Campaigns Battle Over "Joe The Plumber"

McCain, Obama Continue Talking About Joe Wurzelbacher From Ohio; Meanwhile, He Reveals He Doesn't Have A License

(CBS/ AP)  The campaign between John McCain and Barack Obama now centers on "Joe The Plumber."

Early in Wednesday night's final debate between the two candidates, McCain brought up Joe Wurzelbacher, an Ohio plumber who approached Obama at a campaign event last Sunday, to illustrate how the Illinois senator's tax policy would hurt small businesses.

Wurzelbacher told Obama that his tax plan would prevent him from buying the plumbing business that now employs him. Obama said he plans to raise taxes on people making more than $250,000 a year while cutting taxes for everyone else.

"He wants the government to take Joe's money and give it to someone else. His hard-earned dollars. We're not going to stand for that," McCain said Thursday at a Pennsylvania campaign stop. "America didn't become the greatest nation on Earth by spreading the wealth. We became the greatest nation on Earth by creating new wealth."

Obama on Sunday told Wurzelbacher that he wanted to raise taxes on wealthier earners so lower-wage workers could receive a tax cut. He added, "I think when you spread the wealth around, it's good for everybody."

Obama also referred to the discussion during an appearance in New Hampshire today. Obama said McCain was misleading voters by proposing tax plans that favor the rich while criticizing an Obama tax plan that would raise taxes only on people making more than $250,000 a year - just 5 percent of all taxpayers.

"He's trying to suggest that a plumber is the guy he's fighting for," Obama said. "How many plumbers you know that are making a quarter-million dollars a year?"

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Reality Check: How The Candidates' Plans Will Actually Affect "Joe The Plumber"

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McCain at his event said that "Joe the Plumber" was the real winner of Wednesday night's debate.

"Joe's the man!" McCain said at a rally in this Philadelphia suburb as supporters chanted "Joe! Joe! Joe!"

"He won, and small businesses won across America," McCain said. "They won because the American people won't let Sen. Obama raise their taxes in a tough economy. They're not going to let him do it, my friends."

"For John McCain, 'Joe The Plumber' represents the one aspect of economic crisis where he may have an edge over Obama," said CBSNews.com senior political editor Vaughn Ververs. "Republicans have traditionally won on their platform of keeping taxes low and that could be an appealing message at a time when voters are feeling pinched. But these are extraordinary times and the tax issue hasn’t seemed to bolster McCain up to this point."

Wurzelbacher himself has suddenly become a central figure in the campaign, giving several interviews to the media since last night.

After the debate, he told CBS News anchor Katie Couric that the experience of watching the debate last night was "surreal."

"Surreal's a good word to use for it," Wurzelbacher said on the CBSNews.com Debate Webcast. "It was - you know, I was glad I was able to act as some type of point, you know, to where they could sit there and hammer out what they both think, what they want to say. But ultimately, you know, the important part was the debate." (Read more of Couric's interview with "Joe The Plumber")

On Thursday, he revealed to the media assembled outside his home that he wasn't a licensed plumber. He said he works for a small plumbing company that does residential work. Because he works for someone else, he doesn't need a license, he said.

But Wurzelbacher still would need to be a licensed apprentice or journeyman to work in Toledo, and he's not, said David Golis, manager and residential building official for the Toledo Division of Building Inspection.

State and local records show Wurzelbacher has no license, although his employer does. Golis said there are no records of inspectors citing Wurzelbacher for unlicensed work in Toledo.

Wurzelbacher, 34, also said he doesn't have a good plan put together on how he would buy Newell Plumbing and Heating in nearby Toledo.

He said the business consists of owner Al Newell and him. Wurzelbacher said he's worked there for six years and that the two have talked about his taking it over at some point.

"There's a lot I've got to learn," he said.

Wurzelbacher also owes the state of Ohio $1,182.98 in personal income tax, according to Lucas County Court of Common Pleas records.

In January 2007, Ohio's Department of Taxation filed a claim on his property until he pays the debt, according to the records. The lien remains active.

Wurzelbacher, who voted in the Republican primary and indicated he backed McCain, was cited by the GOP presidential candidate as an example of someone who wants to buy a plumbing business but would be hurt by Obama's tax plans. Wurzelbacher said he was surprised that his name was mentioned so many other times.

"That bothered me. I wished that they had talked more about issues that are important to Americans," he told reporters gathered outside his home.

Wurzelbacher said he's feeling overwhelmed.

"I'm kind of like Britney Spears having a headache. Everybody wants to know about it," he joked.

In Toledo on Sunday, Wurzelbacher told Obama that he was preparing to buy the plumbing company, which earns more than $250,000 a year, and said: "Your new tax plan is going to tax me more, isn't it?"

Obama said that under his proposal taxes on any revenue from $250,000 on down would stay the same, but that amounts above that level would be subject to a 39 percent tax, instead of the current 36 percent rate.

Wurzelbacher said Obama's tax plan wouldn't affect him right now, because he doesn't make $250,000. "But I hope someday I'll make that," he said.

"If you believed (Obama), I'd be receiving his tax cuts," Wurzelbacher said. "But I don't look at it that way. He'd still be hurting others."

As he leaned against the Dodge Durango SUV parked in his driveway Thursday morning, Wurzelbacher indicated to reporters who crowded around that he was a conservative, a fan of the military and McCain. He said meeting McCain would be an honor but said he hadn't been contacted by the Republican campaign.

Still, the plumber wouldn't say who he was voting for and brushed off a question about whether he could influence the election or other voters.

"I don't have a lot of pull. It's not like I'm Matt Damon," Wurzelbacher said.

"I just hope I'm not making too much of a fool of myself," he added.

But his story clearly caught on with McCain's crowd. Some supporters held signs saying: "Joe the Plumber for senator. Undeniably qualified to clean up Washington's waste."

[cariboubarbi]

If Joe the plumber makes over 250 thousand a year, he''s selling crack on the side.


Or smoking it.

[gop_will_win]

Joe the Plumber = Meet John Doe. Maybe he will start Joe the Plumber clubs throughout the country.

[DCropp]

Joe the Plumber also had a tax lien filed against him.

The lien claims Joe didn''t pay all his state taxes so they filed against him in January 2007.

Clearly, Joe was twisting the facts to try to make McCain look good. Unfortunately, McCain never did his research, just like when he chose his running mate.

Now McCain is supporting someone who lied about his income, lied about needing a license, hates Social Security, and failed to pay his taxes.

[yongamerica]

I think Jow was referring to the taxes he''d have to pay on the purchase of the business and not the tax on the businesses income.

This example is drawing attention away from more important things, like the $800 billion that was quietly withdrawn from the treasury that was not part of the $750 billion from the bill that was recently passed. And the new issue of T-Bills to back this money the Feds really didn''t have in the first place.

And why was this fact mentioned casually in an economic talk show and this HUGE story never made the news?

[ricardo4rh]

This guy is obviously a bigot and McCain supporter. Why would he go out of his way with the Sammy Davis comment if he wants someone to take him serious?

[paggy-2009]

"If you believed (Obama), I''d be receiving his tax cuts," Wurzelbacher said. "But I don''t look at it that way. He''d still be hurting others."
--------------------------------------------------
Wow.. In this economy Joe feels the pain when Obama suggests tax increase for people/biz earning more than $2,50,000! May be his mind is not flushed clean yet to understand how big $2,50,000 is!

[marshall65]

I don''t think Joe is a plant, but he saw a chance to be in the limelight for a few seconds, and maybe make some money. Problem is he goofed it all up. He could of just as well told Obama that he supported McCain and wanted Obama to explain his tax plan. But to make up a bunch of hooey about buying a plumbing business and then not even being licensed was bad. Add to that he isn''t a registered voter-wonder how many of John''s supporters are ''Joe''s the Plumber''?

[strangeworld]

It''s almost a joke, isn''t it? What have we found out so far...the guy''s not named Joe, he''s not a plumber, and there''s no way that he going to make the $250,000 in income even if he could buy the plumbing business from his boss. What''s left to the story? Weird.

[ramos937]

To Joe The Plumber:

It is about time an average Joe had a break. Get yourself an agent ASAP...while you are hot, you are hot. When you are cold, you are cold. Right now, you are hot. Forget the problems you have because nowadays, many folks in the middle/poor class have very large problems. Forget the naysayers. Just make hay while you can. Take full advantage of the break the good Lord just gave you. I wish I was in the Agent business because right now you are a hot property.

Good luck and God Bless....

[newz4i]

McCain picks a man who doesn''t have a license, who WOULD benefit with Obama''s tax plan.

McCain picks big talkers ... one right after another.

[thcarson-2009]

Who cares if he''s licensed or not, he just seems like an ordinary man who asked a very legitimate question. Taking from the rich and giving to the poor is not tax cuts, it is tax credits and will cost taxpayers 900 billion over 4 years if Obama wins.

[incog-nito]

In other news, Joe the Plumber admits that he''s not really a plumber but occasionally fixes toilets for people, and is currently living in his mother''s garage. He also has no idea how to get the $250K to buy his plumbing business. "Maybe I''ll hit the jackpot playing the slots one of these days," Joe reportedly said. Investigative sources have also reported that Joe has a checkered past, including incidents of domestic violence and bouts of mental illess.

[gop_will_win]

BREAKING NEWS! John the Plumber just made a statement that if McCain isnt elected he will jump off the tallest building on New Years Eve! So there you go you liberals, if McCain isnt elected, his blood is on YOUR HANDS!

[thcarson-2009]

McCain picks a man who doesn''''t have a license, who WOULD benefit with Obama''''s tax plan.

McCain picks big talkers ... one right after another.


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Posted by newz4i

If obama let''s the Bush tax cuts expire as he plans, then everyones tax rate increases 3%, how does that not effect Joe.

[rodfather9]

Joe Wurzelbacher, A.K.A "Joe The Plumber." is won greedy american. it''s his atitude that has gotten this country to where it is now. "i''m rich, and i want more money." this guy should should present an alternative, instead of crying that he won''t be able to make a 1/4 of a million dollars because he will have to pay some extra tax. it''s GREED!!! these people should leave this country, and not try to divide it!!!

[liberalme]

It''''s almost a joke, isn''''t it? What have we found out so far...the guy''''s not named Joe, he''''s not a plumber, and there''''s no way that he going to make the $250,000 in income even if he could buy the plumbing business from his boss. What''''s left to the story? Weird.

Posted by Strangeworld at 03

Well the name Wurzelbacher in Ohio should ring a bell?

"Turns out that Joe Wurzelbacher from the Toledo event is a close relative of Robert Wurzelbacher of Milford, Ohio. Who%u2019s Robert Wurzelbacher? Only Charles Keating%u2019s son-in-law and the former senior vice president of American Continental, the parent company of the infamous Lincoln Savings and Loan."

http://www.progressohio.org/page/community/post/daveharding/CHv8

Could this be true? Is McCain still "buddies" with some of the Keating 5?

Was using "Joe the Plumber" a prop to snag Obama?

Gonna look more into this.

[mbourn2]

He is a fraud. HAHAHAHA

Posted by getoffmine1 at 03:23 PM : Oct 16, 2008

I''''ve been saying this the whole *** time! This guy works for McCr*pStain.

Posted by ObamaUberAll
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I have to laugh at people who attack the messenger when they don''t like the message. The point of all of this has nothing to do with "Joe the Plumber" The point is your candidates answer. Watch the clip.... listen to his words. Sometimes I think the off the cuff remarks are far more telling than the scripted stuff.

[Froman08]

Oops...there goes McSame''s talking point for the next 3 weeks


The Republicans are taking "L" all over the place.

[repforbarack]

He''s not even licensed...he''ll fade away soon enough

Joe the plumber: Poster child for the GOP

Required licenses for Toledo, Master Plumber, Journeyman Plumber and contractors license if the owner.

So is Joe a plumber or just a helper? Also in Ohio you need to have taken a business class. But, Joe has no plan. (just like McCain, a perfect fit)

The question is, does the business do 250,000 in sales, Gross profit, or net profit? It makes a world of difference. Also will Joe who says he has no plan, be a sole owner, LLC, Corp, partnership? All makes a difference in the revenue stream and what you''re taxed on.

Say it ain''t so Joe!

Even better say it ain''t so McCain!

[eggy1620]

Joe the plumber is a wealthy multiple business owner with ties to CHARLES KEATING. McCain needs to hire some staffers who recognize the world is a little bit older than their living memories.

[mbourn2]

If Joe-six-plumbers is talking about a business, then that $250k taxable income business would probably be pulling in about $750k to $1M per year in revenue...which is not your grandma''''s pottery business.

Either way...Joe ain''''t no average Joe in his hypothetical question. He''''s a fraud!

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Possibly, but your candidate did not say that. He pretty much conceded the point and said that he wanted to "spread the wealth around"

[good4always]

YO STUPID REPUBLICANS.....

HOW MANY PLUMBERS IN USA MAKE 250,000.00??????????????????????????????????????????????

[gop_will_win]

Ha ha, you liberals are falling for the "Meet John Doe" scam! Hilarious! That will teach you not to watch old movies. Vote for D.B. McCain everyone!

[brucie2006]

"Wurzelbacher, 34, also said he doesn''t have a good plan put together on how he would buy Newell Plumbing and Heating in nearby Toledo."


Joe the Plumber is a fraud and so is McCain for using him as a prop!

[frootloophhh]

Whether ''Joe the Plumber'' is a fake (or a McCain plant) he brought up a viable concern. And Barack answered it. He plans to have a tax break for ''small business''. However, ''small business'' hasn''t been defined.

However, more to the point, the redistribution of wealth from the rich to the middle and poor classes isn''t fair. I don''t think ANYONE likes our tax system, but that''s what Obama and McCain have to work with. So at the present time, taking from the rich to give to the poor is the only way to effect lower taxes for the middle and low income folks.

I hope Obama, when elected, will consider changing our tax system.

[coppertales]

A prime example of the liberal news media trying to distract the issue here. Wether or not Joe has a license or not is immaterial. The issue is that Obama said he is going to tax any business making over 250000 bucks and give it to the poor.

For example of what the media is doing, I work for airline XYZ but I don''t have a pilot''s license so it is not safe to fly airline XYZ. So what? Stick to it issue and don''t try to cover it up...

[liberalme]

So if "Joe the Plumber" doesn''t have a license wouldn''t that make him "Draino Joe"?

[cariboubarbi]

Here we go again.

If Joe the unlicensed plumber''s helper is anywhere near making 250k, we all need to start shoveling ***** right away!

There''s no way he or his unlicensed boss are pulling in that kind of money unless it''s a front business for selling drugs.

Joe, put the pipe down. I mean the crack pipe.

[thcarson-2009]

Either way...Joe ain''''t no average Joe in his hypothetical question. He''''s a fraud!


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Posted by ObamaUberAll at

You''re a moron, how much do you make a year? Do you not understand Obama''s tax credits will cost taxpayers 900 billion over 4 years. Why does someone who pay absolutely nothing in on taxes deserve tax credits? I make 80k per year and don''t believe for 1 second that my taxes will go down under Obama.

[brucie2006]

Good4Always
YO STUPID REPUBLICANS.....

HOW MANY PLUMBERS IN USA MAKE 250,000.00 ????????????????

Exactly. thanks.

[yongamerica]

Don''''t put the cart before the horse. With today''s economic crunch and failing banks, it''s more than probable Joe couldn''t qualify for the loan to buy the business in the first place.

[docpeter1953]

From the above article, "Wurzelbacher told Obama that his tax plan would prevent him from buying the plumbing business that now employs him."

"Joe''s the man!" McCain said at a rally in this Philadelphia suburb as supporters chanted "Joe! Joe! Joe!"

"He won, and small businesses won across America," McCain said. "They won because the American people won''t let Sen. Obama raise their taxes in a tough economy. They''re not going to let him do it, my friends."

"On Thursday, he revealed to the media assembled outside his home that he wasn''t a licensed plumber. He said he works for a small plumbing company that does residential work. Because he works for someone else, he doesn''t need a license, he said.

But the county Wurzelbacher and his employer live in, Lucas County, requires plumbers to have licenses. Neither Wurzelbacher nor his employer are licensed there, said Cheryl Schimming of Lucas County Building Regulations, which handles plumber licenses in parts of the county outside Toledo."
_____________

So what we have here is a liar supporting the McCain/Palin ticket on national news pretending to be a wanna be small business owner.

[cariboubarbi]

prime example of the liberal news media trying to distract the issue here. Wether or not Joe has a license or not is immaterial. The issue is that Obama said he is going to tax any business making over 250000 bucks and give it to the poor.

For example of what the media is doing, I work for airline XYZ but I don''''t have a pilot''''s license so it is not safe to fly airline XYZ. So what? Stick to it issue and don''''t try to cover it up...

Posted by coppertales at 03:46 PM : Oct 16, 2008




Obama never said he''d give it to the poor. He''s adjusting our tax policy so that it will stop favoring the rich over the working class as it does today.

Trickle down economics has been a huge disaster for this country.

[docpeter1953]

A prime example of the liberal news media trying to distract the issue here. Wether or not Joe has a license or not is immaterial.

Posted by coppertales at 03:46 PM : Oct 16, 2008
____________

Until they do work on your house and the p00p backs up into your living room and ruins your carpet. Then you would wish he had a license.

I guess you are one of the ones that cannot distinguish the differences between lies and truth, personal and corporate income taxes.

[dooddad]

Maybe McCain should have nominated Joe to be Vice-President. He seems just as qualified as Palin.

[cariboubarbi]

Posted by PALIN691 at 03:49 PM : Oct 16, 2008



Some plumbers do well. But you''d be hard pressed to find any plumbers who make 250k unless they sell drugs on the side.


Joe the fraud is unlicensed as is his boss the only other employee of this bogus company. These two geniuses who''d be lucky to make 40k a piece.

[frootloophhh]

I make 80k per year and don''''t believe for 1 second that my taxes will go down under Obama.
Posted by thcarson at 03:48 PM : Oct 16, 2008
--------------------------
Actually, at our rate they don''t go down, they say right about the same. McCain''s and Obama''s tax table are out on the net....check''em out.

The tax relief for the lower middle class and below come almost exclusively from sucking it to the ''rich dudes''. However, the ''rich dudes'' taxes will be right back to pre-Bush days.

[thezenmethod]

Who is the real John McCain? Dr Jekel or Mr. Hyde?

http://my.barackobama.com/page/community/post/markoppenheim/gGgHpf

[mbourn2]

It seems like your the only one here that doesn''t understand what Obama actually said.
Posted by ObamaUberAll

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Well, lets take a look at what they both said. Below is Obama''s answer from the clip. Is his position on this is so great, maybe he should produce an ad letting EVERYONE know about how he wants to "spread the wealth around".

Joe: Your new tax plan is going to tax me more isn''t it?

Obama: It''s not that I want to punish your success, I just want to make sure that everybody who is behind you, that they''ve got the chance at success too. I think that when you spread the wealth around, its good for everybody.

[macusweil]

So in the end like everything else with the republican party, Joe the plumber isn''t real, he''s not an actual plumber and he doesn''t make a quarter million a year.. it''s all smoke -n mirrors.

[dutchiehaley]

Hey, that guy Joe Six-Pak showed up, spoke intelligently, called the Socialist Messiah a Socialist, scared the heck out of the Dems, and got his 15 minutes! JOE SIX-PAK SCARRES THE HECK OUT OF YOU dUM''S!hahahahaha!!

[realcloak]

I commend both Senators in the use of ''Joe the plumber'' as a metaphor and some how, miraculously saving face. Because Lord knows, the real ''Joe the plumber'' is a dumb-a**! I am litterally laughing hysterically as I type this, because politics has become a caricature of itself. With any luck, on the evening of November 4th, Rush Limbaugh and Bill O''Reilly will drink themselves into a stupor after history is made for more comedic effect!

[notfooled]

This Plumber Joe tactic reeks of sheer stupidity.

McCain tries to smear Obama by trying to make us feel sorry for folks that make more than 250k.

How many folks out there feel sorry for people that make 250k a year?

Stupid is as stupid does. You have to feel sorry for desperate McCain and his antics.

[cariboubarbi]

A prime example of the liberal news media trying to distract the issue here. Wether or not Joe has a license or not is immaterial.

Posted by coppertales at 03:46 PM : Oct 16, 2008



He has to be licensed to be insured. And he has to be insured to protect the customers from thousands of dollars of potential damage to their property should he screw up.

That''s why plumbers are required to have a license in his town.

Joe is just another one of the many frauds that McCain and the GOP are trying to sell the American people on.

[gop_will_win]

Will Joe the Plumber jump off the roof of City Hall on Christmas Eve if McCain isnt elected?

[DCropp]

Plumbers are not rich. The average is less than $50,000/year.

Joe told several lies.

1) He''s not a licensed plumber. In his county, he cannot perform plumbing tasks or it is a state violation.
2) Joe doesn''t make nearly the amount he claimed. In fact, Joe will receive 3 times more from Senator Obama''s plan than from Senator McCain''s plan.
3) Joe had a tax lien filed against him by the state in January 2007 because he failed to pay all of his state taxes.

Joe has been a registered Republican since his first vote. Joe the Plumber lied because he wants McCain to win.

[cattiej]

Joe, the fake plumber was a plant. I hope the Obama campaign folks are monitering this site. This "Joe" is not the average Joe but was a "set-up by the McCain camp. All more of McCain''s dirty campaign tactics.
We are certain we will now vote for Obama. We were undecided until this information was "leaked" today. Just goes to show you how McCain and Palin would conduct our business here in America...Palin is a barracuda Barbie and McCain needs to retire to one of his 8 homes. Message to McCain''s mom, we ARE NOT going to hold our nose (as you suggested months ago) and vote for John.....
Joe and his boss, should be arrested for working as unlicensed Plumbers''s They should also be fined $$$$ and the money given to charity.
Since McCain''s campaign people didn''t vet this guy before sending him out to harass Obama (like they did''t vet Palin), we now find out that oe is a relative of Robert Wurzelbacher of Milford, Ohio. Charles Keating''s son in law and former senior vice president of Amrican Continental, the parent company of the infamous Lincoln Savings and Loan !
Remember that John McCain was part of the Keating 5!!
Does McShame think that our citizens can uncover in graft in all this dirty politics from this group of cone-heads.

[strangeworld]

"However, more to the point, the redistribution of wealth from the rich to the middle and poor classes isn''''t fair."

Have you paid attention at all for the last 28 years? Since Reagan took office in 1980, the republican party''s goal has been to redistribute the wealth of the middle class to the rich. They''ve succeeded, and our current economic meltdown is a byproduct of that effort. The wealthy in this country now hold a far greaterpercentage of the total wealth than they did even 7 years ago, while the middle class has been shrinking with more people slipping into the poor category. The rich have been grabbing the money for years, now are crying when someone wants to return the balance to a normal situation. I really don''t care too much if the wealthy have to pay a little more in taxes...and if you don''t make over $250,000 you shouldn''t either. One could argue that the best days of the US, both for business as well as other people, came at a time when business and the wealthy paid a far greatwer percentage of their earnings to the taxman than they are doing now. Obama is not talking about redistributing wealth...he''s talking about helping the middle class return to a level of wealth that they held during the good times. Nothing wrong with that idea.

[oscarez]

This from USAToday:
"Joe the Plumber, he of some two dozen mentions in last night''s presidential debate and probably closing in on that many media interviews, apparently isn''t a licensed plumber. He may be registered to vote under a misspelling of his last name. Plus, there''s a lien on him for nearly $1,200."

Poor old John he just can''t check a break!!!!