Sparks Fly In Democratic Debate

In Nevada, Presidential Hopefuls Spar Over Health Care And Foreign Policy, Accuse Rivals Of Mudslinging

(CBS/AP)  Under pressure in a feisty debate, Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton accused her closest rivals Thursday night of slinging mud "right out of the Republican playbook" and leveled her sharpest criticism of the campaign at their records.

"People are not attacking me because I'm a woman, they're attacking me because I'm ahead," Clinton said, striving to protect her standing as front-runner in an increasingly competitive nominating campaign.

"What the American people are looking for right now is straight answers to tough questions, and that is not what we have seen from Senator Clinton on a host of issues," said Sen. Barack Obama of Illinois in the opening moments of a debate seven weeks before the first contest of the race for the Democratic presidential nomination.

"There's nothing personal about this," said former Sen. John Edwards of North Carolina, who joined Obama in bluntly accusing Clinton of forever switching positions on Social Security, driver's licenses for illegal immigrants and other issues, turning aside the suggestion that she was seeking to hide her positions. Long an advocate of universal health care, she said Obama's current proposal leaves millions uncovered and that Edwards did not support health care for all when he first ran for president in 2004.

The three-way confrontation at the beginning of a lengthy debate reduced the other Democratic presidential hopefuls on the debate stage to the uncomfortable role of spectator, yet it perfectly captured the race for the party's nomination. Clinton leads in the nationwide polls, but recent surveys in Iowa show she is in a virtual dead heat with Obama and Edwards.

“This is the first time in these debates that Clinton has directly engaged and responded to the criticism from her opponents and she did so to great effect,” said CBSNews.com senior political editor Vaughn Ververs. “She managed to regain some of the certainty she has exuded for most of this campaign. But this remains a tight race in the crucial state of Iowa and that is not likely to change as a result of tonight’s debate.” (Read more debate analysis from Vaughn Ververs in Horserace.)

For New Mexico Gov. Bill Richardson, Sens. Joe Biden of Delaware and Chris Dodd of Connecticut and Rep. Dennis Kucinich of Ohio, the opening moments were frustrating - and they repeatedly tried to break in.

"Oh, no, don't make me speak," Biden said in mock horror when moderator Wolf Blitzer of CNN called on him roughly 15 minutes into the proceedings.

Richardson, who has campaigned in Nevada more than any other presidential hopeful, took verbal shots at Clinton and her two closest pursuers in the polls.

"Let's stop the mudslinging," he said.

He said Edwards is engaging in class warfare, Obama was trying to start a generational war and Clinton "with all due respect with her plan on Iraq doesn't end the war. All I want to do is give peace a chance."

Richardson was in the minority when the candidates were asked whether human rights could ever trump national security.

He said it could; Clinton said it could not, and Dodd said "obviously national security." Obama challenged the question, saying "the concepts are not contradictory."

Clinton seemed intent on redeeming what even she conceded was a sub-par performance at the previous debate, turning aside criticism from her rivals and answering questions with practiced ease.

Asked whether she was guilty of playing the "gender card" in her drive to become the first female president, she said she had not.

"I'm not playing the gender card here in Las Vegas," a magnet for gamblers. "I'm trying to play the winning card," she said.

Obama was the first to challenge Clinton, saying it took two weeks to "get a clear answer" on whether she supports or opposes issuing driver's licenses for illegal immigrants. "The same is true on Social Security," he said.

For the first time in a debate since the campaign began, Clinton swiftly answered in kind. "When it came time to step up and decide whether or not he would support universal health care coverage he chose not to do that," she said of Obama. She added his plan would leave 15 million people without coverage - the population of Iowa and three other early voting states in the nominating campaign.

Edwards was next to accuse Clinton of trying to have it both ways - with the war in Iraq, Social Security and defining the scope of President Bush's power to use military force against Iran. "She says she will bring change to Washington while she continues to defend a system that does not work, that is broken, that is rigged, that is corrupt," added the former North Carolina senator.

"I've just been personally attacked again," Clinton broke in. "I don't mind taking hits on my record on issues, but when somebody starts throwing mud at least we can hope it's accurate and not right out of the Republican playbook."

The debate unfolded on a stage at the University of Nevada-Las Vegas. The state holds caucuses on Jan. 19 - following Iowa on Jan. 3 and most likely the New Hampshire primary several days later.

The focus on Clinton from the debate's opening moments was hardly surprising.

The New York senator herself has conceded she turned in a sub-par performance at the last debate, when she stumbled on a question about driver's licenses for illegal immigrants. Her husband, the former president, leapt to her defense in the interim, saying of her rivals: "Those boys have been getting tough on her lately."

The setting underscored Nevada's newly prominent role in the nominating process. The state is far more racially diverse than either Iowa or New Hampshire, with a population that is about 22 percent Hispanic and 10 percent black.

Democrats in Nevada hoped the focus on their state would prompt candidates to pay closer heed to Western issues like water, grazing and mining rights.

But it was more than an hour into the two-hour debate before the issue of energy came up.

Instead, Clinton drew the first question - and moments later the first barb from Obama.

Despite her critics, she said, "I think the American people know where I've stood for 35 years," adding she had been fighting for children, workers, families and universal health care.

More than an hour later, Dodd sought to turn the focus back onto Clinton, saying she had changed positions on trade by announcing her support for a deal with Peru at the same time she advocates a "time out" for such agreements.

Moments earlier, Clinton gave a careful answer when asked whether she now viewed the North American Free Trade Agreement - a product of her husband's administration - to be a mistake.

"NAFTA is a mistake to the extent it did not deliver what we hoped it would," she said.

And she fielded another question about NAFTA with a quip. Asked whether she now believes Ross Perot when he argued against NAFTA in a 1993 debate with her husband's vice president, Al Gore, she said: "All I can remember from that is a bunch of charts," a reference to Perot's penchant for presenting information in made-for-television format.

[candide777]

"she gave a muddy series of answers on the subject of giving driver''s licenses to illegal immigrants. On Wednesday, the eve of the Las Vegas debate, she said unequivocally that she did not support the idea."

Too late, our lazy media is going to beat this dead horse into its sub-atomic particles. Just wait and see, we''ll be hearing about this one until she''s sworn in. Meanwhile, don''t expect the media to report on anything of substance. Our so-called journalists checked out a long time ago.

[baghdadshere]

Giuliani mocks Clintoon.
"Dont pick on me by asking that question. Thats a gotcha question. Do not pick on me for asking that question. Now let me see what I think... Let me see... First put up your hands and tell me what you think. Then Ill tell you what I think. Are you for it or against it? Ok, youre not gonna tell me. So Im for it, for it. I am against it. I''m for it and against it. And I wanna be your president."
"Okay, all kidding aside, I am against it," he said. "Its a terrible mistake. You dont give drivers licenses to illegal immigrants."
"If you cant take a position on drivers licenses, what the heck are you gonna do about war and peace, and difficult decisions in crisis?" he added returning his attention to the Democratic frontrunner.

[baghdadshere]

ABC.com

Democratic presidential hopeful, Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton, D-N.Y., speaks about her health care policy on Sept. 18, 2007. An examination of Clinton''s fundraising donors reveals three donors were pardoned by President Clinton when he was in office. (Charlie Neibergall/AP Photo)

[hawksprings]

...the first debate "out West"????
What''s that supposed to mean, "out West"?
The 120 Million+ of us who live west of the Mississippi don''t consider ourselves "out West".

Nothing like objective journalism, not showing your bias or perceptions, is there.

"out West", good grief.

Why do they have so many of the debates "out East?"

[lastmoment-2009]

RON PAUL FIGHTS BIG PHARMA
People have gotten wise to the fact that vaccines are contaminated with DNA fragments, viruses, fungus, mercury, and a cocktail of other poisonous toxins. Fleets of reputable studies have been published globally detailing the wide swaths of destruction caused by vaccines, including autism. So, now the establishment is on the offensive, attempting to bully us into submission. Big Pharma is one of the biggest businesses in the world. It is among the top three purchasers of advertisement in print, TV and radio. Thay have major pull. President Bush recently vetoed a Bill which would have forced Big Pharma to remove mercury from vaccines. If that''s not bad enough, parts of the so-called Patriot Act contains provisions that essentialy removes the spectre of civil liability against Big Pharma with respect to vaccines. This was done under the quise of protecting Big Pharma in case they had to quickly develop a vaccine to combat some form of biological terrorism. No other candidate understands health issues as well as Ron Paul does. He not only supported the Bill which would have removed mercury from our vaccines, he voted against the Patriot Act as well. Dr. Paul., an OB/GYN physician, who has delivered over 4,000 babies, has been the national leader in preserving our Health Freedom. He feels that Americans are justifiably concerned over the government''s escalating intervention into our freedom to choose what we eat and how we take care of our health.

[lastmoment-2009]

DR RON PAUL UNDERSTANDS HEALTH CARE
Dr. Ron Paul., an OB/GYN physician, has been the national leader in preserving our Health Freedom. He feels that Americans are justifiably concerned over the government''s escalating intervention into their freedom to choose what they eat and how they take care of their health. The Food and Drug Administration (FDA), in order to comply with standards dictated by supra-national organizations such as the UN''s World Food Code (CODEX), NAFTA, and CAFTA, has been assuming greater control over nutrients, vitamins and natural health care providers to restrict your right to choose the manner in which you manage your health and nutritional needs. He introduced the Health Freedom Protection Act, HR 2117, to ensure Americans can receive truthful health information about supplements and natural remedies. He supports the Access to Medical Treatment Act, H.R. 2717, which expands the ability of Americans to use alternative medicine and new treatments. He opposes legislation that increases the FDA''s legal powers. The FDA has consistently failed to protect the public from dangerous drugs, genetically modified foods, dangerous pesticides and other chemicals in the food supply. Meanwhile, they waste public funds attacking safe, healthy foods and dietary supplements. He also opposed the Homeland Security Bill, which, in section 304, authorizes the forced vaccination of American citizens. The government should never have that kind of power. Vote YES for Dr. No.

[lastmoment-2009]

RON PAUL WILL PRESERVE SOCIAL SECURITY
Our nation''s promise to its seniors, once considered a sacred trust, has become little more than a tool for politicians to scare retirees while robbing them of their promised benefits to pay for militarization. Today, the Social Security system is both broke and broken. Those in the system are seeing their benefits dwindle due to higher taxes, increasing inflation, and irresponsible military spending. The proposed solutions, ranging from lower benefits to higher taxes to increasing the age of eligibility, are NOT solutions; they are betrayals. Imposing any tax on Social Security benefits is unfair and illogical. In Congress, Dr. Paul introduced the Senior Citizens Tax Elimination Act, which repeals ALL taxes on Social Security benefits, to eliminate political theft of our seniors'' income and raise their standard of living. Solvency is the key to keeping our promise to our seniors, and he introduced the Social Security Preservation Act (H.R. 219) to ensure that money paid into the system is ONLY used for Social Security. Also, it is fundamentally unfair to give benefits to anyone who has not paid into the system. The Social Security for Americans Only Act, which Ron Paul supported, ends the drain on Social Security caused by illegal aliens seeking the fruits of your labor. In short, if we stop our runaway military spending overseas, there will be plenty of money available to keep Social Security solvent for decades to come.

[lastmoment-2009]

RON PAUL: A GUN OWNER''S BEST FRIEND
Like Ron Paul, I share our Founders'' belief that in a free society each citizen must have the right to keep and bear arms. They ratified the Second Amendment knowing that this right is the guardian of every other right, and they all would be horrified by the proliferation of unconstitutional legislation that prevents Law-abiding Americans from exercising this right. Congressman, Paul has always supported the Second Amendment and these are some of the Bills he introduced in the current Congress to help restore respect for it: H.R. 1096 includes provisions repealing the Brady Handgun Violence Prevention Act and the Federal Firearms License Reform Act, two invasive and unconstitutional Bills. H.R. 1897 would end the ban on carrying a firearm in the National Park System, restoring Americans'' ability to protect themselves in potentially hazardous situations. H.R. 3305 would allow pilots and specially assigned personnel to carry firearms in order to protect airline passengers, possibly preventing future 9/11-style attacks. H.R. 1146 would end our membership in the United Nations, protecting us from their attempts to tax our guns or disarm us entirely. In the past, he introduced legislation to repeal the so-called assault weapons ban before its 2004 sunset, and he has opposed all attempts to reinstate it. Congessman, Paul also recently opposed H.R. 2640, which would allow government-appointed psychiatrists to ban veterans experiencing any form of PTSD.

[lastmoment-2009]

RON PAUL TAKES ON FEDERAL RESERVE CHAIRMAN
Federal Reserve Chairman Ben Bernanke appeared before the Congressional Joint Economic Committee Chairman, Congressman Ron Paul on November 8th, and had to face some tough criticism concerning the fact that the Fed has been increasing the money supply while at the same time refusing to raise the Prime Interest Rate in order to curb inflation and devaluation of the Dollar. Paul accused the Federal Reserve of "robbery," telling Bernanke, "There''s a dollar crisis out there and people''s money is being stolen," Paul said. "People who have saved, they''re being robbed. I mean, if you have a devaluation of the dollar at 10 percent, people have been robbed of 10 percent." Federal Reserve Chairman Ben Bernanke attempted to dispel that notion by explaining, "If somebody has their wealth in dollars and they''re going to buy consumer goods in dollars, then the only effect it has on their buying power is that it makes imported goods more expensive." Paul disagreed, reminding Bernanke, "Yeah, but not if you''re elderly and you have your wealth in CDs. Their cost of living is going-up no matter what your CPI says," adding finally, "Their cost of living is going up, and they''re hurting. And that''s why the people of this country are very upset."

[lastmoment-2009]

RON PAUL IS THE TAXPAYER''S BEST FRIEND
If he is elected President, Ron Paul will work to abolish the Federal Reserve System as well as the IRS, returning our country to the Gold Standard. He believes, as I do, that our current Income Tax System is unconstitutional, because it is a direct tax that is not equally apportioned as The Constitution requires. Whenever taxes are raised by the federal government, it should be done as The Constitution does require--in an indirect way, which is equally apportioned. This system would benefit all of us, creating more individual wealth, and allowing us to make more decisions for ourselves about our lives. As President, Ron Paul will also work to abolish the Federal Reserve, a group of private banks, run by unelected officials, which loans our government unbacked money which they are allowed to essentially print out of thin air, making each dollar in your pocket worth less all the time, and increasing our national debt to these banks. Worse still. Most of our debt is owned by China (25%) and Saudi Arabia who finance our runaway military spending overseas. This is a threat to our nation. We need to bring our troops home from overseas, and use the trillions we would save thereby to reduce our debt, and to re-invigorate our currency. We can use this money to ensure that Social Security and other essential programs will still be solvent in the future. Vote for Ron Paul. He''s published three books on the topic of sound economics. ronpaullibrary.org

[lastmoment-2009]

RON PAUL KNOWS HOW TO STOP ILLEGAL IMMIGRATION
The talk must stop. We must secure our borders now. A nation without secure borders is no nation at all. It makes no sense to fight terrorists abroad when our own front door is left unlocked. Ron Paul has a plan: (1.) Physically secure our borders and coastlines. We must do whatever it takes to control entry into our country before we undertake complicated immigration reform proposals. (2.) Enforce Visa rules. Immigration officials must track Visa holders and deport anyone who overstays their Visa or otherwise violates U.S. Law. This is especially important when we recall that a number of 9/11 terrorists had expired Visas. (3.) No amnesty. Estimates suggest that 10 to 20 million people are in our country illegally. That''s a lot of people to reward for breaking our Laws. (4.) No welfare for illegal aliens. Americans have welcomed immigrants who seek opportunity, work hard, and play by the rules, but taxpayers should not pay for illegal immigrants who use hospitals, clinics, schools, roads, and social services. (5.) End birthright citizenship. As long as illegal immigrants know their children born here will be citizens, the incentive to enter the U.S. illegally will remain strong. (6.) Pass true immigration reform. The current system, and those proposed by ALL other candidates, is incoherent and unfair, and would allow up to 60 million more immigrants into our country.

[actiscenei]

Kucinich is the only Democrat with a spine, a vision, and a cause bigger than himself.

[iceman_1960]

RE: Post by billysmith6 at 06:06 PM : Nov 15, 2007

You"ll be a real Adonis at 60, no doubt.

[gkc99]

"An examination of Clinton''''s fundraising donors reveals three donors were pardoned by President Clinton when he was in office. (Charlie Neibergall/AP Photo"--Posted by BaghdadsHere


So what? A Repug president pardoned a Repug ex-president who committed numerous Constitutional violations and felonies!

[iceman_1960]

"Thursday''s debate is on CNN at 8 p.m. EST."

If you don"t have cable, it will be covered by live video at www.cnn.com

The debate is being preceded by a live "cage" wrestling match between Ron Paul and "Big Pharma"

Don"t miss it.

[seven_pesos]

not one red state will vote for hillary.

the red states prefer upstanding, christian , faith professing republicans

and top notch leadership like george bush, jr.

the red states would like to find another prez like george bush. jr.

the red states are considering drafting rush limbaugh to be the republican candidate.

he has all the qualifications...

fat, bigoted, republican, christian, drug user, demogogue.

oh well, that''s the red states for you, folks!

[xlib]

gkc99-That''s right, if a Republican does something it''s awful. If a dem does something, like the ultra corrupt clinton''s that''s ok because....... It''s incredible how you libs think. While you at it, how about those thousands of FBI files the madame had. And you complain about Watergate??!! I always did like lynardskynard.
Now, madame clinton will come off steller tonight. After all, the war room full of clinton ex cons made sure of that. No asking "personal" questions of a would be president like "what''s your stand on drivers licenses for illegal invaders", nope don''t ask anything like that. And be sure to tell the madame how thin she looks in her pant suit. After all, you can''t treat her like a guy, she''s just a little woman (who will rip your lungs out with her bare teeth).
It is amazing how you libs think, absolutely amazing.

[megaprophet]

POLLSTERS ARTIFICIALLY SKEWING RESULTS
Ron Paul breaks fundraising records, wins phone-in and Internet polls, yet why are his national poll numbers so low? A Zogby pollee recently revealed what happened to him when he took part in their national, 2008 presidential election poll. Upon confirming Ron Paul as his choice for President, the poll then branched out into a myriad of bizarre and intrusive questions which would discourage most people from completing the process, and thereby making their vote for Ron Paul null and void. "The first part of the poll was about which candidate one prefers, with candidates from both parties being available as choices. Great! However, after I finished answering positively for Ron Paul, the poll got very interesting," he writes. "As anyone who is familiar with how polls work is aware, polls are branching in their structure. Answers you give to one section of the poll will determine what questions you will receive in the next section of the poll." The pollee then relates his confusion about the fact that the poll threw up 20 questions about cooking rice before another extensive set of questions regarding personal sexual behavior. "This went on for a number of pages and was rather intrusive," he said. "It dealt with sexual positions, sexual fantasies, sexual preferences and similar intimate subjects. Of course neither rice cooking or sexual behavior have anything to do with presidential elections or politics in general. Or at least it shouldn''t!"

[megaprophet]

CBS NEWS CONDUCTING RIGGED POLLS
Most people can see right through the prejudice CBS News obviously has towards Ron Paul. In the few times they''ve covered him at all, I''m suprised they didn''t have one of their graphics artists Photoshop some devil horns on top of his head in that worst ever photograph they always use of him. CBS obviously thinks that if they pretend Paul isn''t a top-tier GOP candidate, then their readers and viewers will eventually think so too. Whenever they are forced to do a story on Paul, because some other mainstream source is covering him for some reason, the fact that their editors work overtime to slant their stories in such a way as to either marginalize his accomplishment, or present Paul in the most negative light possible, is obvious to anyone with a modicum of intelligence. "What about their polls?," you ask? As far as the CBS News poll is concerned, they don''t even include Paul on the list of GOP candidates which pollees can choose from, and then afterwards, report to you that Paul doesn''t even rank in their final tally. Ron Paul is getting major grass roots support nationwide. He has over 62,380 meetup group members in 1,175 Groups from 1,004 cities nationwide, with another 7,197 people more folks just waiting to hear when a new meetup group will start-up near them. He''s won ALL of the viewer phone-in polls in ALL of the GOP debates he''s been in, and has raised more money ($4.2 million) in one day than any other GOP candidate ever. Go Ron Go!

[megaprophet]

RON PAUL CAN WIN THE ELECTION
Ron Paul can win the GOP nomination. If he does, I predict a landslide victory in November of 2008. Even the oddsmakers in Vegas aren''t willing to discount his chances. They''re currently giving him 2:1 odds to win against Hitlery if he gets the nomination. Romney, McCain and the globalist, sell-out Giuliani aren''t given anything better than a 45:1 chance of winning if they get the GOP nod. All it takes is for formerly apathetic individuals to get off the couch and nominate him in their local Republican primary or caucus process. Political parties are nothing more than tools. Those who read the manual and use the tools properly will win the nomination for their candidate. For the past 20 years, many good people have stayed at home and accepted whatever candidate they let others select for them. This year, those people are learning how to use their vote to make a difference. In order to do so, you must participate in the Republican primary election or caucus process in your county, precinct or district. Nothing else matters. If we do this, we win. If not, we lose. The GOP has been suffering from declining participation for decades. Fewer than 10% of registered voters have ALL the power because they actually participate. Now the remaining 90% must surge to use their vote as a tool to bring about positive and long overdue political change in this country. The time to act is now. The time for political revolution has come. The time for Ron Paul is NOW!

[iceman_1960]

RE: "not one red state will vote for hillary."

No, by definition. If it voted for Hillary it would be a blue state.

[tylenol6]

On the question of driver''s licenses for illegal immigrants Hitlery says, yes, no, yes, no, yes, no,
yes, no and tonight the answer is no. Whew!!!!! Finally
an answer. I think HITLERY is finished......Tommorrow though she may say yes.

[megaprophet]

RON PAUL FAVORS NON-INTERVENTIONIST FOREIGN POLICY
All of the other presidential candidates wants to continue our illegal police action in Iraq indefinitely, and they do not rule out a preemptive (nuclear) first strike against Iran. Conversely, Ron Paul voted against our (undeclared) war in Iraq, which was sold to us with lies. The area is more dangerous now than when we entered it. We destroyed a regime hated by our direct enemies--the jihadists, and created thousands of new recruits for them. The war in Iraq has cost more than 3,500 American lives and almost a trillion dollars. We need a leader in the White House who will ensure this never happens again. Both Jefferson and Washington warned us about entangling ourselves in the affairs of other nations. Today, we have 750 foreign bases and troops in 130 countries. We are spread so thin that we have too few troops defending America. And now, there are new calls for a draft. We can continue to fund and fight no-win police actions around the globe, or we can refocus on securing our borders against illegal aliens who are invading us from the South. No war should ever be fought without a Declaration of War voted upon by the Congress, as required by The Constitution. Under no circumstances should the U.S. again go to war as the result of a resolution that comes from an unelected, foreign body, such as the United Nations. Too often, we give foreign aid and intervene on behalf of governments that are despised. Then, we become despised.

[a8151947]

Ron Paul is a no body. Just like you.
With that out of the way. I am voting for the lady, I think she is better they a------and a--------. She is not done, Keep trying.I would like to know what you are going to say when she wins. She will win and I''ll be here to let you all know.

[megaprophet]

RON PAUL IS THE NEW WAY
What we need is a President who will show us the way. Not the old way. Not the same way, but a NEW way. Think about this for a minute. What if we pulled all of our troops out of South Korea? They''ve been there for 50+ years. What if we quit worrying about Iran, but instead, realized that its having a nuclear weapon will not mean the end of the world? What if we pulled all of our troops out of the Middle-East, and brought them all home? What if we realistically addressed the National Debt, and paid attention to REALLY DOING SOMETHING about stopping illegal immigration? These are the ideas of Presidential candidate, Ron Paul. He''s a ten term Congressman and a physician who has delivered over 4,000 babies. He''s an intellectual who''s published four books, three of which are devoted entirely to sound economics and one to foreign policy. He was raised on a dairy farm in Pennsylvania as a pious Lutheran, but now he attends a Baptist church. Paul is given to mulling things over morally. Whenever he recollects the helicopter pilots he treated as an Air Force Flight Surgeon (Captain) during the Vietnam War, a war which he now says was "totally unnecessary and illegal," he laments, "They were gung-ho. I''ve often thought about how many of those people never came back." Candidates with the high level of personal integrity and proven track record of adherence to The Constitution, Congressman Paul has always demonstrated only come around once in a lifetime, if we''re lucky.

[downtowner97]

So who do you think will win the Superbowl? I don''t mean the next one, but the one after that.

This is all too early for me. Talking about the election now is like seeing Christmas decorations in the stores before Halloween. It just makes me cringe.

[megaprophet]

RON PAUL WILL RESTORE U.S. SOVEREIGNTY
All of the trade deals and world government organizations, which all of the presidential candidates support (except Ron Paul), such as the ICC, NAFTA, GATT, WTO, and CAFTA, are all a major threat to our nation''s sovereignty. They transfer power from our government to unelected foreign elites. The ICC wants to try our soldiers as war criminals. Both the WTO and CAFTA could force Americans to get a prescription to take herbs and vitamins. The WTO has forced Congress to change our laws to meet their needs, and not our own. If anything, the WTO makes trade relations worse by giving foreign competitors a new way to attack U.S. jobs. The NAFTA superhighway, being built by a Spanish company, is just one part of a plan to erase our borders and create the North American Union, a single nation State like the EU, out of Canada, the U.S. and Mexico, with a new, unelected bureaucracy and money system. Forget about controlling immigration under the NAU scheme. There won''t be any borders anymore, or a free America. Our limited, constitutional government will be gone forever. Let''s not forget the UN either. It wants to impose a direct Carbon Tax on us. Ron Paul successfully fought this move in Congress last year, but if we are going to stop ongoing attempts of this world government body to rule over us, we need someone in the White House who knows how to say "No." We must withdraw from any organizations or treaty that infringes upon our nation''s sovereignty.

[megaprophet]

RON PAUL KNOWS HOW TO STOP ILLEGAL IMMIGRATION
The talk must stop. We must secure our borders now. A nation without secure borders is no nation at all. It makes no sense to fight terrorists abroad when our own front door is left unlocked. Ron Paul has a plan: (1.) Physically secure our borders and coastlines. We must do whatever it takes to control entry into our country before we undertake complicated immigration reform proposals. (2.) Enforce Visa rules. Immigration officials must track Visa holders and deport anyone who overstays their Visa or otherwise violates U.S. Law. This is especially important when we recall that a number of 9/11 terrorists had expired Visas. (3.) No amnesty. Estimates suggest that 10 to 20 million people are in our country illegally. That''s a lot of people to reward for breaking our Laws. (4.) No welfare for illegal aliens. Americans have welcomed immigrants who seek opportunity, work hard, and play by the rules, but taxpayers should not pay for illegal immigrants who use hospitals, clinics, schools, roads, and social services. (5.) End birthright citizenship. As long as illegal immigrants know their children born here will be citizens, the incentive to enter the U.S. illegally will remain strong. (6.) Pass true immigration reform. The current system, and those proposed by ALL other candidates, is incoherent and unfair, and would allow up to 60 million more immigrants into our country.

[megaprophet]

WILL THIS POST SOON BE A THOUGHT CRIME?
While CBS was busy pretending all other news didn''t exist during the California wildfires, our Constitution was burning on the floors of Congress. On Oct 23, the House overwhelmingly passed HR 1955, the Violent Radicalization and Homegrown Terrorism Prevention Act. This Bill is one of the most blatant attacks against our right to freedom of speech ever devised by Congress. The Bill actually defines different types of thought as "homegrown terrorism," and unlike previous anti-terror legislation, it specifically targets U.S. citizens. The Bill uses extremely vague language to define "terrorist propoganda" as any speech which promotes an agenda that the government considers an "extremist belief system." Since the bill doesn%u2019t specifically define what an "extremist belief system" is, it will be entirely up to the interpretation of government officials. Isn''t that comforting? Considering how much the government has done to desecrate our Constitution lately, they would surely have to define this post as promoting an "extremist belief" system, since it promotes the restoration of civil liberties--something not en vogue these days. As disturbing as this Bill is, so to is the additional requirement that there be a seperate, "public version." In other words, the Bill we see is different from what Congress is seeing. Why''s that necessary? Whatever the reason, I predict this Bill will become Law soon while CBS focuses the country''s attention elsewhere

[formrusmcsgt]

If he does, I predict a landslide victory in November of 2008.

Posted by MegaProphet at 08:28 PM : Nov 15, 2007

You are nothing but a spam generator. Who cares about your opinion?

[megaprophet]

WERE HAVING A TEA PARTY! YOU''RE INVITED
As we all know, freedom isn''t free in this country. Therefore, in the wake of our successful fundraising event of November 5th, in which we all came together to raise $4.2 million dollars for Ron Paul''s campaign, we''ve set yet another date for an even bigger fundraiser. This one will take place during on December 16th: a very important date for people who love freedom and hate tyranny to ring the Liberty Bell, and let our sold-out, globalist, political ****** and their mainstream media enablers know that good Americans are mad as hell, and that we''re not going to take it anymore. December 16th is the 224th aniversary of The Boston Tea Party: an act of protest by the American colonists against the tyranny of Great Britain where the Sons of Liberty boarded British ships and dumped crates of tea overboard into Boston Harbor. It was a key event which helped to spark the American Revolution, and we hope this event will, likewise, add additional spark to our own 21st Century political revolution to restore peace, prosperity and freedom to our Republic by helping elect a President whose record of adherance to The Constitution is unmatched by anyone in American politics. Please join us this December 16th for the largest one-day political donation event in history. Our goal is to bring together 100,000 people to donate $100 each, creating a one day donation total of $10,000,000. The time to act is now. The time for Ron Paul is NOW! TeaParty07.com

[megaprophet]

ARE WE A NATION OF LAWS?
Consider the Patriot Act. The Law is 342 pages long, or 57,000 words, making it a bit longer than Dostoevsky''s "Notes from Underground" or, if you''re partial to pigs, about twice the size of Orwell''s "Animal Farm." The Patriot Act is the reigning champion of our government''s recent un-American activities. When it was first paraded before Congress and the Senate following the 9/11 attacks, few Members, other than Congressman, Ron Paul dared to vote against it. Most in Congress simply gave it their rubber-stamp of approval, without ever reading it. Why bother? It was, after all, named the "USA Patriot Act." It must be a good thing. Right? Now in effect, the Law wrecks a generation''s worth of constitutional protections against government snooping, legalizing police-state tactics in searches and seizures, criminalizing certain forms of speech and political activity, and opening the way for the mistreatment of foreigners in government custody and wholesale expulsions and imprisonment. It is a repugnant, unnecessary Law that goes against the very principles its name wrongly implies. Yet, it remains unchecked and unbalanced by public opinion, Lawmakers or the Courts. So, yes, we''re a nation of Laws. But the Laws aren''t much to speak of when they''re designed to hoodwink the public to win its docility. Neither is public responsibility much to speak of these days when its docility is secured with nothing more than a ploy-riddled play on the word "patriot."

[formrusmcsgt]

WILL THIS POST SOON BE A THOUGHT CRIME?

Posted by MegaProphet at 09:37 PM : Nov 15, 2007

No, but spamming certainly is. How many names is this for you now, 10? 12?

All because all you do is spam for the Bircher Paul.

[sharncedar]

blah blah blah blah blah Ron Paul voted against the Patriot Acy blah blah blah blah

Posted by MegaProphet at 09:50 PM : Nov 15, 2007

just because he voted against the Patriot Act doesn''t make him smart or a hero or somthing - he is a contrary kind of person who votes against all kinds of legislation. To show that he is smart, you also have to point out examples where he voted FOR somethin that turned out right. He votes against everything, like some crusty old fahrt he is just trying to get attention.

[megaprophet]

CAMPING OUT WITH HALIBURTION
The John Warner Defense Authorization Act, which was supported by Clinton, Obama and McCain, permits militarized police round-ups and detention of protesters ("potential terrorists") and other "undesirables" for detention in facilities which are already contracted for and under construction by Kellog, Brown & Root, a subsidiary of Halliburton. This Law, which was sold to an "emergency managed" and willfully gullible public in the wake of the 9/11 attacks as a necessary measure needed by our President in order to fight his "global war on terrorism," permits the indefinite detention of American citizens who resists the foreign and domestic agenda of our President. The Journal of Counterterrorism & Homeland Security International reported recently that global engineering and technical services powerhouse, Kellog, Brown & Root announced during January 2006 that its Government and Infrastructure division had been awarded a (no bid) Indefinite Delivery/Indefinite Quantity contract to build these detainment camps with a maximum total value of $385 million over a five year term, and that this contract called for the company to build "temporary detention and processing capabilities" to augment existing U.S. government Detention and Removal Operations and to support "the rapid development of new programs." New Programs? Could it possibly get any worse? Why would the president be so concerned about Americans protesting? Aren''t we all happy campers?

[megaprophet]

CLINTON ALLOWS BUSH TO PARDON HIMSELF
Buried deep inside Military Commisions Act, which was FULLY SUPPORTED by Senators Clinton, Obama and McCain, is a provision which pre-pardons President Bush and all the members of his administration for any crimes which they may have committed all the way back to September 11, 2001. Why that far back? That kind of makes you wonder. Huh? I can''t help but recall what Nixon said during an interview following the Watergate scandal when he said, "If the President does it, by definition, it''s not illegal." History never repeats itself, folks. It only rhymes. At least Nixon had enough class to wait for another President to pardon him for his crimes against our country. Bush apparently doesn''t want to take that chance. He has to consider the risk that Ron Paul will become our next President.

[megaprophet]

CLINTON MAKES BUSH DICTATOR
With the full support of Senators Clinton, Obama and McCain, President Bush recently signed into Law the John Warner Defense Authorization Act, which, according to Senator Leahy (VT), will actually "encourage the President to declare Martial Law." It does so by revising the Insurrection Act, a Laws which limits the President''s ability to deploy troops within the United States. The Insurrection Act has historically, along with the Posse Comitatus Act, helped to enforce strict prohibitions on military involvement in domestic Law enforcement. With one cloaked swipe of his pen, Bush has now undone all of those prohibitions. The John Warner Defense Authorization Act, which was signed by the President in an unpublicized ceremony, allows the President to declare a "public emergency," suspend Congress; The Constitution; and to take control of state-based National Guard units without the consent of your Governor or local authorities, in order to "suppress public disorder." President Bush seized this unprecedented power on the very same day that he signed the equally odious Military Commissions Act. The two Laws compliment one another. One allows for torture and detention abroad of those who dissent and are stripped of their citizenship, while the other seeks to enforce acquiescence at home by allowing the President to order the military onto our streets in a domestic Law enforcement role, which is already being done. Vote for Liberty. Vote for Ron Paul.

[megaprophet]

CLINTON MAKES BUSH DICTATOR
With the full support of Senators Clinton, Obama and McCain, President Bush recently signed into Law the John Warner Defense Authorization Act, which, according to Senator Leahy (VT), will actually "encourage the President to declare Martial Law." It does so by revising the Insurrection Act, a Laws which limits the President''s ability to deploy troops within the United States. The Insurrection Act has historically, along with the Posse Comitatus Act, helped to enforce strict prohibitions on military involvement in domestic Law enforcement. With one cloaked swipe of his pen, Bush has now undone all of those prohibitions. The John Warner Defense Authorization Act, which was signed by the President in an unpublicized ceremony, allows the President to declare a "public emergency," suspend Congress; The Constitution; and to take control of state-based National Guard units without the consent of your Governor or local authorities, in order to "suppress public disorder." President Bush seized this unprecedented power on the very same day that he signed the equally odious Military Commissions Act. The two Laws compliment one another. One allows for torture and detention abroad of those who dissent and are stripped of their citizenship, while the other seeks to enforce acquiescence at home by allowing the President to order the military onto our streets in a domestic Law enforcement role, which is already being done. Vote for Liberty. Vote for Ron Paul.

[megaprophet]

YOU''RE A FROG IN A POT
My fellow Americans need to open their eyes to the fact that our Republic, along with The Constitution upon which it was founded, is being flushed-down the toilet by our nations'' bought and paid for politicians and media. While the Oligarchs warn and incite fear in the sheeple about the prospect of terrorism, they at the same time leave our borders wide open, and then conduct illegal wars overseas that do nothing but incite the terrorism which their Orwellian Laws like the Patriot Act and the John Warner Defense Authorization Act pretend to protect us from. Wake up America! It''s not about protecting you from terrorism, or Global Warming, or any of that other fear-mongering garbage the sold-out, mainstream media feeds you 24/7. It''s about feeding the bankers and the military industrial complex, and facilitating the global elite''s ability to ratchet-down control over the American people, placing us into a total control grid where they can surveille, track and control everywhere we go and everything we do. It''s the groundwork for tyranny. It''s the New World Order plan of Bush, Clinton, Edwards, McCain, Giuliani, et.al., being executed quite beautifully. You''re a frog in a pot: In order to cook a frog, you don''t throw him into a pot of boiling water. If you do, he''ll resist and jump-out. What you do instead is, you turn the heat-up REAL SLOW, and by the time the water is boiling, he won''t be able to jump out anymore, because it''s too late--he''s already doomed.

[likeitis5050]

I love the strategy being used to kill Ron Paul''s chances at getting a serious nod by spamming the he11 out of him on the boards. It''s working like a charm. Now, let''s get Hillary out of the way. Spam away!!!

[scartercmu]

Hillary Clinton has proven she can handle the Presidency tonight. She''s taken on Barack Obama, John Edwards and won! I was supporting Barack Obama but now I''m supporting Hillary Clinton, simply because he''s become just as negative as John Edwards.

[iceman_1960]

"RON PAUL FAVORS NON-INTERVENTIONIST FOREIGN POLICY
All of the other presidential candidates wants to continue our illegal police action in Iraq indefinitely, and they do not rule out a preemptive (nuclear) first strike against Iran."
- Posted by MegaProphet at 08:42 PM : Nov 15, 2007

In a related news item:

SYDNEY (AFP) - "Santas in Australia"s largest city have been told not to use Father Christmas"s traditional "h*o h*o h*o" greeting because it may be offensive to women, it was reported Thursday.

Sydney"s Santa Clauses have instead been instructed to say "ha ha ha" instead, the Daily Telegraph reported."

[tmn]

Does RON PAUL dress in women''s clothes and head out at night for fun?

[samthetvcat]

I''m getting tired of these debates that favor the candidate who can best shovel out the rhetoric because it rewards the best used-car salesperson of the bunch, which is clearly Hillary. It''s embarrassing to see her shovel her *** and actually have people eat it up. She claims she''s not going to do a *** thing to secure social security because "she''s for the middle class", yet when Barack attempts to inject the unfortunate reality that this can''t really be done without raising taxes which he''s only going to do to the top 6% of income earners people boo. How on earth does Hillary doing nothing actually benefit the middle class? It doesn''t - it actually jeopardizes the middle class because she''s not willing to alienate the upper class, but she''s smart enough to know people don''t really think past the soundbyte of ''no new taxes'' so she''ll go with that.

Like my IQ is only 150 so I have a hard time keeping up with somebody smart with an ulterior agenda like her . . . I think she knows people with even lower IQ''s don''t even suspect they''re getting duped and she can get away with selling them the Brooklyn Bridge. Ick.

[seven_pesos]

christians are offering eternal bliss in heaven with pat robertson, jerry falwell, jimmy swaggart, tammy fae bakker, ralph reed, ted haggard and other christian leaders...

muslims are offering 72 virgins.

i''m converting to islam.

ha,ha,ha.

red state republican war makers.

want more? just vote republican.

ha,ha,ha.

[Scooter68]

We are really in trouble folks - We have a GOP field of candidates that is spending a great deal of time an money to distance themselves from the current administration and has offered little new in terms of plans or policies. We have DEM field of candidates that can''t make up their minds on who to attack each other, the GOP candidates, or the current administration and oh by the way none of them (GOP or DEM)has a viable plan for the major challenges ahead namely: 1)Immigration/Illegal alien policies, 2) Resolving the Iraq war situation, 3)Balancing national security without compromising individual freedom, 4)Social Security, 5) Tax reform (the full spectrum)

If this comes down to another purely partisan election this country will continue to stagger down a sprialing path to the ashbin for another 4-8.

[seven_pesos]

want more war, hate, christian creeps, death and destruction?...

vote republican!

[pepperp1]

Senator Clinton just knocked Edwards out for the count and Obama needs to move on or is it to late for a future, well really it is and it is unfortunate but he is not a good candidate when he is writing his own answers and he cannot hold his own among his peer group on a stage.

Edwards was boooooooed and rightly so, he needs to take his Rove play book and go home and take care of his wife and family.


So hopefully the WWW Smackdown rumble in Vegas is over for now or until the General and we are all forced to deal with the Republican dirty politics 7 by 24, BRING IT ON wacko righties Senaotr Clinton will clean your clocks as well.

[seven_pesos]

red state republican christians are praying for the troops in iraq...

praying for the rapture...

praying for water in georgia...

praying for george bush, jr....

praying for pat robertson...

and still praying for gawd to save terri schiavo

ha,ha,ha.

i think ya''all are dialing the wrong number

nothing''s working!

[racam_us]

This shows the mindset of the Democrats. They will destroy each other and their chances of electing a Democratic President. At one time I thought Edwards was the person I would cast my vote for, however, I would not vote for him for dogcatcher. I never considered Obama, he is too immature. The rest of them are a joke also.