Judge May Make CIA Torture Memo Public

ACLU Lawsuit Prompted A Federal Judge To Examine The Controversial Document

(AP)  The CIA must let a judge view a 2002 memo purportedly including waterboarding among interrogation methods to be used on prisoners in U.S. custody so he can decide whether it should be made public, the judge ruled Thursday.

U.S. District Judge Alvin K. Hellerstein issued the order after he had earlier said the 18-page memo did not have to be turned over to the American Civil Liberties Union because it was protected by attorney-client privilege. The ACLU said it believes the memo includes a section addressing the subject of waterboarding, which simulates drowning.

Hellerstein said he reconsidered his ruling after hearing from both sides again on the subject. The CIA must turn the item over for review on Monday.

Rebekah Carmichael, a spokeswoman for government lawyers representing the CIA, said the government had no immediate comment.

Hellerstein said he realized he did not give sufficient consideration to an earlier court ruling related to the legal issue and to ACLU evidence indicating all or parts of the memo may have been incorporated into or used to justify official practice and policy.

The ACLU praised the decision, saying the memo written by the Department of Justice's Office of Legal Counsel is critical to the public debate over treatment of detainees because it specified brutal interrogation techniques including waterboarding.

Jameel Jaffer, director of the ACLU National Security Project, said no Department of Defense memo made public so far has included a section addressing waterboarding.

"There are still significant gaps in the story of how U.S. interrogators came to use torture and this memo is a critical piece of this story," Jaffer said.

"We think that the public has a right to see the documents that provided a basis for the CIA's torture program," he said. "We know that interrogators waterboarded prisoners and subjected prisoners to other forms of torture. There's no legitimate reason why the basis for those interrogation practices should be withheld."

The order came as a result of a lawsuit brought in October 2003 by the ACLU and other civil rights groups seeking to use the Freedom of Information Act to get records concerning the treatment of prisoners in U.S. custody abroad. So far, more than 100,000 pages of government documents have been released as a result.

[veteran72]

The order came as a result of a lawsuit brought in October 2003 by the ACLU and other civil rights groups seeking to use the Freedom of Information Act to get records concerning the treatment of prisoners in U.S. custody abroad. So far, more than 100,000 pages of government documents have been released as a result.

Another 10 million pages were shredded by Dickkk "Shotgun" Cheney....

[veteran72]

At this rate, Shrub, Darth and their Neocon Nazi pals ought to be insome serious hot water for their crimes sometime in the next millennium.......take your time, Demowhimps......no rush......

[stn_sage]

This is laughable!

The judge has to order them to present the material so HE can see it!?

In other words, the CIA denies the right of the courts to see relevant material related to investigations!? That''s one way to halt the ''wheels of justice'' from turning around!

As little credibility as the courts have in the minds of many Americans, the judge OUGHT to release the documents to the public as requested!

A very relevant question in the mind of the judge should be, can we afford NOT to release it and be perceived as---once again---covering up illegal activity?!

Afterall, the CIA claims they haven''t done anything wrong! So, why NOT release the documents?! Unless ofcourse, they''re LYING and HAVE done a bunch of illegal things! Correct!? Uh-huh.

[puritan9]

I say that if there is to be torture, let%u2019s be the best at it. If someone is not torturing according to the instructions in the Bush-Gonzales manual we need more funding for better torture training. We should set the international standards for torture perhaps even start some training camps, or better yet college level courses and award degrees. God knows everyone has already completed Torture-101 reading Abu Graib reports over past few years. May be we can even create a Noble Prize for Torture! Who would be awarded first?

[carjenbe]

Once again we have a judge who is going to write law when in fact the judge does not have authority to do so. The judge is to determine the facts and render a decision, it is not to make laws. Probably a graduate from the Social Democratic College of Good Feelings; Obama, Ted and Hillary are all graduates.

[johnpatrick9]

Torture whether practiced by the Inquisition, Nazi Germany, Imperial Japan, Russian Commissars, Latin Dictators, Muslim fanatics or American soldiers or intelligence agents is always to be considered an atrocity and a crime...no fancy vocabulary or legal fine points can mute the ugliness of these reprehensible acts. Those who torture another are scum and those who support the torture are scum as well and worthy of the hangman''s noose for their crimes against humanity for they have forfieted their right to live among us. We did it to the Nazis and the Imperial Japanese and the same fate should be put upon those who practice it here under a phony patriotism.

[johnpatrick9]

"Beware that when you go to fight the Devil that you do not become one yourself." Nietzsche

[dinkydog1]

Once again we have a judge who is going to write law when in fact the judge does not have authority to do so. The judge is to determine the facts and render a decision, it is not to make laws. Probably a graduate from the Social Democratic College of Good Feelings; Obama, Ted and Hillary are all graduates.


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Posted by CARJENBE at 07:47 AM : May 09, 2008

..................

How is this judge writing the law by allowing US citizens to see a memo written by our government officials?

[johnpatrick9]

Those who are for torture should be tortured. IT MAY CHANGE THEIR VIEW ON TORTURE AS A GOOD THING.

[johnpatrick9]

Neo-con Republicans come across as Slave holders so sure that the use of the whip and the rabid dog is a just and Christian practice..so long as it is pracitced on another.Such a Red State mentality.

[ioweign]

At this rate, Shrub, Darth and their Neocon Nazi pals ought to be insome serious hot water for their crimes sometime in the next millennium.......take your time, Demowhimps......no rush......

Posted by veteran72 at 12:31 AM : May 09, 2008


This is a result of a separate lawsuit.

[mbcsmith]

Neo-con Republicans come across as Slave holders so sure that the use of the whip and the rabid dog is a just and Christian practice..so long as it is pracitced on another.Such a Red State mentality.


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Posted by johnpatrick9 at 08:20 AM : May 09, 2008


LIBS are more concerned with protecting terrorists than the citizens of the U.S. They have no idea how to protect this country.

[mbcsmith]

How is this judge writing the law by allowing US citizens to see a memo written by our government officials?


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Posted by dinkydog1 at 08:03 AM : May 09, 2008


He apparently doesn''t believe in attorney client privilege which is established law.

[johnpatrick9]

WE DO NOT PROTECT OURSELVES BY BECOMING AS EVIL AS OUR ENEMIES FOR THEN WE BECOME AS THEY ARE. SOON ENOUGH WE TURN THE EVIL RELEASED UPON OURSELVES AS HAPPENED IN COMMUNIST RUSSIA AND A HOST OF OTHER ROTTEN NATIONS. WAKE UP NEOCONS FOR YOU ARE THE ENEMY OF AMERICAN LIBERTIES AS MUCH AS ANY TWO BIT TERRORIST.

[johnpatrick9]

If you are into pain then go whip yourself and pluck out your fingernails and then wonder at what the hell you are doing to yourself and why would anyone do this to any human being? Moreso, what the heck are we gaining from this except a perverse sense of power coming from ones own sense of being a creep.

[dinkydog1]

"We think that the public has a right to see the documents that provided a basis for the CIA''s torture program," This sentence really say it all dosen''t it? The reds are so ashamed to let the rest of the world see how low we have sunk they will hide behind any legality to keep us in the dark.

[mbcsmith]

"We think that the public has a right to see the documents that provided a basis for the CIA''''s torture program," This sentence really say it all dosen''''t it? The reds are so ashamed to let the rest of the world see how low we have sunk they will hide behind any legality to keep us in the dark.


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Posted by dinkydog1 at 08:46 AM : May 09, 2008


Any legality? You mean like attorney client privileged information. LIBS just don''t get it.

[dinkydog1]

Any legality? You mean like attorney client privileged information. LIBS just don''''t get it.


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Posted by mbcsmith
....

Attorney-client privilege is a legal concept that protects communications between a client and his or her attorney and keeps those communications confidential. A Department of Defense memo is not a client/attorney communication.

[kaviz]

mbcsmith, wouldn''t the people be the clients in this situation,since it is our tax dollars that pay for the CIA? Should we not be allowed to see what we have payed for?

[johnpatrick9]

Just as the Nazis tried to hide behind the "legality" of the Nuremburg Laws and the Nazi Laws which made murder and torture and buthery legal so do the Reds in America, our own home grown American fascists seek to justify their atrocities as being "legal." What garbage they spew. Don''t give us that client/attorney *** for you cannot hide your dark deeds behind your big mouths.

[mbcsmith]

Attorney-client privilege is a legal concept that protects communications between a client and his or her attorney and keeps those communications confidential. A Department of Defense memo is not a client/attorney communication.


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Posted by dinkydog1 at 09:20 AM : May 09, 2008


Legal opinion written by the Dept of justice. The attorney client privilege extends to legal opinions from DOJ lawyers to the CIA.

[mbcsmith]

mbcsmith, wouldn''''t the people be the clients in this situation,since it is our tax dollars that pay for the CIA? Should we not be allowed to see what we have payed for?


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Posted by kaviz at 09:25 AM : May 09, 2008


By that logic, we should have seen all Clinton/DOJ communications regarding private individuals suing a sitting president. PROTECTED.

[excoachken]

Hey, Captain Bushy, this is the first step toward "walking the plank" to a sentence for War Crimes, and it couldn''t happen to a more evil person!

[mbcsmith]

Hey, Captain Bushy, this is the first step toward "walking the plank" to a sentence for War Crimes, and it couldn''''t happen to a more evil person!


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Posted by excoachken at 09:59 AM : May 09, 2008



LOL...LIBS are more concerned with lynching a U.S. President than hanging the terrorist murderers at Gitmo. VERY SAD.

[inventagod2]

Was the Bu$h CIA behind 9/11?

[oscarez]

mbcsmith about 75% of the people in the USA think Bush should be run out of office on a rail.

[mbcsmith]

mbcsmith about 75% of the people in the USA think Bush should be run out of office on a rail.


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Posted by Oscarez at 10:03 AM : May 09, 2008


and 80% of LIBS think he should be lynched. LIB AMERICA has lost all sense of reality.

[excoachken]

mbcsmith: What "is sad" is that gutless fools like you still support the most corrupt President in history, while 75% of this country (including objective Republicans) can see his failure. What is in it for you?

[oscarez]

"lynching a U.S. President than hanging the terrorist murderers at Gitmo"
mbcsmith so it does not matter to you how bad a president Bush is as long as he is killing Muslims?

[mbcsmith]

mbcsmith: What "is sad" is that gutless fools like you still support the most corrupt President in history, while 75% of this country (including objective Republicans) can see his failure. What is in it for you?


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Posted by excoachken at 10:12 AM : May 09, 2008


Cite for your statements please. Or, are you just another LIB LIAR.

[mbcsmith]

"lynching a U.S. President than hanging the terrorist murderers at Gitmo"
mbcsmith so it does not matter to you how bad a president Bush is as long as he is killing Muslims?


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Posted by Oscarez at 10:16 AM : May 09, 2008


So you agree that he should be "lynched". VOTE LIB, VOTE HATE!

[mbcsmith]

mbcsmith about 75% of the people in the USA think Bush should be run out of office on a rail.


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Posted by Oscarez at 10:03 AM : May 09, 2008


Cite for your claim please. Or just another LIB lIE.

[l8c6]

There are things that the government does that the public doesn''''t need to know about..

Posted by cornbiker

And torturing in the name of the american people is not one of them. If you think this is one of them then you are a disturbing individual and not one desirable as an example of an american citizen. The right wing despises history. Something we should learn from. Wearing flag pins on lapels is far from righteous. Nazis, barbaric murderers as they were can be seen in pictures in family gatherings holding babies with loving expressions on their faces. We live in troubled times. Sociopaths having taken hold of positions of leadership.

[godseyesore-2009]

cornbiker, name it.

[bm6005]

LOL...LIBS are more concerned with lynching a U.S. President...
Posted by mbcsmith

Can I pull the trap door? How''s the menopause going Mary?

[tejasdemo]

LOL...LIBS are more concerned with lynching a U.S. President...
Posted by mbcsmith

Can I pull the trap door? How''''s the menopause going Mary?


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Posted by bm6005 at 11:34 AM : May 09, 2008

Rofl.

[hologram5]

Everything that a Government does should be made public, that is what our forefathers fought and died for. I am tired of being lied to and my rights violated at every turn. They are all greedy bitter little men that all they care about is making more money to add to their growing fortune at the cost of lowly taxpayers. I hope our economy collapses so they can learn what it is like to not have money. they don''t have any skills to make a living other than off the backs of the poor.

[tejasdemo]

Menopause is crazy. First politician who states that women who have menopause are officially declared a national diaster zone gets my vote and some money.

[tonyd_31]

mbcsmith, stop tripping. America is for justice regardless of who the perpetrator is. Let the shoe fall where it may: if it GW or the terrorist. You brainwashed neo cons make me laugh and disgust me at the same time.

[lochlan-2009]

Obama, No pardons for the Bush Regime!!!!

[ricknuber]

"There are things that the government does that the public doesn''''t need to know about.."
Posted by cornbiker at 10:32 AM : May 09, 2008

Spoken like a true Stalinist. Please enlighten us as to the sort of things, specifically in a representative democracy, the public doesn''t need to know about?

You obviously have a very loose grasp on the whole "of, by and for the people" thing.

[mcvet]

What''s the problem?? If, as Heir Bush said, we did no wrong then there shouldn''t be a problem with releasing anything. Hummmm Could this be a situation where we add YET ANOTHER lie to the list for Sir Lies-A-Lot? Sieg Heil Bush

[mcvet]

There are things that the government does that the public doesn''''''''t need to know about..

Posted by cornbiker

Duh?? What are they teaching you fascist in those Nazi Youth Groups these days anyway? Go to your local library and get a copy of the CONSTITUTION... Oh before you go take off a couple of those swastika''s... you will NEVER understand it with those on. Now read the FIRST line in that Document. It say''s.. "WE the PEOPLE of the United States, in order to form a more perfect Union..." That establishes the GOVERNMENT moron!! WE the PEOPLE are the Government.. that disgusting piece of human trash YOU call a President?? He''s supposed to REPRESENT us... you know WORK FOR US! Sieg Heil Bush! I''ve seen dirt smarter than this fascist bootlicker folks!!

[ioweign]

There are things that the government does that the public doesn''t need to know about..

Posted by cornbiker at 10:32 AM : May 09, 2008

Hmmm - deja vu for the last 7+ years and let me guess who gets to decide what goes public...

And we invaded Iraq to spread this kind of "democracy"...

[notblue]

Ricknuber and McVet, I need you guys to clear up a coule of things, McVet calls fellow conservative American citizens nazi fascists which are completely differnt than stalinist socialists. Which are we? Do you understand the difference?

[ioweign]

LIBS are more concerned with lynching a U.S. President

Posted by mbcsmith at 10:01 AM : May 09, 2008

And how much did the GOP and Ken Starr spend on a blue dress ?

[l8c6]

Ricknuber and McVet, I need you guys to clear up a coule of things, McVet calls fellow conservative American citizens nazi fascists which are completely differnt than stalinist socialists. Which are we? Do you understand the difference?

Posted by notblue

If your mind is receptive to truth you will seek it and find that extremism is often the ill. Old style republicans are being labeled liberal by the warped right wing privatizing elite global capitalist one world order neo con fascist modern day republicon.

[newsjunky5]

Didn''t Bush Sr. call someone a "Card carrying member of the ACLU" in an insinuation that the ACLU is communist, to smear them?

"Now read the FIRST line in that Document. It say''''s.. "WE the PEOPLE of the United States, in order to form a more perfect Union..." WE the PEOPLE are the Government.."
OMG, all that talk about the people''s this and that, and unions and such, sounds like communism, too. In fact, having a greedy despotic leader who ignores The Constitution and the desires of the people on that government is probably the farthest thing from communism. Wouldn''t you agree, notblue?
PS: I''m not a communist or neocon, just like spinning the absurd into something wearable.

[kansas1946]

"There are things that the government does that the public doesn''''''''t need to know about.."
Posted by cornbiker at 10:32 AM : May 09, 2008

Spoken like a true Stalinist. Please enlighten us as to the sort of things, specifically in a representative democracy, the public doesn''''t need to know about?

You obviously have a very loose grasp on the whole "of, by and for the people" thing.


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Posted by RickNuber at 12:17 PM : May 09, 2008
************************************

Amen, Rick. Don''t the sheep amaze you sometimes, how they glibly brush off the constitutional protections that a whole lot of people died for establishing this free nation. These are the same types that would ratting out their neighbors under Stalin, for the "good" of the country. Sad.

[mcvet]

Ricknuber and McVet, I need you guys to clear up a coule of things, McVet calls fellow conservative American citizens nazi fascists which are completely differnt than stalinist socialists. Which are we? Do you understand the difference?


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Posted by notblue at 12:51 PM : May 09, 2008
+ report abuse

Can''t speak for the other guy but I base MY view on SOLID FACTS obtained during the Fuhrer''s rule which have been submitted to several Political Scientist. Sieg Heil Bush