A Third Party Alternative To McCain?

Some Conservative Christian Activists Revisit Idea Of Supporting Minor Party As Alternative To GOP Front-Runner

(AP)  The same conservative Christian activist who called a meeting last fall to discuss backing a third-party candidate to counter a possible Rudy Giuliani candidacy is revisiting the idea as Sen. John McCain closes in on the Republican presidential nomination.

Bob Fischer, a South Dakota businessman and anti-abortion activist, told The Associated Press on Wednesday that while he could back the Arizona senator over either Democratic Sens. Hillary Rodham Clinton or Barack Obama, he made clear that he and others in the evangelical movement are not content with those choices.

"I'll be working in other ways to see that we have additional choices as conservatives," Fischer said.

He declined to elaborate, but held out hope that Mike Huckabee might mount an improbable comeback, or that another "good conservative, Godly, Christian pro-life" GOP candidate somehow emerge to supplant McCain. The Arizona lawmaker has opposed abortion during his four terms in the Senate.

Fischer also volunteered an alternative scenario: supporting the nominee of the fledgling Constitution Party.

Although some conservative Christian activists are warming to McCain, Huckabee's success with that voting bloc in recent primaries and caucuses shows that much work remains for McCain.

Several Christian conservative leaders dismiss renewed talk of a third-party strategy, but any significant loss of conservative Christian voters could spell trouble for McCain in a close general election.

"Some of these folks might be trying to send a signal to McCain," said Mark Rozell, a political scientist at George Mason University. "There are also some people in that movement who believe McCain is hopeless. And they're not bluffing."

McCain already faces danger if conservative Christians are not energized about his candidacy, and the prospect of a third-party candidate siphoning off even a half-percentage point of McCain support could be a difference-maker, Rozell said.

Last fall, Fischer called a meeting in Salt Lake City as Christian conservative leaders attended a separate gathering of the ultra-secretive Council for National Policy, an umbrella group for the movement.

Most attendees of Fischer's meeting, including Focus on the Family founder James Dobson, agreed to support a minor-party candidate if Giuliani emerged as the Republican nominee, according to Dobson and others in attendance. Another group suggested creating a new party, but no consensus emerged, Dobson wrote in an op-ed in The New York Times.

Several Christian conservative leaders, speaking on condition of anonymity, said Fischer has invited them to a follow-up meeting next month in New Orleans coinciding with another Council for National Policy meeting.

Fischer would not confirm nor deny a meeting, but said, "If I told you we were, I think the success of that meeting would be greatly compromised."

Mat Staver, who heads the conservative Christian legal group Liberty Counsel, said blunting McCain with a minor-party candidate has scant support because McCain is much closer to social conservatives on issues than Giuliani.

Former GOP presidential candidate and conservative Christian Gary Bauer, who endorsed McCain this week, also was dismissive: "I think the third-party idea has effectively gone the way of all bad ideas," Bauer said.

Fischer said that for large numbers of social conservatives to entertain backing McCain, he would need to reverse himself on several positions, including his support for relaxing restrictions on federal funding for embryonic stem-cell research. Fischer said if McCain prevails short of doing that, he and many other conservatives "will not work as hard as we could" to elect him.

He then raised the possibility of Christian conservatives lining up behind the Constitution Party, citing its conservative moral stances and ability to get on state ballots, a steeper challenge for an entirely new party.

The Constitution Party, which calls itself "completely pro-life, pro-gun, pro-American sovereignty and independence," has secured spots on about 16 state ballots and hopes to exceed 40, national field director Gary Odom said. The party has nominated founder Howard Phillips as its presidential candidate in the past and will select its candidate in April.

Said Fischer: "The Republican Party needs to remember that (the Constitution Party) will nominate a conservative. If the Republican Party wants to avoid defeat in November, they need to do the same. There are no votes to waste in this election."

[godseyesore-2009]

Let''s hope a third republican party is established...and soon! Right on, Obama!

[jjp735i]

The Constitution Party? To the rest of America it will be known as the Republican Taliban Party.

It''s banner theme: Religious Extremism at its best. Do was we demand and stop gay s*x, drugs, hookers, bribes, lying, cheating, and so on.

You know, the very things the Religious Right is always getting caught in media about. the title "False Preachers" is what they should run under.

[quetzal0666]

the Conservative Party can go back to Calling Itself
the Evangelical Apparteid Party.

[taotxzen]

One thing that continually amazes me is how the extreme right always falls for the abortion, gay marriage ploy. If you cannot see that you are being shamelessly exploited let me explain. For 5 years you had your President and a your majority in Congress. What did they do on these issues in 5 years?

The majority of people in this country do not believe in amending the constitution to appease a group that is at the far extreme on social issues, flaming liberal or religious extremist. Those that have misled you with their empty pledges have their own agenda and now we have to deal with its consequences.

[afmca]

Constitution Party - what a joke. People are correct - this would be the Christian Taliban Party. They want to control all aspects of all lives and totally destroy the barrier between religion and government. The Consitution would be destroyed and replaced by the Bible. Better to be called the Bible Party. That this movement would find its roots in the South sets the stage for another bitter fight based on southern bigotry, intolerance, and ignorance. Civil War circa 2010. Probably all the racist Repubs would embrace this Party, but it would do the job of isolating them into a true minority. Next step for them would be to become violent just like other pseudo-religions get when they don''t get their way.

[rowdytexan2]

Religious extremism alive and well in the US...they want to control your every thought, your every action, and how you spend your money. Kinda sounds like Islam.

[donbl1]

Not going to happen. This is CBS just wandering around trying to make a story out of nothing.

Republicans learned their lesson with Ross Perot and George Wallace. The Democrats learned their lesson with Ralph Nader.

3rd party candidacies are over.

[prinzowhales]

afmca--Nonsense! The anti-abortion question is one of when life begins...those of us who know that life exists in the womb, recognize it as life, and know that this fact transcends race. I agree, however, with Ron Paul who recognizes that this is not a federal question and should be left to the states.

If you''ve ever bothered to read the US Constitution, you''ll pretty much have the Constitution Party platform in a nutshell.

People don''t want to vote for Obama because of the people backing him and advising him--they are War Pigs--and, his Iraqi withdrawal plan has loopholes in it that you could fly a Boeing though (unlike the hole in the wall of the Pentagon). If you are only concerned with skin colour as a determinant for who to vote...look to Cynthia McKinney...she is running for the nomination of the Green Party and is utterly fearless...unlike the weasel-like Obama.

[omega39-2009]

What did they do on these issues in 5 years?

Posted by taotxzen

If they "fixed" it then it would cease to be an issue. Without the wedge issues, the Republican party represents no more than ten percent of the vote, the rich ten percent.

[prinzowhales]

donbl--If you think everyone is content to make the same kind of non-choice in 2008 that we had in 2004, you are sadly mistaken...And, if more Americans had stood up for principles instead of slinking off to support Kerry and Bush...we would not be in Iraq today. Hundreds of thousands of lives would have been saved and hundreds of billions of dolars would not have been squandered.

A vote for the Demopublican Party is a vote flushed down the same toilet that gave us Clinton and Bush.
It is a vote that sanctions the crimes that brought us to war and continues the war of aggression.

[culturechang]

Go ahead, make my day. If republican leadership would rather fall apart than move itself to get aligned with the people, then, I guess, that''s its destiny.

[prinzowhales]

Voting for the Demopublicans is voting for the party that has given us two wars, a usorious debt, a recession and an energy crisis as well as more corruption than any administration in history.

[lochlan-2009]

Go for it evangicals. Everyone knows that the third party candidate is mostly used to pull votes away from the party they most closly resemble. Obama will probably need that help to beat McCain in the racist, white, republican, bible pounding South.

[micma-2009]

That''s awsome! These ultra-religious nut jobs and far right fascists can finish their slide into irrelevance.

[bm6005]

Please, oh please, please, please....let it happen!

[hungry1968]

When are these delusional psychotics known as evangelicals going to get it?

"YOUR RELIGION IS ***NOT*** WANTED IN OUR POLITICAL SYSTEM!!!!"

[jack3213]

Such nonsense. Empty talk from empty people.

[prinzowhales]

micma--Do you really think the Left will be fooled into voting for a Brzezinski and Crown backed Obama?
The anti-war Left can read his platform as can the anti-war Right...That is why Nader has launched an exploratory campaign and why the Green Party is going to choose an anti-war candidate.

Having dumb animals like "lochlan" denigrate the South not withstanding, Obama won the primary races there so far with the exception of Clinton''s Arkansas and Gore''s Tennessee.

[prinzowhales]

No one who has any character is going to vote for the Demopublican Party that has given us two wars based on lies, corruption without end, recession, open borders and endless debt.

[prinzowhales]

McCain is as sorry a choice as Obama. He made 32 propaganda films for the North Vietnamese and had his naval career boosted by his father the Admiral. He is married into the Arizona mob, is a Keating Fiver and a man who supports amnesty and citizenship for MS13 drug gang members. When we finish swift-boating this piece of human garbage he won''t be able show his stinking face in public again.

[DaveGress]

for this comment:
There are also some people in that movement who believe McCain is hopeless. And they''re not bluffing."

I think their movement should be to another country, say like Iran or Pakistan. Then they''ll be right at home with the other oppressive, conservative, fantasy believing nut cases.

[lochlan-2009]

Having dumb animals like "lochlan" denigrate the South not withstanding, Obama won the primary races there so far with the exception of Clinton''''s Arkansas and Gore''''s Tennessee.

Posted by Prinzowhales

Take a look at the voting results in those southern states that Obama won. See who the whites voted for and who the blacks voted for and you''ll see what I am talking about.

[Razzl]

Any "Christian" third-party effort is a guaranteed loss for McCain. Apparently you guys would "rather be right than be president" (I think that was an old Woodrow Wilson quote?) so go for it. So far as the larger public can tell McCain is a conservative whose only sin is that he criticized Bush policies that Reagan conservatives were also criticizing, but if you guys want to march off to the ash heap of history with your own convention, knock yourselves out...

[prinzowhales]

Posted by lochlan at 10:56 AM : Feb 14, 2008
-------------------------
In South Carolina Democratic primary, the figures showed 1-in-4 blacks voted for Clinton and 1-in-4 whites voted for Obama. That is certainly no indictment of the South and paints the same picture of the voting patterns of both races.

[prinzowhales]

razzl--I don''t think any Conservative would mistake McCain for one...though the Trotskyite neocons are scurrying to his standard. Likewise, neither Bush is a Conservative...they--like Colin Powell subsribe to "Rockefellar Republicanism"...a kind of Socialist Corporatism. They preach free markets and free enterprise and practice Corporate Socialism...with the emphasis on the ''Corporate''.

[lochlan-2009]

Actually in South Carolina it was 80% of the black vote that voted for Obama, 18% Clinton and 2% Edwards. For the whit vote it was 38% Clinton, 38% Edwards, and 24% Obama. I don''t know where you come from but that tells me if it were up to the southern whites, Obama would be out already. Don''t worry, I''m sure the typical southern racism had nothing to do with it.

[realpatriot1]

lochlan,

When the electoral votes are awarded for southern states in November it won''t matter how the votes break down demographically it will only matter who has the most.

The only southern states so far where the Democratic vote didn''t totally swamp the Republican vote were Alabama, Tennessee, & Oklahoma.

Secondly, your generalization on the racial breakdown has not been the case in every southern state. In Virginia (which hasn''t voted Democratic for President since 1964) he won 48% of the white vote and his vote total swamped not only Hillary but McCain & the Huckster too!

[jack3213]

Here are some realities that neither group wants to face: Both candidates are establishment insiders
Both are corporate-state politicians. Large sources of Obama money are law firms, investment houses, and real estate companies, and 80 percent of his donors are affiliated with business, compared to 85 percent for Clinton.Neither are true progressives or populists, like Kucinich and Edwards.
Both Clinton the fighter and Obama the talker will sell out once they confront presidential realities. Why? Because plutocracies know how to retain power AFTER elections. After two years it will be clear that the new president will have failed to extract the US from Iraq, will have failed to deliver universal health care, will have failed to address illegal immigration, will have done nothing to get a new and serious 9/11 investigation, will have done nothing to stop middle-class-killing globalization, and will have utterly disappointed the vast majority of Americans.
Finally, for those seeking serious political system reforms, it is troubling that neither Clinton nor, especially, Obama have the courage to advocate needed constitutional amendments, such as replacing the Electoral College with the popular vote for president, getting all private money out of politics, making universal health care a right, and preventing presidential signing statements that undermine laws.

[realpatriot1]

lochlan,

So the fact that 38% of white voters in South Carolina voted for johnny Homeboy and 38% voted for Hillary the Queen in waiting is simply because they''re racist crackers?

What about the lesbians in Massachusetts and the Latinos in East LA...are they crackers too?

To the extent that there was a abacklash it was during the height of the whole racial pissing match between the Clinton & Obama campaigns. He just split the white vote and won Hispanics in Ole Virginia.

[realpatriot1]

Karl Rove(alias Tracy Morgan1),

We heard your attempt at rap already at the correspondents dinner.

It wasn''t that good then and it still isn''t.

[prinzowhales]

Posted by lochlan at 11:42 AM : Feb 14, 2008
--------------------------
I found an article from CNN...Your figures show that only 1-in-5 blacks chose a white candidate while 1-in-4 whites voted for a black candidate in the South Carolina Democratic Primary. More whites voted for a black candidate than blacks voted for a white candidates, so if you want to point to your figures as indicative of racism...it would be indicative of black racism in the South.

[liberalvet]

So the Evangelicals are not happy with thier choices....GOOD. America has not been happy since thier little Napolean want to be took office in 2000. Wake up you radical nitwits and realize that the MAJORITY of this nation does not believe in or want your so called values.

[liberalvet]

The Constitution Party, which calls itself "completely pro-life, pro-gun, pro-American sovereignty and independence,"

Funny, that describes the typical uneducated redneck bible thumper as well...

[liberalvet]

Let the Evangelicals form thier own party. They will then see what a small percentage they really are. They have been leeching themselves on both the Democratic and Republican parties for entirely to long.

[gunownerdan]

Third parties are powerless. The dirty democrats and rotten republicans have totally hijacked our government making tons of rules to be sure third parties are not given an equal chance.

[oladywho]

So is the so-called "third party" looking for a Protestant Pope or a president?

An Ultra-secretive council for national policy? Man, that has a sinister sound to it. These guys scare the heck out of me. Religious fanatics leave no room for moderation or tolerance. Mr. Miaggi said it best,(paraphrased) "Walk right side of road, Okay. Walk left side of road, Okay. Walk middle of road, SQUISH, like grape."

[prinzowhales]

Posted by LiberalVet at 12:14 PM : Feb 14, 2008
----------------
Then, I take it that you and other ''Liberal Veterans'' are against American sovereignty and independence? against the Second Amendment? and anti-Life?... you must be very well ''educated'' to have reached such a remarkable condemnation of those poor dumb old rednecks...like the ones who followed General Jackson to New Orleans and saved the city and prevented the British from controlling the mouth of the Mississippi River...the one''s like my own relative, Sgt Alvin York, who came out of the hills where he learned to shoot and thump the Bible a bit and won the Medal of Honor in World War I. Who do you want to surrender our sovereignty to, LibVet? our independence? our guns? Poor old rednecks...too dumb not to believe that the child kicking in their wife''s belly isn''t a living being....

[prinzowhales]

So is the so-called "third party" looking for a Protestant Pope or a president?

An Ultra-secretive council for national policy? Man, that has a sinister sound to it. These guys scare the heck out of me. Religious fanatics leave no room for moderation or tolerance. Mr. Miaggi said it best,(paraphrased) "Walk right side of road, Okay. Walk left side of road, Okay. Walk middle of road, SQUISH, like grape."
Posted by oladywho at 12:53 PM : Feb 14, 2008
-------------------------------
And just what "secretive sinister council" are you referring to with regard to Third Parties? Just trying to scare yourself? "Prostestant pope"? You people are worse than the Neocons about making up nonsense and trying to scare yourselves with your confabulations.

[bdrlnt4rl]

i keep asking, but no responses.

why do christians say,''do what jesus would do'' but yet the do not except on sunday. oh, but they go out to eat after church, so they do not even keep the sabbath holy.

it really confuses me why they preach not to be hypocrits, but yet that is what the do on an everyday basis.

someone please help with me confusion.

[oladywho]

Prinzo:

"An Ultra-secretive council for national policy"
See paragraph 10 of the article. I didn''t make it up.

[gordon.couger]

Putting a far right third party in the race assures the democratic candidate wins by taking votes from McCain. Just as Ross Perot and Ralph Nader did.

If they don''t like McCain will they like Hillary or Obama better? I don''t think so.

A third party effort is shooting yourself in the foot

GC

[prinzowhales]

oladywho--I''m not familiar with this group...do have a vague idea that it was associated with the Bush candidacy.

These are links to the Constition Party...platform and history.

http://www.constitutionparty.com/party_platform.php

http://www.constitutionparty.com/party_history.php

You can also find the founding documents at the site as well.

[prinzowhales]

bdrInt4rl--I read somewhere that it was part and parcel of the syncretism of the growing Church with Sunday being made the day of worship because it was the holy day of other sun worshippers....If not keeping the Sabbath holy was the only problem with mondern day Christianity...we''d be in pretty good shape...perhaps the Adventists have it right. I think it is pretty clear that Saturday was supposed to be the day of rest from the Bible but, ''ell...I don''t know.

[lochlan-2009]

realpatriot1- Virginia, D.C., Maryland are not southern states. Virginia used to be more southern but the North has moved in pretty good all the way down to North Carolinas shore line. Then there''s Floridas mostly Northern retirees for many years now, Phoenix Arizona, and Las Vegas Nevada (not so much) that the North have moved in on for retirement.

"is simply because they''''re racist crackers", is to strong a phrase. More along the lines they don''t believe this country "is ready" (PR) for a balck president.

Prinzowhales- "it would be indicative of black racism in the South" for some. Just like Jews stick with jews, and Chinese stick with Chinese, the blacks are hoping to see a little gravy come their way from the top for a change, and of course are going to vote accordingly.

Still, let''s wait and see. Truth will out.

[jailrove]

I heard Ralph Nader talks to God.

[prinzowhales]

gcouger--If the two wings of the Demopublicans don''t represent anything you would vote for...then your only choice is a Third Party...following the path of least resistance has taken us down the road to greater debt, bigger government, fewer good jobs, de-industrialization, bloody and expensive wars and a police state as well as a diminuition of the Constitution...

...If this the path you want to travel, then by all means, vote Demopublican. I''m going to find and support a candidate and party that is not taking us along the road to National Socialism.

[prinzowhales]

Posted by lochlan at 01:31 PM : Feb 14, 2008
-------------------
I don''t look to get anything from government...and I don''t want it getting anything from me. That is why I object to all four candidates in the Demopublican mainstream. They want me to fight, support a big government to tell me what I can do and can''t do, be treated in a health care system of their choosing and be taxed to pay for it all...while they give the money creating powers of our government to a handful of men and manipulate the value of the unit of exchange to send jobs abroad....

...I''m perfectly willing to vote for Cynthia McKinney...she has shown her true colours in House and stood up to some of the biggest criminals in Washington...She''d be a great president...but, Obama...He''s part of he problem...just like the other three...And, I''d be willing to bet that we would all get more "gravy" from a McKinney victory than anyone is going to get from Obama...

[jailrove]

If McCain turns into a Yearning Bush to please conservative Christians, he''s toast.
This election is spelled C-H-A-N-G-E.

[lorinkundert]

Write in "Ron Paul" it''s as simple as that.

[prinzowhales]

If McCain has his way, everyone on the planet is going to be "toast."