Court Eyes Illegal Aliens And ID Theft

Supreme Court To Decide Whether Aliens Using SS Docs Should Be Prosecuted For ID Theft

(CBS/AP)  The Supreme Court agreed Monday to decide whether people picked up on immigration violations also can face charges of identity theft if they use Social Security and other identification numbers that belong to others.

Federal appeals courts have split over whether the defendant must know that the phony ID numbers belong to a real person and the court said it will resolve the question.

Federal prosecutors have increasingly been bringing the more serious identity theft charges against undocumented immigrants, including many who were arrested in raids on meatpacking plants.

Defense lawyers have argued that their clients should not be charged with stealing someone else's identity because the immigrants only were seeking documentation that would allow them to work. They didn't know if the numbers were fictitious or belonged to someone else, their lawyers say.

The Bush administration, however, has said that it doesn't matter under federal law.

CBS News legal analyst Andrew Cohen says no matter what the Justices decide, this trend toward charging undocumented immigrants with identity theft is here to stay.

"And if the Court says that current law restricts what prosecutors can do, then Congress can simply change the law to make such charges easier to prove.

This issue is not going to go away no matter what the Justices decide. And if this weren't an election year it's likely that Congress would be voting on how to give prosecutors more leeway to go after undocumented immigrants for identity theft charges,'' said Cohen.

The 8th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals, based in St. Louis, agreed with the administration and upheld the conviction of Ignacio Carlos Flores-Figueroa.

Flores-Figueroa, a Mexican national, worked at a steel plant in East Moline, Ill., since 2000. Originally, he worked there under an assumed name, and false Social Security and alien registration numbers. In 2006, he told his employer he wanted to be known by his real name and submitted new identification documents.

This time, though, the Social Security number belonged to someone else, and his green card number was that of yet another person. Suspicious, the employer contacted immigration authorities, who arrested Flores-Figueroa.

The five-count indictment against him included two counts of aggravated identity theft.

Federal appeals courts based in Atlanta and Richmond also have ruled in the government's favor in similar cases, while the appeals court in Washington, D.C., has sided with defendants.

The case, which will be argued next year, is Flores-Figueroa v. U.S., 08-108.

[frankinaz]

"You know how to stop illegal imigration? You make things so miserable for anyone caught entering illegally, they don''''t come here without the proper documentation to begin with."
Absoulutely-It''s time to say "NO!" to illegal immigrants-NO Jobs, anchor babies, housing, utilities, licenses for driving and businesses, automobile ownership, free healthcare, clinics, non-emergency hospital visits, or in-state residence
college tuition in any US state.
It should be a felony to enter and remain in this country illegally, and deportation should be automatic, because there is no such a person as a
"Law-Abiding Illegal Immigrant." These people are breaking laws, making a mockery of this country and taking advantage of it, and it''s time to end their lawbreaking and drain on the taxpayers here.
If there is compassion to be shown, let the home governments and countries of where most illegal immigrants come from (Such as Mexico) show it. These countries and their governments need to be responsible for their own populations, and not take the easy way out by dumping the problems and costs of these people on the legal US citizens and taxpayers.
Illegal immigration to the US needs to be ended for good.

[momofdaisy]

Theft is theft, no matter who does it.

[mcdonaj3]

They are smart enough to sneak illegally into our country and stay for years in some cases, but when caught they become very ignorant. Amazing.

[darnedsocks]

OF COURSE ILLEGALS SHOULD BE CHARGED WITH IDENTITY THEFT CHARGES! THEY ARE BREAKING THE LAW, DESTROYING AND DIMINISHING THE QUALITY OF LIFE OF THE PERSON WHOSE ID THEY HAVE STOLEN. IT IS IRRELEVANT WHAT THEIR MOTIVE IS: IF THE SOCIAL SECURITY NUMBER DOES NOT BELONG TO THEM; THEY ARE COMMITTING FRAUD. PERIOD. IGNORANCE IS NOT AN EXCUSE. THEY ARE TAKING THESE RISKS OF BEING JAILED AND DEPORTED WHEN THEY DON''T FOLLOW THE LAW. THE ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS NEED TO RESPECT OUR LAWS, RULES, VALUES, AND WAY OF LIFE WHEN THEY COME TO THE UNITED STATES. THIS IS NOT SUPPOSED TO BE THE LAND OF "LAWLESSNESS" WHERE IGNORANT, 3RD-WORLD PEOPLE CAN JUST DO WHATEVER IS "CONVENIENT." THEY MUST FOLLOW AND RESPECT OUR LAWS! OUR LAWS EXIST FOR VERY GOOD REASONS!

[csmith1948]

brdliky6,
get back on your meds, you''re blithering.

[cbsblogger]

It shouldn''t take the Supreme Court to decide that if someone uses fake ID and a fake Social Security number as the basis for bypassing our laws that they are committing an identity theft and a serious crime. The only question is why illegal immigrants have been getting a pass on this for years when a citizen would be charged immediately with a crime.

The second point is that those employers who hire these people are knowingly aiding and abetting a crime and need charged also.

[greeneyes222]

Well of course this is id theft. You can''t just make up a social security number and expect it to not be taken.

"They didn''t know" isn''t a defense.

[connapa]

I think the big question should be, "are they having federal taxes (Withholding and SS)taken out of their paychecks under these false SS numbers?" If they are being taxed, just deport them and keep that money. I wouldn''t be surprised if one actually sues the government to get back all the money he''s paid to the government prior to deportation.

[harbinger09]

"The Supreme Court agreed Monday to decide whether people picked up on immigration violations also can face charges of identity theft if they use Social Security and other identification numbers that belong to others."

Of course they should face ID theft, why wouldn''t they? They know THEY don''t have SS numbers so any number they have either belongs to a real person or is meant to defraud the government--the "ID" they took is not theirs so it is theft. This is a no brainer. If they can''t be charged then they are getting preferential treatment which is more than is afforded citizens who use other people''s SS number.

[burneb]

In most cases, if you take and use something of value that does not belong to you, whether you know the rightful owner or not, it''s theft.

Even if you don''t know whether someone else may claim it, the burden is on the non-owner who took it if a rightful owner is found.

[tktkr]

I agree with squeakof2006.I know it is not good to be hateful but sooner than later someone needs to make a stand and it has to be power so it has to be the government yeah right.

[tktkr]

It is the Governments fault all the immigrants are here overpopulating us and taking benefits that don''t belong to them,etc.etc. It is B.S. This is another reason why we should vote Democrat. We already have seen what Republicans DON''T DO.

[nojoy01]

Posted by brdliky6 at 09:22 PM : Oct 20, 2008

Unfortunately, as a poem, this sucks. But, you should try putting it to ''music'' and spitting it out as a rap piece. It''ll probably go platinum.

[stevador39]

Illegal aliens are criminals. This country is swamped with illegal aliens, refugees and immigrants. They all need to be denied access to food stamps, health care, education and jobs. The charities that encourage illegals are making money from this mess. Do not give to any charity that gives to foreigners.

[slim1h2o]

Posted by brdliky6 at 09:22 PM : Oct 20, 2008

Sorry Oakishpines,,,,

This poem is unacceptable,,


try again,,,,

[squeakof2006]

You know how to stop illegal imigration? You make things so miserable for anyone caught entering illegally, they don''t come here without the proper documentation to begin with. We have too many drug-dealers, rapists, burglers, murderers, all coming from Mexico with the drug trade, trashing America''s country side and cities. When they get caught, if they are an illegal with the drug trade, shoot them in the head, send them back to Mexico in a box. They steal social security numbers from citizens (they know what they''re doing when they do it!!), cut off their hands, deport them. They try to come back, shoot them. No compassion. They make a moccary of our nation. Time to deal with them. If their home contries won''t take them back, send them for a swim in the ocean. Make their lives miserable until they leave. Illegal is illegal. It''s time to take a stand!

[nojoy01]

I picked Nevada for no particular reason other than there is a lot of empty space there & if you didn''t build the prisons next to the hiways nobody would notice them. Of course, West Texas is a possibility too. :)

[nojoy01]

OK. Let''s try something new & novel to try & cut through all of the BS surrounding the basic issue. If you are an Illegal Alien, legal resident Alien, or a citizen & you commit a crime, you go to jail. Period. And if that means that we have to build more & bigger prisons, so be it. I will cheerfully pay higher taxes for a solution like this. By the way, entering the U.S. w/o going through customs IS a criminal offense, but unless you are willing to turn most of the state of Nevada into a prison compound, that law will never be enforced.

[starleo146]

There are thousands of people who entered this country legally, and waited there turn, went to school, and became citizens of this country, for them I am glad to have them join our country, and they are improving this country every day. After saying this anyone who enters illegally should be sent back to whatever country came from, they are not all Mexicans,but are the majority, a lot come from Cuba via Mexico, and I am not for any illegals in this country for any reason. Before they decide to come here believe me, they know what they need to do, what they want to do, so stealing peoples identity should only add to the crime. If you ask the legal immigrants, I think they do not like doing everything this country laws ask of them, is not right for the illegals to think they can take a shortcut.

[slim1h2o]

And there''''s more to follow, I''''m sure...

Posted by slim1h2o at 07:44 PM : Oct 20, 2008

And the Latino population that is here, the ones that are 2nd, and 3rd generations that have been raised here thinks it''s a good thing that the illegals are here. And these people are the ones helping the illegals.

And doing everything to get SS to help with food stamps, and other welfare benefits.
And when that''s failed, they have gotten their Embassy involved.


The question I would like to ask people who have had to ask for help,, Americans that is,,,


Did your Embassy help secure your benefits?


I doubt it...