WASHINGTON, Feb. 7, 2008
The Death Of Late 20th Century Politics?
Please, Say It's So, Says CBS' Dick Meyer
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(CBS/AP)
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Play CBS Video Video McCain Probable Nominee Sen. John McCain is so far ahead in delegates for the GOP presidential nomination that he may be unstoppable. Mitt Romney has a tough decision after Huckabee stole lots of votes. Chip Reid reports.
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Video Super Tuesday By The Numbers Super Tuesday may have settled the GOP race by giving John McCain a commanding lead, but the Democratic race is still wide open. Chief Washington correspondent Bob Schieffer breaks down the numbers.
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Video Race Goes On For Democrats It was a neck-and-neck race for the Democrats, with both Sens. Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama claiming the better Super Tuesday finish. Jim Axelrod reports.
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Section Campaign Coverage News and video from the campaign trail.
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In The Spotlight Campaign Watch '08 Check out the latest campaign ads in the race for the White House.
It is worth pondering for a moment what the prospect of a presidential race between Barack Obama and John McCain would say about the United States of America. I believe it would say something very nice.
Think about a McCain-Obama race, if you can, while trying to suspend your own current inclinations on the race, the parties, the candidates and the issues du jour. I know, that sounds impossible and ridiculous, but it is a worthwhile exercise.
Obama and McCain engage in MSP: mainstream politics. They procure public attention primarily through MSM: mainstream media. The definition of MSM also includes marketing, not just what MSP-ists call "free media" - news.
Public officials and aspirants who do not engage in MSP are almost never legitimized by MSM. And so they do not acquire political power.
I would argue that McCain and Obama are both rebelling against MSP to the degree possible that allows them to still be "credible" in the worlds of MSP and MSM as they now exist. I would further argue that many voters, especially independent voters, recognize these efforts. That recognition is powering the success of these two underdog campaigns, along with other factors, of course.
I am not arguing the following:
What voters want is complex; it includes wanting a candidate who is not George W. Bush, who has character, who speaks the English language well and who isn't a Stepford Candidate. Beyond that, they're all over the map.
What many voters - especially independent and independent-minded voters - do not want is more late-20th century MSP.
That is a style of politics marked by two factors: the triumph of marketing and the strategy of intentional polarization. Marketing became more important than conquering the party machine, developing clout in a legislature or being a representative of real community. Securing the support of your party's most motivated - but partisan - wing, and dividing the opposition's coalitions, became more important than running for the middle, which is what old-time politicians did.
McCain and Obama are both, in different ways, trying to obtain real power without succumbing completely to MSP. Others have tried before them, but perhaps the times and their temperaments are more well-suited than their predecessors. Perhaps.
This is a tricky path to power that poses political and ethical paradoxes and problems.
For example, Obama condemns negative politics and hyper-partisanship, but when he defends himself from attacks, he looks, and may in fact be, negative and partisan. Similarly, John McCain has railed against the American mechanism for funding campaigns for decades, yet he raises campaign funds.
McCain has picked fights with some leaders of the Religious Right who he found hubristic and wrong-headed, but has sought the support of voters who are conservative and religious. Obama hasn't courted self-appointed black and civil rights leaders in the traditional fashion, but wants votes from African-Americans.
Hillary Clinton and Mitt Romney are classic late 20th century practitioners of MSP. Romney does not lead or represent citizens, he commits marketing on them. Clinton is a pure partisan, a creature of interest group politicians and a tactician.
Late 20th century MSP has crippled government. I doubt that the effectiveness and legitimacy of government will improve much until MSP withers further.
If the 2008 presidential campaign is between Obama and McCain, it will be a sign that the withering has begun for real - that's a big "if". But it would say something nice about the country.
E-mail questions, comments, complaints, arguments and ideas to Against the Grain. We will publish some of the interesting (and civil) ones, sometimes in edited form.
By Dick Meyer
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PARTNERS
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Add a Comment See all 37 Comments
- The Limbaugh-like hate-piece on the Kennedy family by commonsence, in addition to being replete with unsubstantiated opinions and fodder from the rumor mill, contains a number of factual erors.
Lobotomy was not "experimental" at the point where it was performed on Rosemary Kennedy. Though controversial, and in later years discredited, it was the only hope of many families in that pre-pharmaceutical era who had a loved-one suffering from a progressively debilitating mental illness. Rosemary Kennedy faced such a future. A recent PBS hour-long story on lobotomy covered all of this . . and did so FACTUALLY.
Joe Kennedy was hardly alone in taking advantage of America''s absurd excursion into legislating morality (prohibition), nor was he alone in his isolationist views in that era. In the latter, however, his attitude was passive in nature.
Contrast that passivity with the ACTIVE involvement of Prescott Bush in his admiration for (and fortune-building dealings with) the Nazi business community of the 30s. It''s not difficult to see where our current president got not only much of his wealth, but his proto-fascist mindset.
Lastly, JFK volunteered to fight our enemies in the 40s, in contrast to GWB''s cowardly avoidance of active service. - Reply to this comment
- Somehow I don''''t think the leaders of Iraq, Iran, etc. will be as gullible when Hilary whips up some crocadile tears. Come on! If she gets this emotional during a campaign, what the hell do you think will happen if she has to lead this country? Do you want the US Commander In Chief crying at the UN?
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Posted by otdky07 at 11:34 PM : Feb 07, 2008
+ report abuse
SPARKY I''ll tell you what! My Mom was a very emotional person but you threaten her family and YOU are in for a fight like you have never had. Women ARE more emotional than Males, that''s a fact. Give her the power of the greatest military in the world and YOU are toast!! Now IF you are a married man and IF you are worth your salt you will put that *** in your pocket and shut up!! You bigots are the slime of the earth.. plain and simple. Sieg Heil Bush!! - Reply to this comment
- The results of this election no matter who wins will be a clear indicator and a good measuring stick as to where we are in reaching that elusive goal, a goal America only seems to flirt with during a national crisis!
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Posted by tbweb at 11:26 PM : Feb 07, 2008
+ report abuse
One thing for certain that person MUST make me feel like I''m part of the country and the government. That''s the problem with where we are now, I nor so many others out there feel like we''re part of the Government. In HONESTY to people who hold my views, we are living under a dictator. WE went out, as the rules say, and won an election. Our leader resorted to FASCISM instead of HONESTY. We MUST have someone who will LISTEN when we vote. - Reply to this comment
- Sorry. I am a black male, and I don''''t buy it. McCain v Obama will be more of the same -- two ******* running for president. Obama is ran as racially transcendent until he needed to unify black support around him. So his surrogates complained and complained and complained about racism. Give me a break. White guys, like yourself, hate Hillary. So maybe that means she should not get the nomination -- but we should call sexism what it is.
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Posted by darrren12000 at 07:32 PM : Feb 07, 2008
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I''m afraid I have to agree with you. Right now we need a leader who has BEEN under pressure and KNOWS what that office is about. With our economy on the verge of collapse and NO progress to speak of in catching those who attacked us. We need someone who KNOWS, at least, what a budget LOOKS like when it''s balanced AND someone who can actually TALK to the rest of the world. Obama is great and he''s great for the party, no doubt about it, but Hilary has been PROVEN under fire!! Sieg Heil Bush! - Reply to this comment
- We had better change directions and the meaning of Congress. I''ll tell you one thing I NEVER want to see some Religious Leader call our congress back into session AND have the President screaming about HIS, the Religous NUT, right to substitute HIS decision for that of a SPOUSE!! That AFTER the parties have gone to COURT and a Judge has RULED on the issue. IF I''m going to ever support another President he/she had BETTER be more concerned with the CONSTITUTION and my rights under it. We need a President who will LISTEN when the people speak. United we are a powerful force... You can''t UNITE a people and trample on the CONSTITUTION like the present folks do. Sieg Heil Bush!!
- Reply to this comment
- So otdky07 is concerned that Hillary might shed a few tears at the UN. Does he imagine that would somehow embarass the US?
How could the US be embarassed any more in the eyes of the world than it has been for the past 7 years under an incompetent president and a fascist VP? Being the laughing-stock of the world could make anyone cry!
You''re worried about tears? How about the tears of the families of 4000 unnecessary dead US service people? The tears of six-digit Iraqi families? Or the tears of Americans who have seen their constitution trampled by our "unitary executive"?
Or, we can try the soon-to-be tears of those who will lose their jobs and savings in the upcoming recession, a recession resulting from Bush''s runaway spending and tax cuts. Katrina tears?
There''s a lot to cry about, otdky07, so let''s not worry about a few tears from Hillary. - Reply to this comment
- Somehow I don''t think the leaders of Iraq, Iran, etc. will be as gullible when Hilary whips up some crocadile tears. Come on! If she gets this emotional during a campaign, what the hell do you think will happen if she has to lead this country? Do you want the US Commander In Chief crying at the UN?
- Reply to this comment
- The United States of America has not reached its full potential yet. The American Dream, selecting the best American for any position including President based on the persons ability to do the job, regardless of race, gender, religion or any other traditionally crippling criteria. When that day arrives, America will truly be powerful. I''m not sure if that day will ever come in my lifetime. The results of this election no matter who wins will be a clear indicator and a good measuring stick as to where we are in reaching that elusive goal, a goal America only seems to flirt with during a national crisis!
- Reply to this comment
- The United States of America has not reached its full potential yet. The American Dream, selecting the best American for any position including President based on the persons ability to do the job, regardless of race, gender, religion or any other traditionally crippling criteria. When that day arrives, America will truly be powerful. I''m not sue if that day will ever come in my lifetime. The results of this election no matter who wins will be a clear indicator and a good measuring stick as to where we are in reaching that elusive goal, a goal America only seems to flirt with during a national crisis!
- Reply to this comment
- I''m a Dem, have always been so, and seen no reason to change my allegiance.
However, if a Repub HAD to be prez the last 8 years, it shoulda been McCain. He''s presidential to a degree Bush can only lick the boots of. I saw that in 2000. He was robbed by Bush''s ''dirty tricks'' department (Rove). So what else is new.
Also, I''m really impressed by Huckabee. He''s quick on his feet, smart, and think he''d make a great leader. Also (close to my heart), he''s close to an economic liberal in outlook.
Still, I''ll vote Hillary or Obama when it comes to it. Time for the tide to turn.. Past time.. - Reply to this comment
- Sorry. I am a black male, and I don''''t buy it. McCain v Obama will be more of the same -- two ******* running for president. Obama is ran as racially transcendent until he needed to unify black support around him. So his surrogates complained and complained and complained about racism. Give me a break. White guys, like yourself, hate Hillary. So maybe that means she should not get the nomination -- but we should call sexism what it is.
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Posted by darrren12000 at 07:32 PM : Feb 07, 2008
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You may or may not be a black male, but I will tell you this. Anyone who votes for Obama just because he is black, or votes for Hillary just because she is a woman, has missed the point. I don''t hate Hillary but I am supporting Obama. I think he is the finest candidate from either party that we have had for years. I think Hillary is a fine candidate but I don''t like her health care plan. I thought Edwards was a fine candidate, but he just couldn''t gain momentum. Democrats - three great candidates
Repulbicans - one so-so candidate. - Reply to this comment
- It is worth pondering for a moment what the prospect of a presidential race between Barack Obama and John McCain would say about the United States of America. I believe it would say something very nice.
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I believe so too. Maybe all of the hatefulness is finally wearing people out. It is about time. Some of the most hateful rhetoric from the right has been aimed and McCain and Obama, and of course, Hillary. And they are all doing well. I think the ditto-heads finally grew a brain and started thinking for themselves, I think Ann Coulter has just been exposed for the hate-monger that she is. Just think, every right-wing whacko talk show host on the radio has been blasing McCain for months and here he is. Amazing. - Reply to this comment
- Sorry. I am a black male, and I don''t buy it. McCain v Obama will be more of the same -- two ******* running for president. Obama is ran as racially transcendent until he needed to unify black support around him. So his surrogates complained and complained and complained about racism. Give me a break. White guys, like yourself, hate Hillary. So maybe that means she should not get the nomination -- but we should call sexism what it is.
- Reply to this comment
- Obama vs McCain
Thank God
Obama would be a step forward for the Democrats.
McCain would be...
maybe, maybe, maybe,
the beginning of the end of the stupid Reagan-era.
I think Alzheimer''s collectively spread to the entire Republican party since that time. - Reply to this comment
- The "factual" basis of crtoo''s 1:27 anti-Obama diatribe is that Obama is "a snake in the grass". Are such profundities as this supposed to move the dialogue forward? Why is Obama''s observation that the neo-con slime machine is going to go in to full gear digging up Hillary-dirt so disturbing to this poster? ANYONE who has been in Washington politics as long as the Clintons (or McCain) is vulnerable, and the primary electorate SHOULD be aware of that when selecting their most electable candidate.
I would be happy to see either Clinton or Obama as president, but at this point I believe Obama''s vision of what America can be outweighs Clinton''s "experience" card in the minds of voters.
And what the h-ll does crtoo mean by a "Obama/McCain ticket"?. McCain as Obama''s veep? ? ?. This kind of absurdity is an example of what I meant earlier when I suggested commenters have become POLARIZED and POLITICIZED that they are unable to contribute constructively, or to make sense even to themselves. I can only guess that crtoo was trying to say "Obama VS McCain ELECTION". - Reply to this comment
- We probably all want some kind of change. We want our freedoms and our rights. The question is ''what'' Bush taken away from us worth it. I say NO. I want all my freedoms, I do not need someone else doing my thinking for me or deciding, for me, what is best. You are elected ''to do a job'', nothing more, nothing less. Your job is to UPHOLD our rights, NOT take them away.
I do not know about anyone else, be let me decide how best to protect me, let me decide how to or not to worship. We are allowing this country to become a dictatorship because of 9/11. We need to start depending on ourselves instead of our elected officials. They are only in it for what ''they'' can get out of it, nothing more nothing less.
WAKE UP AMERICA, don''t continue to be blinded by the media. Think for yourselves. - Reply to this comment
- i have seen it and at least my intuition is confirmed. Obama will do anything, just like any other candidate, to get there.
However, never heard of using opposing party slime to bash your colleague and party member competition.
Yup, a banner bashing Bill Clinton and blaming him for the failure of the democratic party. Worse yet calling him UNAMERICAN. Bill was a 2 term President. Maxed out by law. 8 years of peace. later 4 years of prosperity and resulting in not only a budget in the black but with a sizable surplus surplus.
Why if so many are looking "to the future, a new future, a change" do you get stuck in the past of which they have a foggy recollection at best?
Now I can see the probability of an OBAMA/MCCAIN ticket. I felt it and now I know it. Obama is worse than I thought. he really is a snake in the grass.
OBAMA - I challenge you to Come out with the truth instead of the canned publicity you paid mega bucks for. Tell it like it is. Tell it how you are a business man, a politician, stop playing the fiddle and let people really see under the veneer before you stab us in the back. Give us a change to defend ourselves first. - Reply to this comment
- We have lost touch with the core visionary differences between right and left. In an ideal world, the right (Republicans) is supposed to say that we are better off by maximizing individual freedom, even if it means people are a little less equal. The left (Democrats) is supposed to say that we are better off by maximizing equality, even if it means that people have a little less freedom.
The Democrats have been closer to the line above than the Republicans (excluding Ron Paul, who was never taken seriously as a Republican candidate). The diversion into religious and security politics (ignoring corruption) that emphasizing Christianity and national security over freedom and equality really does not lead to constructive debate and leaves half of the ball dropped, the important one for those of us (Libertarians) who want to live in a free country even more than we want to live in an equal country. - Reply to this comment
- Posted by Quatrops at 11:07 AM : Feb 07, 2008
What then would you have us think about, debate about, ponder?
what then would you do to go with or change the present status quo?
Moan and groan about other posts, but you add nothing. - Reply to this comment
- Posted by ByeNeocons at 11:29 AM : Feb 07, 2008
OMG, I forgot all about Nicaragua, when I live just 50 miles from there and watched the planes, soldiers and trucks making their runs. In fact certain local farmers received sizable payments for running everything otherwise known as "nothing" to Nicaragua. To handle all this traffic, Reagan rebuilt the Liberia Airport to handle US fighters and cargo planes to be "the best Airport in Central America".
I forgot about G.Bush Sr. close involvement in plane loads of DRUGS flying out of Panama into Miami.
I forgot about Oli Norths cover up , etc. etc.
Those that want to know the truth have no problem getting at the truth.
Unfortunately MCM (Mega Corporate Media), doesn''t want to know the truth or doesn''t want the public to know it. You decide depending on how charitable you chose to be. - Reply to this comment
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