Don't Know Much About History…

Kids These Days — Are 17-Year-Olds Losing Touch With Cultural References?

(CBS)  For generations now, we've been asking the same question: What's the matter with kids these days?

A new survey of 17-year-olds found that when asked which year Columbus sailed the ocean blue, 26 percent did not say 1492, CBS News correspondent Ben Tracy reports.

And a whopping 57 percent did not know the Civil War happened in the last half of the 19th Century.

At one high school in Oakland, Calif., the students were pretty sharp.

Tracy asked one, "Which American poet wrote Leaves of Grass?"

"I want to say Walt Whitman," the student said. And was correct.

But other historical names, like anti-Communist crusader Sen. Joseph McCarthy, have been, well, blacklisted.

"What was the big controversy that surrounded him?" Tracy asked.

"Is he the Senator that did the bathroom stint?" one student said.

The author of a new book, "The Dumbest Generation," says teenagers are too distracted by computers and social networking.

"They don't care! That doesn’t' touch them" said Mark Bauerlein from Emory University. "There's no reason for them to care."

He added: "This is what is crowding out the materials of history, civics and so on."

But a lot of educators say all this talk about the dumbest generation is really quite stupid. They say high school is more demanding than it's ever been, and students don't need to know a litany of dates because they can just Google them.

"You helped teach this generation - do you take any offense to any of this?" Tracy asked Bishop O'Dowd High School's Steve Phelps.

"I know that this generation is the smartest we've had," he said.

Phelps teaches at the Oakland high school. He says students are expected to analyze events and concepts rather than recite dates.

"People think that not knowing the old information means you're not educated," he said. "But they don't look at what this generation knows today."

Closing that gap between teens and their parents may be the real test.

[feddupp]

Wow! And these young people are our "future!"

Does this chill anyone else out there?

And, before many of you say it doesn''t "matter," remember the old axiom about
"those who don''t remember the past are doomed to REPEAT it!"

[mikesowa1]

Dumbest Generation?? I doubt it . . . Maybe the most ignorant . . . due to no fault of their own. We are suffering from a education system that, since "no-child-left-behind," has been largely based on exam results vice concepts. When Mr. Phelps boiled history down to a bunch of dates a chill went through my spine - - An educator that has missed the point of what history lessons are - - lessons - - that we should learn. When I try to relate a concept to my teenager using historical context, it''s as if we are from two different worlds. . . One in which time begain before we existed and one in which time revolves around us. There is no more important tool than history that we can use to teach a the same sense of civic duty on which this country was founded. As for the dates we all had to learn - well what else are you going to grade students on to make sure they paid attention.

[snowprincss]

I watched this report on television, and I must say, Couric''s closing line (something along the lines of, "Don''t know who wrote that book? Just ask big brother.") sounded SEXIST to me. Yes, I know, it would have sounded stilted to say "big brother or big sister" but the way she put it made it sound like girls don''t read in school.

[snowprincss]

I watched this report on television, and I must say, Couric''s closing line (something along the lines of, "Don''t know who wrote that book? Just ask big brother.") sounded SEXIST to me. Yes, I know, it would have sounded stilted to say "big brother or big sister" but the way she put it made it sound like girls don''t read in school.

[mikesowa1]

Princess - please look up George Orwell''s book "1984." I think you''ll see no sexism was intended.

[ragingmounta]

Loss of historical reference points IS a major problem for ANY nation, ANY society. The Hungarians took special pains to teach their children the History Of Hungary in the aftermath of the Soviet return after the short-lived revolt of 1956, and even prior under direct Soviet occupation post 1945 agreements.

Countries that don''t teach History to their children; don''t survive. Remember, HISTORY is merely a RECORD of the PAST. What is surprising is that leaders do NOT LEARN from History to even TRY to avoid present-day mistakes.

BLAME? THAT falls SQUARELY on the EDUCATIONAL ESTABLISHMENT!! On 10-04-1957, these learned scholars ran for their lives and hid under the kitchen table. Their response to the first Earth satellite had been launched. BOTH HISTORY and GEOGRAPHY were banned from the syllabus. WHY? Concentrate on the hard sciences from Math through Physics. Great for those who like it, BUT, evidence today STILL shows a lacking in ELEMENTARY MATH. Also, the hard sciences do NOT create job opportunities for the general populous.

Btaim, to forget History, leads to NOT knowing who, and WHAT a person IS. The kindred saying: "If you don''t stand up for SOMETHING, you''ll fall; for anything."

What our "test subjects" are learning is to be desireous of INCLUSION, THAT extends TO ONE WORLD GOVERNMENT!!!!!!!!!!!! NOT WANTING to be an AMERICAN.

Think about it.
Ragingmountain
[e-mail]
02-26-08

[ragingmounta]

Snowprincess:
I am NOT sure IF George Orwell''s book "1984" IS required reading. In my day, NO, BUT, we had the benefit of the movie to give us the picture. Pretty close to the book, though.

I am sure Ms. Couric was indicating that "1984" was the intended target. No sexist intent as I viewed the report.

Btaim, I DO BELIEVE that the message that MIGHT be sent is that high school girls usually do NOT read George Orwell, Use this info: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Orwell. I THINK you''ll find what the ture message is for, here.

Ragingmountain
[e-mail]
02-26-08

[loudpipes3]

I am not a teacher. I am a maintenance person. I work in a school district. Often we do work in classrooms while class is being held. Sometimes I see students asleep at their desk while class is being held. Why the teacher permits this is beyond me. Others DO try to learn though. - I think that the "object", these days, is to push students to learn science & math, so in the future, our country will be competitive with other countrys as far as progress is concerned.
I have seen these kids work blackberrys & cell phones, and they dont even look at them, and their fingers FLY over the keyboards! - Its amazing. - I think its a different type of future that they are headed for, but I dont think they, (the teachers) should neglect the basics that we learned though.
I should say this: --- If "I", were caught sleeping in algebra class in MY day, I would be quickly awakened by the smart rap of a teachers pointer over my back!!!
--- Then, probably paddeled in front of the class!
Oh, but "Yes", I forgot, ---- they dont permit that sort of thing anymore. - Too bad! - Everybodys handicapped; the teachers, parents, - everybody!
Teachers are afraid of the kids; so are parents!
Pretty bad-------Thats my bit.

[skeptical4]

I guess it''s easy to develop concepts when you''re unencumbered by facts. You don''t have to remember dates to study history, if you''ve found a better way to remember the sequence of events. The sequence is essential for establishing causal relationships. I suspect that quizzes on Geography, Science and Math would produce the same dismal results. Professional educators have opposed No Child Left Behind because it introduced standards and accountability. Smart but ignorant...sort of like having a large engine on blocks.

[snowprincss]

I watched this report on television, and I must say, Couric''s closing line (something along the lines of, "Don''t know who wrote that book? Just ask big brother.") sounded SEXIST to me. Yes, I know, it would have sounded stilted to say "big brother or big sister" but the way she put it made it sound like girls don''t read in school.

[toolmangler-2009]

Princess - please look up George Orwell''''s book "1984." I think you''''ll see no sexism was intended.
Posted by mikesowa1 at 09:21 PM : Feb 26, 2008


Princess - Read Goerge orwells "Animal Farm" then read his "1984" then read the congressional changes to our "Constitution" since GWB took office, then Read about NAFTA, CAFTA AND SOON ''AFTA''. then lookup "Posse comitatus" the reasons for it and what Bushy-baby has done to it. Lookup "Habeas Corpus" and the reasons for it and what GWB has done to it. Then you will have learned enough to ask some intelligent questions. I hope you do ask.

[irisheyes555]

Those Who Forget History Are Doomed to Repeat It

George Santayana: "Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it."

[runningralph]

About 20 or 25 years age I predicted that computers would do for the human brain what machines have done for the human body-make it flabby and weak. Also the welfare system pays women to propagate indiscriminately, so this result is inevitable.

[ianlou]

Those Who Forget History Are Doomed to Repeat It

George Santayana: "Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it."
Posted by IrishEyes555

"Those who are ignorant of the horrors of WWI and WWII will goose-step their way to WWIII."

[ianlou]

When I was a kid, our reading list of choice was made up of books that were banned in most southern states.
There are a lot of people out there who are glad that kids are not reading like they use to.

[gunownerdan]

Unfortunately many Americans today would rather be entertained rather than informed.

"Today we need a nation of minute men; citizens who are not only prepared to take up arms, but citizens who regard the preservation of freedom as a basic purpose of their daily life and who are willing to consciously work and sacrifice for that freedom. The cause of liberty, the cause of American, cannot succeed with any lesser effort."
-- President John F. Kennedy, January 29, 1961

[faerie2]

Also the welfare system pays women to propagate indiscriminately, so this result is inevitable.

Posted by runningralph at 08:59 AM : Feb 27, 2008

RR:
Have you even looked into the welfare system lately? Since Clinton enacted his welfare reform, things have changed. People are only allowed to be on TANF (temporary assistance for needy families) for a total of 60 months. While a person receives those benefits, in order to receive the full amount (which in Missouri is $290 a month for a single parent with 2 children) That adult MUST be meeting a requirement of work/volunteering or will face a reduction in benefits. Up until about a year, year 1/2 ago, if that adult was going to either college or trade school to aquire the skills needed to become self-sufficient, that appeased the requirement. But the republican govt changed the rules and said that these people who are trying to better their lives through education had to start working part time or volunteering. Going to school no longer counted. So I suppose if you want them to get off welfare, perhaps we could start helping them access the tools to do so!

[klingon69]

And so it is that we pay teachers a barely liveable wage... Ya want smart children? Pay teachers $120K/year and reduce the wages to Gov''''t contracted security firms.

Regards,
Posted by Nancy_Naive at 09:51 AM : Feb 27, 2008
That will do some good, however, until the curriculum changes and truth is put BACK in education, no hope of success.
Looking at public school textbooks today, they are nothing like those I used in the 60s-70s.

[skyk-2009]

That will do some good, however, until the curriculum changes and truth is put BACK in education, no hope of success.
Looking at public school textbooks today, they are nothing like those I used in the 60s-70s.



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Posted by Klingon69 at 09:56 AM : Feb 27, 2008
+ report abuse

LOL I sure hope not!! When you look at all the changes that have come about since then IF the books contained the same or simular we''d be in even more trouble. Nancy is right. I teach at a Community College and even there we have lost several of our best and brightest because they could not afford to teach anymore. Text''s are only guides and the secret to a good teacher is the ability to challenge students to think for themselves. To take what is in their text an apply it to life and the world around them. That takes SKILL and that Skill is NOT being rewarded.

[charlotte76-2009]

Your history may be great, Ralph, but your biology sucks. Last I checked, it''s not just women who engage in propogation. There has to be a man involved in there somewhere.

[Razzl]

It is now and always has been bogus to expect teenagers in that age bracket to have a wealth of historical or literary cultural references on the tip of their tongues. The knowledge they have of computers and technology is deep and real, but the kinds of people who do the "cultural reference" tests probably don''t even have the basic knowledge to ask them the right questions about those fields. And if you ask them questions about current film stars or musicians, they would probably embarass you as an out-of-touch fogey who doesn''t know a fraction of what they do.

This old accusation about cultural illiteracy is a red-herring issue that''s been going on since the ''50''s when the first generation of pre-war parents who learned the old way, from rote, felt resentment toward a world that didn''t do that kind of education any more. Of course, references to educational history are something the surveyors themselves might not do so well with...

[briannorwood]

You know, I get a kick out of older folks bemoaning how the younger kids have not sense of history.

They forget that the reason they know alot of history is that they lived through alot of it!

I''m sure this complaint is as old as dirt too!

[ianlou]

Here''s some history for the young voter:
In the history of the United States of America there have only been three presidents who have hit a Presidential Triple Play being that they got elected, reelected and kept their party in the Whitehouse with the next presidential election. They are George Washington, Franklin D. Roosevelt, and Ronald Reagan.
George Bush Junior does not belong nor deserve to be part of this exclusive list.
Send this failed president a clear message, Vote Democrat in this election.

[runningralph]

Charlotte76,
You are correct, of course. Men are required. What has changed is the indiscriminate part. Women used to be more careful with whom they bred. I know women who have taken up with men they met online- with bad results as you might expect. I know a pretty 20 year old who took up with a man with a sixth grade education and 3 *** children he made no effort to support. So she gave him one more and went back to work in the fast food restaurant. Welfare is survival of the unfittest.

[gunownerdan]

Dirty Democrats and Rotten Republicans are DUMBING-DOWN AMERICA.
Politicians can control you much easier if you don''t know or care about history.

[ianlou]

In the history of the United States of America there have only been three presidents who have hit a Presidential Triple Play being that they got elected, reelected and kept their party in the Whitehouse with the next presidential election. They are George Washington, Franklin D. Roosevelt, and Ronald Reagan.
Posted by ianlou

Opps, FDR died in office, Only Washington and Reagan are on this very exclusive list!

[erasmus6]

"A new survey of 17-year-olds found that when asked which year Columbus sailed the ocean blue, 26 percent did not say 1492."

Who cares? What''s a measley DATE, when a lot can''t even find their own country on a freakin'' map! They know nothing about their own country, and nothing about any other country.

And it ain''t just about THIS generation, it is all generations.

"Closing that gap between teens and their parents may be the real test."

Well, where I live, the gap between teens and their parents is getting closer together as time goes by. The gap between my kids and myself is a lot closer than it was between me and my parents or between my parents and their parents.

[greeneyes222]

That''s what happens when groups like the NEA worry more about the color of ink used to grade papers than teaching core subjects.

Not saying our kids aren''t bright, but they''re bone ignorant and unable to compete with students from third world countries. Cut out the foo foo programs, spend the money where it will do the most good (attracting good teachers), and return to basics before they all wind up with meaningless degrees and working for WalMart.

[gunownerdan]

meaningless degrees and working for WalMart.
Posted by greeneyes222

In England you can now get your "education" from working at McDonald''s(it''s true).
Mark my words, soon in America you will be able to get an "education" from Wal-Mart University.
A dumbed-down population is a cooperative population.

[random_radar]

Considering the garbled lies they teach in school, I am not too concerned about not knowing garbage. I have forgotten most of what I was brainwashed with in school and it is all for the better.

Those who don''t know history are doomed to repeat it. But it won''t hurt because they don''t know it. And those who do know history can look like genuine prophets since they can anticipate what is coming.

Ignorance is a great tool in the hands of the enlightened. Quit griping about how ignorant the masses are and take advantage of them. Money and power await those willing to seize the day!

[taddles-2009]

"Considering the garbled lies they teach in school, I am not too concerned about not knowing garbage.

Posted by random_radar at 11:55 AM : Feb 27, 2008"


Such as what pray tell.

[kennergirl]

I don''t think kids are ignorant today by any means but I do believe with the technology they have access to the classroom environment itself needs to be updated to compete. I think kids are bored with it the way it is right now and I think it''s about time for some sort of an update.

[carpriddler]

History teachers in most high schools are jaded egomaniacs full of information that only matters to those who want to become history teachers.

[thgdriver]

School kids can forget about Columbus altogether.

Christopher Columbus could not find the nose on his face without a mirror. If you leave Spain/England and sail West and do not hit land you have some real problems.
Columbus did not discover anything that was not here already.

Now, my hero Dr. Jonas Salk, he discovered something. Hoe many statues do you see of him? How many Roads, buildings, parks do you see named after him?

[faerie2]

Women used to be more careful with whom they bred. I know women who have taken up with men they met online- with bad results as you might expect. I know a pretty 20 year old who took up with a man with a sixth grade education and 3 *** children he made no effort to support. So she gave him one more and went back to work in the fast food restaurant. Welfare is survival of the unfittest.

Posted by runningralph at 11:07 AM : Feb 27, 2008

I see you''re still ranting about women and welfare with no real basis. Go you!

[gunownerdan]

"In the councils of government, we must guard against the acquisition of unwarranted influence, whether sought or unsought, by the militaryindustrial complex. The potential for the disastrous rise of misplaced power exists and will persist.
We must never let the weight of this combination endanger our liberties or democratic processes. We should take nothing for granted. ONLY AN ALERT AND KNOWLEDGEABLE CITIZENRY can compel the proper meshing of the huge industrial and military machinery of defense with our peaceful methods and goals, so that security and liberty may prosper together."
- Dwight D. Eisenhower, January 17, 1961

And this is why those who are in charge will see to it that Americans are as dumb as possible.

[ianlou]

gunownerdan,
Eisenhower said some great things, my favorite is...

Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired, signifies in the final sense a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and are not clothed.
Dwight D. Eisenhower

or
In most communities it is illegal to cry "fire" in a crowded assembly. Should it not be considered serious international misconduct to manufacture a general war scare in an effort to achieve local political aims?
Dwight D. Eisenhower

[libsrweak]

Posted by ianlou at 02:20 PM : Feb 27, 2008
+ report abuse


*****************

hunger??cold?? humm what about food stamps..public housing?? in this country you stay hungry or cold because you decided to put yourself in that position.

and in regards to your ''war-mongering'' issue..how far do you want these jihadist to ram that 747 up your arse before you can be convinced that there are people out there that wants to destroy you and your lifestyle.

[gunownerdan]

in regards to your ''war-mongering'' issue..how far do you want these jihadist to ram that 747 up your arse before you can be convinced that there are people out there that wants to destroy you and your lifestyle.
Posted by libsrweak

Most of the 9/11 hijackers were SAUDIS, you know, from Saudi Arabia. Bush is often seen kissing and holding hands with their leader while we pay them billions and they "educate" the next generation of hateful Islamic terrorist bigots.

[libsrweak]

Most of the 9/11 hijackers were SAUDIS, you know, from Saudi Arabia. Bush is often seen kissing and holding hands with their leader while we pay them billions and they "educate" the next generation of hateful Islamic terrorist bigots.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Posted by gunownerdan at 04:07 PM : Feb 27, 2008
+ report abuse


******************

and most saudis are...................muslims..if you would had paid attention to what i said..
islam does not discriminate..it will take citizens from all nations..it will take followers of any color..

to say that all muslims are evil is moot..its pretty much like saying all gun owners are redneck inbreeds or all liberals are fa ggots (i use my cyber name to catch attention but do not necessarily mean all liberals are weak minded). there are efforts from all moderate muslims to address the issue at hand..

[ianlou]

Posted by libsrweak at 03:42 PM : Feb 27, 2008

Hey! These are quotes from Dwight D. Eisenhower. A very famous and respected Republican President who led our nation and the free world to victory in WWII.
Sorry he still isn''t up to your NeoCon standards.

Do a web search on Eisenhower + Quotes, what you will find will probable make YOU go screaming into the night.

[sebastian27-2009]

There is a difference between educated and being smart. Many young people are smart, but only in what they interested in. They may are may not be educated are educable. On the other had, some people are uneducated as in formal education, but they are very smart. Bill Gates was one of those.
Then there are people that have a lot of education, but are very limited in common sense. These are the ones that have difficulty adjusting to the world in which they live. Some are absolute failures, thought they may have several college degrees.

[mrmusicguy]

I was deeply offended by this report. How can you call this generation the "dumbest"?

I am a 13 year old boy in the eighth grade. My parents are average, middle class citizens. By no means, am I a guiness or prodigy. 30 or 40 years ago, would you have heard of a full (30+ students) taking a college level Algebra II/ Trigonometry class. So that must make me dumb, right? So, students are dumb because we dont know dates and historical figures? Well, I can guarantee if you went and surveyed 500 people on the street (at random), you would find half wouldn''t know the correct dates or someones importance in history?

[toolmangler-2009]

don''''t think kids are ignorant today by any means but I do believe with the technology they have access to the classroom environment itself needs to be updated to compete. I think kids are bored with it the way it is right now and I think it''''s about time for some sort of an update.
Posted by kennergirl at 12:49 PM : Feb 27, 2008



Main Entry: ig7no7rant
Pronunciation: ''ig-n(?-)r?nt
Function: adjective
Date: 14th century
1 a: destitute of knowledge or education an ignorant society ; also : lacking knowledge or comprehension of the thing specified parents ignorant of modern mathematics b: resulting from or showing lack of knowledge or intelligence


kennergirl - with respect I disagree. They are in a large way, ignorant of what made this world the way it is, They are very intelligent about clothes, music, state-of-the-art electronics and cars, but if you ask them what Descartes meant by the statement "Cogito Ergo Sum" (even if you tranlate it for them).they don''t have a clue. It is uaually the geeky looking (outcast) that learns the deeper meanings of life, but by the time they have matured they have "tuned out and turned on" as Leary wanted them too. Yes there are those that avoid the pitfalls and become the major players of today but far too many opt out of responibility and become Moneygrubbers and thieves that prey on the rest because of a lack of caring for anyone but themselves.

[erasmus6]

"Then there are people that have a lot of education, but are very limited in common sense" posted by Sebastian27

Yes, people can get really high grades in school and yet have no common sense. Just because you can memorize a lot of stuff doesn''t make you intelligent. If you don''t have common sense, you don''t have nothing. They say you are either born with common sense or you''re not. Some will say that you can learn common sense to a certain degree. I disagree.

[runningralph]

faerie2,
Yes I''m still ranting about women and indiscriminate breeding because in my line of work I''m confronted daily with more examples of young women toting little big eyed babies around with no man on the horizon. It''s an unending spectacle. The over sixty women didn''t breed with any man that came down the street. They tried to find one with some prospect. No wonder IQ''s are frending down.

[gunownerdan]

Anyone seen the movie Idiocracy with Luke Wilson, Dex Shepard, and Maya Rudolph...

It is perhaps a sad prediction of things to come...

Posted by ozilot

The first 5 minutes or so unfortunately seems to exlain it pretty well.