U.S. Abandons Afghan Base, Taliban Move In
Troops Reportedly Arm Local Cops Before Bailing On Remote Outpost, Then Cops Flee Militants
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Face covered Taliban militants pose before they execute two Afghan women in Ghazni province, Afghanistan, on July 12, 2008. (AP PHOTO)
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Taliban Kills U.S. Troops
Nine U.S. soldiers were killed in a Taliban attack with the distinct markings of al Qaeda. Lara Logan reports on the group's growing stronghold in Afghanistan's remote, mountain regions.
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9 Dead In Taliban Attack
Nine U.S. Soldiers were killed and fifteen others wounded in the deadliest attack on U.S. forces in Afghanistan in three years. Kimberly Dozier reports.
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Violence Flares In Afghanistan
An attack by insurgents against a U.S. base in Afghanistan left nine U.S. troops dead. Since May, more U.S. and allied troops have been killed in Afghanistan than in Iraq. Thalia Assuras reports.
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Compounding the military setback, insurgents quickly seized the village of Wanat in Nuristan province after driving out the handful of police left behind to defend government offices, Afghan officials said.
Some 50 officers were headed to the area to try to regain control, said Ghoolam Farouq, a senior provincial police official.
Sunday's attack by some 200 militants armed with machine guns, rocket-propelled grenades and mortars was the deadliest for the U.S. military in Afghanistan in three years. Rebels fought their way into the newly established base, wounding another 15 Americans and suffering heavy casualties of their own, before the defenders and warplanes could drive them back.
The assault underlined how Islamic militants appear to be gaining strength nearly eight years after the ouster of the Taliban, and the difficulties facing foreign and Afghan forces trying to defeat them.
NATO said the post, which lies amid precipitous mountains close to the Pakistan border, had been vacated, but insisted that international and Afghan troops will "retain a strong presence in that area with patrolling and other means."
"We are committed, now more than ever, to establishing a secure environment that will allow even greater opportunities for development and a stronger Afghan governmental influence," NATO spokesman Capt. Mike Finney said.
We are committed, now more than ever, to establishing a secure environment that will allow even greater opportunities for development and a stronger Afghan governmental influence.
Capt. Mike Finney, NATO spokesmanSami said U.S. troops armed local police with more than 20 guns before they left, but that the officers had fled the village and crossed into neighboring Kunar province when 100 militants moved into Wanat.
In other related developments:
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See all 122 CommentsCompounding the military setback, insurgents quickly seized the village of Wanat in Nuristan province after driving out the handful of police left behind to defend government offices, Afghan officials said.
This improves our position in Afghanistan how???
Anybody that was in Vietnam recognizes this FUBAR. Take a position and then walk away from it. Just so more American lives can be lost to retake it. What kind of sh*t for brains military command do we have there????
Thanks, for a minute I thought I was in some kind of time warp and was watching a CBS evening news report on the war in vietnam. *** is going on there ?
Also disturbing is they gave local cops 20 guns to hand over to the Taliban as they moved into town.
Thanks to the great training of the Iraqi Armed Forces and police by the US Armed Forces and our allies in Iraq.
IF..................IF.......................IF Obama and our Do Nothing Democrats in our Congress had gotten their way Iraq would have been lost.
NOW that the surge has worked in Iraq .............OF COURSE we will be shifting more to wrapping up our Afgan efforts.
But NO THANKS to Obama, the Democrats, and the left-wingers in our wolfpack press, the Dems historic "enablers".......................................sad but true.
It astounds me how little our military has refused to learn. How little American lives mean still mean to those in command...
It''s not unusual to see you fascist have these attacks. Now let''s have a little recount of ACTUAL FACT here Sparky. Iraq was and will always be a LIE. IT is not nor was it EVER the "Front" in the War on Terror. The Surge did NOT work nor will it work... the parties in Iraq are NOT going to unite into ONE government until and unless they HAVE too. Afganistan is a problem because that HOPELESSLY INCOMPETENT LOSER a few still call a President and that LOSER running for the Republican Party WALKED away from the real enemy and allowed them to COMPLETELY REBUILD! Gezzzzzzzzzz! They say wearing a swastika makes you stupid... how many do you have on?? SIEG HEIL BUSH
4dd0fa711/GkVgJb/VEsH/
When we leave, and we will, the Iraqi leaders will set up the type of government that THEY want, which will NOT be a western style democracy.
And without a lot more help from NATO, Afghanistan will probably leave us with the same result that the Russians wound up with.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
You sound like you think that politicians actually believe what they say in their speeches. What you hear is what their speech-writers actually believe about the subject.
More than a year and half before 911 the CIA Special Activities Division was conducting operations in Afghanistan, trying to topple the Taliban regime for the Caspian Sea Oil & Gas Pipelines...........We now call such activities terror.
February 12, 1998 John J. Maresca vp of UNOCAL oil appeared before a House sub committee. The purpose of the meeting was to gain support for exploitation of oil & natural gas resources, for the rights purchased by BIG OIL in the Caspian Sea area.
In his testimony he stated, "The key question is how the energy resources of Central Asia can be made available to nearby Asian markets ".
The exploitation option stated : "One obvious route south would cross Iran, but this is foreclosed by American companies because of U.S. sanctions (with Iran ) . The only other possible route is across Afghanistan, which of course has it''s own unique challenges. " He continued saying, " the pipeline we have proposed across Afghanistan could not begin until a recognized government is in place that has the confidence of governments,lenders (world monitary fund & world bank ) ,and our company "......"
UNOCAL and other American companies are prepared to undertake the job ".
When it is all said and done, Iran backed extremists in Iraq and Iran backed extremists in Afghanistan will quietly move back in and take over.
Trying to plant the seeds of democracy in muslim middle eastern countries is a complete waste of time, money and human life.
"That didn''t work,,,where next will we
bet nine soldiers'' lives on a forward
outpost working?, , anyone?, , ,Steven? , ,
Yes. Id like to propose a great talking
point to counter the present Fannie, Freddie "misundering".
That''s the NEXT think tank, Steve!!
NINE LIVES!!,, the public just
proved they will accept nine dead
soldiers to test the feasiblility of a
forward outpost! So where to next? , ,
, , , ,anyone? , , , , , ,
, , , George, you got the darts, , ,"
In Afghanistan as in Iraq - as in all wars - you must adapt your tactics to suit the terrain and the enemy.
We should have gone in, inflicted massive punishment, got out, and prepared to repeat...ad infinitum.
But PNAC - with their fixation on possession with a view towards turning an eventual profit and/or creating an emotional target that obscured the existance of Israel - instead relegated our troops to the role of "possessors" (note how I carefully avoided the term "occupiers").
When you face an enemy that uses fluid and dynamic tactics and you force your personnel into static defensive positions, you transform your military from the most aggressive and successful force in the history of the world into so many tin ducks in a shooting gallery.
It is too bad that George H.W. Bush''s genes did not breed true - he had the requisite intelligence to keep his personal emotions, desires and whims out of the dynamic decision-making process that is war.
Posted by harpoot at 09:31 AM : Jul 16, 2008
That is a misstatement.
The military learned from Vietnam. Unfortunately, the decision making power resided - and resides - in the hands of people who successfully hid from the lessons of Vietnam - Cheney and Bush.
Terrorism is effectively guerrilla warfare - and success in guerrilla warfare is closely linked to the ability to utilize concealment.
Iraq is mostly desert, so concealment was provided by blending in with the local population; I say "was" because once the U.S. military discarded the failed PNAC (rummy, wolfie, and cheney) policies and garnered the cooperation of the Sunni, that concealment went away.
Afghanistan is much more like Vietnam in that concealment is provided by the extremely rugged and mountainous terrain, as well as by the proximity of "off limits" nations like Pakistan (which could be considered to be Afghanistan''s Cambodia).
Afghanistan is much, much more dangerous to us..
Compounding the military setback, insurgents quickly seized the village of Wanat in Nuristan province after driving out the handful of police left behind to defend government offices, Afghan officials said."
The righties call this "winning" the war on terror?!?
Mayer also says that although Bush officials feared prosecution and frantically sought protection via legislation like the atrocious Military Commissions Act, lawsuit are not likely because many of those in Congress who would spearhead such legal actions are themselves compromised:
An additional complicating factor is that key members of Congress sanctioned this program, so many of those who might ordinarily be counted on to lead the charge are themselves compromised. [%u2026] My guess is that the real accountability for President Bush will be in the history books, not the court room.
Glenn Greenwald pounces and tears apart the Democrats for their complicity in Bush%u2019s torture regime/war crimes.
I strongly suggest you read the entire interview, but this paragraph really stuck with me:
The sadistic treatment of Abu Zubayda also seems to have affected him psychologically in bizarre ways. Two sources said that he became sexually obsessive, masturbating so much his captors feared he would injure himself. One described him as acting %u201Clike a monkey at the zoo.%u201D A physician was called in for consultation%u2014one of many instances in which health professionals have played truly disturbing roles in this program. (I personally feel that the medical and psychological professionals who have used their skills to further a program designed to cause pain and suffering should be a high priority in terms of accountability. It has long been a ghastly aspect of torture, worldwide, that doctors and other medical professionals often assist. The licensing boards and professional societies are worthless, in my view, if they don%u2019t demand serious investigations of such unethical uses of science.)
(cont)
By: SilentPatriot @ 6:45 AM - PDT
In a fascinating interview with Scott Horton, investigative journalist Jane Mayer talks about her new book, The Dark Side, which chronicles the Bush administration%u2019s dealings with torture, and offers some incredible (and depressing) insight into her superb reporting over the past few years.
The reaction of top Bush Administration officials to the ICRC report, from what I can gather, has been defensive and dismissive. They reject the ICRC%u2019s legal analysis as incorrect. Yet my reporting shows that inside the White House there has been growing fear of criminal prosecution, particularly after the Supreme Court ruled in the Hamdan case that the Geneva Conventions applied to the treatment of the detainees. This nervousness resulted in the successful effort to add retroactive immunity to the Military Commission Act. Cheney personally spearheaded this effort. Fear of the consequences of exposure also weighed heavily in discussions about whether to shut the CIA program down. In White House meetings, Cheney warned that if they transferred the CIA%u2019s prisoners to Guantanamo, %u201Cpeople will want to know where they have been%u2014and what we%u2019ve been doing with them.%u201D Alberto Gonzales, a source said, %u201Cscared%u201D everyone about the possibility of war crimes prosecutions. It was on their minds.
(cont)
If Bush and his fellow Republican idiots would have simply finished the job in Afghanistan instead of running off to steal Iraq''s oil, Al Qaeda and the Taliban would have been defeated.
Posit this scenario:
In response to Hitler''s declaration of war, we (presuming we had technological superiority as we have in Iran and Afghanistan) blew in like a tornado and smoked those forces that we could see in February of 1943.
Would World War II have ceased at that point in time? I would answer with a resounding "NO!".
You see, Nazism, like the corrupted version of Islam that al-Qaeda has adopted, is an ideology that had many "true believers". It was the run-up to our eventual invasion of Germany that guaranteed the lack of subsequent years of guerrilla warfare.
We bombed Germany, and bombed them, and bombed them, and bombed them, and bombed them....killing Germans 100,000 at a time in some instances.
We literally burned the "belief" out of the "true believers" of Nazism - leaving nobody with the will to continue the fight using guerrilla - or "terrorism" - tactics.
PNAC (both those who are within and and outside of this Administration) live in a world where you call the cops or carry out a hostile takeover and your problems magically just disappear...at no personal risk to themselves.
What''s funny is that you''ll NEVER hear about how or when or where we captured bases, defeated the enemy, etc...
but should the Taliban literally walk into an abandoned camp - it''s the front cover story...
Liberals - aiding & abetting America''s enemies since 1953
If the Afghanistan gambit is sincere, I don%u2019t think it is good geostrategy. Afghanistan is far more unwinnable even than Iraq. If playing it up is politics, then it is dangerous politics. Presidents can become captive of their own record and end up having to commit to things because they made strong representations about them to the public [%u2026]
Afghan tribes are fractious. They feud. Their territory is vast and rugged, and they know it like the back of their hands. Afghans are Jeffersonians in the sense that they want a light touch from the central government, and heavy handedness drives them into rebellion. Stand up Karzai%u2019s army and air force and give him some billions to bribe the tribal chiefs, and let him apply carrot and stick himself. We need to get out of there. %u201CAl-Qaeda%u201D was always Bin Laden%u2019s hype. He wanted to get us on the ground there so that the Mujahideen could bleed us the way they did the Soviets. It is a trap.
The problem, as Cole very expertly notes, is that there%u2019s no government in any meaningful sense over there, just a loose confederation of tribes and clans. There is probably a more pernicious force willing to subjugate them, but if the clans are willing to resist it will be unsuccessful. As it is the clans appear only willing to resist Western forces.
When was the last time that an al-Qaeda operative was captured in Afghanistan by US forces? Is that really what US troops are doing there, looking for al-Qaeda? Wouldn%u2019t we hear more about it if they were having successes in that regard? I mean, what is reported in the press is that they are fighting with %u201CTaliban%u201D. But I%u2019m not so sure these Pushtun rural guerrillas are even properly speaking Taliban (which means %u2019seminary student.%u2019) The original Taliban had mostly been displaced as refugees into Pakistan. These %u2018neo-Taliban%u2019 don%u2019t seem mostly to have that background. A lot of them seem to be just disgruntled Pushtun villagers in places like Uruzgan.
There has now been a rise of suicide bombings in Afghanistan, on a scale never before seen. One killed 24 people in a bazaar at Deh Rawood on Sunday. Robert Pape has demonstrated that suicide bombings typically are carried out by people who think their country is under foreign military occupation. If the US keeps sending more troops, will that really calm things down?
(cont)
Posted by dogsoul at 10:08 AM : Jul 16, 2008
The problem with you neocons is you cannot distinguish between "liberals" and those of us who prefer to fight and win wars rather than watch chickenhawk neocons turn a profit getting Americans killed.
It was known from day one u can''t win these kind of wars with air power and a tiny occupation force. Heck u couldn''t even subdue Alabama with a force this small much less an incredibly mountainous and diverse country the size of Texas whose citizens hate your guts.
Great job Bushie and Rummie! Great planning, we didn''t win because you didn''t want to, you want the instability and high oil prices to feed your New World Disorder dream.
http://politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/512/
FOR MORE OF THE SAME,
VOTE MC CAIN!!!
Some of you Bush_Cain lovers please tell me why Bush let the Taliban walk away with their weapons and leadership intact? Please I really want to know what the plan was. It seems to have worked out so well for us and our soldiers who die for Bush''''s mistakes there, I just want to know what the strategic thinking was.
Posted by talkingham at 10:47 AM : Jul 16, 2008
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
talkingham;
IMO, the answer has been evident from the beginning.
The Iraq invasion was on track long before 9/11,
NOTHING was done, or even attempted, to stop the second and third hijacked planes from striking the second tower and the pentagon, even though the first tower was hit much earlier in the day.
The Bush administration immediately blamed Bin Laden for 9/11 and declared that we would bring him to justice and launched the attack in Afghanistan, then not only abandoned the search for Bin Laden to invade Iraq, he flatly stated that Bin Laden was not important and he didn%u2019t worry/think about him.
He, purportedly, forced some who were close to getting Bin Laden to cease their efforts, and immediately removed most of the troops from Afghanistan and invaded Iraq
Bin Laden, and 911, were evidently only used as an excuse to do what had been planned in the first place.
Stinking Bu$h Oilwar...
July 15, 2008 Bush morning news conf: Everything''s going well so far in the Caspian Basin "....
And the extermination continues:...........
February 12, 1998 John J. Maresca vp of UNOCAL oil appeared before a House sub committee. The purpose of the meeting was to gain support for exploitation of oil & natural gas resources, for the rights purchased by BIG OIL in the Caspian Sea area.
In his testimony he stated, "The key question is how the energy resources of Central Asia can be made available to nearby Asian markets ".
The exploitation option stated : "One obvious route south would cross Iran, but this is foreclosed by American companies because of U.S. sanctions (with Iran ) . The only other possible route is across Afghanistan, which of course has it''s own unique challenges. " He continued saying, " the pipeline we have proposed across Afghanistan could not begin until a recognized government is in place that has the confidence of governments,lenders (world monitary fund & world bank ) ,and our company "......"
UNOCAL and other American companies are prepared to undertake the job ".
...and those lackluster Repugs tried to impeach Clinton for a BJ...
God - I guess being a traitor is better?
would it not be more sane to bring our troops home than to start carrying on with such foolishness?
God - I guess being a traitor is better?
clinton was in trouble and lost his law license for lying under oath.clinton turned down a chance to get osama bin laden.he was just the greatest ever president,with him in charge we sure helped advance china''s missle technology.what is there not to love weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee.
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