Clemens Vs. Trainer: Who Lied?

Conflicting Accounts Given In Congressional Testimony Over Pitcher's Alleged Steroid Use

(CBS/AP)  Under oath and sometimes blistering questioning, Roger Clemens stuck to his story Wednesday. So did his chief accuser and former personal trainer, Brian McNamee.

And after a 4½-hour hearing, Congress settled for a draw in the he-said, he-said between the two men over whether the seven-time Cy Young Award winner used performance-enhancing drugs. Ultimately, the matter may be referred to the Justice Department for a resolution - and, possibly, criminal charges.

"I haven't reached any conclusions at this point," said California Democrat Henry Waxman, chairman of the House Oversight and Government Reform Committee.

But, as ranking Republican Tom Davis of Virginia, put it: "Both can't be telling the truth."

Clemens and McNamee, once employer and employee, and by all accounts once friends, sat at the same witness table and rarely, if ever, looked at the other.

His reputation and legacy on the line, Clemens gestured toward McNamee with his right arm and said, "I have strong disagreements with what this man says about me."

At times, Clemens struggled to find the right words as he was pressed by lawmakers about McNamee's allegations - told to federal prosecutors and then baseball investigator George Mitchell - that he injected the pitcher with steroids and human growth hormone from 1998 to 2001. Clemens also was asked about new accounts of drug use made against him by former teammate and pal Andy Pettitte.

Using words like "misremembered" and even mispronouncing McNamee's name at one point, Clemens raised his voice toward the end to interrupt Waxman's closing remarks. Waxman pounded his gavel and said, "Excuse me, but this is not your time to argue with me."

It was extraordinary theater, writes CBSNews.com legal analyst Andrew Cohen in the Couric & Co blog.

"The Zen moment of the day came early when Clemens told the Committee that Petitte had 'misheard' and 'misremembered' Clemens talking about his own steroid use. It is Petitte’s new testimony - directly linking Clemens to an acknowledgement of the use of performance-enhancing drugs - that is probably the most likely to generate a perjury charge against Clemens. And his defense - that the government’s star witness 'mis-remembers' - is not likely to gain a lot of traction before a judge or jury should we ever get to the unhappy prospect of a Clemens’ perjury trial," writes Cohen.

It seemed clear nearly from the start that the committee would not treat Clemens with kid gloves, despite all the face-to-face sit-downs he did with representatives in recent days - sometimes posing for photos or signing autographs for staff members.

Later, the committee appeared split along party lines, with the Democrats reserving their most pointed queries for Clemens, and the Republicans giving McNamee a rougher time. Chris Shays, a Connecticut Republican, likened the hearing to a "Roman Circus" featuring gladiators.

"I have never taken steroids or HGH," Clemens said after rising with McNamee to swear to tell the truth. "No matter what we discuss here today, I am never going to have my name restored."

For many, his denials rang hollow.

"It's hard to believe you, sir," said Rep. Elijah Cummings, a Maryland Democrat. "I hate to say that. You're one of my heroes. But it's hard to believe."

McNamee's answers were generally quick and concise. His credibility also came under scrutiny.

"You're here under oath, and yet we have lie after lie after lie after lie," said Rep. Dan Burton, an Indiana Republican.

When it was over, Clemens left the hearing room through a back door. Just before exiting, he paused to shake hands with Davis. Clemens later spoke briefly to reporters, saying: "I'm very thankful and very grateful for this day to come. I'm glad for the opportunity finally. And, you know, I hope I get - and I know I will have - the opportunity to come here to Washington again under different terms."

Since both men can't be telling the truth, it may come down to physical evidence to see who committed perjury before Congress, reports CBS News investigative correspondent Armen Keteyian.

The best physical evidence against Roger Clemens, the "smoking guns", may be the bloody gauze pads, vials and syringes McNamee said he used to inject Clemens in 2000 and 2001.

A former police officer, McNamee told the committee he kept the material in waste-disposal box at home for years - for one reason: "While I liked and admired Roger Clemens, I don't think I ever really trusted him."

Federal authorities have reportedly sent the evidence to a lab for testing, setting up a potential forensic duel, reports Keteyian.

Exactly two months after the Mitchell Report was released, Clemens and McNamee were separated by one seat in the same wood-paneled room where Mark McGwire and Rafael Palmeiro saw their careers tarnished during a hearing in March 2005. In a reference to McGwire's evasions that day, Rep. Mark Souder, R-Ind., admonished Wednesday's witnesses by saying: "It's better not to talk about the past than to lie about the past."

Clemens briefly stared at McNamee, his former employee, during his accuser's opening statement, in which the trainer said he injected Clemens more times than he previously had said.

Members of Congress questioned the credibility of both.

Waxman - who opened the proceedings by saying he thought this would be the last hearing his committee holds on baseball - pointed out inconsistencies in Clemens' comments. Waxman also accused Clemens of possibly attempting to influence statements to the committee by the pitcher's former nanny.

Burton repeatedly read remarks McNamee had made, and each time the former trainer was forced to admit they were untrue.

"This is really disgusting. You're here as a sworn witness. You're here to tell the truth," he said. "I don't know what to believe. I know one thing I don't believe and that's you."

Cummings set the tone within minutes of the start, repeatedly reminding Clemens he was under oath and admonishing the pitcher to "keep your voice up." McNamee was asked to pull his microphone closer.

Debbie Clemens, the pitcher's wife, sat behind her husband and listened as Waxman implicated her in HGH use, citing statements by Pettitte. Later, Clemens read a statement from his wife and said she "has been broken up over this."

IRS Special Agent Jeff Novitzky, a key member of the federal prosecution team against Barry Bonds, watched from a second-row seat. Asked why he was there, Novitzky declined comment.

Bonds, baseball's home run king, was indicted in November on charges of perjury and obstruction of justice stemming from his 2003 testimony to a grand jury in which he denied knowingly using performance-enhancing drugs. Because of his denials under oath, Clemens could be subjected to a similar criminal probe. McNamee also could be referred to the Justice Department.

Pettitte, who was excused from testifying, said in a statement to the committee that Clemens admitted to him as long as 10 years ago that he used HGH. Waxman read from affidavits by Pettitte and Pettitte's wife, Laura, supporting the accusations.

"Andy Pettitte is my friend. He was my friend before this. He will be my friend after this and again. I think Andy has misheard," Clemens said. "I think he misremembers."

McNamee told Mitchell that he injected Clemens 16 to 21 times with steroids and human growth hormone from 1998-01, and that Pettitte and Chuck Knoblauch used HGH. In his opening statement, McNamee said he might have injected Clemens and Knoblauch more than that.

"I have helped taint our national pastime," McNamee said. "Make no mistake: When I told Sen. Mitchell that I injected Roger Clemens with performance-enhancing drugs, I told the truth."

Waxman said McNamee, a former New York City police officer, lied to police seven years ago during an investigation of a possible rape. He also was tough on Clemens.

"We have found conflicts and inconsistencies in Mr. Clemens' account. During his deposition, he made statements that we know are untrue," Waxman said.

In the affidavit, Pettitte said Clemens backtracked when the subject of HGH came up again in conversation in 2005, before the same House committee held the first hearing on steroids in baseball.

Pettitte said in the affidavit that he asked Clemens in 2005 what he would do if asked about performance-enhancing substances. Pettitte said Clemens responded by saying Pettitte misunderstood the previous exchange in 1999 or 2000 and that, in fact, Clemens had been talking about HGH use by his wife in the original conversation.

[fuzzybear9]

Hello Baseball Fans

`` Take me out to the ball game , take me out with the Crowd ``

I mean who cares ?
Nobody cares !
You don`t care , I don`t Care , Nobody Cares .

Play Ball.

Sincerely you second base stealing Bear
Fuzzy

[jersupporter]

Yankees are cheaters and their championships are tainted. Lets put asteriks next to their names and take away those championships in the last decade.

[jetlizhan]

this has gone on way too long - it''s time to put this one to bed, whatever the outcome.

[random_radar]

Laying aside the issue at hand, I would never trust one man''s testimony as establishing the facts. Especially when that one man has compelling reasons to say what the government wants him to say.

People may rail all they want about steroids in baseball and corruption elsewhere in society, but they should be very careful about how little evidence they accept for the truth. Fools believe what they want to hear, and fools are sought out by liars because they are so gullible.

[jersupporter]

The Yankees are CHEATERS. Take away their tainted titles.

[jersupporter]

Fools believe what they want to hear, and fools are sought out by liars because they are so gullible. Posted by random_radar
-------------------------------------
Andy Pettite and Chuck Knoblauck have already admiited to cheating while members of the New York Yankees - so are they lying and Roger Clemens is telling the truth? Clemems is the liar and will pay for perjury (already three times today). What a shame - Yankees are cheaters.

[tomanyt]

How is it that the committee believes what one person says and not the other? There is not physical evidence the Clemens did what the other guy claims he did. This whole this is stupid. Unless you have physical proof, its all a matter of he said/he said.

[gunshack1]

Roger Clemens is never going to win this. He should just take the 5th. and tell the congress "were done here" and leave.

[downtowner97]

Gunshack - I couldn''t have said it better myself. What would they do to him, lock him up for contempt for a week?

[ianlou]

Roger Clemens did what?
Who cares!!
Isn''t he a football player or something?

We as a nation spend way to much time watching others play with their bats and balls. Let leave the kiddy games to the kids.

Professional-sports is an oximoron.

[samrensho]

Who really cares if these monkeys gobble drugs. Professional sports are around only because so many armchair beer guts don''t have a life.

[jersupporter]

I have a gut feeling that Clemens is guilty as hell, but it is a fact that the Yankees are CHEATERS and their championships in 1999 and 2000 need to be taken away and an asteriks placed against the team. Cheaters should not be rewarded and the the New York Yankees are CHEATERS

[jersupporter]

samrensho and ianlou - then why spent time posting on a message board reference this subject. Perhaps you all have too much time to complain. Wipe your A$$ and move out. Thanks

[samrensho]

JERSupporter is that another name for a sweaty jockstrap?? Go back to your beer and KFC.

[creeper00]

Whatthehell is Congress doing wasting time on this?

I guess they have all the country''s problems fixed.

[ianlou]

"samrensho and ianlou - then why spent time posting on a message"
JERSupporter

Because I can''t avoid this dribble, CNN has been providing Live Coverage of the congressional hearing for Over an HOUR!!!!

Assassinations of world leaders get less coverage.

This story belongs in the "Who''s on Dope" section of "Entertainment Tonight"

[byeneocons]

This reeks of McCarthyism. Doesn''t congress have anything better to do than to figure out if a bunch of overpaid beer jocks used steroids? Who cares? If they really want to know, all they have to do is check out his berries. If they shrunk into M&M''s, then yes, he used steroids. Why don''t they just whip ''em out on the floor of congress and measure?

[roger_inkart]

HGH and steroids would certainly explain some of Clemens more insane outburts (throwing part of a broken bat at Mike Piazza during the WS) along with his massive head and general Bonds-like obstinance, arrogance and agression.

[craigh9]

Typical politicians - say they are doing it to help when all they are doing is digging up mud and pointing fingers. Know how you can tell when a politian is lying - their lips move!!!

[kevboom]

Can anyone explain to me why Congress is spending so much of our time investigating something as stupid as steroid use when we have much bigger fish to fry in regards to the economy, housing, health care, education, and a million other things? Get over it. Most of the ex-players used steroids, will lie about it, and get away with it, because they have high-paid lawyers. So figure out how to stop it from happening in the future, and get over it. Who cares?! Get back to work on something that matters. Good grief.

[craigh9]

What is it with you guys and this "why is Congress wasting time" stuff? That''''s like someone robbing a bank and the police saying "why waste time with that when there are murders to be solved". They are Congress, they can do more than one thing at a time. It''''s not like the country is being destroyed because Congress is too busy with the baseball steroids issue. Lighten up, jeez.

They are doing nothing constructive - if they really wanted to improve things they would force baseball to put a real policy in place or remove their anti-trust status - life really is simple - politicians make it difficult because they want exposure time.

[ianlou]

Now if they found out Hillary Clinton is using steroids, we would have a story worth covering.

[craigh9]

"They are Congress, they can do more than one thing at a time".Posted by rafterman1 at 11:57 AM : Feb 13, 2008

I haven''t seen any evidence of congress doing anything in a long time - never the less more than 1 thing at a time

[rushlimpdrug]

Posted by rafterman1 at 11:57 AM

Are you for real?

Did they waste this much time investigating steroid and wrestling and what became of that?

Are they going to investigate why the NBA excludes testsing of marijuana?

What other sports are going to be investigated?

Has anyone noticed how buff the golfers are nowdays?

Shouldn''t they be investigated also?
and on and on . . .

When will congress stop?
Or where do they draw the line?

[jersupporter]

I haven''''t seen any evidence of congress doing anything in a long time - never the less more than 1 thing at a time Posted by craigh9
----------------------
Have you ever worked with Congress? have you ever attended a session of Congress? If the answer is no then perhaps your stereotypical views are just an uninformed opinion.

[jersupporter]

LOL - you called golfers buffed?

[byeneocons]

There was just as much evidence that Bush used coke along with his boozing. Why no investigation?

[downtowner97]

Only the House is working on this? What about the Senate, the Supreme Court? We need FEMA, the entire military, and everyone else on this. Maybe we can bring in some of our allies like Poland and England to help out. We need to shut down the government, suspend the war, shutter the post office and get to the bottom of this thing.

[rushlimpdrug]

Next on the agenda for congress:

Investigate how to help:

1. Brit Spears
2. The grammys
3. Singinrick
4. virgin muslims
5. chineeze businesses
6. lagging beer sales
7. traffic on 5
8. Elvis
9. Jessica simpson
10. congress low wages

[smiley676]

Once again, why are my tax dollars being spent on this? Why can''t Congress use my money to do something positive for the nation, like fix education? Oh right, becuase liberals are in Congress and they believe they have the power to use our money for their enjoyment.

[dkrimm]

I lived down the street from Roger Clemens when I was a kid. We had snowball fights at the bus stop. He hit my sister in the eye with a snow ball. She ran home crying and her eye was red. My father came out and gave Roger the third degree and accused him of putting ice in the snow balls. He had two snow balls in his hands at the time. He was courteous to my father, although my father was very mean. He crumbled the two snowballs he had in his hands to show that he was not putting ice in the snow balls. My family never believed him until he became the Rocket. Roger was always kind to me as a child. My family was abusive and sometimes encouraged neighbor kids to pick on me as well, but Roger was always nice to me.
This is the kind of person he is. I was good friends with his step-sister Bonny Boher (spelling wrong) I remember his step dad, Woody, who was a kind and generous person. They were very poor. Roger didn''t even have a coat to wear out in the snow and cold. I used to always ask him, "Arn''t you cold?" And he always replied, "No, I''m fine" Roger does not need anything to enhance his skills. He has had them since he was a kid! I believe Roger ClemensA

[jeanne021556-2009]

Clements is just like Rafael Palmerio when he testified. Adamant about not taking, yet Palmero was found to be taking steroids only months later. Clements needs to spend a little time behind jail. That will be the best lesson for kids to learn from all of this. No ball player can lie their way out of the truth.

[battyellison]

Well Well Well looks like Baseball was looking at Barry Bonds as the fall guy since he was hated by most fans and end up getting their greeat white hope implicated in the same scandle. Most baseball fans that have followed the game knows that steriods were used mainly by white players in the 80''s & 90''s to increase speed and power so they could better compete against the African American & Latin players not playing the race card it''s a proven fact. Now i see all the senators and congresman trying to make the trainer out to be the villian always acknowledging the good that Clemens has done and he has done some great things but for him to come out and lie when his buddies say he did as well is BS!!!! So lets see if he will be taken down for finger printing on lieing under oath. The fact that Clemens says he doesn''t know anything about steriods but let his wife get injected with them is insane he''s a good player but also a lier

[jinxkity]

Everyone needs to write their congressmen and get them to let this trivial *** go! Who cares!?!? If baseball doesn''t want drugs in their game, they need to get it out. Congress obviously didn''t care that NFL''s New England Patriots cheated, which I think is a much graver instance, so leave it go! This is not a government issue! Vote these idots out of office!

[drputt45]

I guess this is all about "cleaning up our national sport." These guys are performers. When they screw up, the penalties are minimal. I watched the Rocket at Texas and the bigs. He is good, but he is not a national hero, so what''s the big deal. Most of the folks that is around him don''t like him because of his ego.

The real national heroes wear a different kind of uniform, police, military, certainly not baseball, football or basketball uniforms.

If these guys want to pump themselves full of hormones and turn green, who cares. They are not teaching our kids anything, we are. The best case for showing a kid not to use a drug is the results of the drug. Steriods, HGH, etc, will eventually cost these guys a lot more than they are making. So give it to them.

That is, unless the costs of these drugs are driving up the ticket costs. Then, that is a problem.

[ianlou]

... Oh right, because liberals are in Congress and they believe they have the power to use our money for their enjoyment.
Posted by smiley676

As opposed to the last (Repuglicant) congress who used their powers to line their pockets, I sure do miss Tom Delay and his K Street cronies...
They got so much more done...

[battyellison]

Oh its let it go now, but when Barry Bonds was being trampled on and lied on all you bloggers were for his hanging, because he''s arrognant and also have you notice since all this has been going down they haven''t mentioned the name Bonds one time...the one who is taking all the blame for steriod use. I wonder now will the fans be willing to put an asterik by 7 Cy youngs

[rushlimpdrug]

Posted by battyellison at 12:53 PM

shut up stupid.

whatever about YOUR bonds krap.

If anyone wants something out of you they''ll squeeze it out of you.

[Markus]

Clemens or Mcnamee "could go to jail for perjury".BUT GEORGE BUSH,ALBERTO GONSALEZ,*** CHENEY AND THE REST OF THE GANG..............THEY CAN LIE ALL THEY''S LIKE.WHAT HAS OUR GOVERNMENT COME TO...........FLUSH IT AND START OVER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[smiley676]

The liberals in the Supreme Court decide that the government has the power to take our land for "public purposes" like building a mall. The liberals in the Supreme Court decide the federal government has the power to make drug laws, not the state governments because somehow illegal drugs affect commerce. The liberals in Congress spend our money on useless past times, questioning sports figures about drug use, when this is clearly a duty of law enforcement not law makers.

Why do we keep letting them take our rights away?

[ekucrew]

Bring in Judge Judy! She says she gets a twitch in her eye when someone she is questioning is lying......

Anyway... why would Clemens make a dash to get to the nanny before the feds? Some of these committee members were speaking like PR people. ( wonder how many asked for an autograph....wink wink)

[jersupporter]

Ignorant battyellison - last time I looked Barry Bonds was indicted on federal charges of perjury. That has not gone away. So please keep your racist comments to yourself. Thanks

[consciousnes]

When are they going to quit waisting our tax dollars and do something constructive.
OH, I''M SOOOOO SORRY, WE ARE TALKING ABOUT OUR CONGRESS.

[random_radar]

Baseball should take care of steroids in baseball.

If congress wants to look into drug abuse, they ought to investigate how many members of congress have used and continue to use illegal drugs. Now there would be an interesting lesson in hypocrisy and public exposure.

[battyellison]

So please keep your racist comments to yourself. Thanks


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Posted by JERSupporter at
JERSupporter it''s you who is racist you closet klansman what i saying is the truth and you know it what Clemens is doing IS perjury and you know that too

[jersupporter]

SAN FRANCISCO, California (CNN) -- A federal grand jury indictment on Nov 15 charged Barry Bonds, baseball''s record home run hitter, with perjury and obstruction of justice and accused him of testing positive for performance-enhancing steroids. The grand jury in San Francisco returned a five count indictment against Bonds, which includes four counts of perjury and one count of obstruction of justice and accuses him of lying when he said he didn''t knowingly take steroids given to him by his personal trainer, Greg Anderson. The indictment includes the first official public acknowledgement that Bonds allegedly tested positive for steroids and other performance enhancing drugs.
So bottom line is battyellison is attempting to make this a racial issue. Shame on you.

[battyellison]

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Posted by JERSupporter at

Number 1 JERS Bonds never faild a drug test for major league baseball NEVER!!!!! so thats a BS statement number 2 Clemens is saying he never took steriods or knows what they look like even though his wife was injected in 2003 and number 3 they will drop charges against Bonds because of this because then you will have to get all of the others on the same charges

[battyellison]

shut up stupid.

whatever about YOUR bonds krap.

If anyone wants something out of you they''''ll squeeze it out of you.

Your Mother

[pastdue1]

After listening to about 5 minutes of Waxman trying to corner Roger Clemens, it was enough to cause nausea. Why in the world would CNN consider this justifiable news. Why can''t our legislature investigate something at least somewhat important, using somewhat sensible testimony, using somewhat sensible questions and accomplish something somewhat important. This investigation points up exactly how ineffectual our government is and why the American public is so disgusted with them.

[watcher269-2009]

Who CARES - there''s a Fu*cking war going on and American Freedoms are being RAPED from us and the headline news is overpaid baseball jerkoffs taking drugs -

Who Fu*cking CARES about Baseball!