John McCain's Army Of Joes

National Review Online: Republican Candidate's "Regular Joe" Supporters Are Angry At The Media Treatment Of Joe The Plumber

(National Review Online)  This column was written by Byron York.

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Tito Munoz was ready to rock when John McCain showed here up at the Connaughton Community Plaza in Woodbridge, Virginia Saturday afternoon. Dressed in a yellow hard hat covered with McCain-Palin stickers, wearing an orange high-visibility vest, Munoz carried a hand-lettered sign that said CONSTRUCTION WORKER FOR McCAIN. He got a coveted spot in the bleachers directly behind McCain, where he could be seen in the camera shot along with the guy holding the sign that said PHIL THE BRICK LAYER and the woman with the ROSE THE TEACHER banner. He cheered a lot.

Everybody was playing on the Joe-the-Plumber theme. McCain spent a lot of time on it in his stump speech, using the now-famous Joe Wurzelbacher of Toledo, Ohio, as a stand-in for “small businessmen and women all over America [who] want to keep their earnings and not give it to the government.” McCain added that Obama’s response to Wurzelbacher - the assertion that it would be best to “spread the wealth around” - made Joe the Plumber “the only person to get a real answer out of Sen. Obama.”

The crowd laughed and cheered. But for them, Joe the Plumber is much more than a zinger in McCain’s stump speech. In recent days, the Joe the Plumber phenomenon has taken on a deeper meaning for McCain’s audiences, for two reasons. First, he is a symbol of their belief that Barack Obama is going to raise their taxes, regardless of what Obama says about hitting up only those taxpayers who make more than $250,000 a year. They know Wurzelbacher doesn’t make that much, and they know they don’t make that much. And they’re not suspicious because they believe that someday they will make $250,000, and thus face higher taxes. No, they just don’t believe Obama right now. If he’s elected, they say, he’ll eventually come looking for taxpayers who make well below a quarter-million dollars, and that will include them.

The second reason Joe the Plumber resonates with the crowds is what his experience says about the media. Everybody here seems acutely aware of the once-over Wurzelbacher received from the press after his chance encounter with Obama was reported, first on Fox News, and then mentioned by McCain at last week’s presidential debate. Wurzelbacher found himself splashed across newspapers and cable shows, many of which reported that he didn’t have a plumber’s license, that he wasn’t a member of the plumbers’ union, that he had a lien against him for $1,182 in state taxes, and that he failed to comprehend what many commentators apparently felt was the indisputable fact that Barack Obama would lower his taxes, not raise them. As the people here in Woodbridge saw it, Joe was a guy who asked Barack Obama an inconvenient question - and for his troubles suddenly found himself under investigation by the media.

In the audience Saturday, there were plenty of people who were mad about it. There was real anger at this rally, but it wasn’t, as some erroneous press reports from other McCain rallies have suggested, aimed at Obama. It was aimed at the press. And that’s where Tito Munoz came in.
After McCain left, as the crowd filed out, Munoz made his way to an area near some loudspeakers. He attracted a few reporters when he started talking loudly, in heavily-accented English, about media mistreatment of Wurzelbacher. (It was clear that Spanish was Munoz’s native language, and he later told me he was born in Colombia.) When I first made my way over to him, Munoz thought I was there to give him the third degree.

“Are you going to check my license, too?” he asked me. “Are you going to check my immigration status? I’m ready, I have everything here. Whatever you want, I have it. I have my green card, I have my passport - “

I was a little surprised. Did Munoz really bring his papers with him to a McCain rally? I asked.

“Yeah, I have my papers right here,” he said. “I’m an American citizen. Right here, right here.” With that, he produced a U.S. passport, turned it to the page with his picture on it, and thrust it about an inch from my nose. “Right here,” he said. “In your face.”

Munoz said he owned a small construction business. “I have a license, if you guys want to check,” he said.

Someone asked why Munoz had come to the rally. “I support McCain, but I’ve come to face you guys because I’m disgusted with you guys,” he said. “Why the hell are you going after Joe the Plumber? Joe the Plumber has an idea. He has a future. He wants to be something else. Why is that wrong? Everything is possible in America. I made it. Joe the Plumber could make it even better than me. . . . I was born in Colombia, but I was made in the U.S.A.”

The scene turned into a mini-fracas when David Corn, of Mother Jones, defended press coverage. Munoz was having none of it. Why, he asked, would the press whack Joe the Plumber when it didn’t want to report on Obama’s relationship with William Ayers, the former Weather Underground bomber? “How come that’s not in the news all the time?” Munoz said. “How come Joe the Plumber is every second? I’m talking about NBC, MSNBC, CBS, ABC, and CNN.”

A black woman with a strong Caribbean accent jumped in the fray. “Tell me,” she said to Corn, “why is it you can go and find out about Joe the Plumber’s tax lien and when he divorced his wife and you can’t tell me when Barack Obama met with William Ayers? Why? Why could you not tell us that? Joe the Plumber is me!”

“I am Joe the Plumber!” Munoz chimed in. “You’re attacking me.”

“Wait a second,” Corn said. “Do you pay your taxes?”

“Yes, I pay my taxes,” the woman said.

“Then you’re better than Joe the Plumber,” Corn said.

That set off a general free-for-all. “I’m going to tell you something,” Munoz yelled at Corn. “I’m better than Obama. Why? Because I’m not associated with terrorists!”

And so it went. I walked away for a few minutes to strike up a conversation with the woman who had jumped into the debate. Her name was Connie, and she said she had been born and raised in Antigua, in the West Indies. “I immigrated to the United States over 20 years ago,” she told me. “It’s my home. America has become my home. I came here freely of my own free will because I loved it, and I loved what it had to offer, and I don’t want to see it ruined.”

I asked her whether it was difficult, as a black person, to support McCain at a time when probably 90 to 95 percent of black voters support Obama. “I have always been a conservative,” she told me. “I’m mad. I was extremely upset to see the way the media went after Sarah Palin and Joe the Plumber. . . . To see the drive-by media and the Obama campaign attack two ordinary Americans simply because one of them managed to get Barack Obama to tell the truth, it was shameful and disgraceful.”

Meanwhile, the great debate was continuing, with Tito the Construction Worker and David the Journalist trading points. Much of it wasn’t terribly informative, but there was one lovely moment when a shouting match turned into a lesson on the fundamental meaning of American constitutional rights - and the immigrant was the teacher.

“Let me talk,” Munoz said to Corn. “I know the Constitution, and I know my First Amendment - ”

“I’m not the state,” Corn said. “I can’t take that right away from you.”

“No, no,” Munoz shot back. “Even the state, the state cannot take that right away.”

“Right, right,” Corn quickly agreed.

“Nobody can take that away,” Munoz said.

And indeed they can’t.

[sramadera]

I am so glad that McCain is the candidate for the working man who believes in earning an honest dollar and seeking to acheive on his/her own. Our nation has an illegal immigration problem because of the opportunities that are available for the common man to acheive great wealth and to be all that they can be in whatever field they desire, the American Dream.

What a vitriolic attack on plumber Joe, the man who simply asked a question. It is the man who answered the question who needs to be scrutinized. His answer reveals his Socialistic plans for our nation. Take from those who acheive and give to those who have not yet done so. Our education system has acheived its goal of created a dependent, uneducated mass of workers who want to be led by the intellectual elites. HOW SAD!!!!

[dubya_luvr]

Joe needs to ask McSame why he wants to give tax breaks to the wealthiest Americans and corporations who ship our jobs overseas.

True socialism is giving my tax dollars to corrupt CEO''s.

True radicalism is calling 52% of America "anti-American"

McSame and Caribou Barbie: so bigoted and divisive they can''t help themselves from attacking their own country.

[idnnsg]

I am so glad that the media gave Joe the Plumber his 15 minutes of fame for being a dishonest and rather stu.pid media hog. Our nation has a stu.pidity problem because the opportunities that are available for the common man to achieve notoriety through lying are so great... it''s the American Dream!

What a vitriolic attack on plumber Joe, just because he isn''t a licensed plumber, he had no actual plan to buy his boss''s business, a business which would pay LESS taxes under Obama''s plan, not more as he claimed, and because he was a relative of Charles Keating, reminding us all about McCain''s participation in the Keating 5 swindle of US citizens, and because Joe the not-a-plumber also would pay LESS taxes under Obama''s plan, not more as he claimed-- that is, IF he paid his taxes, which he hasn''t!

FYI, all you idiot Joes: Unless you are in the top 5% earnings of this country, you will all pay LESS taxes under Obama''s plans than you will under McCain''s!! But, go ahead and vote for McCain if you''re really as stu.pid as you look!

[oscarez]

I think "Joe the Plumber" was a McCain plant to be used any way he sees fit. Joe will be paid well for his work.

[noloyalisti]

These are the average joes who don''t mind being lied to, don''t mind sending their sons to kill civilians for oil, and don''t care about spying and torture as long as it is happening to someone else. In short the trailer trash of America with less than a whole brain between the lot of them. God save America from the war-monger Cons.

[irmcvet97]

Why are McSame and his Supporters always "ANGRY" at someone or something?? "Joe the Plumber" was, like the candidate, a FRAUD! He was a LIAR and a radical, far removed from the "Average Joe" out here. Good Grief!!

[Razzl]

Joe the Plumber was a not very bright guy who got bitten by circumstances because he tried to embarass a candidate before having his facts straight. All the other Joe''s at the McCain rally also don''t have their facts straight, but to NRO that''s okay because it''s only their "feelings" that matter. Teaching people that they have their facts wrong and how to get them right is the thing that conservative hypocrites use as a symbol of "elitism" when educated Democrats do it, but is perfectly okay for Republicans to do by passing laws against everything THEY don''t like that not-bright people might do. It''s why NRO is propaganda rather than discourse; their baloney is so thick you can cut it with a knife...

[trillion1]

I am a blue collar worker and don''t know a single blue collar worker that supports mccain. When his name is mentioned most just laugh.

[ubrew12]

NRO: "They know [Joe the plumber] doesn%u2019t make that much, and they know they don%u2019t make that much. And they%u2019re not suspicious because they believe that someday they will make $250,000, and thus face higher taxes."

The days when the Republicans could win populist votes by putting their tax cuts ''on the tab'' are over. The music has stopped and its time for the little people to play for the Reagan administration, and then pay for the Bush administration. If McCain is elected, we''ll be asked to pay for the McCain administration as well. Repubs may not raise taxes, they may cut them, but they NEVER cut spending to match, and the result is a $10 trillion debt. Why not ask America to pay down even just $1 trillion of that debt? Because, if Repubs ever did, the American people would never believe their lies again. So, thanx to Repubs, the debt just goes up, and up, and up...

[quatermass2]

So - the Republicans are going back (again) to the "base" - the under-educated (and damned proud of it), the same people who rage that there even IS a candidate like Obama, who all seem to feel that they are "victims" of some grand scheme to......what? Take away their guns? Force them into some undefined-but-inevitable Marxist economic system and marry a gay person? These are the same jackasses who voted for Bush on the basis of him seeming more like someone they''d to have a beer with, and now their 401Ks are in the toilet, the country is engaged in TWO endless wars, and they''re upset that some clueless, no-license clown who can''t pay his taxes has ALSO been "thrown under" some imaginary "bus"? Hah - they weren''t going to vote for Obama anyway - why try to use their most-hated weapons against them: REASON and FACTS.

[stopkidding]

Obama more scrutinized by the media than any candidate in history. Black voters go with the Democrat 90 of the time when the candidate is white. McCain is losing (badly) and no one is really paying attention to Joe the Plumber. Other than that and about fifty other things, great article.

[skysoldier75]

Anybody who STILL can''t see for themselves, after 8 disastrous years of GOP administration, that the GOP is "what''s wrong with America" and is the reason that more than 90% of the country believes "this country is going in the wrong direction", is truly blind.

The Democrats have NEVER created a disaster like the one we''re living through right now.

It took the GOP to create a mess of this enormous magnitude.

Don''t be a fool. If you truly care about saving America, then vote Obama.

Under McCain things will only go from "incredibly bad" to "even worse".

[bobnjersey]

[Working men and women in America can read the writing on the wall - the Democrats and the Liberal Media are performing character assasinations to anyone who questions Barack Obama.]
[Posted by OneAmerican7 at 04:23 PM : Oct 20, 2008]

not quite ... idiot joe thought he had obama with a ''gothca moment'' ... and it all backfired on him because his intentions were simply to forward his agenda and throw whatever in obama''s face.

i''m hoping to win the lottery some day ... and i''m concerned that my taxes might go up ... is any candidates tax plan going to penalize me?

(only a fool would think their taxes would not be higher when you move to a higher bracket ... and as mccain has proven ... there are plenty of fools ... and they''re following behind mccain)

[nativewoman]

The truth that everyone seems to overlook is that government has to be financed somehow.

No matter who is in power, that cost will always be trickled down to the masses whether it is through taxes or taxes in disguise such as impact fees, usage fees, etc.

Shifting the tax burden away from business to the masses or from the masses to business does not lessen the overall financial burden required to run the government.

And in the end, the masses are always going to carry the financial burden either through direct taxation or increased prices for goods and services because business will always trickle the tax burden down to the masses.

If you''re going to dance the piper must be paid. The bill can be paid by the current dancers or it can be shoved off to future generations of dancers.

But the bill must always be paid.

[rayuk-2009]

The rednecks lost the Civil War, they lost the Civil Rights fight. Now they fear gun control of any kind and hate the thought of a Black President who is also a White President.

One thing wrong with Republican politicans over the last fourty years has been their very low brain power. Dole, Ford, Reagan, Bush and now McCain are good examples of people that are just too dumb to lead.

[dmgenet]

NRO again, makes a mountain out of a mole hill. The only people who WON''T get hurt by McCain''s economic thinking is the top 3% of the heap. Not Joe whomever. I love how the right loves to get the working guy and gal on their side. Obviously those workers still believe in the trickle-down theory of economics. This is akin in scope to the let-theme-eat-cake theory of economics. Here you go you can have the scraps...

[dmgenet]

Bush has set a huge precedent with his body of lies. He is not the first president to do so on either side of the aisle. Along with corruption, abuse/use of the evangelical Christians, almost constant scare ,an attemtpt to elevate the presidency to imperial status, and just the pure nastiness exuded from the White House has turned Republicans and Democrats away from the fascist-like, power hungry, ''experienced'', Bush team. In short. They blew it. Even the so-called genius of Karl Rove will be hard put to turn this around.

[cattlekate]

FAUX News repeated this meme all weekend - they were killing the "liberal" messengers who were curious to investigate if Joe was a plant. When they found out that he was, FAUX chose not to state that, but to kill the messenger.

Just like they are doing to Colin Powell right now.

FAUX should not be bundled as "news" and should not be in basic-cable packages. They are part of the destruction of our democracy, and The Fourth Estate.

[nojoy01]

Self righteousness and belligerance.
Are we ever going to see anything else from these people?
Is this all they have left?

Posted by ainttaken at 07:46 PM : Oct 20, 2008

When I first read this post, before I read the rest of your posts, I thought you were commenting on most of the people posting about this story who seem to be wishing bodily harm to other human beings & appear to be wrapped in their self righteousnes as if in a cloak of armor. My misunderstanding. After I read the rest of your posts I realized you ARE one of the self righteous, belligerent, and out of touch with reality posters.

[kansas1946]

Everybody was playing on the Joe-the-Plumber theme. McCain spent a lot of time on it in his stump speech, using the now-famous Joe Wurzelbacher of Toledo, Ohio, as a stand-in for %u201Csmall businessmen and women all over America [who] want to keep their earnings and not give it to the government.%u201D

*******************************************

LOL. Well if John McCain really wants "an army of Joes" then our deficit will be worse than it is, since it seems that Joe the (non)plumber chooses not to pay his taxes. Great. I think I will just choose not to pay my taxes so I can be a right-wing hero like Joe the (non)plumber.
I will be pretty hard to pay down King George''s deficit with a buch of Joe the plumbers.

[markangeloo]

Workers Of The World Unite
The day of the international union is upon us.
U the laborer will be able to set your wage
& the big elephant wearing the white collar
will be working for U.
Marx gave Amerika a rope & & they hung themselves.

It is actually greedy & lazy people,
mostly republican bankers, real estate loan brokers & all,
who think they work but sit around all day pushing paper;
ultimately stealing from real workers, tradespeople. etc.

As U probably guessed that includes U.
Yes writers write what others actually do.
The Hero is not the writer they are only
jealous inactive bystanders.

U just have a hobby.
Anything I can do while I am working
is not work.
In other words I could do your so called work
at my occupation but U could not do mine.
I paint houses.

Now how is it that U have all that money again??
Is it even your wealth ??

[everittjames]

Our Best Hope For America On Election Day - McCain-Palin!

I believe that McCain-Palin with the rest of our ticket for reform best represents our best hope for America and are ready to serve our country. With your help and support, we can make this happen on November 4th. Stand with us now and join our team. We need your support, James Everitt http://www.johnmccain.com

I%u2019m for lower taxes and smaller government, because lower taxes are better for families, property owners, and small businesses. With lower taxes, businesses have more money to invest, hire, and provide services. Less government bureaucracy improves the business climate, promotes economic growth, and reduces unemployment.

How are you "Joe the Plumber"?
Tell us in 30 seconds...

We want you to tell us how you are "Joe the Plumber" and why you''re supporting John McCain and Sarah Palin in thirty seconds. You could even see your video http://www.johnmccain.com/joe/ as an official McCain TV ad.

Thanks,
James Everitt
http://www.everittjames.blogspot.com

Advocates for Self-Government Quiz: http://www.theadvocates.org/quizp/index.html

P. S. Just take a couple of minutes to view our ads and I''m certain that you will understand the importance and the urgency of our message. You can see them at http://www.neverfindout.org

[ubrew12]

The days when an army of Joes would vote to enrich the already American rich is over (the wealthiest 10% already OWN 75% of the country, up from 55% in 1960).

Three-fourths of the economic growth that occurred after Bush cut taxes went to the wealthiest 1% of Americans (according to The Economist magazine). What did the ''average joe'' get? A chance to bail out Wall Streets bankers!

Enough already. If McCain speaks for the average joe, he''s in the wrong party.

[giddyupgo6]

Does anyone really believe John McCain could lead this country? A left over; from another time and place. Vindictive in every respect of his life style. An old man that set aside his first wife because she was ill, latching onto Cindy for her beer umpire and now a nobody govenor Palin who has her own problems in her own state and known to be a liar in that reguards. Aryer and Rev. Wright makes the news with them quite often, but I don''t hear about a colored person giving her witchcraft healing. McCain blows his horn, as only he can about being a war hero, but was he really, only he knows the truth. Why didn''t he return when he was allowed to? Couldn''t take the heat is my thoughts. Throughout the campaign has anyone heard him give credit to the ones that didn''t make it back or the 4000 plus lost and maimed during this iraq war? Can''t lift his arms over his head, what a pity! Look to the VA centers and those that don''t have arms to lift. Look at his body and face movements on TV. Thumbs up, clawing hands and shifty eyes, make him appear as a person on his way out and I''d bet Palin can''t wait. A constant "my friends" rolling of his tongue and the hate ads, show who the real bigot is. At 73, my predictions; Obama will be president for better or worse; McCain will get rid of Cindy and move to Alaska with Sarah and don''t know what will happen to Tod.
If your for McCain don''t forget to vote, than tell all your friends that you did!

[andor3]

joe the plumber is the perfect republican icon: he is not a plumber or a prospective business owner, nor anything he clams it seems. but he does have connections to wealthy campaign donors--so he is willing to pose as an ordinary guy to help convince real ordinary guys to vote to give their money away to the rich like relatives of "joe the plumber."

very republican!

[Netterz]

I think the media must do the polls they claim. I guess they must get this info during the day the typical 9-5 PM, never got any calls ( I work 8-4) no calls in the evening either, so I dont put any stock in supposed polls.

Maybe that is how Qbama is ahead. Every else is at work.

[babooph]

All the brainwashed "Joes" voting to not get their tax cut ,so the rich can keep theirs -I LOVE IT!!!

[messiahx4eve]

Is anyone else SICK and TIRED of McCain/Palin LOSER, WHINNEY/BUTT. SNIVELING, CRYBABY, REPUBLICAN SMEARTACTICS, PARANOID DELUSIONAL WEEZERGEEZER GIVE-ME-ONE-LAST-HURRAH-BEFORE-I-DIE/ARMEGEDDON BY PALIN SUBCHRISTIAN VALUES SPONSORED BY SINNERSRUS? I am looking forward to the fifth of November as being NO MORE AD SMEARS ON TELEVISION BY INSANE MCAIN/FAILIN''PALIN.....GOOD RIDDENCE TO HUMAN GARBAGE!!!!!!!!!!!!

[elz523]

The scene turned into a mini-fracas when David Corn, of Mother Jones, defended press coverage. Munoz was having none of it. Why, he asked, would the press whack Joe the Plumber when it didn%u2019t want to report on Obama%u2019s relationship with William Ayers, the former Weather Underground bomber? %u201CHow come that%u2019s not in the news all the time?%u201D Munoz said. %u201CHow come Joe the Plumber is every second? I%u2019m talking about NBC, MSNBC, CBS, ABC, and CNN.%u201D


The press is "whacking" Joe the Plumber because what he said was not truthful. If you put yourself or have John McCain put you in front of the media making claims about yourself that are not true, then you can expect that there will be questions. That is only fair. If you make claims about yourself in order to make a point, you should expect to have those claims examined very closely.

[elz523]

The scene turned into a mini-fracas when David Corn, of Mother Jones, defended press coverage. Munoz was having none of it. Why, he asked, would the press whack Joe the Plumber when it didn%u2019t want to report on Obama%u2019s relationship with William Ayers, the former Weather Underground bomber? %u201CHow come that%u2019s not in the news all the time?%u201D Munoz said. %u201CHow come Joe the Plumber is every second? I%u2019m talking about NBC, MSNBC, CBS, ABC, and CNN.%u201D


The press is "whacking" Joe the Plumber because what he said was not truthful. If you put yourself or have John McCain put you in front of the media making claims about yourself that are not true, then you can expect that there will be questions. That is only fair. If you make claims about yourself in order to make a point, you should expect to have those claims examined very closely.

[Gary Kempf]

John McCain''s Army Of Joes

John McCain''s Army Of Loser Joes!!!!!!!

[ocasanas]

Hahaha, oh Joe where are you. Do you Joes know that this very name of Joe is an insult in other countries?
Joe the plummer had a kitchen, eea, eaa, oh!

[walt1944-2009]

John McBush McCain says that he supports the army of "Joes" and "Janes" out there in the middle class.

Why do I not hear anything about him supporting the REAL ARMY of GI JOES? McBush has consistently voted against the GI JOE on issues like pay increases, funding for better equipment, longer time at home, and especially BETTER GI BENEFITS!

This from a former military man who claims he supports the troops, but only as far as his nose!

And this is the guy that the AVERAGE JOE thinks will support HIM, when he won''t even support GI JOE???

The only person McBush supports is HIMSELF and his AMBITION to get on the "throne" in the Oval Office.

All the rest of us can go scratch!!!

SIG HEIL, I SHOWED MCBUSH EVERYTHING ABOUT AMBITION!!!, BUSH!!!
sig heil, I RUN A CLEAN, HONEST CAMPAIGN!!!, McBush!!!
sig heil, SO LET''S HAVE A "HATE" RALLY!!!!, Palin!!!!

[hologram5]

They can take away the first amendment and they have in some cirumstances. They will continue to do so.

[markangeloo]

I dreamed I saw Joe Hill last night,
Alive as you or me
Says I, "But Joe, you''re ten years dead,"
"I never died," says he
"I never died," says he
"In Salt Lake, Joe," says I to him,
Him standing by my bed,
"They framed you on a murder charge,"
Says Joe, "But I ain''t dead,"
Says Joe, "But I ain''t dead."
"The copper bosses killed you, Joe,
They shot you, Joe," says I.
"Takes more than guns to kill a man,"
Says Joe, "I didn''t die,"
Says Joe, "I didn''t die."
And standing there as big as life
And smiling with his eyes
Joe says, "What they forgot to kill
Went on to organize,
Went on to organize."
"Joe Hill ain''t dead," he says to me,
"Joe Hill ain''t never died.
Where working men are out on strike
Joe Hill is at their side,
Joe Hill is at their side."
"From San Diego up to Maine,
In every mine and mill,
Where workers strike and organize,"
Says he, "You''ll find Joe Hill,"
Says he, "You''ll find Joe Hill."
I dreamed I saw Joe Hill last night,
Alive as you or me
Says I, "But Joe, you''re ten years dead,"
"I never died," says he
"I never died," says he

Joe Hill, an IWW union organizer and poet, was executed in 1915 after being framed on a murder charge

[zendigity]

Is it really socialism? No
McCain''''s policies seem designed to make it easier for the rich to buy a 6th or 7th house than provide a livable wage for the poor.
Hmm...How does this tactic usually play out?
Well, next step, we can round up all the poor people into camps...when those camps become overcrowded and disease begins killing people in large swaths then what comes next?
Well, I suppose we could just burn all those bodies in some kind of large ovens...
Hmm still some people alive in those camps? Are people starting to ask questions? Is it costing too much to continue to hold them there.
Guess we could gas them...after all they''re sick and poor anyway...

Is it really worth it just so the rich don''t have to pay a little more in taxes..

[G H M]

McLair and a dirty old man

[eric-914]

Curious the growing anger at the media, isn''t it? Is it because people are more and more feeling the media doesn''t represent the people? That would explain the ''elite'' media title, I guess.

[inketolstoy]

The press is "whacking" Joe the Plumber because what he said was not truthful. If you put yourself or have John McCain put you in front of the media making claims about yourself that are not true, then you can expect that there will be questions. That is only fair.

Those people attacking Joe W. do not know much about what is going on in the world of contracting. Not having a license doesn''t keep you from being a contractor, it just limits what jobs you can bid on. As far as haveing about 2,000$ owed in back taxes, that is pretty low. When I worked as a subcontractor for a couple of summers I often owed close to that. Income tax, double social security, it adds up quick. If you don''t keep that kind of cash on hand for the end of the year, you end up owing the government. You would be suprised how many "successful" contractors owe much more than that. The truth is that the media that is attacking a man''s character do not understand that really are thousands of "joes" out there in that same situation, and by questioning his integrity and patriotism they are questioning the integrity and patriotism of these other people also.

[smclimans]

Here''s the real story with "Joe the Plumber"

The liberal media is attacking an ordinary citizen because he had the audacity
to ask the liberals'' "messiah" tough questions that the liberal media will not ask.

The liberal media took offense that "The Chosen One" was embarrassed
by an ordinary citizen asking tough questions of "Him".

Rather than following up on these tough questions that were asked of "the messiah",
the media has decided to attack the ordinary citizen instead.

Pretty much sums it up

McCain is using ''Joe the Plumber'' to instill fear in the average Joe that his taxes will go up under an Obama Administration. Well I''ve got news for you, no matter who become President, taxes will have to go up regardless in order to pay for this mess that McCain''s political party and leader of that Party, George W. Bush got got us into. The point is that wage earners will fare better under the Obama Plan than under McCain''s simply because McCain wishes to continue Bush''s tax cuts and they my friends favored the wealthy a.k.a. the rich at the expense fo the wage earners. McCain is just ***''en out his mouth.

[noloyalisti]

Hey Posted by smclimans, where do you get this mindless junk. Messiah? Chosen One? Him? Sounds like you have been listening to Limp Balls again. Shame on such stupidity and ignorance. Support stem cell research, grow Republicons brains.

[stevex47]

Isn''t it amazing how many nutjobs listen to Flush?

Evidently they dont realize they are listening to the rants of a drug addict.

Just like the Manson and Hitler and James Jones followers.

[smclimans]

Here''s the real story with "Joe the Plumber"

The liberal media is attacking an ordinary citizen because he had the audacity
to ask the liberals "messiah" tough questions that the liberal media will not ask.

The liberal media took offense that "The Chosen One" was embarrassed
by an ordinary citizen asking tough questions of "Him".

Rather than following up on these tough questions that were asked of "the messiah",
the media has decided to attack the ordinary citizen instead.

Pretty much sums it up

[noloyalisti]

These "Joes" are frightened little people. Chuckle nuts McSame or Failin or Rove mention the word terrorist and they start asking for mommy. The fact is that the real terrorists are Bush, Cheney, McCain and the Republicans since war = terror. They STILL have the little brained Americans on the run. Wow!!!!

[luvcomments]

Are candidates, their campaign managers and strategists immune from being sued for libel and slander? I am truly wondering about this, considering all the lies and filth being slung around against their rival just because they can''t think of anything positive about their own candidate.

[govwatch-2009]

It doesn''t seem to come to anybodies notice, but you don''t have to have a license to be a plumber, nor do you need to be in a union. Most states do require a license to be a contractor however. Joe the plumber never said he was a contractor, he just wants to be someday. Get your facts straight before you make a fool out of yourself, again.

[ecs1749-2009]

''These "Joes" are frightened little people.''

''it is obvious Joe was a plant,''

Look what happens when somebody dares to question "Obama, the messiah"

Yes, I made over $250K last year. I don''t apologize for it. It took me 30 years of hard work to get to where I am. I used to walk 2-3 hours to work in order to save the bus fare. Now tell me why I should share my money with you or anybody else?

And yes, I paid my share of taxes, all 26% of it.

http://www.johnmccain.com/Joe/

[skysoldier75]

"Now tell me why I should share my money with you or anybody else?"

Posted by ecs1749 at 05:45 PM : Oct 21, 2008

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

Maybe because you live here and use all the things that taxes provide just as much as anybody else that lives here does? Doh!

You drive on public roads paid for with tax dollars, you enjoy Police and Fire protection, which cost tax dollars, our military defends your country and that takes LOTS of taxes. When you get old you''ll collect Social Security and Medicare and those cost tax dollars. Your schools cost tax dollars. Your sea ports and airports cost tax dollars. Your courts and jails and prisons cost tax dollars.

I could go on and on, but I''ll spare you.

Suffice it to say that there''s no such thing as a "free lunch" - even for cheap-assed Republicans that don''t want to pay their fair share of the cost of running and maintaining this country.

Your tax dollars keep you free and safe, with them you buy "civilization".

Paying taxes is patriotic -- dodging them is criminal.

Wake up, cheapskate!

[ecs1749-2009]

"Paying taxes is patriotic -- dodging them is criminal.

Wake up, cheapskate!"

I didn''t complain about paying my share of taxes, did I? As they say, it''s the cost of doing business.

My question was, in case you miss it: Why should I share my money with YOU? Why should I accept Mr. Obama''s notion that "sharing wrath with others is good...". Last I check, this is not a Socialist country.