1,300 Iraqis Fired For Refusing To Fight

Iraqi Police, Army Members Dismissed After Deserting In Face Of Basra Militias Last Month

(AP)  The Iraqi government has dismissed about 1,300 soldiers and policemen who deserted or refused to fight during last month's offensive against Shiite militias and criminal gangs in Basra, officials said Sunday.

Interior Ministry spokesman Maj. Gen. Abdul-Karim Khalaf said 921 police and soldiers were fired in Basra. They included 37 senior police officers ranging in rank from lieutenant colonel to brigadier general.

The others were dismissed in Kut, one of the Shiite cities where the fight had spread.

Last month, Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki ordered the security forces to confront armed groups in Basra, Iraq's second largest city.

But they met fierce resistance and the attack quickly ground to a halt as fighting flared across the Shiite south and Baghdad.

Since then, government officials have revealed that about 1,000 members of the security forces - including an entire infantry battalion - had mutinied, on some cases handing over vehicles and weapons to the militias.

The majority of Iraqi soldiers and police are Shiites.

Speaking in Basra, Khalaf said those dismissed included 421 police officers and 500 soldiers who had not returned to duty in the southern port city and would be tried by military courts.

"Some of them were sympathetic with these lawbreakers, some refused to (go into) battle for political or national or sectarian or religious reasons," Khalaf said.

But he said that those who returned in coming days and could prove they had been prevented from doing so by the militias would be reinstated.

In Kut, a senior police officer said 400 local policemen have been sacked for refusing orders to combat the militias, including the Mahdi Army of anti-American cleric Muqtada al-Sadr.

The officer, who spoke on condition of anonymity because he was not authorized to speak to the media, said the Interior Ministry in Baghdad had ordered the policemen removed from duty on Saturday.

Although fighting in Basra eased in late March, security operations are continuing.

Fighting in Baghdad's Sadr City, a stronghold of al-Sadr's militia, has been ongoing for the past two weeks. Fresh clashes were reported Sunday and at least two rockets or mortar rounds were fired at the capital's Green Zone, which houses diplomatic missions and much of Iraq's government.

A senior military commander said Sunday that Iraqi forces in Basra were expanding their sweep of six neighborhoods, with army and police cordoning off the areas while searching for illegal weapons, ammunition and criminal elements.

Lt. Gen. Mohan al-Fireji said the operation, which started on Saturday, had netted significant amounts of weapons, roadside bombs and drugs. He said a large number of suspects had been detained, but he provided no figures.

Al-Sadr, who is believed to be in Iran, repeated on Saturday his demand for American soldiers to leave the country and urged his fighters not to target fellow Iraqis "unless they are helping the (U.S.) occupation."

Despite the strident rhetoric, however, there were signs that al-Sadr was trying to calm his militia to avoid all-out war with the Americans. Al-Sadr is also under pressure from al-Maliki, also a Shiite, to disband the Mahdi Army or face a ban from politics.

Meanwhile, an Apache helicopter accidentally destroyed a U.S. Humvee in eastern Baghdad when a Hellfire missile missed its target and struck the armored vehicle instead, the military said Sunday.

Two U.S. soldiers and three Iraqi civilians were injured in the incident on Saturday, the statement said.

[wardoglrs]

See McCant was right its all under control...Look to
Dr Ron Paul and wake up people enough is enough. Poor killing the poor in war. "Return to the constitution"
Before its to late.

[ranger1948]

nancy_naive
If it includes george then i am all fo it

[ioweign]

nancy_naive
What is a AWOL TANG pilot ?

Posted by ranger1948 at 04:12 PM : Apr 14, 2008

AWOL = Absent WithOut Leave
TANG = Texas Air National Guard

AWOL TANG = George W. Bush

[ranger1948]

nancy_naive
What is a AWOL TANG pilot ?

[prinzowhales]

It may soon be time for hundreds of thousands of US servicemen to refuse to fight against Iraqi freedom and come home.

The Demopublican Regime and its lying war does not support democracy...they backed Samoza...Batista... Marcos...Pinochet...the Shah...among others...

[usbrit-2009]

Remember Saddam''s much vaunted, much feared (by the press) Republican Guard and so hard it will be to get into Baghdad with them fighting to the last man? Well they all disappeared PDQ when GIJoe showed up on the doorstep didn''t they. Having disbanded the Iraqi military, how can we expect regular US trained soldiers to fight when the Republican Guard left their posts? The logic escapes me.

[swwils]

Man,what do they think that we(AMERICANS)are going to do everything for them?This is a prime example why most Americans want us to bring home our military.They need to stand up,or just sit down, and let another dictator worse than Saddam take over.If we roll out that is exactly what will happen to Iraq.

[ranger1948]

pfd572
I still say the bottom line is they signed up. They knew the situation. If they weren''t willing to do the job they should not have signd up. Iraq is a no win situation for the U.S. They were fighting before we came and will be fighting long after we leave. My daughter is there and they are supposed to train their police. She said they will not listen and do not want to learn. They do not want us there. This was a civil matter and should have been left to the Iraqui people to resovle.

[pfd572]

ranger: These were Shiite Muslim soldiers being asked to fire on other Shiites. Not only does it have to be a blow to moral that the invading army is telling you who to attack, but to be asked to attack someone who believes they are fighting for you must be agony. They could be your family and friends. Muslims first and foremost identify with Islam first, not their country. Ask an American who he is and his first answer will be ''an American'', as a Muslim the same question and his first answer will be ''Muslim''. Faith is first and attacking someone of your own sect is a grave sin. So before we condemn these men, perhaps we should try and understand why they refused. Executing them as deserters could be the worse possible response to their actions. Can you morally ask someone to commit a mortal sin, even in a war?

[ranger1948]

Rhe GATEWAY 1
vERY INTERESTING AND INFORMATIVE. i STILL LIKE POETIC JUSTICE FOR THE TERRORISTS AND HOPE MY VERSION PREVAILS.

[ranger1948]

alphaa10
Well said

[ranger1948]

brianbwb
If they signed up and took whatever oath then i still think they should be shot as traitors. I am hardcore military on this one.

[brianbwb-2009]

Posted by ranger1948

Ranger, not every country''s military takes oaths as those who join the US military do. Most often in countries with such polar economic opposites, soldiers join up for the pay, often the only employment available, (folks in Flint, Michigan can understand this) and an opportunity to join the local military "mafia", so they can take advantage of their military status for personal gain. They mark their registries with their signatures, fingerprints, or both, pick up whatever uniform offered, and start training.

They have no problem engaging in the corruption that is so rampant in such situations, even the occasional murder of someone who resists their "authority", but there is a line they will not cross, to fire wholesale upon their own people, especially on orders of a government that they themselves rightly view as the tool of their enemy invaders.

That is a line I wouldn''t ask, or expect them to cross, as it is also one that I wouldn''t cross.

But I totally agree we do need to hold Bush and his klan personally accountable for this mess, and leave the Iraqis to sort themselves out. They would be less likely to rebel if they knew that the government they are tasked to protect was their own, and not just the Bush klan''s tool.

[termtex01]

"Their leaders promise when they die they will be martyrs and so many virgins will be theirs when they reach their heaven.

Posted by ranger1948 at 04:27 AM : Apr 14, 2008"

What most people don''t know is that, the line supposedly supporting the claim that 72 virgins await martyrs has been identified as a mis-translation.

The word huri was mis-transcriped some time after the 14th century as houri, which is the Arabic for a type of angel (which can be male or female or niether. What huri really means is white grapes (like dates or figs).

Hand-copying has been credited with passing this error down through the centuries. Current scholars, who have gone over ancient Arabic versions of the Koran, say the most literal translation of the line in question promises ''milk, honey, and a silver platter of 72 white grapes'' for the faithful (not martyrs, just faithful).

[ranger1948]

Their leaders promise when they die they will be martyrs and so many virgins will be theirs when they reach their heaven. First off if they can''t satisfy one woman here on earth how do they expect to satisfy 30 or more up there. Second i think it would be really funny if they did meet so many virgins when they get there, all male, all gay and just waiting for them.

[alphaa10-2009]

The USS "Surge" lists perilously nearer the waterline for its unsustainable imbalance of mutally-opposed forces-- a supposed coalition government actually dominated by Shia politics, a Kurdish leader, and a ministry of the interior staffed and run by Shia death squads and elements of the al Sadr army.

Iraq is once again revealed as a political fiction, and now effectively partitioned into Sunni, Kurd and Shia areas. Originally, "Iraq" was created for the administrative convenience of European powers after WWI. Today, it is maintained as a front for imperialist American occupation of an oil-rich country.

But leaving American and other outsiders where they belong-- outside-- what of the "Iraqis" themselves? Surrounded by armed and hostile states, there could not be a more untenable proposition for peace than to continue the pretense of a viable, independent and integrated Iraq.

When Iran finally takes control of the Shia areas is not an issue, but rather, how long Washington will struggle to maintain the fiction that American presence is pledged for the next 100 years. The way out of Iraq is the same way America went in-- to drop the fraudulent notion America somehow could "liberate" Iraq from itself. The argument we must continue with a debacle to avoid a defeat mocks both semantics and truth, itself.

[naucoming4u]

Now there''s 1,300 more disenfranchised Iraqis out in the streets. This will just add more instability to that country.

To paraphrase Colin Powell''s "Pottery Barn" quote...

Bush broke it, and our great grand children''s children will be paying for it.

[pfd572]

marizara: Faith based actions can be very confusing to many of us. Look at what had been happening in Texas and the FLDS. They too are being indoctrinated from birth. Perhaps the blind obedience is natural when it is all you have know since you were born.

[Marie Zarankevich]

Hey! -- I like a good fight as much as anyone, but these kids that are shooting at our guys and gals are being told by some jerk in a dress that God will give them 30 wives and a palace only if they die shooting at an American. -- Their real crime is that they believe that junk! -- Don''t any of them THINK for themselves? -- If they did, they''d know it''s a crock. -- That they are being lied to, by those who claim to care about their souls. -- It''s sick!

[pfd572]

brianbwb: 1) I agree with you about the 1300 soldiers and police. I wonder how many of our soldiers would be able and willing to fire on their own families and neighbors when asked to do so by an invading army. What many Americans have yet to understand, is the for Muslims, their faith is their primary identification when you ask them who they are, where we would say ''Americans'' they will answer ''Muslim''. So we have another possible reason they would not fire. Until we know the facts, understand the culture of Islam and admit that we are an invading army, we should not pass judgment.
2) I see Mr. dumbshun has left the boards without answering questions. I appreciate your information regarding his methods. I will ignore his posts until compelled to address intolerant comments.