Hamas Flip-Flops On Seminary Attack Claim

Anger, Grief As Israel Mourns 8 Rabbinical Students Killed By Gunman

(CBS/AP)  Hamas militants in the Gaza Strip on Friday backtracked on their claim of responsibility for a deadly attack on a Jerusalem rabbinical seminary that killed eight Israelis.

A U.S. State Department official tells CBS News that an American was among the eight dead. The U.S. student killed was Avraham David Moses, 16, CBS News reporter Charles Wolfson reports. Another American was "severely" wounded in the attack, the State Department said.

Ibrahim Daher, head of Hamas' al-Aqsa radio, said his station put out an earlier claim of responsibility prematurely, based on confused information.

Abu Obeida, a spokesman for Hamas' military wing, confirmed the group was not taking credit for the attack - at least yet.

"There may be a later announcement ... But we don't claim this honor yet," he said.

Hamas militants had issued a statement Friday saying the attack was in response to the week's violence in the Gaza Strip.

A Hamas radio presenter said the group's military wing had "promised a jolting response" to this week's violence in the Gaza Strip in which more than 120 Palestinians were killed by the Israeli military, many of them in the northern Gaza town Jebaliya.

The radio referred to the Jerusalem attack as "the fruits of what happened in Jebaliya" and called on believers to "celebrate this victory against the brutal enemy."

Later, Ibrahim Daher, head of Hamas' al-Aqsa radio, said his station had put out the earlier claim of responsibility prematurely, based on confused information.

Abu Obeida, a spokesman for Hamas' military wing, confirmed the group was not taking credit for the attack - at least yet.

"There may be a later announcement ... But we don't claim this honor yet," he said.

The attack prompted celebrations in Gaza where Palestinians took to the streets firing in the air and passing out candy.

The earlier Hamas announcement came as thousands of mourners marched in funeral processions for the dead students.

CBS News correspondent Robert Berger reports that the country is on high alert following the shooting rampage. However, while Israel slapped a closure on the West Bank, an Israeli official indicated that fledgling peace talks with the Palestinians would go on despite the violence.

On Friday, thousands of Israelis gathered outside the bullet-scarred seminary to begin funeral processions for the students.

Thousands of shocked Israelis gathered at the Jerusalem Seminary where the shooting occurred to mourn the dead. A bearded rabbi recited Hebrew psalms line by line, the crowd repeating after him, in memory of the dead students, one of them 26 years old and the rest teenagers between ages 15 and 19. People packed nearby balconies to observe the ceremony, after which the bodies were to be taken for burial.

The victims had been studying in a packed library when a Palestinian gunman from East Jerusalem stormed in and began shooting.

Students jumped out of windows in panic. Some died while clenching holy books drenched in blood.

Police said an Israeli soldier in the area shot and killed the gunman, who worked as a driver for the school.

It was the first major attack in Jerusalem in four years, and the deadliest incident in Israel since a suicide bomber killed 11 people in Tel Aviv on April 17, 2006.

The shooting came on the heels of a surge in fighting between Israelis and Gaza's Hamas rulers that killed three Israelis and 120 Palestinians, roughly half of them civilians, according to Palestinian officials. The violence continued on Friday, when the body of a 40-year-old militant was brought to a hospital in northern Gaza. Medics said they had been told he was killed by Israeli tank fire. The army said it was unaware of the incident.

For the most part, however, Gaza was quiet on Friday.

Israel will push ahead with peace talks "so as not to punish moderate Palestinians for actions by people who are not just our enemies but theirs as well," an Israeli official said, speaking on condition of anonymity because the government had yet to make an official announcement.

The attack Thursday was the second crisis to roil the fragile talks this week. Earlier in the week, Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas suspended negotiations because of a spike in violence in the Gaza Strip, but later backed down under pressure from U.S. Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice, who was in the region to push the talks forward.

It wasn't clear if Israel would respond with more military operations, though Hamas' claim of responsibility made that seem more likely.

An Israeli government official urged the moderate Palestinian leadership based in the West Bank to do more to rein in militants, which he said was a requirement for successful peace talks.

"Talks will go nowhere unless we get the issue of terrorism under control. If we have talks on Monday and bombs going off on Tuesday, talks will become meaningless," said Mark Regev, Israeli Prime Minister Ehud Olmert's spokesman.

Regev said that even though the attacker was from east Jerusalem, under Israeli sovereignty, the shooting had almost certainly been organized in the West Bank. He would not confirm that Israel had reached a decision to continue peace talks, but did not deny the other official's statement that negotiations would go on.

Rice, who strongly denounced the attack, told Abbas in a phone call Friday that she would do everything in her power to restore calm as soon as possible, said Abbas aide Nabil Abu Rdeneh, an aide to Abbas.

After the attack on the seminary, students gathered outside the library and screamed for revenge, shouting, "Death to Arabs," while in Hamas-controlled Gaza thousands of jubilant Palestinians took to the streets to celebrate.

The attacker was Alaa Abu Dheim, a 25-year-old from the east Jerusalem neighborhood of Jabel Mukaber, according to his family, who set up a mourning tent outside their home and hung green Hamas flags along with one yellow flag of the Lebanese militant group Hezbollah.

His family said several relatives had been taken for questioning by Israeli police. They described him as quiet and intensely religious, but said he was not a member of a militant group and had planned to get married in the summer.

Abu Dheim had been transfixed in recent days by the news from Gaza, said his sister, Iman Abu Dheim. "He told me he wasn't able to sleep because of the grief," she said. His family last saw him when he left for evening prayers Thursday, she said.

"We are proud and happy, and everyone in Jabel Mukaber is proud of him," said a cousin, who identified herself as Umm Fadi.

Israeli police confirmed the attacker was from Jabel Mukaber in east Jerusalem, where Palestinian residents hold Israeli ID cards that give them freedom of movement in Israel, and had worked as a driver. Several residents of Jabel Mukaber said Abu Dheim had been a driver at the seminary he attacked, but neither his relatives or police would confirm that.

Mahmoud Abbas, the moderate Palestinian president with whom Israel is negotiating a peace agreement, condemned the attack.

The attacker walked through the seminary's main gate and entered the library, where witnesses said some 80 students were gathered. He carried an assault rifle and pistol, and used both weapons in the attack, leaving at least six empty bullet clips on the floor, police said. Rescue workers said nine people were wounded, three seriously.

Yehuda Meshi Zahav, head of the Zaka rescue service, entered the library after the attack. "The whole building looked like a slaughterhouse. The floor was covered in blood," he said. "The floors are littered with holy books covered in blood."

Police later said they found the gunman's vehicle nearby.

David Simchon, head of the seminary's high school, said the gunman was finally killed by a seminary graduate who is an army officer and lives nearby. The officer rushed into the seminary with his weapon and killed the gunman, he told Israel Radio.

The seminary, a prestigious center of Jewish studies, largely produced the ideology behind the Jewish settlement movement in the West Bank and educated its leaders. It serves some 400 high school students, young Israeli soldiers and adults, and many of them carry arms.

At mosques in Gaza City and the northern Gaza Strip, many residents performed prayers of thanksgiving - only performed in cases of great victory to thank God.

[newsterl]

LOL George, priceless :)

I like Pat Condell''s clips a LOT, he is good.

[newsterl]

Funny too George;
read what he says on that youtube page, seems he is a PEST over there too, sending unwanted messages/email to atheists;

"...atheists have blocked me from sending them emails on you tube..."

LOL thats hilarious.

[newsterl]

Thanks George, I''ll look

His url is;

www.youtube.com/user/singinrick `

[newsterl]

Whats MORE hilarious is Rick''s youtube page says this, note the # of subscribers and views of his clips;

singinrick
Style: Christian
Joined: August 15, 2006
Subscribers: 4
Channel Views: 1,921
20 "friends"

Now check out the director of the Texas chapter of atheists.org;

ajoeyjo
Joined: February 03, 2007
Subscribers: 559
Channel Views: 13,428

83 "friends"

Not only does the atheist have more views and subscribers, he opened that page 6 months after Rick opened his.
Tells me a lot :)
Adding me as a subscriber... to the Texas atheist channel.

[newsterl]

Whats MORE hilarious is Rick''s youtube page says this, note the # of subscribers and views of his clips;

singinrick
Style: Christian
Joined: August 15, 2006
Subscribers: 4
Channel Views: 1,921
20 "friends"

Now check out the director of the Texas chapter of atheists.org;

ajoeyjo
Joined: February 03, 2007
Subscribers: 559
Channel Views: 13,428

83 "friends"

Not only does the atheist have more views and subscribers, he opened that page 6 months after Rick opened his.
Tells me a lot :)
Adding me as a subscriber... to the Texas atheist channel.

[newsterl]

Good ones george2221

Title of the first one is;

Christian extremists disrupt a Hindu prayer at the senate

Another one;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xMDCWnclzKs `

rom the series, "When Christians Misbehave"
This is a two part benediction at a public college in Texas given by the very religious valedictorian of that school. This came after some wrangling about whether to even have a benediction, since some students objected. This is unbridled Christian advertising in the form of a self induced fit on stage.

At the near end of the video, the brown-uniformed woman walking up the aisle is a Texas Department of Public Safety Trooper, going up on stage to render aid. She obviously doesn''t think it''s a very serious emergency. I dont think anyone else does either.

Joe Zamecki aka aajoeyjo
Texas State Director, American Atheists
www.atheists.org/tx

[newsterl]

Good ones george2221

Title of the first one is;

Christian extremists disrupt a Hindu prayer at the senate

Another one;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xMDCWnclzKs `

rom the series, "When Christians Misbehave"
This is a two part benediction at a public college in Texas given by the very religious valedictorian of that school. This came after some wrangling about whether to even have a benediction, since some students objected. This is unbridled Christian advertising in the form of a self induced fit on stage.

At the near end of the video, the brown-uniformed woman walking up the aisle is a Texas Department of Public Safety Trooper, going up on stage to render aid. She obviously doesn''t think it''s a very serious emergency. I dont think anyone else does either.

Joe Zamecki aka aajoeyjo
Texas State Director, American Atheists
www.atheists.org/tx

[newsterl]

Still waiting on ya Ricky, I got lots more ready to go, we can do this all night, let''s see what we can accomplish!!
Ball in your court now while I have dinner.

16) Jesus says : "Ye have heard that it hath been said, Thou shalt love thy neighbor, and hate thine enemy" (Matthew 5:43). This statement does not exist in the OT either In fact, Proverbs 24:17 says, "Rejoice not when thine enemy falleth, and let not thine heart be glad when he stumbleth"

17) Jesus is reported to say: "The law and the prophets were until John: since that time the kingdom of God is preached, and every man presseth into it" (Luke 16:16). Certainly every man is not pressing to enter the kingdom of God. The very fact that I am an atheist (one third of the worlds population does not believe in a god) proves this verse to be false

18) "Or have ye not read in the law, how that on the Sabbath days the priests in the temple profane the Sabbath, and are blameless?" (Matthew 12:5) Nowhere does the OT state that the priests in the temple profaned the Sabbath and were considered blameless

19) "Yea; have ye never read, ''Out of the mouth of babes and sucklings thou hast perfected praise''" (Matthew 21:16). Jesus is quoting Psalm 8:2, which says, "Out of the mouth of babes and sucklings hast thou ordained strength because of thine enemies%u2026". "Perfect praise" has little to do with "ordaining strength because of thine enemies." Another misquotation!

[newsterl]

We''re waiting for you to reply RICK, lets get it ON boy!

More jesus LIES:

13) In Mark 10:19 Jesus said: "Thou knowest the commandments, Do not commit adultery, Do not kill, do not steal, do not bear false witness, Defraud not, Honour thy father and mother." Jesus needs to re-read the Ten Commandments. There is no Old Testament commandment against defrauding. The only relevant statement about defrauding is in Leviticus 19:13 , which says : "Thou shalt not defraud thy neighbor." This is an OT law, but is not listed with the Ten Commandments. Surely, if Jesus was god incarnate he would know the commandments.

14) "And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven" (John 3:13). If Jesus is in heaven, how can he be down on earth speaking? Moreover, according to 2 Kings 2:11 ("and Elijah went up by a whirlwind into heaven") Jesus was not the only person to ascend into heaven, nor was he the first. Elijah preceded him and apparently Enoch did also ("And Enoch walked with God: and he was not; for God took him"--Genesis 5:24).

15) In Luke 23:43 Jesus said to the thief on the cross, "Today shalt thou be with me in paradise." This obviously has to be false, for Jesus was supposed to lay dead in the tomb for three days following his crucifixion.

[newsterl]

Where you at Rickey?

Statements Jesus Made Which Are False:

9) Jesus in John 14:12 & Mark 16:17-18 said: "Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth in me, the works that I do shall he also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father." This implies that Jesus%u2019 true followers should be able to routinely perform the following tricks: 1) cast out devils, 2) speak in tongues 3) take up serpents 4) drink poisons without harm, and 5) cure the sick by touching them and MANY other of Jesus%u2019 "works". Curiously I have yet to see a Christian that can do any of the above on demand.

10) In John 14:13-14 Jesus stated: "And whatsoever ye ask in my name I do, that the Father may be glorified in the son. If ye ask any thing in my name, I will do it." In reality, millions of people have made millions of requests in Jesus%u2019 name and failed to receive satisfaction This promise or prophecy has failed completely.

11) Paul says Christianity lives or dies on the Resurrection (1 Corinthian 15:14-17). Yet Jesus said in Matthew 12:40 that he would be buried three days and three nights as Jonah was in the whale three days and three nights. Friday afternoon to early Sunday morning is only one and a half days, so he could not have been the messiah by his own and Pauls admission

12) jesus prophecy in John 13:38 "The *** shall not crow, till thou [Peter] hast denied me 3 times") is false Mark 14:66-68 shows the *** crowed after the first not the third

[newsterl]

"But thou, Bethlehem Ephratah, though thou be little among the thousands of Judah, yet out of thee shall he come forth unto me that is to be ruler in Israel; whose goings forth have been from of old, from everlasting." Micah 5:2 The gospel of Matthew (Matthew 2:5-6) claims that Jesus%u2019 birth in Bethlehem fulfils this prophecy. But this is unlikely for two reasons.

A) "Bethlehem Ephratah" in Micah 5:2 refers not to a town, but to a clan: the clan of Bethlehem, who was the son of Caleb%u2019s second wife, Ephrathah (1 Chronicles 2:18, 2:50-52 & 4:4).

B) The prophecy (if that is what it is) does not refer to the Messiah, but rather to a military leader, as can be seen from Micah 5:6. This leader is supposed to defeat the Assyrians, which, of course, Jesus never did. It should also be noted that Matthew altered the text of Micah 5:2 by saying: "And thou Bethlehem, in the land of Judah" rather than "Bethlehem Ephratah" as is said in Micah 5:2. He did this, intentionally no doubt, to make this verse appear to refer to the town of Bethlehem rather than the family clan.

[newsterl]

Prophecies Christians Use to Verify Jesus as the Messiah, Yet Clearly Fail:

4) The gospels (especially Matthew 21:4 and John 12:14-15) claim that Jesus fulfills the prophecy of Zechariah 9:9. But the next few verses (Zechariah 9:10-13) show that the person referred to in this verse is a military king that would rule "from sea to sea". Since Jesus had neither an army nor a kingdom, he could not have fulfilled this prophecy.

5) Matthew (Matthew 2:17-18) quotes Jeremiah (Jeremiah 31:15), claiming that it was a prophecy of King Herod%u2019s alleged slaughter of the children in and around Bethlehem after the birth of Jesus. But this passage refers to the Babylonian captivity, as is clear by reading the next two verses (Jeremiah 31:16-17), and, thus, has nothing to do with Herod%u2019s massacre.

6) John 19:33 says that during Jesus%u2019 crucifixion, the soldiers didn%u2019t break his legs because he was already dead. Verse John 19:36 claims that this fulfilled a prophecy: "Not a bone of him shall be broken." But there is no such prophecy. It is sometimes said that the prophecy appears in Exodus 12:46, Numbers 9:12 & Psalm 34:20. This is not correct. Exodus 12:46 & Numbers 9:12 are not prophecies, they are commandments. The Israelites are told not to break the bones of the Passover lamb, and this is all it is about. And Psalm 34:20 seems to refer to righteous people in general (see verse Psalm 34:19, where a plural is used), not to make a prophecy about a specific person.

[newsterl]

Jesus Christ is a False Messiah

According to Jesus%u2019 admissions, as well as the Bible%u2019s prophecies, Jesus of Nazareth could not have been the Messiah. This of course, would invalidate Christianity as we know it. The compilation presented here shall be split in three sections. The first shall be the biblical prophecies that were made in order to identify the messiah, which Jesus does not fulfill. The second shall be the prophecies that Christians use to say that Jesus was the Messiah, yet they clearly fail. The third set shall be the prophecies and statements Jesus made yet they are false and have never came true.



Prophecies to Identify the Messiah, Which Jesus Does Not Fulfill:

1) Matthew 1:23 says that Jesus (the messiah) would be called Immanuel, which means "God with us." Yet no one, not even his parents, call him Immanuel at any point in the bible.

2) The Messiah must be a physical descendant of David (Romans 1:3 & Acts 2:30). Yet, how could Jesus meet this requirement since his genealogies in Matthew 1 and Luke 3 show he descended from David through Joseph, who was not his natural father because of the Virgin Birth. Hence, this prophecy could not have been fulfilled.

3) Isaiah 7:16 seems to say that before Jesus had reached the age of maturity, both of the Jewish countries would be destroyed. Yet there is no mention of this prophecy being fulfilled in the New Testament with the coming of Jesus, hence this is another Messiah prophecy not fulfilled.

[nothappyatall]

Nope, Im just sick of having religion forced down my throat on a NEWS and WEATHER site
posted by newster1

"You have decided ON YOUR OWN FREE WILL To PARTICIPATE in this discussion."

BULLchit!! you are posting your religious krap all over this dam site, you are like a disease that infiltrates every crack, you want a religious posting WAR, I''m going to GIVE you one! Now we can sit here all night and slam the hel1 out of each others posts, I''ve got ALL NIGHT pal, give it your best shot!

[j-whitman]

singinrick,,,, You are one ignorant SOB

[nothappyatall]

Gezus, reading the last bunch of krap posted by singinrick (Rick Miesse) church must have just let out and our resident bibull thumper just got out of the child care center there and came here to attack, rant and rave again. Someone get this nut some blue pills or a trip with the men in white coats, cause its obvious hes gone off the deep end.

We had a nice day or so, free of this krap, even some good dialogue starting up that was free of this religious kook, now he brings his sorry excuse of a religion in HERE again to stir the krap up again by attacking those who refuse to believe in HIS god or read his ******* bibull.

He is like a bad odor, something disgusting you cant scrape off the bottom of your shoe that just stays there.

[nothappyatall]

You are complete idiot Rickey boy, completely DAFT, sick in the mind, you need to talk to a psychiatrist or therapist or something and get over this OBSESSION you have with a book of fairy tales and invisible Santa Claus in the sky.

When you actually apply to get your medical DEGREE Dr Rick, and you pass to get a license to practice medicine, then you can come back and analize people here, you dont know me from squat and Im tired of telling you two right wing morons the facts which you dont seem to let SINK INTO your head- that I HATE, DESPISE and SPIT ON your stupid god, your fake jezus and your book of death and its violence. There is NO satan either unless you count PEOPLE, many of whom may as well be considered Satans in 3 pc suits.

Like I said before- I dont CARE if you call it ''old'' testiment or new, its HISTORY, people have USED it to murder, enslave, subvert others, it is still IN your book of death being validtaed by its continued being there.
Now get out of my face moron, and stop preaching your chit to me, Im tired of it, you absolutely WILL NEVER alter my views on this nor convert me, Im a CARD CARRYING DUES PAYING ATHEIST!

www.atheists.org `
atheist2.freeforums.org `
www.zeitgeistmovie.com `
www.evilbible.com `

[nothappyatall]

Isreal Flip-Flops on wanting peace in order to continue with their methodical genocide of eleminating an entire people & culture to replace them with Jews ,

JERUSALEM - Israel announced plans Sunday to build hundreds of homes in the West Bank and disputed east Jerusalem, setting off another crisis in the embattled peace process ahead of the arrival of a key U.S. mediator.

Posted by j-whitman"

Yeah thats for sure, they just keep poking a stick into the hornet''s nest by doing this stuff, they do it because they know the USA is their personal GUARD DOG, they snap their fingers and we JUMP.
How the hel1 did we ever get mixed up with those idiots in the first place?? After WW2 when Hitler was gone, we should have let the cards fall they may with israel instead of getting involved in 1948 and since with these nuts.
All they know is war, conflicts, bloodshed and land grabs- its become a way of life, they wouldnt know what to DO with themselves all day if they decided to actually HAVE peace.

[j-whitman]

Isreal Flip-Flops on wanting peace in order to continue with their methodical genocide of eleminating an entire people & culture to replace them with Jews ,,,,

JERUSALEM - Israel announced plans Sunday to build hundreds of homes in the West Bank and disputed east Jerusalem, setting off another crisis in the embattled peace process ahead of the arrival of a key U.S. mediator.

[nothappyatall]

"HUNDREDS OF MILLIONS of fellow human beings who are unable to even think for themselves, because they are PREVENTED from doing so!
sociallyjust"

If you read the history, you will find the church was basically the police, judge and jury of the land, you could be accused of ''witchcraft'' by anyone, arrested, tried and convicted under TORTURE into ''confessing'' and then you were executed, often by burning at the stake.

They even jailed or executed those who dared speak against accepted teachings such as those who said the earth is NOT flat but round, and the astronomer who discovered the earth is not the center of the universe as taught and the stars etc do not revolve around earth every 24 hours was also jailed and I think executed for ''heresy''

So it was a bit difficult to go against that power and break free of it and the brainwashing control that went on, and continues today even if less.