11.2 times what those in the bottom tenth make, according to the Census Bureau."

They earn it...it is not given to them....and everyone has that same opportunity.

There''s no doubt that an assembly line worker works just as hard in eight hours as a CEO of a Fortune 500 company...but what effort, what risk, what investment did they each make?

The assembly line worker likely graduated from high school and went to work. The CEO excelled in school, went on to 4-7 years of college, where he/she also excelled and earned a spot within a company, working their way up the ladder. The risk, the effort, the investment of higher education made that climb possible.

Why should people be given rewards for little effort in getting ahead?

There is no incentive to get ahead in life if, instead, government will hand you what you lack...without incentive, there is no progress....without progress, no national wealth...

[homespunlady]

Posted by boosterprez1 at 01:28 PM : Oct 25, 2008

I''m sitting here having gotten TOP State scholarship that I couldn''t use since my parents had NO money to send me and the scholarship didn''t cover expenses even AFTER I put in a full shift plus overtime in addition to my college - so I joined the military.

It took decades between assignments but I FINALLY got college degrees up through an MBA.

I believed in HONESTY, ETHICS, FAITH and "playing by the rules.

Know what I got for all that? POVERTY

You just aren''t TELLING THE TRUTH.
The REAL way the WEALTHY get there is CONNECTIONS -either through family, "friends", "associates", or "social organizations" such as fraternity/sorority, Masonic type or "special relationships".

This has led to corruption and a SHRINKING of the power base that is the "hidden" true route. Without that knowledge of "it''s not WHAT you Know but WHO YOU KNOW"; all the "hard work" you espouse is useless.

A growing majority are not falling for your delusion of "blame the victim" anymore.

That''s WHY there''s a growing push for MORE UNIONIZATION, MORE grouping together of health-care responsibility without the AIG type "middlemen", MORE emphasis on REAL education, etc.

If you''re idea was correct this nation would NOT be SHELLING OUT 5 to 10 TRILLION to BAIL OUT your beloved "hard working" FINANCIAL FAT CATS!

[andor3]

"It is not the governments job to make everyone wealthy...it is ONLY their job to make OPPORTUNITY available to everyone...and that they have done!"

No, the evidence is clear the opportunity and motivation is not well distributed in America now. When wealth is generated, it is done through government policy. The distribution of that wealth is determined by government policy. When rich people get richer and the middle class shrinks and loses all motivation to contribute, the policy is broken and the economy will (correction: did) crash. Policy must be fixed: good regulation sets the framework.

[homespunlady]

There is no incentive to get ahead in life if, instead, government will hand you what you lack...without incentive, there is no progress....without progress, no national wealth...
Posted by boosterprez1 at 01:28 PM : Oct 25, 2008


So HOW can you reconcile that idea with GWB?

THAT man has "LIVED OFF THE GOVERNMENT", FAMILY and "friends" all his life.

although your description DOES have SOME truth - King George has DEFINITELY arranged for this nation to have "no national wealth"...

[andor3]

or to look at it another way, the middle class has been the economic engine of the USA in modern times, a bridge between the top and bottom of the scale, and the driver of the American dream and culture. Focusing on the health (or lack of) in the middle class is a smart economic strategy. Obama gets it.

[boosterprez1]

Homespunlady:

Life and success are all about CHOICES....merely stating that you have an MBA doesn''t tell the whole story, does it? In your educational trek, what route did you choose? Was it a route that would later prove lucrative? Was it in a field that was hungry for graduates?

Simply getting an education may not be enough. Again, it is often about the choices we make for ourselves. And I disagree with the "it''s who you know" mentality....A majority of the billionaires in the world are self-made, many of them high school and college dropouts...but they had dreams and they had ideas....what ideas did you profer?

I suggest that it is YOU who is not being truthful...

You should really see the movie "The Pursuit of Happyness" with Will Smith...a great movie that dispels the notion that Big Brother is necessary to get ahead in life...

[boosterprez1]

"There is no incentive to get ahead in life if, instead, government will hand you what you lack...without incentive, there is no progress....without progress, no national wealth..."
Posted by boosterprez1 at 01:28 PM : Oct 25, 2008


So HOW can you reconcile that idea with GWB?

THAT man has "LIVED OFF THE GOVERNMENT", FAMILY and "friends" all his life.

although your description DOES have SOME truth - King George has DEFINITELY arranged for this nation to have "no national wealth"... Posted by Homespunlady

________________

There are no absolutes in life, surely you know that....I am as disappointed in the presidency of Bush as anyone, and I voted for him...

But it''s an absolute cop-out to blame things on only him....why not blame Democrats for not putting forth a credible candidate in 2000 and 2004? Why not blame Congress for continuing to ignore a growing problem in our financial markets? Why not blame voters for continuing to elect do-nothing familiar faces and refusing to become educated on issues that face us?

It''s always easiest to blame the guy at the top...just as people always blame the wealthy for being where they are....people are afraid to look at their own choices along the way...

[olivia4441]

Don''t believe the Obama hype coming out of the mainstream media. Instead of trying to browbeat the country into voting for Obama, they would be analyzing the issues and factors that favor and disfavor both candidates. Instead of focusing on college students and intellectuals, they would be focusing on working-class and middle-class voters, especially "Hillary Democrats." These voters may very well determine the election. Yet this huge story is being ignored by the MSM.


Furthermore, the media would not so consistently confuse intensity of support for breadth of support. Granted, Barack Obama''''s supporters tend to be more enthusiastic about their candidate than John McCain''''s supporters are about him. Leftists are always looking for their earthly messiah.

Of course, we all know what the mainstream media''''s "narrative" will be if (I believe, when) John McCain wins the election: The American people refused to vote for Obama because of the color of his skin (and not because of the content of his politics). The "right-wing attack machine" scared voters into voting for McCain, even against their own social and economic self-interest. Black and poor voters were intimidated by Republican thugs and prevented from voting. We know this story by heart as well.


So be prepared. For there are real signs pointing to a McCain victory this year, whether or not the mainstream media wants to acknowledge them.

[olivia4441]

PS The wealthy will not do one of a few things:
1)They will not pay their taxes if they are too high and if they know they are just going to the people who never pay taxes.
2) They will earn less so they pay less which means less work for people
3) They will move out of the country, as will jobs.

[homespunlady]

Posted by boosterprez1 at 02:01 PM : Oct 25, 2008

And you are NAIVE.
You refer to a "prettied up" movie.
The reality is that behind the story there WERE CONNECTIONS and POWER GAMES being played for this TOKEN to succeed.
During the Great Depression there was a similar "blame the victim" push that was epitomized by the "bootstrap books" such as "Sink or Swim". they ALL CLAIMED the SAME BULL - "hard work" ALWAYS leads to wealth and it''s the personal FAULT or SHORTCOMINGS of the people that don''t "make it".

Ironically, the story lines seem to follow a McCain like plot...hardship, finding a "friend" that "takes an interest" and marrying a WEALTHY DAUGHTER.

Granted McCain proved that that route was possible but are there MILLIONS of WEALTHY POTENTIAL SPOUSES for the REST of us?

Then again the defenders of this MYTH all DEFEND the EXCLUSIVITY of their "elite hard workers" in the SAME breath as they "pull the football away" (remember Lucy in the Snoopy cartoons)and MOCK the GULLIBILITY of those kept OUTSIDE their "clubs".

[hennighg]

Hey, I''m not a Joe, but I''m pretty average. No one rebels against the idea of rich people. Heck, one of the great things about the US is that if you work hard, get a little lucky, and yada yada las scalla, you can be rich. It''s a great thing to aspire to.
But the Reagan, Bush the first, and Bush the second people seem to think that being rich is HARD. No, it''s not. It''s GOOD. But no one said that being rich means you don''t have to pay your fair share. Or that you can get away with murder. The problem with rich people is that they think they should be immune to all the tribulations of life, at the expense of the non-rich. Phooey. Rich is GOOD, but it''s not a free pass. C''mon, rich people. . .be patriots. The US poor should be the best treated poor on earth. The women, the black, and yada yada las scalla. . .We aren''t trying to rip you off. We just think that the country, good and bad, should come before wealth. If you want a South-American financial structure, move down there. If rich Italians appeal to you more than middle-class Americans, move there. And so on. Otherwise, make the US what it should be -- the sought after place.

[hsinco-2009]

So be prepared. For there are real signs pointing to a McCain victory this year, whether or not the mainstream media wants to acknowledge them.

Posted by Olivia4441 at 02:32 PM : Oct 25, 2008


You have Obama right where you want him! LOL

[na1013]

I understand why for political reasons McCain is doing this but the truth is, we need to help the poor and the middle class get to a level that they contirbute to society. That is how our economy grows. Obama is right it is from the bottom up, not the top down. The daughter of an immigrant taxi driver who grows up to be a doctor. If the rich don''t pay taxes and subsidise her education that does not happen. Obama''s tax plan is more American than McCains

[na1013]

I understand why for political reasons McCain is doing this but the truth is, we need to help the poor and the middle class get to a level that they contribute to society. That is how our economy grows. Obama is right it is from the bottom up, not the top down. The daughter of an immigrant taxi driver who grows up to be a doctor. If the rich don''t pay taxes and subsidize her education that does not happen. Obama''s tax plan is more American than McCains

[homespunlady]

Posted by hennighg at 02:38 PM : Oct 25, 2008

Thank you. I agree.

[homespunlady]

So be prepared. For there are real signs pointing to a McCain victory this year, whether or not the mainstream media wants to acknowledge them.

Posted by Olivia4441 at 02:32 PM : Oct 25, 2008


Is that the "official word" from the OWNERS of the VOTING MACHINE companies that you are passing on?

there are several "keep them honest" efforts this go around. My favorite is Blackboxvoting.ORG

[homespunlady]

Posted by d7767w at 02:41 PM : Oct 25, 2008

Congratulations.

So, you''re implying you did so with NO HELP from "special friends" or "family"? Your rise in your business had NOTHING to do with CONNECTIONS?

Your arrogance is impressive.

Bet you''re the "life of the (GOP) party" with your "holier than thou" attitude.

Marie Antoinette would LOVE you.

[oneworldusa]

"Most Americans hope to be wealthy..." get a grip. We''d all like to have no fear about paying bills, but the fact is, most of us work for other people who will get rid of us the first opportunity they get for cheap overseas labor or to keep their own pockets padded during lean times. They are not going to give up one red cent for the sake of keeping people employed if there''s any chance it will come out of their pocket. So, unless you''re going to start your own business, and 95% of them fail within the first year, most people will never become ''rich'' we will live on our substandard wages that don''t even touch the cost of inflation and keep going deeper and deeper in the hole. The only answer is to keep going to college and adding to your educational arsenal to make yourself distinguished amongst others.

[homespunlady]

For REAL information on REAL VOTE FRAUD I usually check with Blackboxvoting.ORG

They have an EXCELLENT film called "Hacking Democracy", several RESOURCES on what an HONEST ELECTION should look like and articles on the latest tricks, scams and manipulations that are happening.

The SURPRISING THING is that what THEY are MOST concerned about IS NOT BEING TALKED ABOUT in the MSM!

They also have a grassroots movement to help KEEP THE ELECTIONS HONEST that could REALLY use some volunteers and help with EDUCATION and watching to INSURE HONESTY.

[homespunlady]

My favorite reference to this problem was best stated by this:

By DAVID CAY JOHNSTON
Published: December 15, 2007

The INCREASE in incomes of the top 1 percent of Americans from 2003 to 2005 EXCEEDED THE TOTAL income of the poorest 20 percent of Americans, data in a new report by the Congressional Budget Office shows.

The poorest fifth of households had total income of $383.4 billion in 2005, while JUST THE INCREASE in income for the top 1 percent came to $524.8 billion, a figure 37 percent higher.

The total income of the top 1.1 million households was $1.8 trillion, or 18.1 percent of the total income of all Americans, up from 14.3 percent of all income in 2003. The total 2005 income of the three million individual Americans at the top was roughly EQUAL to that of the bottom 166 million Americans, analysis of the report showed.

Earlier reports, based on tax returns, showed that in 2005 the top 10 percent, top 1 percent and fractions of the top 1 percent enjoyed their GREATEST SHARE of income since 1928 and 1929.

(hint the GREED TRIGGER to the LAST DEPRESSION)

[andor3]

"... 11 years after that (1981) I retired a millionaire so I know it can be done. "

that is the point. It COULD be done in the pre-Reagan days when it was possible. Not today. We need to roll back to those days, which is basically Obamas plan.

[joetheplunge]

Sara is a Hot Chick and is upset the now JOE THE PLUMBER has Stole her early THUNDER JoeThePlunger-com. She was not and is not the person for this job and the gimick did not hold up. It has to be about after the election from here on...John McCain is swinging to this drum also as he has to be concerned about the country and his role after OB wins...and it sure looks like he will

[joetheplunge]

Go to JoeThePlunger(dot)Com and see what I mean

[joetheplunge]

If you don''t think this is correct go to JoeAmerica(dot)Org and you will not find you are convinced

[homespunlady]

Were you flexible?
Posted by d7767w at 03:04 PM : Oct 25, 2008

Hmm...let''s see.

moving Thousands of miles away from family and friends versus your mere 150.
Giving up personal freedoms to serve my country. (which apparently you know nothing about).

Working ANY hours needed then toping it off with college when I could.
Volunteering.
Working at whatever I could find while being told I should know "my place".
Helping those in need...

NAH your claims of relentless, self interest are by FAR more "flexible" and of course
DESERVE" to be compensated just like those AIG execs "DESERVED" that "resort getaway" for ripping off everyone from their investors to the taxpayers.

[misha128-2009]

Choose the candidate and choose the means you desire to distribute wealth.

McCain offers welfare-like refundable credits for health insurance even available to those that do not work.

Obama chooses to concentrate revised tax rate decreases to the middle class.


You get wealth redistribution with either candidate.

[lloydbest1]

My answer to boosterprez1, d7767w and others who defend wealth is this:
There''s nothing inherently wrong with being wealthy. for the most part wealth beyond level of need is value neutral; perhaps it is even a virtue. It seems, on the surface, that both of you worked hard and were smart enough to take advantage of the opportunities that came your way and parlay them into fortunes. You are to be commended.
But wealth such as you describe and claim to possess is not a right. Let me repeat that. It is NOT a right. It is merely a privelege that all of us have because we live in a society that allows us to rise to our potentials. Most of us do not have the tools, or the luck, or the talent or the drive - so we don''t get there. And that''s also O.K.
Nonetheless, earning (or otherwise acquiring) extremes of wealth is still only a privelege; and those who ARE able to take advantage of the opportunities that come their way or make for themselves are, or should be, obliged to pay the most for it.

[homespunlady]

The BIGGER QUESTION is WHO or WHAT has recently REALLY BENEFITED - In other words WHO''S GAINED A GREATER SHARE and AT WHAT COST?

HANDS DOWN it is the CORPORATIONS and TOP FEW PERCENT that have GAINED the last few years while THE REST of this nation has watched their portion SHRINK DIRECTLY BECAUSE of the "cleverly designed to benefit the WEALTHY" current "tax structures".

The RESULT of this "pity the downtrodden RICH PERSON" was that the WEALTHY became SO RICH and SO EFFECTIVE at HIDING and EXEMPTING THEIR WEALTH that it has now STOPPED the flow of CASH that was the GREASE of this ECONOMY and in doing so STOPPED TRADE.

Think of it this way - If a MILLION people have and spend $10 we have a LOT of TRADE in a LOT of things but if 10 People have a million dollars THEY DO NOT SPEND it on all those things and instead there might be a FEW luxury goods made or a FEW servants but TRADE DROPS to a TRICKLE.

And THAT is the TRUE REASON "trickle down" is a guaranteed ECONOMIC FAILURE for a nation that wants ANY social structure beyond FEUDALISM

[rjmcbs]

The people in the middle are the ones who deserve a tax break not the guys at the top with 7 houses,13 cars, millionaire family, or the guys at the bottom who don''t want to pay taxes. you know I''m talking about, both John and Joe are just a bunch of bums

[homespunlady]

Taxes are on MUCH more than Federal income.
There''s sales tax.
Disability tax.
Gas taxes
Social Security.
Lots of Communication (telephone) tax.
"special assessments" on utilities.
Fees which are disguised taxes
the "pass through" that ALL business does to pay for their tax "costs"
property tax
personal property tax
school tax
and on and on....

Percentage wise if all those are counted rather than JUST "income tax" or "capital gains tax" (which now tops out at 15 percent) the "poor" are paying by far more than the "wealthy" since they DON''T get "write-offs" on all the "hidden" taxes they pay.

[trillion1]

The fact is the average American worker is the back bone of the economy not the wealthy. When workers have more to spend the economy over all improves.

[veteran22]

In the Drucker Foundation book Organization of the Future, they tell of a different kind of organization, a cooperative, conceived to create jobs and as a by product has created great wealth. Greedy Robber baron exploitative cooperations who downsize simply to increase the bottom line are not the only way to create wealth and jobs. "The Mondragon Model which is based on a co-operative founded in Spain that has a remarkable record of job creation even during recession and depression that was founded by a Jesuit monk. Barker writes,.....When you are faced with a choice of risking your capital to protect jobs or risking jobs to protect your capital, always protect your jobs! There are other ways to create both jobs and wealth -- what we need is leadership and that will be provided by Obama/Biden 08

[sbelknap01]

I''m willing to bet that not 10% of the posters on this page know how much federal income tax they paid last year. Most people don''t. Go look at last year''s tax return, look at the Total Tax Due line, after the credits are applied. How much does a married couple with two small kids have to earn before they pay $1 in federal income tax, taking the standard deduction? Don''t know? How about a single adult? How about a partnership? (trick question) How about a Corporation? If you don''t know, and most people don''t, stop debating taxes, stop pretending that taxes are the only important issue. Taxes aren''t killing you. Bad jobs are killing you. Vote for the guy who''s talking about creating better paying jobs - vote Obama/Biden 08

[palin08o8]

You know what I changed my mind about Obama! I think he will be better for national security and the economy!

Plus sarah palin $150,000.00 on clothes, most Americans could have bought a home for that amount!

Besides I think Sarah Palin is really a Terrorist

Breaking News: The Terrorist Group AKA Alaska Independent party Calling on Russia to help secede from the Union
www.chilitoz.com
Extremists Mark Chryson and Steve Stoll former leaders of the Alaska Terrorist group AKA Independence Party and friends of Sarah Palin are calling on Russia to help them gain independence from the United States.

Watch video of Sarah palin addressing The Alaska Terrorist Group also known as The Independence party. They are calling for a civil war against the mainland.
www.chilitoz.com

[whatithink10]

sukitobamy,

Corporations own the government, so it is the same thing.

[whatithink10]

We''ve let the corporations take control of our government. This is not what was meant to be. This has changed over the last 30 years. Trickle-down IS wealth redistribution.

[smclimans]

Today on my way to lunch, I passed a homeless guy sitting
on the sidewalk with the extra advertisement
"Vote Obama, I need the money".
I smiled.

In the restaurant,
the waiter had an Obama ''08 button with his Obama necktie.
Again I smiled.

When the $12 lunch bill came, I explained to the waiter
that I was testing the Obama wealth redistribution concept.
He stood there, dumbstruck and MAD, as I told him I would be
giving his tip to the homeless guy outside who needed it more.
The waiter trotted off pissed, while the homeless guy
was thrilled that he receieved money he didnt EARN!

Just a short lesson in Obama socialist economics.
Great story, huh? (and true) just happened
Try it yourself in the next few days!


ANYONE WHO THINKS I WAS BEING MEAN,

I got the "spread the wealth" idea from OBAMA

[whatithink10]

ZEITGEIST on Youtube.

If you want to know who is running this country.

This is BASIC ECONOMICS, people.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Posted by sukitobamy at 04:32 PM : Oct 25, 2008

It''s only one theory of economics.

There is nothing "Socialist" in changing tax rates, we''ve done it for decades.

There is no reason the rich or corporations should be given ways to protect their income by paying lower tax rates. The "trickle down" theory needs to be looked at pretty much as a failure, sure we all made some money, but those at the top made more and in many cases did not reinvest or reinvested someplace besides America.

In case you haven''t noticed (and this election shows it) basic rules and structure nearly always start at the top, but real change starts from the bottom up

[whatithink10]

sukitobamy,

This is what Reagan wanted you to believe. And, you did. And, in 1982 the wage gap between the CEO and the average full-time worker was 42. In 2004, it was 431. Slowly and quietly, the trickle-down has worked and now people need to go into debt to keep up. The CEOs are not working harder today than in 1982 and the full-time worker is not working less.

[bigjoe-24]

@scb1111_1 said:

After a week of early voting in Pennsylvania, over one-third of the Democratic voters in many local newspaper surveys show they voted John McCain. BAD NEWS for Barack Obama. Many papers in Pennsylvania now believe John McCain will take the state on Election night? .........
........................

I challenge you to provide a link to one of those "newspapers" (even fix news would do).

Just because you want it to be true doesn''t mean it would be... hope you have the honor to show us some links.

[whatithink10]

DEBT = SLAVERY = TRICKLE-DOWN = TRICK YOU INTO THINKING YOU ARE *** THE POOR, WHEN YOU ARE REALLY *** YOURSELF.

[whatithink10]

sukitobamy,

Look at what Chicago School did to Argentina...the guinea pig.

It doesn''t work. Sorry.

Another example of wealth re-distribution under Reagan. Research what happened to THE SOCIAL SECURITY TRUST FUND.

Finally, the GOP has NEVER cut taxes. In order to truly cut taxes, you need to have a surplus. The GOP has ONLY fooled you...bamboozled you...

They''ve taken out debt with compounding interest to foreign nations

and our children will pay for it.

That''s another form of wealth re-distribution...making those who pay taxes in the future support decisions made in the past.

[bigjoe-24]

@Posted by sukitobamy said: The Wall Street bail out IS socialism, and the DEMOCRATS had to drag the Republicans kicking and screaming into the House and Senate to support it! That was BAD GOVERNMENT (SOCIALISM).

So now you think we should elect Senator Government (Obama) to complete the transformation of the USA into the USSR???!!!
.................

It seems you''ve been leaving under a rock for the last 8 years... even communist china is doing better.

[smclimans]

but real change starts from the bottom up

Posted by RICKWAR at 04:47 PM : Oct 25, 2008





Absolute B.S.

IF real change starts at the bottom up,
then why isn''t Mexico or Cuba a major economic power

Hmmmmmmmm ????

[smclimans]

but real change starts from the bottom up

Posted by RICKWAR at 04:47 PM : Oct 25, 2008





Absolute B.S.

IF real change starts at the bottom up,
then why isn''t Mexico or Cuba a major economic power

Hmmmmmmmm ????

[smclimans]

Today on my way to lunch, I passed a homeless guy sitting
on the sidewalk with the extra advertisement
"Vote Obama, I need the money".
I smiled.

In the restaurant,
the waiter had an Obama ''''08 button with his Obama necktie.
Again I smiled.

When the $12 lunch bill came, I explained to the waiter
that I was testing the Obama wealth redistribution concept.
He stood there, dumbstruck and MAD, as I told him I would be
giving his tip to the homeless guy outside who needed it more.
The waiter trotted off pissed, while the homeless guy
was thrilled that he receieved money he didnt EARN!

Just a short lesson in Obama socialist economics.
Great story, huh? (and true) just happened
Try it yourself in the next few days!


ANYONE WHO THINKS I WAS BEING MEAN,

I got the "spread the wealth" idea from OBAMA

[whatithink10]

smclimans,

The golden years of the U.S. engine were the years when the gap between the rich and everyone else was the narrowest...the 1950s and 1960s.

EVERY first world country has a much smaller gap between the rich and everyone else than EVERY third world country...and China and India are working to build up their middle classes...while we destroy ours by forgetting how we got here.