Gay Community Still Wary Of Obama

Politico: Candidate's Assocations With Proponents Of "Ex-Gay" Movement Draw Questions

(The Politico)  This story was written by Carrie Budoff Brown.

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Sen. Barack Obama didn’t have to issue the challenge about homophobia in the African-American community - not in one of the nation’s premier black churches, not on the eve of the Martin Luther King Jr. holiday - but he did it anyway.

“If we are honest with ourselves, we’ll acknowledge that our own community has not always been true to King’s vision of a beloved community,” Obama told 2,000 worshippers Sunday at Atlanta’s Ebenezer Baptist Church, where King once preached. “We have scorned our gay brothers and sisters instead of embracing them.”

The statement drew polite applause from the congregation, but it roared across the gay blogosphere, earning almost universal praise from a constituency that doesn’t always feel supported by presidential candidates.

Yet the goodwill - at least among some in the gay community - evaporated quickly.

At the same time as Obama’s Sunday speech, gay bloggers were digging into the background of the Rev. Kirbyjon Caldwell, a spiritual adviser to President Bush who endorsed Obama a day earlier. They turned up a page on his Houston church Web site promoting a ministry to cure homosexuals, sparking outrage among the same bloggers who were extolling him only a few hours earlier.


The twin developments appeared to encapsulate the tension inherent in Obama’s embrace of what he calls a new style of politics, his belief in forging alliances even with those who hold fundamentally different views.

In this case, he has spoken out against homophobia in front of black audiences while embracing some black religious leaders who are resistant to gay rights.

“People are confused,” said Wayne Besen, a gay activist and founder of Truth Wins Out, a New York organization aimed at countering the “ex-gay” movement. “We see one report of him saying powerful words. Then he is hanging out with some shady characters. People don’t know what to make of that.”

By Monday, Caldwell’s church, Windsor Village United Methodist in Houston, scrubbed its Web site of any reference to the gay conversion program, Metanoia Ministry.

In a Politico interview Tuesday, Caldwell said his 14,000-member church - one of the largest United Methodist congregations in the country - is not affiliated with Metanoia.

“I got to tell you, this is going to sound real stupid, but I didn’t know it was on our website,” Caldwell said. “I was surprised and embarrassed by it. I’m embarrassed from the standpoint that I should have known. We have 120 ministries at the church. You can’t be on top of everything.”

When asked if he opposed such programs, Caldwell said: “It’s not a ministry of the church. It is not supported financially by the church. It is not located at the church. That is pretty much where I am with it.”

Caldwell issued a similar statement Monday to John Aravosis at Americablog, a a popular liberal website.

But blogosphere skepticism has persisted, in part because of this connection: Barbara Hicks, a church staff member and treasurer of the church’s Prayer Institute, is listed as the contact for Metanoia Ministry. She uses a church phone number and email address.

“That is my ministry,” Hicks said Tuesday when reached at her church office.

She directed further questions to Caldwell, who said Hicks “does it on her own.”

The controversy started Saturday when Caldwell told Texas reporters that he was personally backing Obama for his “character, confidence and courage.” He said he would campaign for the Illinois senator, who might even appear at the church.

But two days later, the Obama campaign, which did not participate in the endorsement, appeared to back away from Caldwell.

The campaign told Americablog on Monday that Caldwell has not - and will not - be asked to do anything for the campaign. In a statement posted on the blog, Caldwell said neither Obama nor his staff “knew of this outside ministry, nor have they expressed any agreement with my church’s belief on gay rights.”

“Bottom line: Obama gets some major chits for what he did yesterday morning, and with that in mind, I think on this one we can give him a pass,” Aravosis wrote Monday.

Aravosis was highly critical of Obama in October for appearing with Donnie McClurkin, a gospel singer who considers himself an “ex-gay” and has called homosexuality a “curse.” Obama and McClurkin traveled South Carolina as part of a gospel tour aimed at religious African Americans.

Besen, who was also vocal during the McClurkin controversy, said Obama “deserves a lot of credit” for his speech, but was not as forgiving about Caldwell.

“It matters who you are endorsed by because these are the people who are going to be calling in favors,” Besen said. “The gay and lesbian community has the right to be disturbed when such individuals are standing up beside Obama.”

For his part, Caldwell said he is a “believer in everybody having access to all rights and privileges.”

When asked if that meant he supported civil unions and gay marriage, Caldwell said: “I would need to check with the church.”

[kansas1946]

At the same time as Obama%u2019s Sunday speech, gay bloggers were digging into the background of the Rev. Kirbyjon Caldwell, a spiritual adviser to President Bush who endorsed Obama a day earlier. They turned up a page on his Houston church Web site promoting a ministry to cure homosexuals, sparking outrage among the same bloggers who were extolling him only a few hours earlier.
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Now come on gay folk. Don''t you find it a bit suspicious that a "spiritual advisor" with a church that thinks "homosexuals can be cured" would be endorsing Barack Obama. A person who supports gay right, who is pro-choice. Do you think they just might want to be muddying the waters??? *** and lesbians have nothing to fear from Obama.

[rowdytexan2]

Everybody is changing their mind about Obama after taking him out of the box and looking at him!

This is good!

First he''s against the war, then the republicans have all the good ideas. Then he supports a bill for nuclear energy, then gets to Nevada, he''s against nuclear energy. He''s for universal health care, then he''s not for universal health care. He supports his alternative life style brothers and sistahs...and then he''s against them.

He doesn''t HAVE a straight answer!

[kansas1946]

First he''''s against the war, then the republicans have all the good ideas. Then he supports a bill for nuclear energy, then gets to Nevada, he''''s against nuclear energy. He''''s for universal health care, then he''''s not for universal health care. He supports his alternative life style brothers and sistahs...and then he''''s against them.

He doesn''''t HAVE a straight answer!


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Posted by RowdyTexan2 at 10:09 PM : Jan 24, 2008
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Spin...spin...spin...LOL

[paris1969]

The gay and lesbian community has absolutely no basis for believing that Obama will support them. His first four years will be used to get re-elected for his 2nd term. And he has spent so much time with those who opposed even the most basic rights for gay and lesbians it would be foolish to assume that he would give up their support. On the other hand, everyone knows Senator Clinton''s stand on gay and lesbian issues ... and so those who are against gay and lesbian civil rights don''t bother to ask her to lunch! She said, "I''m your girl!" ... and I believe her!

[dcorse-2009]

Finally people are starting to see the true Obama. He is not a saint or the second coming. Too many idealistic people are willing to accept words and not look at a person''s true stance on things. I am not looking for a preacher with high sounding platitudes. I know what Hillary stands for. Just look at her many years of hard work. What does Obama stand for? Beats me. Check the Chicago Sun Time''s comments on his relationship to Reizo. May not be the correct name spelling. Read all the sidestepping Obama is doing in relationship this connection.

[candide777]

Obama is a wild card -- he''s been anything but up front about what he really believes. Anyone who votes for Obama knows they are taking a gamble -- the question is, in these dangerous, desperate times, "do you feel lucky?" well, do ya?

[harp1963]

All people regardless of their sexual orientation should be respected, but I do not believe in legislating that marriage is anything other than a bond between a man and a women. I also don''t beleive we should teach this as a normal lifestyle alternative to heterosexual relationships in our schools. This issue will be the one that put another greedmonger Republican in the White House.

John Edwards is the Democrat we need in the White House.

[tmcoop]

Discrimination is discrimination! Most people do not choose to be straight, gay, or transsexual. People should be able to choose who they want to marry according to THEIR own religious beliefs. If we truly have freedom of religion, then let them decide. Too many heteros get married too many times, but no one is stopping them. It is none of your business who they want to love and they should have equal rights. The same arguments were used to deny multi-racial couples from marrying years ago, and it wasn''t their business. Separate is not equal. It is discrimination. Kucinich was the best candidate. Obama hangs around to many Baptist gay-hating Bigots.

[tmcoop]

Paris_1969,

You said Clinton support gay and lesbian rights.

She voted for DOMA, the Defense of Marriage Discrimination Act that said *** and lesbians were second class citizens and could not marry (defining marriage).

She also originally supported Don''t Ask Don''t Tell, the gay gag order violation of freedom of speech. She may have changed her tune on this, but still...

Unfortunately, if it comes down to Clinton and Obama, I''ll have to choose her, because Obama has much less experience and he hangs around too many bigots.

Edwards is good as far as trying to keep corporate interests out and to help the poor, but I don''t think he has enough support and he has said some homophobic remarks. Kucinich was the best but he''s out now.

[Ed0719]

rick: the fact that you equate g*a*y people with rapists and murderers, etc. confirms that you are a g*a*y-hating bigot. You can sugar-coat your words with all the "hate the sin" stuff as much as you want, but it is still confirmation that you''re a g*a*y-hating bigot. If it walks like a duck...

[candide777]

-Hey, I''m a Christian, and I go to a Baptist church, but I don''''t hate *** one bit.
Posted by singinrick at 08:11 AM : Jan 25, 2008

Tsk, tsk Rick, your lies are making the baby Jesus cry again. Let me remind you of just of of your many, hateful posts and lies about ga_y_s:

"You homosexuals are always trying to ram your sinful lifestyle on the rest of our culture all while claiming to be the victims here."
Posted by singinrick at 08:49 AM : Oct 27, 2007

Rick, you better get good with Jesus, is all I''m saying.

[candide777]

but it is still confirmation that you''''re a g*a*y-hating bigot. If it walks like a duck...
Posted by fuziwuzi at 08:26 AM : Jan 25, 2008

Amen to that! Singinrick bears false witness about g*a*ys every time he opens his pathetic lying mouth, which ought to be washed out with soap, it''s so filfthy from the residue of all his lies. Interesting that he never compares liars like himself to murderers and pedophiles, no, he saves all his hatred for g*a*y people.

[klingon69]

I know what Hillary stands for. Just look at her many years of hard work.
Posted by dcorse at 12:37 AM : Jan 25, 2008
What years of hard work? What has she done?

[candide777]

I also don''''t beleive we should teach this as a normal lifestyle alternative to heterosexual relationships in our schools. This issue will be the one that put another greedmonger Republican in the White House.
Posted by harp1963 at 12:54 AM : Jan 25, 2008

No, it''s ignorant attitudes like yours that will put another greedmonger republican into the white house. Being gay is not a choice and it''s not a lifestyle. Learn the facts.

[croft777]

You know, If *** want to marry let them marry, but....and I mean but...in a different manner. You know the churches are against it. It does say about *** in the bible, and we all know how God feels about that issue. Gods name shouldn''t be brought up when theres a marriage with gay people, thats just not right. But for financial security, let them have it. Its no place for us to judge, God will.

[kansas1946]

You know, If *** want to marry let them marry, but....and I mean but...in a different manner. You know the churches are against it. It does say about *** in the bible, and we all know how God feels about that issue. Gods name shouldn''''t be brought up when theres a marriage with gay people, thats just not right. But for financial security, let them have it. Its no place for us to judge, God will.


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Posted by croft777
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I think people are confusing marriage in the case of same s e x couples and marriage as people view it religiously. Marriage as viewed by the state is a legal contract that confers certain benefits, such as tax structure, how social security is handles, property, end of life issues, etc. Many thousands of heterosexual couples get married outside of church because they choose not to have a religious ceremony. No one is going to force a church to marry anyone they don''t want to.

G a y couples just want the same protections for their families that other couples have.

[kansas1946]

Dr. Paul Cameron, founder of the Family Research Institute in Colorado.
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LMAO. What a joke. I would be embarassed to quote this quack, which has nothing to do with the argument at hand, which is equal benefits for gay families. This is a financial issue. Has nothing to do with "forcing" any lifestyle down anybody''s throat. (no pun intended) I am 62 years old and no one has ever in my life tried to force me to be gay.

[kansas1946]

And remember, speaking out against a lifestyle you believe to be immoral IS NOT hating anyone. It''''s simply utilizing your Constitutional rights to speak out.

And guess what, us CHRISTIANS Have just as much of a right to speak out as does everyone else.

The minute that right is taken away from us, is the minute our Constitution goes to the shredder.


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Posted by singinrick at 12:20 AM : Jan 26, 2008
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No one said that you can''t voice your disapproval. As a Christian, you probably don''t approve of alchohol either, but would you deny people social security benefits because they had wine with dinner, or because they were of a different faith than you. Approving of something is one thing, but to try to deny people and their families protections, through legislation, because you don''t approve of them is another.

[Dnmdaman]

How ironic that when people want to talk about murders that they seem to alway put somthing about how G/A/Y/S being the cause looking at a list like this makes me think other wise seeing that each person on the list was in fact STRAIGHT..

Profile of Serial Killer Jeffrey Dahmer
Jeffrey Dahmer was responsible for a series of gruesome murders of seventeen young men in Ohio and Milwaukee.
Serial Killers Couple Ray and Faye Copeland
Why Ray and Faye Copeland, both in their 70s, went from being loving grandparents to serial killers who used the clothing of their victims to make a warm winter quilt to snuggle under is a story both morbid and perplexing.
Dean Corll and the Houston Mass Murders
Dean Corll was a 33-year-old electrician living in Houston, Texas, who, with two teen accomplices, was responsible for kidnapping, torturing, raping and murdering at least 27 young boys in Houston in the early 1970s.
Profile of Serial Killer Alton Coleman
Accompanied by his girlfriend Debra Brown, Alton Coleman went on a six-state raping and killing spree in 1984.
Profile of Serial Killer Richard Chase
When looking into the life of Richard Chase, one can only wonder who is to blame for the six people he savagely murdered. His parents and health officials considered him sane enough to live freely. Yet, early on in his life, Chase was displaying severe abnormal and dangerous behavior.

[Dnmdaman]

Because If you read up on them each of the murderers had a girlfriend or a wife.. except they had a perverted insight... being g/a/y doesnt do that to you so what is that to say about straight people.

[candide777]

And I don''''t take back that statement either, because you are trying to ram your lifestyle down people''''s throats.
Posted by singinrick at 12:00 AM : Jan 26, 2008

Rick, you''re bearing false witness again. The Ten Commandments say nothing about being ga_y, but they do forbid you from bearing false witness against your neighbor, so I fear there is a special place in hell for you.

Name one way that I am trying to "ram" my lifestyle down your throat. You can''t. You, on the other hand, are denying me the same rights that you enjoy as a heterosexual. No, Rick, it is you who are trying to "ram" your un-christian values down my throat. Remeber, Rick, "do unto others as you would have them do unto you." You see, you talk about Christianity, but I live more like a Christian than you do. I would never push an agenda aimed at denying heterosexuals equal protection under the law, but you''ve devoted your life to it, it seems. You are evil and unfair to the core, plain and simple.

Oh, and for every gay murderer or pedophile you can name, I can name about a thousand straight ones, but that''s not the point. You couldn''t construct a logical argument against gay_s to save your life, so instead you resort to mudslinging. I, like most gay_s, have never murdered anyone nor ever molested a child, so you have no justification for denying me my civil rights -- you are a hateful bigot, pure and simple.

[candide777]

-It is a choice and there are plenty of ex-*** who have made the CHOICE to leave the lifestyle. It happens all the time.
Learn the facts.
Posted by singinrick at 11:57 PM : Jan 25, 2008

Silly, Rick, there you go again. If it were a choice, you wouldn''t have gay teens committing suicide because of the hateful environment for gay_s that people like you promote. They''d simply choose not to be gay if it were that easy. Furthermore, Rick, unless you yourself are gay, you have absolutely no idea as to whether it is a choice or not, so the best you can say on that topic is that you don''t know and are merely speculating. The fact that you''ve used the fires of hell to scare a very small minority of very troubled individuals (troubled thanks to liars like yourself who equate gay with murdering and pedophilia) proves nothing at all. That''s like saying Michael Jackson is proof that being black is a choice. But keep the hate and lies comin, rick, it just proves my point.

[candide777]

-Seems like you''''re the one filled with hatred and bigorty, not me. You are bigoted towards anyone who believes that homosexuality is wrong. (which would be the majority of our population and most of the 50 states in our union)
Posted by singinrick at 11:59 PM : Jan 25, 2008

No Rick, I only hate people like yourself who lie and distort the facts because you are so threatened by the very possibility that being gay is as natural as being left-handed. That idea so threatens the foundation of your entire belief system that rather than reconsider that belief system you turn into a pathological liar. There is no proven correlation between being gay and being a murderer, and yet you promote that lie every opportunity you have. Why is that Rick? Actually, the fact that *** work, pay taxes, and are then denied equal rights by the likes of cowards like you makes is surprising that more gay_s don''t take up arms and go after hateful and cowardly bigots like you. I guess there is something about being gay that just makes you morally superior to a coward.

[heartlight3]

Mr. Obama has said repeatedly from the beginning that he believes in talking to those he agrees with and those he does not agree with. That is one of the refreshing and hopeful things I like about him. He obviously supports gay rights, and I don''t see that associating with people who don''t changes that. How do you expect to positively influence someone if you refuse to interact with them or only interact with them in a negative way? The difference between republicans and democrats is that republicans believe competition is the answer and democrats believe co-operation is the answer.