Mix-Up "Big Danger" In Sect's DNA Tests

Expert: Sheer Number Of Simultaneous Samplings From Polygamists Complicates Matters Greatly

(CBS)  The court-ordered DNA tests on the 416 children and teens removed from the polygamist compound in Eldorado, Texas could determine who their parents are with "99.999 percent" certainty, and might even provide evidence of incest within the sect, an expert says.

But the high number of people whose DNA will be tested at the same time means there's also a "very big danger" that samples could get mixed up, he adds.

On The Early Show Monday, Lawrence Kobilinsky, professor of forensic science at John Jay College in New York, told Russ Mitchell he suspects the testing will take "a couple of months.

"This is complicated testing. It's not simply paternity testing where you have the triad -- the mother, the child and the alleged father. We have 416 children. We've got mothers and fathers. We are hoping that we will have the DNA profiles on everybody in the community. If there are uncooperative people and we don't have those profiles, it'll make things even more complicated."

If some sect members don't cooperate, Kobilinsky continued, it could be "hard to find paternity in each case. Some critical genetic profile could be missing, and then you would not have another male that matches up."

The number of sample involved is another concern, he said, making it "a very big danger" that samples could get mixed up. "Chain of custody is critical in paternity cases," Kobilinksky stressed, "and here, where you're dealing with so many people, it becomes absolutely essential."

"It is probably the most complicated paternity case I have ever seen," Kobilinksy noted.

But the results will be "conclusive to the point where the probability of paternity or maternity will be measured in the range of 99.999. So, I think people will certainly be able to link the children with both mother and father."

Asked if the testing will be able to determine if there was incest going on, he replied, "I believe there will be. When you have situations like that, people are more closely related, DNA technology is able to establish kinship, so we can do a paternity, we can do kinship. It's the same kind of testing that we use for criminal matters."

Kobilinksy explained to CBS News that, with DNA testing, "You do a cheek swab, a photograph, a fingerprint, and try to get whatever information they can. They take one swab of the cheek and let them air dry and package them. Then they are brought back to the lab. The lab has to make sure the chain of custody is preserved and make sure the specimen is kept sealed. This applies to any paternity case; if they mix up samples, you could get a father excluded when he really is the father. Everything has to be documented. You have to bar code the swabs and fingerprints so everything is in order, and nothing can be challenged down the road. People in this business recognize that if they don't protect the chain, don't do collection properly, results could be challenged and compromised. It's also imperative that you know who you're taking a cheek swab from.

[Syndicate]

Seems like a violation of the right to privacy to me.

[nownthen-2009]

guilty until proven innocent!!!

[jozray-2009]

*** with a child is a crime. Privacy is given up when a crime is committed. The court obviously has enough evidence to authorize this testing.

[rwm2_2000]

I don''t know what the court has but whatever they got was gotten by UNCONSTITUTIONAL MEANS...They raided this home ILLEGALLY and UNCONSTITUTIONALLY. These folks lead a quiet lifestyle and we have NO AUTHORITY to enter. As far as they have no rights cause they are criminals that''s foolish. If criminals have no rights then our Gov''t can take their DNA, as they are doing, and sell body parts worldwide as the Chinese Gov''t already does. ARE YOU READY TO ALLOW OUR GOV"T TO SELL BODY PARTS OF CRIMINALS AND IF WE ARE THEN WHAT HAPPENS WHEN WE ARE TRIED AND CONVICTED FALSELY OF CRIMES! GIVE ME LIBERTY OR GIVE ME DEATH!!!CALL UR CONGRESSMEN NOW AND DEMAND THAT THEY PROTECT UR CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHTS AS FAR AS DNA ETC ARE CONCERNED...I HAVE!

[ricknhouston]

What in the hell is happening in this country??????
Bona Fide search warrants "used" to require specific allegations against specific individuals, made by identifiable complainants with specific targeted items in specific locations. These children are being exposed to grave medical danger by being forcably "integrated" into "our society" because few, if any, have ever been immunized against social diseases, have never been exposed to or forced to consume flouridated water, pasturized dairy products or any of the myriad of enzymes, hormones, or other additives that permeate the western diet.

[ricknhouston]

The "undercover informant", that had supposedly been imbedded in the community for the past four years, was surely able to relay to his employers the absolute absence of firearms within their midst ... So why the presence and deployment of sooo many of our version of the "American Gestapo Police" repleat with the black riot gear swat uniforms,surrounded by snipers, tanks, armoured personnel carriers, the hundreds of armed uniformed state troopers & Texas Rangers, the likes of which I can promise you WERE NOT garnered from anywhere close to San Angelo, Texas area. The logistical and coordination of an assault of this magnitude & precision, which demands massive amounts of resources, decries any truth to the statements made to the effect that this "intervention" had only been decided in the previous week when the alleged "cry for help" telephone calls were received at the supposed "telephone crisis center", which was coincidentally being manned by "escaped former members" of the community. This was an excercise that required weeks, if not months, of precise advance planning, the cooperation & availability of the massive statewide resources of Texas Department of Public Safety, The Texas Rangers, local & county law enforcement agencies & Chidrens Protective Agencies from the Austin, Dallas and Houston metro areas. This is yet another breach of our Civil Liberties. Guilty until Proven innocent!

[oscarez]

"ARE YOU READY TO ALLOW OUR GOV"T TO SELL BODY PARTS OF CRIMINALS AND IF WE ARE THEN WHAT HAPPENS WHEN WE ARE TRIED AND CONVICTED FALSELY OF CRIMES!"

Posted by rwm2_2000 at 02:26 PM : Apr 21, 2008

rwm2_2000 you may have come up with a way for Bush to pay for the Iraq war. By selling body parts.

[mollydtt]

No matter how much disdain this sect has for Texas, the U S and government in general, there is no more frontier. There is government everywhere, and laws everywhere. They want to make sure their children do what they tell them to do, feel what they tell them to feel, and isolating them is the only way to accomplish this. Unfortunately, there is no spot in Texas where laws can be ignored. The fact that they got public assistance was kind of a slap in the face. These are people that feel pure as long as they isolate themselves, and any interface with other people is contaminating. Sorry, but the fact that these women and children don''t even know who they are related to speaks volumes. Listening to the wives is like listening to the Stepford Wives.

"The court obviously has enough evidence to authorize this testing."
jozray, why do you assume that? *IF* they had evidence, they would have made much of it in the newspapers, instead of changing their story.. from a phone call (now shown to be a malicious prank call from a woman in Colorado) to allegations based on prejudice, that are now forcing people to undergo invasive procedures, and give up their fifth amendment rights, to supply the prosecution with a case.

[lilathe]

"In yet another FLDS raid-related development, coordinating attorneys, legal aid attorneys and guardians ad litem announced an undisclosed number of 20-30 young women whose adult status had been debated had indeed been determined to be legally adults. "

Many of these girls are the "ALLEGED" underaged girls that were pregnant or had children. Some of them had drivers licenses, birth certificates, and income tax returns to prove they were over 18 but Comrade Meisner and Comrade Voss looked deep into their eyes and called them liars and said their documents might be fake.
These ADULTS were refused to be allowed to hire their own attorneys and had to have pro-bono attorneys selected by the courts (again no offense to wonderful attorneys that volunteer their time) But just how LEGAL is refusing legal counsel to an adult?

How LEGAL is it to keep the women in the CPS compound away from their attorneys

[random_radar]

I am beginning to see why the government prefers the Waco solution. It was a simpler and less expensive solution for them.

[cpaide]

"This is complicated testing. It''s not simply paternity testing."

and why you are making complicated testing for this clean humble mormans when for everyone else, you are making the simple paternity testing?

this is bad and dishonest actions by the KLK (krazy lesbians kult) that have been stalking and harrassing these nice mormans for many years now.

look here http://www.ireport.com/docs/DOC-9289 and you will see that i have good honest proof.

[frankbowers]

I think each blood draw whould have a fingerprint from the right thumb or index finger to stay at all time with the drawn blood. This is one way to prevent it from being mixed up the finget print will be the same today as 5 years from now. Frank Bowers

[mommalolo]

And how many of these posts are from the FLDS people who are trying to cover their buts

[bobnjersey]

["You do a cheek swab, a photograph, a fingerprint, and try to get whatever information they can.]

then move on to the next us citizen ... thank you very much for your cooperation.

when they can''t figure out who has done right ... and who has done wrong ... they''ll apply the ''broad net'' concept ... just test everyone.

coming to your town soon.

[kesac4650]

Only one man has the background and knowledge to properly handle an operation like this.
Jerry Springer.

[ndg1979]

No, Jerry doesn''t do DNA. Instead, he would give the FLDS women a chance to go toe to toe with any woman who hates them. It would take Maury Povich to sort the paternity out. Then it''s on to Dr. Phil to find out where it all went wrong and to hear that you''re a moron. Finally, a visit to Oprah is in order to tell your story of persecution and reconciliation before the audience members all receive a pastel dress.

That is the timeline (learn it, know it, live it):
Jerry
Maury
Dr. Phil and
Oprah.

As for my comment on the article - they will most likely find that there has been underage pregnancies, but as for incest - that is questionable but is not unlikely. Even the FLDS would not take a risk of producing offspring with potentially life-threatening deformities.

Unfortunately, and even the Catholics can''t deny this, it is written in the bible that God told Noah after the flood to be fruitful and multiply. Well, in a way, these people are doing just that. No matter how you look at it, as ok or not, this whole situation just shows how ill our society has become.

For a peek at FLDS life, rent or buy the HBO series "Big Love" starring Bill Paxton as a father of 3 families. It is fairly accurate in its portrayal.

[matter77]

For decades the argument has been that between consenting adults, nearly anything and everything is legal. This is what *** and wife-swappers and porn users and dealers have all argued - "what business is it of yours...we can do what we want...we''re not hurting anyone..."
So, ultimately the only premise the state has is that someone was being held against their will. If they don''t get that, this will be a forty million dollar disaster for the prosecution. What are they going to do - charge everyone with wearing retro clothing???
Incredibly, this affects everyone.