Kirk: Clinton Wouldn't Be Able to Govern

Political Players: Former Dallas Mayor Says Only Obama Can Unite America

(CBS)  Political Players is a weekly conversation with the leaders, consultants, and activists who shape American politics. This week, CBS News' Brian Goldsmith talked with former Dallas Mayor -- and U.S. Senate nominee -- Ron Kirk about his presidential candidate, Barack Obama, and next Tuesday's potentially decisive Texas primary.

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CBSNews.com: You signed on with Senator Obama very early. What attracted you to him?

Ron Kirk: Well, I met him when he was first thinking about running for the Senate. And I was impressed, first, with just his intellect and also his sincerity about making sure that ordinary people had the same voice, the same access to the powers of government. There is something indefinably different about him, and genuine.

CBSNews.com: Senator Clinton, and President Clinton, both helped you in your Senate race in 2002. Both stood by you at other points in your career. Did you feel that you were disappointing them?

Ron Kirk: You know, I did not want to disappoint them because the Clintons have been very good friends of mine and very good to me. But I will tell you, for me, the decision to support Barack when he called was so easy. Because I just felt like this was a very unique moment in time in the life of our country. And that he was maybe singularly suited to provide that leadership. But I have all the respect in the world for Senator Clinton.

CBSNews.com: What kind of leadership do you think he can provide that she can't?

Ron Kirk: Well, one, I think he gives us a chance for a fresh start. And to some degree, I have a great empathy for Senator Clinton because a lot of her challenges aren't of her own making. But there is, fair or not, a sense that the country is entering a little bit of Bush/Clinton fatigue.

And they just are. In a way, that's unfair to her because she is a very gifted public servant. And she is strongly committed and passionate about the issues that she cares about. But I think a lot of Americans and a lot of Texans, a lot of people I've heard just feel like, you know, the level of extreme partisanship in Washington right now is unhealthy for this country.

And rightly or wrongly, many of us on the Democratic side believe it was driven by the almost extreme mania that some in the Republican party harbor for the Clintons in a negative way. And then, unfortunately, that was returned in kind by some of the Democratic side. But even saying that, the reality is that there just aren't a lot of people that believe that--as brilliant as she may be, and as passionate as she may be--that Hillary Clinton would really ever have a chance to govern because this partisanship would rise again.

I sense that the people believe that Barack Obama presents the best hope America's had in a long time to, at least, try to come in and do what George Bush said he was going to do--and that's to be a uniter and not a divider. But it just seemed a lot more credible coming from Barack Obama than it did coming from George Bush or anybody else.

CBSNews.com: So a couple of months ago, as you well know, Senator Obama was trailing significantly in African-American support behind Senator Clinton. Now, he has almost the complete support of the African American community. Most notably, this week, John Lewis switched sides and is now backing Senator Obama. What do you think led to this groundswell for Obama?

Ron Kirk: I think it's a number of things. One, he's a first term senator. A lot of people didn't know him. America didn't quite know him the way Illinois did.

Secondly, the fact that the Clintons positioned themselves like they were inevitable and had this incredible machine and were going to have such a fundraising advantage over Senator Obama. And if you remember last summer when people saw the extraordinary numbers that he raised and that they weren't coming from traditional sources, people go, "wow, well, at least, he's going to have the resources to make a case."

Then, that extraordinary victory in Iowa in which a lot of people, both black and white, had to kind of take note and say, "Well maybe, you know, he can win in the state in which it's not just a black thing." And then, I think, it was the graciousness of his speech in New Hampshire, where he lost. But I think it was the cumulative effect of all of those.

CBSNews.com: What was it, do you think, about Bill Clinton that really seemed to get to people in South Carolina?

Ron Kirk: You know, I want to say this. I have too much respect for the Clintons and what they have done for the country. And particularly, you know, there is an enormous wellspring of affinity and powerful emotions for the Clintons within the African-American community.

But a lot of us feel like just as we went out on a limb and supported Bill Clinton in 1992, we are as attracted to Barack Obama. And for whatever reason, his ridiculing of Barack before the South Carolina primary was just a horrible miscalculation. And I'm sure if he had that moment to do over, he would have expressed himself in a different way. But since this is a political game, the beneficiary of that was Barack Obama.

CBSNews.com: What specifically did he say that was such a miscalculation?

Ron Kirk: Well, I know it's fun to joke about the idea that Bill Clinton was the first black president. And he is very warmly regarded. But on the other hand, you know, it's kinda like anything. I can make fun of my cross-eyed son, but if you say it, well, we're gonna have a fight on our hands. (laughs)

And you are right. There were a lot of African-American voters that were sort of passive about Barack. And some questioned whether he was as aggressive as he should be and saying he's African American and not mixed. Interestingly enough, a lot of the same stuff that Tiger Woods got early on.

But it was not just Bill Clinton. I think the attack by former Ambassador Andy Young and then the insult by Bob Johnson just seemed to light a fire among a lot of young African Americans, particularly the professionals and others that haven't been as politically involved to say, you know, this is crazy.

There shouldn't be a litmus test. And it is not a bad thing that we finally have a candidate that can maybe move America beyond race. This is a place we've said we wanted to go for many, many generations. And now, we have a candidate who can take us there. And maybe we better be celebrating that.

CBSNews.com: Do you think it's unfair at all that Senator Obama could lose the popular vote in Texas but still walk away with more delegates?

Ron Kirk: As long as he winds up with the Democratic nomination. The one thing that Senator Obama has said, "You tell us what the rules are and we're willing to go play." Then, he has competed well in states in which people thought he shouldn't have.

He's competed well in small states, in big states, in caucus states. And we're going to be committed that we would go out and fight for every vote and every delegate and play by the rules as they exist. And so, if we come out victorious, no one will be more happy than I am.

CBSNews.com: But if that doesn't happen and he walks away with more delegates anyway, do you think it could strike people as a little undemocratic?

Ron Kirk: No. I mean, the parties have the right and the necessity to conduct their business. And Texas is just known for being different. We earn our moniker of being a different state. We hold our primary and caucus on the same day.

And we award delegates out of each process. And at the end of the day, it is the accumulation of all of those things that matters. And to his credit, Senator Obama has gone and competed all over this country, North and South and East and West, in red state and blue state, and put himself in a position to come out of this with the Democratic nomination. And if he does, I think he's earned it.

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Ron Kirk was the first African-American Mayor of Dallas, and was elected and re-elected by landslide margins. The 2002 Democratic nominee for U.S. Senate from Texas, Kirk lost to Sen. John Cornyn. A graduate of Austin College and the University of Texas Law School, Kirk was a longtime aide to Texas Sen. Lloyd Bensten and then served Gov. Ann Richards as Texas Secretary of State. As mayor, Kirk earned a reputation as a coalition-builder who formed close relationships with the business community. Currently a partner at the law firm Vinson and Elkins, Kirk is married with two daughters.

[jack3213]

Edfranco_ I fully agree with you..Ban most newspapers as well.. they are all bias! Such disappointing journalism, there should be new laws in place in regards to this. And, for what it''s worth, the piece about Gloria Steinman downplaying McCains Nam experiance as a POW was outrageously disgusting. Shame on her.

[clovisbuford]

WHY DOESN''''T RON KIRK JUST TELL THE TRUTH. HE, LIKE "ALL THE OTHER BLACK POLITICIANS, ARE BACKING OBAMA BECAUSE OBAMA IS A BLACK MAN. TRUTH! THE CLINTONS WORKED FOR YEARS IN THE CIVIL RIGHTS MOVEMENTS BRINGING ABOUT LIFE CHANGING REFORMS FOR AFRICAN-AMERICANS AND THIS IS HOW THEIR LOYALTY IS RE-PAID. I FOR ONE WON''''T FORGET "Hillary 4us MS or MR first off just beacuse you use caps doesnt make your message anything more than a scream for attention . I am a midle aged white man who voted for Bill clinton twice in texas . Simply put Barrack Obama is the best candidate . Typing in cap letters wont change that. While I am sure Hillary living with Bill was an experience , its not an experience that makes you qualified to run the country . A lot of Americans support obama becasue He is the best candidate. Hillarys campaign dies in texas. get over it and quit typing in cap letters , online that is considered Hollaring .

[amandagalaxy]

"Obama''s supporters react angrily against Hillary''s claim that she offers action, Obama only words. But she has a point: Not in a long time has a candidate sought the presidency on the basis of a record as slight as Barack Obama''s. His supporters compare him to Abraham Lincoln, who served only a single term in Congress before winning election as president. A better analogy might be William Jennings Bryan, who won the Democratic nomination in 1896 on the power of a great convention speech. Obama too gave a great speech in 2004. Beyond that, there is only guesswork, hope and fantasy."
-----David Frum, National Post
Published: Saturday, February 23, 2008

[downsteamjim]

New political slogan: White oppressors for Hussien.

[libra127]

The title of this article is an excellent example of how poorly the press, especially CBS, has treated Hillary. In the interview, Kirk says the following very positive things about Hillary:

"I have all the respect in the world for Senator Clinton."

"She is a very gifted public servant."

"She is strongly committed and passionate about the issues."

"I have a great empathy for Senator Clinton because a lot of her challenges are not of her own making."

CBS, however, chooses for the title the fact Kirk thinks she "wouldn''t be able to govern", a nice little negative soundbite that does not do justice to Kirk''s complex opinion of Hillary, or to Hillary herself, of course. Such biased reporting (sexism?) has played an important role in defeating Hillary.

[libra127]

"can you tell me why Clinton deserves our vote?"
Posted by Vet_SK at 06:49 AM : Mar 02, 2008

Because she is amazingly smart, hard-working, and knowledgeable about all of the issues which the President must deal with - foreign affairs, military issues, economic issues, health care, education, working with BOTH parties in Congress (she has co-sponsored legislation with Repubublicans far more than Obama has).

Because as First Lady she was President Clinton''s chief advisor and, while not always totally agreeing with him on all issues (i.e., NAFTA), she saw the Presidential decision-making process from the inside for 8 years.

Because as Senator for 7 years, she sponsored MORE LEGISLATION PER YEAR than ANY OTHER of the 546 members of Congress. (www.govtrack.us/data/us/110/repstats/enacted.xml)

[boycot-china]

It is so sad that Ron Kirk and many other Black Americans like Senator Obama have turned this election into a racial friction event. I just visited Senator Obama''s "church" website and I was shocked. I have a feeling that I won''t be voting as a Democrat this year.

[truthfinder1]

It seems CBS stands for ''Crooked Broadcast Service''. I guess the company hasn''t learn anything after sacrificing Dan Rather. Making a headline title by twisting Ron Kirk''s words. CBS should eliminate the reporter like Brian who belittles viewer.

[julian1413]

This is a bunch of SEXIST *** - CBS, how long are you going to run this manufactured story intended to manipulate the election process. We''re not idiots - your bias against Hillary Clinton is blatant!

[vet_sk]

When Obama said this. "A hard and fast, arbitrary deadline for withdrawal offers our commanders in the field, and our diplomats in the region, insufficient flexibility%u201D In this same paragraph Obama went far beyond Bush in saying that we MUST set some benchmarks that the Iraqis must meet in the short term. Obama is also planning to get out as soon as possible from Iraq and unlike Hillary would not invade other countries.

Please tell me how you account for Hillary''s vote for the Iran Resolution in Sep 07 - giving Bush authorization to unilaterally strike Iran. Then a month later the career intelligence professions forced the release of the NIE that said Iran was not pursuing nuke weapons. And Hillary who sits on the Senate Intelligence Committee has access to this NIE before her vote.

[vet_sk]

This is what I don''t get. Obama is the post racial candidate, has not brought race into the campaign (The Clintons did that) and then so many in these forurms say that people are voting for Obama only because he is black. What a slap in the face to all people who are voting for Obama because he''s made good decisions in his life - like over the Iraq War, nuclear weapons non proliferation, etc.

If I were to say that people are only voting for Hillary because she was a woman that would be disparaging to you. But I know many Clinton supports must have a better reason then that - although some, only some, are very vocal about the fact that she is a woman and that is why they are voting for her.

I think Hillary has opened this door and we will soon see another viable woman for this position. I would just like to see a woman who did it on her own volition rather then her husbands. I would also like to see a more likeable person then Hillary who can embrace all sides. Don''t shoot the messenger here folks, we all know that Hillary even calls herself a fighter because of the way she bring alientates people.

[hillary4us]

WHY DOESN''T RON KIRK JUST TELL THE TRUTH. HE, LIKE ALL THE OTHER BLACK POLITICIANS, ARE BACKING OBAMA BECAUSE OBAMA IS A BLACK MAN. TRUTH! THE CLINTONS WORKED FOR YEARS IN THE CIVIL RIGHTS MOVEMENTS BRINGING ABOUT LIFE CHANGING REFORMS FOR AFRICAN-AMERICANS AND THIS IS HOW THEIR LOYALTY IS RE-PAID. I FOR ONE WON''T FORGET.

[hillary4us]

WHY DOESN''T RON KIRK JUST TELL THE TRUTH. HE, LIKE ALL THE OTHER BLACK POLITICIANS, ARE BACKING OBAMA BECAUSE OBAMA IS A BLACK MAN. TRUTH! THE CLINTONS WORKED FOR YEARS IN THE CIVIL RIGHTS MOVEMENTS BRINGING ABOUT LIFE CHANGING REFORMS FOR AFRICAN-AMERICANS AND THIS IS HOW THEIR LOYALTY IS RE-PAID. I FOR ONE WON''T FORGET.

[kenbomc]

In response to kmccliment at 05:53 PM : Mar 01, 2008.
You Republicans are taking the advice of Rush Limbaugh? -very bright idea. If that is so, your intelligence ranks right up there with Hillary''s campaign staff.

[kenbomc]

In response to RowdyTexan2 at 06:43 PM : Mar 01, 2008.
Hillary''s stance and plans have changed so many times within the last few months -because of Obama. This all started at the beginning of her camapaign when she took ''planted'' questions from the audience in Iowa. She''s deceitful even with her own supporters.

[truthradar]

AND WHERE WAS THIS ALLEGIANCE OF ARMY GENERALS & CHRONIES WHO NOW SUPPOSEDLY ARE ENDORSING CLINTON DURING THE LAST CLINTON ERA. Obviously such brilliant powers couldnt counsel Bill into keeping his pants on or Hillary from being a 20yr doormat & co-conspirator of his infidelities! All the strategist and endorsements in the world obviously can''t help or advise power-mongering idiots with GOOD JUDGEMENT! Clinton begs us to ask "what if" when we Americans have a vivid memory of "what did" and would prefer not to have to regurgitate it!

[kmccliment]

Barrys a Liar!
A hard and fast, arbitrary deadline for withdrawal offers our commanders in the field, and our diplomats in the region, insufficient flexibility%u201D [2006 Vote # 181, S2766, 6/22/06; Obama Remarks, Congressional Record, 06/21/06]

[rowdytexan2]

Kirk: Clinton Wouldn''t Be Able to Govern

Good Gawd! And Obama who has adopoted Hillary''s ever stance and plan can govern?

No thanks, I''ll vote for the one that took the stances and made the plans in the first place.

[rowdytexan2]

Posted by Future_Watch at 03:13 PM : Mar 01, 2008

Great! It''s good to see our military fighting men are not afraid to support HIllary Clinton for president!

[rowdytexan2]

In other words, this man is throwing Bill and Hillary''s support of him down the toilet because he got the call from Mr. Al and Mr. Jessie that he better support the first man who has a chance to live in the ''White'' House!

Give me a break!