Delayed Reunion Frustrates Sect Parents

Polygamist Sect Children Remain In Texas Custody Despite Court Rulings

(CBS)  The frustration of parents from a polygamist sect mounted Saturday as they continued to wait for the court-mandated return of their children, who were taken into custody by Texas Child Protective Services nearly two months ago for fear of possible abuse.

Parents arrived Friday at the San Angelo courthouse expecting to be reunited with their children after the Texas Supreme Court upheld a lower court ruling that the state overstepped its authority in taking custody of the children. The court ruled the children should be returned to their parents.

However, despite a tentative agreement reached early Friday between lawyers on both sides, the children remained in state custody, frustrating the hopes parents had for a reunion.

"There's no relief. There's no way to knowing when relief will be here," said Willie Jessop, a sect spokesman. "There's no way to get cooperation out of the legal system to fix what they did on April 3."

The tentative agreement, which would have returned the children Monday, contained several conditions for the parents, including:

Parents would be photographed when they pick up their child.

Parents would agree to unannounced home visits as Child Protective Services continues to investigate sexual abuse.

Children could not leave the state of Texas or even travel more than 60 miles without permission.

But after several revisions and an endless stream of concerns from dozens of lawyers representing the mothers, a frustrated Judge Barbara Walther walked of her courtroom saying that if all the lawyers could get their clients to consent and sign the agreement, she would sign it as well, reports CBS News correspondent Hari Sreenivasan. Lawyers for the children were disappointed.

"At the end of the day, these children need to be at home with their parents," said Andrea Sloan, one of the attorneys representing the children.

For eight weeks, the more than 460 children taken from the polygamist ranch in El Dorado have been split up in group shelters all over the state.

"They've had them where they wouldn't eat; they haven't been able to sleep; they've been through an absolute terror of an experience," said Jessop.

At the Yearning For Zion Ranch, parents hopeful of seeing their children continue to wait.


© MMVIII, CBS Interactive Inc. All Rights Reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten, or redistributed.

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by govwatch-2009 May 31, 2008 8:37 PM PDT

This is a very standard ploy by CPS. They grab the kids, don''''t charge the parents of doing anything wrong then say well if you just sign this contract to get parenting class then you can have your kids back. (remember these are the same kids that they are not suppose to have taken to begin with) Then if the parents mis just one class the courts will grab the kids legally. DON''''T SIGN ANY AGREEMENT, IT''''S A LEGAL TRAP!!!! I know, I use to work with CPS. Nasty bunch they are. The kids will come back because they have no legal standing. Then when you get them back, sue their *sses off. They deserve to do things right, not act like gustopos in the name of children''''s rights.
Kids do NOT belong to the state. At least not yet!

Reply to this comment

by ericmiami May 31, 2008 9:49 PM PDT

These True Mormons should go back to Utah. They''ll be safe there, Mitt Romney will protect them.

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by caitlano May 31, 2008 10:18 PM PDT

I think it''s absurd what they are doing to those children. they have them and now they''re farting around giving them back which they should be doing without all of the *** extra stuff that they are trying to get them to sign to get their kids back. they shouldn''t have them in the first place.
sorry I ever called Tx. home.

Reply to this comment

by javalation May 31, 2008 10:20 PM PDT

I view all religions as cults, but still think the authorities overstepped their bounds. They didn''t do a preliminary investigation and have treated all of these mothers as if they are unfit. In America that shouldn''t be allowed. As another poster said, the state doesn''t own all of the children, or adults for that matter.

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by jrdevo May 31, 2008 10:28 PM PDT

Amazing that two higher courts said Texas was wrong in taking the children - BUT - the parents have to sign agreements to get them back ??!!!!!

My million bucks says Texas will be funding this group for the next thousand years after they win the 460 civil lawsuits that will be in the millions EACH....

Way to go, texas...you musta got those trade-school social workers at a bargain price...but no more !

Reply to this comment

by obama4king May 31, 2008 10:39 PM PDT

This is why people distrust and have little respect for the Courts. You should fear this government and examples like this and GITMO are why.

The Courts are puppets.

Reply to this comment

by obama4king May 31, 2008 10:40 PM PDT

BTW,,, why is it that most these anti-liberty kooks come from Texas? ... I can think of another named Bush.

Reply to this comment

by aurum79-2009 May 31, 2008 10:57 PM PDT

This is a case of one religious group "baptists christian nuts" which happens to control the state government of Texas, going after another religious group "mormon christian nuts". When are we going to stop handing over our national discourse to these Luddite cretins? Has it escaped everyone''s notice that religious leaders (obama''s, McCain''s, Bushes, Nixon''s, Reagan''s) have dragged everyone through the sewer of anti-democratic xenophobia? These "religious" people are idiots.

Reply to this comment

by truthalways May 31, 2008 11:35 PM PDT

"abide by laws with one husband, wear their hair normally, dress normally, send their children to public schools " by MyOpinion1

abide by the law, cohabitate with as much sexual partners as you can, divorce as many times as you can and get married as many as you can,dress normally, wear shorts, mini skirts, bikinis everywhere to teh store for perverts to see, for kids to see, on magazines everywhere at the grocery store, at church, wear make-up, indulge yourself in vanity, get a hairdo everyday, blow your money in make-up and harido''s, make yourself look good or like a clown, send the kids to public schools, where they can be bullied, fear for school bombing or rampage, be shot, abused by the teachers etc , meet the pedophile teachers, DA''s, read Harry Potter as high school offer and learn how to kill your parents , get condoms, contraception at 13 in high schools etc....don''t forget you cannot mention the name of God in public schools, so just shut up and learn about wicca, accept g a y s, read the king & the king book as school advise...also learn how to fight for your rights as a g a y and lesbo..and all of this is normal!!! and what does God think of all of that?

Reply to this comment

by truthalways May 31, 2008 11:36 PM PDT

The way the FLDS dress, does not mean they are not normal people...if something would be not normal there is , if there was truly older men abusing the teenage girls and taking advantage of women..the state or cps or judge walter should have thought twice before taking stupid decisions that hurt children and judge all the parents the same way....or in the same basket...they should have just investigated the parents who have underage pregnant teenage girls or the mothers who could have been pregnant when they were younger than 16...that was a lack of tact and just stupid...of course they were abusing of their power and it backfired on them..would have been less costly and easier to just investigate all the teenage girls and found out where the true abuse was...but they did a mess and now we taxpayers will pay for it!!! what do they care, it''s not their money...they should also loose their jobs and that judge be disbarred!

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by susanhelit June 1, 2008 12:37 AM PDT

The courts said that CPS should not have taken the children - not because CPS was wrong, not because it''s OK for religious people to force underage girls to marry, but because they believe the judge should have gone with these restrictions. All they are doing is going with what the appeals court said - put restrictions on the parents that are short of removing the children, until the investigation is complete or finds more evidence. Restraining orders and the like were specifically mentioned.

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by rob416 June 1, 2008 5:49 AM PDT

I certainly don''t agree with the practices of this religious sect allowing underaged children to be married to adult men. If any abuse has taken place, with proof, those children should have been removed from the compound. Without that proof to remove all the children, 400 plus, and take them from their parents amounts to an intrusive Government overstepping their bounds.

The Texas Supreme Court overruled the lower Court ruling and said the children should be returned to their parents. If we are a Nation of laws, the the Court order should be carried out. Instead the Court imposes restrictions that obviously attorney''s representing the parents don''t fully agree with.

The lower Court Judge now refuses to sign the order for release of the children. It sounds like a Judge not agreeing with a higher Court order and trying to legally circumvent the law in order to support the loosing party in the case, which is Texas Child Protective Services. Judges should carry out the law not make it.

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by messiahx4eve June 1, 2008 7:56 AM PDT

NONE of the allegations have been proven so far. Its been all speculation based on a proven hoax phone call. This cult is no different than any other cult; christian or otherwise. "texass: STUPIDITY the religion, IGNORANCE the way of life."

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by jd2408 June 1, 2008 9:50 AM PDT

Don''t forget that these girls are not only married to older men but are often re-assigned to another man. What a terrible way to live. No wonder they look and act like zombies.

The poster who said these women are livestock is so right. "Animals kept or raised for use or pleasure" is the definition for livestock.

Reply to this comment

by messiahx4eve June 1, 2008 10:00 AM PDT

You have to let children live and be themselves. Giving the up for rape at 13 to pedophiles who want to sodomize and abuse them, force them to never cut their hair and confirm to a specific, forced way of life is NOT NORMAL. It is a CULT and you need to accept that. You are so far gone mentally with your paranoid delusions that you may not be able to grasp just how ridiculous your assertions are. They RAPE LITTLE GIRLS as soon as they are able to bear children and marry them off to old men. That''''s WRONG and having more than one wife is ILLEGAL so the cult is breaking the law. They are not a CHURCH.


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Posted by MyOpinion1 at 09:12 AM :


WOW!!!!! Are you talking LDS or christianity? How many christian cults follow the exact same rules you just condemned these people for practicing? Have you been a former member? How do you know all this stuff? Magical thinking? Word of mouth? Tableoid magazines? YOUR church? Being Spiritual is much more important than being religious, IF there really was a god such as the christian god, we as people, would be the furtherst thing from HIS mind. typical male thinking, huh?

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by messiahx4eve June 1, 2008 10:03 AM PDT

Careful truthalways, as the song says, "Paranoia will destroy ya."

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by whatinthewld June 1, 2008 10:52 AM PDT

So, if there is a rapist running around in Dallas, do they send all the children to group homes from the community where the rapist is thought to be?

No, in other states, last I knew, we still investigate who the guilty party is and we arrest the guilty.

Taking 460 + kids (the numbers keep growing by the way) is absolutely rediculous!!

Nobody denies that laws have been broken and a few kids may be in danger, but then for crying out loud lets do some investigating!!
Who does the governement think they are?

Reply to this comment

by whatinthewld June 1, 2008 10:56 AM PDT

If there''s a family living in your community where dad is abusing the daughter, do you think the state has the right to come into the community and take all the kids within a 2 mile radius? Your child may be in danger if the state doesn''t take them because you live close to this abusive man.
This is exactly what they have done in Texas!!

If the men are so dangerous, why haven''t they arrested the MEN. Then let the innocent go and keep those who have broken the law! and Let the children go home to their mothers!! I guess I don''t get it!! Why are they making this such a complicated issue

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by scttbrunson June 1, 2008 11:16 AM PDT

What''s with these riduculous conditions? Why won''t this judge do her duty under the law and release the childern without conditions? The State Supreme Court has stated the CPS is out of control. The problem here is the judges are rubber stamping whatever the CPS puts in front of them. Doesn''t the judge in this case understand her responsibilty includes protecting the citizens from an abusive CPS? Order the release of the childern with out conditions. Do your job...

Reply to this comment

by floydzeppl June 1, 2008 11:24 AM PDT

Delayed Reunion Frustrates Sect Parents: Yeah, I''ll bet those 45- and 50-year-old men are pretty "frustrated" right now. The cold showers aren''t working any more. They may have to stoop to 45-year-old women. A crisis.

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by floydzeppl June 1, 2008 11:25 AM PDT

Posted by scttbrunson at 11:16 AM : Jun 01, 2008
---------

Why are you worried about Constitutional Rights now? You were all for Bush taking them away to keep you safe from a few thousand tribal level terrorists.

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by susanhelit June 1, 2008 6:02 PM PDT

Anyone who wants the real facts goes and reads the Supreme Court decision itself. And in that order, they say that the ONLY reason CPS is in the wrong is that they should have imposed conditions, like those being imposed now, rather than remove the children. The judge is entirely in line, and following precisely what the appeals and supreme courts of Texas said to do.

I don''t know that it''s enough to protect these children - which you''d think would be everyone''s top priority. You''ve got a cult which has a religious belief in child abuse - and some people here don''t seem to think that''s a problem.

Reply to this comment

by susanhelit June 1, 2008 6:05 PM PDT

The 460 kids are treated as a group because they are a group - they all have only one responsible guardian controlling their fate and treatment - Warren Jeffs, convicted *** offender. Their parents obey him, if they don''t, they''re in a compound where Jeffs can and does have them kicked out (without being able to take their wife and children along - they stay to be underage concubines to old men). That''s why all of the families are treated the same. Because they all allow the same person complete control over their children''s lives. This is not like an apartment building - not unless the old pedophile in 3C was so beloved by the entire building that they all brought their children to him for ''private time'' every week.

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by feelfree4u June 1, 2008 6:05 PM PDT

Alternate title:

"Parents Look Forward to Enjoying Sects Once Again With Their Children"

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by messiahx4eve June 1, 2008 7:28 PM PDT

I gather from your own rhetoric of pion logic MyOpinion1 that you feel as though by personally assualting other peoples thoughts or opinions, that you would be the shining savior of biblical babble thus set the standards of which we would all wish to be able to post to your pleasings? Obviously you would be more at home in an Animal Farm setting which seems to be better suited to your tastes than accepting the fact ALL religions are basically cults, not just FLDS. You portay yourself to be as arrogant and boorish as the god you worship, may HE flush you properly.

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by messiahx4eve June 1, 2008 7:46 PM PDT

Being blind has not stopped me from learning and in dealing with people such as you, being blind and having two university degrees, has enabled me to "see" more clearly than most thus from time to time, plain old folks such as yourself just seem to pop up like fly by night carpet bagging schemes flooding the system. I''m sure you are a most "enlightened" individual, but I am afraid, we of the 2% Club, are not interested in cuts of public education because your writing smacks of it just as much as mine or anyone elses.

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by messiahx4eve June 1, 2008 8:06 PM PDT

Again MyOpinion1, I thank you for being the perfect magnanimous example of the need for public education, and my spelling is just fine. The atrocity of your misanthropic skills in dealing with people supports the spurious concepts of your own "legend in my own mind" concept. Don''t worry my friend, if you reach up high enough, you''ll catch it.

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by gaye5 June 1, 2008 8:07 PM PDT

The children should not be allowed back with their FATHERS until the polygamy has been sorted out, mothers yes but not their dads..

THEY HAVE COMMITTED A CRIME, POLYGAMY.. they should at least be charged with that if not indecent acts with monors.

But it appears that you Americans dont care about the fact that polygamy is a crime in itself. It appears that this crime is ok by most of you, thus you say that the children should be allowed to go home.

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by feelfree4u June 1, 2008 9:19 PM PDT

Gaye5,

Re: "The children should not be allowed back with their FATHERS until the polygamy has been sorted out, mothers yes but not their dads."

That''s where it gets tricky.

In some cases, the mothers are the children of the dads.

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by edintex June 1, 2008 9:24 PM PDT

The longer the court and CPS hold those kids from their parents, the better the chances are that they will get a MUCH LARGER settlement when they sue the state and CPS when this is over. And I for one hope they prevail....That being said, I also think that these people should still be investigated to be sure that children are not being abused in any way.......... As far as poligamy goes, who REALLY cares if a guy has more than one wife? He deserves the agony he surely gets if he has more than one wife!!!

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by ybotheratall June 1, 2008 9:46 PM PDT

As far as poligamy goes, who REALLY cares if a guy has more than one wife? He deserves the agony he surely gets if he has more than one wife!!!

Posted by edintex

I''ve heard this from a few people but after reading the "Escape" book and seeing dozens of interviews of ex-FLDS members, I see a recurring theme. These wives are all jealous of the attention these men lavish on them and take it out on the children in the form of beatings. Favorite wives and their children are denied some comforts and even necessities if they fall out of favor with their husband and it''s very sad to think of a child not getting enough food or medical help because of favoritism. So, taking into account that polygamy is illegal, there seems to be a lot of things that make it wrong. My comments are only from the little bit I''ve read over the years and the same theme is consistent amongst all the ex-members: abuse in all different forms and intimidation of anyone who tries to get help.

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by messiahx4eve June 1, 2008 11:42 PM PDT

MyOpinion1, your sad attempt to show everyone how grand you are through your pathetic attempt at cutting me down shows me that you are just as stupid as you are arrogant. To me, people like you are a shining example of what I would never want to be. My blindness is not a disability, you ARE a walking, talking, breathing disability that I will definitely NEVER have the pleasure of knowing and I thank you for that because it must be very lonely where you are, but you seem to have adapted quite well and I appreciate your attempt to humor me but you fall seriously short, almost borderline I would imagine if asked to make a diagnosis. Have a good life as it may be, more or less. You are still tabula rasa in my book.

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by fireceos June 1, 2008 11:51 PM PDT

I would much rather CPS take kids that MIGHT not be being abused, than fail to take ones who are. Too many kids suffer terrible abuse, or worse, death. I know this firsthand. These ''religious cults'' have always been trouble. Sinning and inflicting abuse in the name of ''religion.'' Disgusting.

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by mahdeealoo June 2, 2008 1:06 AM PDT

Instead of banging on each other, how about focusing on outlawing polygamy on this turf (the US) and keeping these children safe, away from the venom that has sexually abused them, scarring them for life in addition to basically waterboarding the infants until they "surrender" and can be controlled.

There is no one under this sun that can say that any of this is right, what has happened to these children in the forms of abuse they have suffered, and look the maker straight in the face. Karma is unfathomable and there are some big debts to pay fellas.

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by j-whitman June 2, 2008 3:13 AM PDT

Delayed Reunion Frustrates Sect Parents ---- Don''t they have a pill or something for sexual frustration ???

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by closethippy1 June 2, 2008 4:25 AM PDT

The sect people are probably feeling like Mel Gibson where he says in one of his movies: "Give me back my son!"

Reply to this comment

by closethippy1 June 2, 2008 4:27 AM PDT

In some cases, the mothers are the children of the dads.
Posted by FeelFree4U at 09:19 PM : Jun 01, 2008

What''s this? Chinatown?

Reply to this comment

by mcvet June 2, 2008 8:03 AM PDT

How can a nation have the words in our constitution we have and still have THIS going on? The FIRST paragraph of our Constitution say''s all that needs to be said in this case. WE THE PEOPLE (there are NO seperate groups) in order to form a more perfect Union (we''re all in this together) establish Justice, provide for the COMMON defense, promote the GENERAL Welfare, and secure the blessings of Freedom to OURSELVES and OUR posterity... There IS no room in there ANYWHERE for seperate GROUPS or Cults...

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by roach9703 June 2, 2008 10:36 AM PDT

I cannot believe that the idiots, Child Protective Services who botched this investigation should be allowed to continue. Statutory rape is a criminal offense to be handled by the State Police, not a bunch of psycho-babble experts. A criminal defense attorney in Philadelphia told me that a social worker is a rapist''s best friend when it comes to the mishandling of evidence.
What about constitutional process here?
Certainly rape complaints must be carefully investigated. However, the search warrant was illegal. It violated the doctrine of probable cause. When are we going to decide that constitutional rules apply to social workers, or is American Communism going to continue its expansion?
There are many cases across the country where children are taken from parents without due process of law.
This is a very blatant case here. If a proper settlement that obeys the Constitution is not implemented, the right all Americans are in peril.

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by ralan40 June 3, 2008 12:55 PM PDT

great, now little Suzie gets to go back to live with Uncle Grandpa and Auntie Mom. The "old fashoned clothes" adopted in the 1950s can''t hide the fact that these church leaders are a bunch of Pervs.

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[govwatch-2009]

This is a very standard ploy by CPS. They grab the kids, don''''t charge the parents of doing anything wrong then say well if you just sign this contract to get parenting class then you can have your kids back. (remember these are the same kids that they are not suppose to have taken to begin with) Then if the parents mis just one class the courts will grab the kids legally. DON''''T SIGN ANY AGREEMENT, IT''''S A LEGAL TRAP!!!! I know, I use to work with CPS. Nasty bunch they are. The kids will come back because they have no legal standing. Then when you get them back, sue their *sses off. They deserve to do things right, not act like gustopos in the name of children''''s rights.
Kids do NOT belong to the state. At least not yet!

[ericmiami]

These True Mormons should go back to Utah. They''ll be safe there, Mitt Romney will protect them.

[caitlano]

I think it''s absurd what they are doing to those children. they have them and now they''re farting around giving them back which they should be doing without all of the *** extra stuff that they are trying to get them to sign to get their kids back. they shouldn''t have them in the first place.
sorry I ever called Tx. home.

[javalation]

I view all religions as cults, but still think the authorities overstepped their bounds. They didn''t do a preliminary investigation and have treated all of these mothers as if they are unfit. In America that shouldn''t be allowed. As another poster said, the state doesn''t own all of the children, or adults for that matter.

[jrdevo]

Amazing that two higher courts said Texas was wrong in taking the children - BUT - the parents have to sign agreements to get them back ??!!!!!

My million bucks says Texas will be funding this group for the next thousand years after they win the 460 civil lawsuits that will be in the millions EACH....

Way to go, texas...you musta got those trade-school social workers at a bargain price...but no more !

[obama4king]

This is why people distrust and have little respect for the Courts. You should fear this government and examples like this and GITMO are why.

The Courts are puppets.

[obama4king]

BTW,,, why is it that most these anti-liberty kooks come from Texas? ... I can think of another named Bush.

[aurum79-2009]

This is a case of one religious group "baptists christian nuts" which happens to control the state government of Texas, going after another religious group "mormon christian nuts". When are we going to stop handing over our national discourse to these Luddite cretins? Has it escaped everyone''s notice that religious leaders (obama''s, McCain''s, Bushes, Nixon''s, Reagan''s) have dragged everyone through the sewer of anti-democratic xenophobia? These "religious" people are idiots.

[truthalways]

"abide by laws with one husband, wear their hair normally, dress normally, send their children to public schools " by MyOpinion1

abide by the law, cohabitate with as much sexual partners as you can, divorce as many times as you can and get married as many as you can,dress normally, wear shorts, mini skirts, bikinis everywhere to teh store for perverts to see, for kids to see, on magazines everywhere at the grocery store, at church, wear make-up, indulge yourself in vanity, get a hairdo everyday, blow your money in make-up and harido''s, make yourself look good or like a clown, send the kids to public schools, where they can be bullied, fear for school bombing or rampage, be shot, abused by the teachers etc , meet the pedophile teachers, DA''s, read Harry Potter as high school offer and learn how to kill your parents , get condoms, contraception at 13 in high schools etc....don''t forget you cannot mention the name of God in public schools, so just shut up and learn about wicca, accept g a y s, read the king & the king book as school advise...also learn how to fight for your rights as a g a y and lesbo..and all of this is normal!!! and what does God think of all of that?

[truthalways]

The way the FLDS dress, does not mean they are not normal people...if something would be not normal there is , if there was truly older men abusing the teenage girls and taking advantage of women..the state or cps or judge walter should have thought twice before taking stupid decisions that hurt children and judge all the parents the same way....or in the same basket...they should have just investigated the parents who have underage pregnant teenage girls or the mothers who could have been pregnant when they were younger than 16...that was a lack of tact and just stupid...of course they were abusing of their power and it backfired on them..would have been less costly and easier to just investigate all the teenage girls and found out where the true abuse was...but they did a mess and now we taxpayers will pay for it!!! what do they care, it''s not their money...they should also loose their jobs and that judge be disbarred!

[susanhelit]

The courts said that CPS should not have taken the children - not because CPS was wrong, not because it''s OK for religious people to force underage girls to marry, but because they believe the judge should have gone with these restrictions. All they are doing is going with what the appeals court said - put restrictions on the parents that are short of removing the children, until the investigation is complete or finds more evidence. Restraining orders and the like were specifically mentioned.

[rob416]

I certainly don''t agree with the practices of this religious sect allowing underaged children to be married to adult men. If any abuse has taken place, with proof, those children should have been removed from the compound. Without that proof to remove all the children, 400 plus, and take them from their parents amounts to an intrusive Government overstepping their bounds.

The Texas Supreme Court overruled the lower Court ruling and said the children should be returned to their parents. If we are a Nation of laws, the the Court order should be carried out. Instead the Court imposes restrictions that obviously attorney''s representing the parents don''t fully agree with.

The lower Court Judge now refuses to sign the order for release of the children. It sounds like a Judge not agreeing with a higher Court order and trying to legally circumvent the law in order to support the loosing party in the case, which is Texas Child Protective Services. Judges should carry out the law not make it.

[messiahx4eve]

NONE of the allegations have been proven so far. Its been all speculation based on a proven hoax phone call. This cult is no different than any other cult; christian or otherwise. "texass: STUPIDITY the religion, IGNORANCE the way of life."

[jd2408]

Don''t forget that these girls are not only married to older men but are often re-assigned to another man. What a terrible way to live. No wonder they look and act like zombies.

The poster who said these women are livestock is so right. "Animals kept or raised for use or pleasure" is the definition for livestock.

[messiahx4eve]

You have to let children live and be themselves. Giving the up for rape at 13 to pedophiles who want to sodomize and abuse them, force them to never cut their hair and confirm to a specific, forced way of life is NOT NORMAL. It is a CULT and you need to accept that. You are so far gone mentally with your paranoid delusions that you may not be able to grasp just how ridiculous your assertions are. They RAPE LITTLE GIRLS as soon as they are able to bear children and marry them off to old men. That''''s WRONG and having more than one wife is ILLEGAL so the cult is breaking the law. They are not a CHURCH.


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Posted by MyOpinion1 at 09:12 AM :


WOW!!!!! Are you talking LDS or christianity? How many christian cults follow the exact same rules you just condemned these people for practicing? Have you been a former member? How do you know all this stuff? Magical thinking? Word of mouth? Tableoid magazines? YOUR church? Being Spiritual is much more important than being religious, IF there really was a god such as the christian god, we as people, would be the furtherst thing from HIS mind. typical male thinking, huh?

[messiahx4eve]

Careful truthalways, as the song says, "Paranoia will destroy ya."

[whatinthewld]

So, if there is a rapist running around in Dallas, do they send all the children to group homes from the community where the rapist is thought to be?

No, in other states, last I knew, we still investigate who the guilty party is and we arrest the guilty.

Taking 460 + kids (the numbers keep growing by the way) is absolutely rediculous!!

Nobody denies that laws have been broken and a few kids may be in danger, but then for crying out loud lets do some investigating!!
Who does the governement think they are?

[whatinthewld]

If there''s a family living in your community where dad is abusing the daughter, do you think the state has the right to come into the community and take all the kids within a 2 mile radius? Your child may be in danger if the state doesn''t take them because you live close to this abusive man.
This is exactly what they have done in Texas!!

If the men are so dangerous, why haven''t they arrested the MEN. Then let the innocent go and keep those who have broken the law! and Let the children go home to their mothers!! I guess I don''t get it!! Why are they making this such a complicated issue

[scttbrunson]

What''s with these riduculous conditions? Why won''t this judge do her duty under the law and release the childern without conditions? The State Supreme Court has stated the CPS is out of control. The problem here is the judges are rubber stamping whatever the CPS puts in front of them. Doesn''t the judge in this case understand her responsibilty includes protecting the citizens from an abusive CPS? Order the release of the childern with out conditions. Do your job...

[floydzeppl]

Delayed Reunion Frustrates Sect Parents: Yeah, I''ll bet those 45- and 50-year-old men are pretty "frustrated" right now. The cold showers aren''t working any more. They may have to stoop to 45-year-old women. A crisis.

[floydzeppl]

Posted by scttbrunson at 11:16 AM : Jun 01, 2008
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Why are you worried about Constitutional Rights now? You were all for Bush taking them away to keep you safe from a few thousand tribal level terrorists.

[susanhelit]

Anyone who wants the real facts goes and reads the Supreme Court decision itself. And in that order, they say that the ONLY reason CPS is in the wrong is that they should have imposed conditions, like those being imposed now, rather than remove the children. The judge is entirely in line, and following precisely what the appeals and supreme courts of Texas said to do.

I don''t know that it''s enough to protect these children - which you''d think would be everyone''s top priority. You''ve got a cult which has a religious belief in child abuse - and some people here don''t seem to think that''s a problem.

[susanhelit]

The 460 kids are treated as a group because they are a group - they all have only one responsible guardian controlling their fate and treatment - Warren Jeffs, convicted *** offender. Their parents obey him, if they don''t, they''re in a compound where Jeffs can and does have them kicked out (without being able to take their wife and children along - they stay to be underage concubines to old men). That''s why all of the families are treated the same. Because they all allow the same person complete control over their children''s lives. This is not like an apartment building - not unless the old pedophile in 3C was so beloved by the entire building that they all brought their children to him for ''private time'' every week.

[feelfree4u]

Alternate title:

"Parents Look Forward to Enjoying Sects Once Again With Their Children"

[messiahx4eve]

I gather from your own rhetoric of pion logic MyOpinion1 that you feel as though by personally assualting other peoples thoughts or opinions, that you would be the shining savior of biblical babble thus set the standards of which we would all wish to be able to post to your pleasings? Obviously you would be more at home in an Animal Farm setting which seems to be better suited to your tastes than accepting the fact ALL religions are basically cults, not just FLDS. You portay yourself to be as arrogant and boorish as the god you worship, may HE flush you properly.

[messiahx4eve]

Being blind has not stopped me from learning and in dealing with people such as you, being blind and having two university degrees, has enabled me to "see" more clearly than most thus from time to time, plain old folks such as yourself just seem to pop up like fly by night carpet bagging schemes flooding the system. I''m sure you are a most "enlightened" individual, but I am afraid, we of the 2% Club, are not interested in cuts of public education because your writing smacks of it just as much as mine or anyone elses.

[messiahx4eve]

Again MyOpinion1, I thank you for being the perfect magnanimous example of the need for public education, and my spelling is just fine. The atrocity of your misanthropic skills in dealing with people supports the spurious concepts of your own "legend in my own mind" concept. Don''t worry my friend, if you reach up high enough, you''ll catch it.

[gaye5]

The children should not be allowed back with their FATHERS until the polygamy has been sorted out, mothers yes but not their dads..

THEY HAVE COMMITTED A CRIME, POLYGAMY.. they should at least be charged with that if not indecent acts with monors.

But it appears that you Americans dont care about the fact that polygamy is a crime in itself. It appears that this crime is ok by most of you, thus you say that the children should be allowed to go home.

[feelfree4u]

Gaye5,

Re: "The children should not be allowed back with their FATHERS until the polygamy has been sorted out, mothers yes but not their dads."

That''s where it gets tricky.

In some cases, the mothers are the children of the dads.

[edintex]

The longer the court and CPS hold those kids from their parents, the better the chances are that they will get a MUCH LARGER settlement when they sue the state and CPS when this is over. And I for one hope they prevail....That being said, I also think that these people should still be investigated to be sure that children are not being abused in any way.......... As far as poligamy goes, who REALLY cares if a guy has more than one wife? He deserves the agony he surely gets if he has more than one wife!!!

[ybotheratall]

As far as poligamy goes, who REALLY cares if a guy has more than one wife? He deserves the agony he surely gets if he has more than one wife!!!

Posted by edintex

I''ve heard this from a few people but after reading the "Escape" book and seeing dozens of interviews of ex-FLDS members, I see a recurring theme. These wives are all jealous of the attention these men lavish on them and take it out on the children in the form of beatings. Favorite wives and their children are denied some comforts and even necessities if they fall out of favor with their husband and it''s very sad to think of a child not getting enough food or medical help because of favoritism. So, taking into account that polygamy is illegal, there seems to be a lot of things that make it wrong. My comments are only from the little bit I''ve read over the years and the same theme is consistent amongst all the ex-members: abuse in all different forms and intimidation of anyone who tries to get help.

[messiahx4eve]

MyOpinion1, your sad attempt to show everyone how grand you are through your pathetic attempt at cutting me down shows me that you are just as stupid as you are arrogant. To me, people like you are a shining example of what I would never want to be. My blindness is not a disability, you ARE a walking, talking, breathing disability that I will definitely NEVER have the pleasure of knowing and I thank you for that because it must be very lonely where you are, but you seem to have adapted quite well and I appreciate your attempt to humor me but you fall seriously short, almost borderline I would imagine if asked to make a diagnosis. Have a good life as it may be, more or less. You are still tabula rasa in my book.

[fireceos]

I would much rather CPS take kids that MIGHT not be being abused, than fail to take ones who are. Too many kids suffer terrible abuse, or worse, death. I know this firsthand. These ''religious cults'' have always been trouble. Sinning and inflicting abuse in the name of ''religion.'' Disgusting.

[mahdeealoo]

Instead of banging on each other, how about focusing on outlawing polygamy on this turf (the US) and keeping these children safe, away from the venom that has sexually abused them, scarring them for life in addition to basically waterboarding the infants until they "surrender" and can be controlled.

There is no one under this sun that can say that any of this is right, what has happened to these children in the forms of abuse they have suffered, and look the maker straight in the face. Karma is unfathomable and there are some big debts to pay fellas.

[j-whitman]

Delayed Reunion Frustrates Sect Parents ---- Don''t they have a pill or something for sexual frustration ???

[closethippy1]

The sect people are probably feeling like Mel Gibson where he says in one of his movies: "Give me back my son!"

[closethippy1]

In some cases, the mothers are the children of the dads.
Posted by FeelFree4U at 09:19 PM : Jun 01, 2008

What''s this? Chinatown?

[mcvet]

How can a nation have the words in our constitution we have and still have THIS going on? The FIRST paragraph of our Constitution say''s all that needs to be said in this case. WE THE PEOPLE (there are NO seperate groups) in order to form a more perfect Union (we''re all in this together) establish Justice, provide for the COMMON defense, promote the GENERAL Welfare, and secure the blessings of Freedom to OURSELVES and OUR posterity... There IS no room in there ANYWHERE for seperate GROUPS or Cults...

[roach9703]

I cannot believe that the idiots, Child Protective Services who botched this investigation should be allowed to continue. Statutory rape is a criminal offense to be handled by the State Police, not a bunch of psycho-babble experts. A criminal defense attorney in Philadelphia told me that a social worker is a rapist''s best friend when it comes to the mishandling of evidence.
What about constitutional process here?
Certainly rape complaints must be carefully investigated. However, the search warrant was illegal. It violated the doctrine of probable cause. When are we going to decide that constitutional rules apply to social workers, or is American Communism going to continue its expansion?
There are many cases across the country where children are taken from parents without due process of law.
This is a very blatant case here. If a proper settlement that obeys the Constitution is not implemented, the right all Americans are in peril.

[ralan40]

great, now little Suzie gets to go back to live with Uncle Grandpa and Auntie Mom. The "old fashoned clothes" adopted in the 1950s can''t hide the fact that these church leaders are a bunch of Pervs.