Local Officials: California Was Unprepared

County Fire Chief Says "It Is An Absolute Fact" That Aircraft Could Have Controlled Fires

(AP)  Unable to slow, much less stop, many of the wildfires that have charred Southern California, some local officials lashed out Tuesday at what they described as state authorities who offered inadequate help and seemed unprepared for a foreseeable disaster.

Most blistering in his critique was the head of Orange County's fire authority, who said a quick deployment of aircraft could have corralled the massive blaze his crews were fighting near heavily populated Irvine.

"It is an absolute fact, had we had more air resources we would have been able to control this fire," Chief Chip Prather told reporters.

His remarks came shortly before Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger praised the rapid deployment of fire crews and equipment across a region where 16 wind-stoked fires were scattered over an area larger than some states. The blazes destroyed nearly 1,500 homes and forced the largest mass evacuation in California history.

Prather said that a dozen firefighters' lives were threatened at one point because too few crews were on the ground. It was not an isolated problem, he suggested, saying the bigger issue was the lack of an overarching scheme to attack several large fires at once.

"What we need to have is a national strategy and a state strategy," he said.

His assessment, echoed by some other firefighters, rekindled a long-running debate over how well California protects itself against a perennial threat.

The state was supposed to be better prepared after a commission made dozens of recommendations following 2003 blazes that killed 24 people and destroyed 3,361 residences. Prather said many recommendations have been ignored, though others, led by Schwarzenegger, said the response was much improved.

"There is much more equipment available, more manpower is available, quicker action," Schwarzenegger said.

Sen. Dianne Feinstein said Wednesday that she had not heard from Prather but would find out about his concerns.

"Everybody wants to help. It is up to the local officials to ask," she told KTLA-TV. "Up to this point no one has called me ... and said, 'Look, we need these, a number of new firefighters.' "

Air tankers and other aircraft couldn't be used at first because of thick smoke and strong winds, but that has changed, she added.

The state's top firefighter said Prather, who was part of a group formed to implement the state commission's recommendations, was misstating the availability of firefighters and equipment. Eight of the state's nine water-dumping helicopters were in Southern California by Sunday, when the first fires began, along with 13 air tankers, said Ruben Grijalva, director of the California Department of Forestry and Fire Protection. Hundreds more firefighters were hired this year.

Grijalva suggested these fires, which have burned the equivalent of about 600 square miles, would have overwhelmed most efforts to fight them.

"I don't believe the kind of additional resources he's talking about would have been capable of containing those fires," Grijalva said. "They are fighting nature here. This is not something that can be easily eliminated with a few additional aircraft or firefighters."

Especially when there's such great need over such a sprawling area.

"With 100 mph winds, you can only do so much," said Dave Gillotte, president of the International Association of Firefighters, Local 1014, which represents members of the Los Angeles County Fire Department.

Los Angeles County firefighters typically would have dispatched engines and firefighters to help out when fires started Monday around Lake Arrowhead. But with blazes near Santa Clarita, in Malibu, and elsewhere, the department already was stretched too thin.

Sometimes, resources haven't arrived as fast as promised.

Crews fighting a fire in San Bernardino County have been vastly understaffed but by Wednesday morning, "we're going to have a lot more resources," said Bob Shidelar, a fire operations branch director in from Sonora to help out.

"Crews, engines, helicopters - they're coming in from all over the country," he said.

Helicopter orders placed Sunday shortly after a fire erupted near the U.S.-Mexico border weren't satisfied until early Tuesday, said Steve Heil, a state commander at the Harris Fire. That's when four National Guard Blackhawk helicopters based at Los Alamitos arrived in San Diego.

Two Navy Seahawks were also flying above San Diego County on Tuesday, but Heil said he was having trouble finding firefighters with qualifications to go up with additional pilots the Navy was offering to help direct water drops.

"We need to have firefighting personnel in the cockpit," Heil said. "We're trying to find firefighters to work with them - once we get more resources we can use them."

On the upside, Heil said military C-130 jets outfitted to fight fires would arrive late Tuesday or Wednesday, rather than on Thursday as he was initially told.

[ocgrandma]

To add to my remarks these are not movie stars these are hard working middle class family & seniors. We pull together. News!My family moved to Rancho Bernardo in 1963 it has grown in size but the news treated a 40 yr old community like it was new . It was not where the fires thatwere a few years ago.No one waited for FEMA or government,people, business donated food water to SD stadium. Hotels dropped the rate let in pets, beaches were opened to campers and food brought by neighbors in the area, we help oursleves. But after a few days same truck came and picked up donated items, yes Mexican not legal caught selling in another part of S.D. When ID was finally asked at the stadium, people left as they were there for the free food, entertainment as no questions were asked. Black,white asian,Indian,Mexican all pulled together always a few bad apples. I am a 60 yr + native and have never seen this many fires at once. Yes we have high home prices not rich, when physicians move to South Orange Co, they compare to the state and prices sticker shock but they come anyway.Have some compassion 1000''s have lost memories that can''t be replaced along with material things .It is nice to sit on the sidelines and judge.

[ocgrandma]

In South Orange County our fire was started by arson, while a lot of North County Fire departments were in other areas helping those fires. We are not in a fire prone area we have homeowners association that would fine if overgrown. The winds spread back & forth so fast& hard from Irvine where my son lives on a flat housing track in Northwood where flames jumped the road on the ground,then to Foothill Ranch ,then back to Irvine then behind Rancho Santa Margarita on to Modjeska Canyon where houses were lost, then Cleveland National Forest where it is still burning. We had no extra help the firefighters did an amazing job, and all over we are gratful. Fire retardant? This was not a high risk area. I was at Disneyland in North OC Sunday I smelled smoke but thought that with the high winds it was Malibu,San Diego. I came home to see a wall of smoke & flames it spread so fast and with no air help because of the winds, it kept on going. I resent people that we were unprepared FOR ARSON? You do not know this area of South Orange Co. or you would not make stupid remarks . I drive 22 miles to North OC to the hospital where I work things were fine. Chip Prather the OC fire chief & his crew Capt. Steve Miller did a great job with news releases to keep us informed city to city .I hate outsiders making statements as if we were in a forest. Learn your geography. I have more to say in next post.

[tyme_gypsy]

Hey haaker, I''ll tell you who he is. He was one of my firefighters who is now the Orange County fire chief and he got there by knowing his stuff. He''s about 100% right. California''s performance on this stuff is abysmal and they do the same stupid stuff year after year, not retaining the lessons for earlier years. Immediate initial attack by air tankers would have cut the damage way back on these fires, but the problem is that you can''t use them in those kinds of winds. The other problem is that there are too few people like Chip in the top ranks of the fire service and too many bookworms, tree huggers and political hacks who don''t know JACK about firefighting. While we were fighting fires and learning what works, they were sitting in classrooms or kissing somebody''s backside to get where they are. He and I were both Ca. Dept. of Forestry back in the 70''s and have sucked our share of smoke together. And who are YOU to criticize him? He''s not trashing the firefighters. He''s being protective of the "boots on the ground" by telling the truth about the "pinheads" at the top.

[tyme_gypsy]

Hey haaker, I''ll tell you who he is. He was one of my firefighters who is now the Orange County fire chief and he got there by knowing his stuff. He''s about 100% right. California''s performance on this stuff is abysmal and they do the same stupid stuff year after year, not retaining the lessons for earlier years. Immediate initial attack by air tankers would have cut the damage way back on these fires, but the problem is that you can''t use them in those kinds of winds. The other problem is that there are too few people like Chip in the top ranks of the fire service and too many bookworms, tree huggers and political hacks who don''t know JACK about firefighting. While we were fighting fires and learning what works, they were sitting in classrooms or kissing somebody''s backside to get where they are. He and I were both Ca. Dept. of Forestry back in the 70''s and have sucked our share of smoke together. And who are YOU to criticize him? He''s not trashing the firefighters. He''s being protective of the "boots on the ground" by telling the truth about the "pinheads" at the top.

[haaker123]

What local officals said this? The Airplanes where in place but grounded do to the wind! We where very prepaired! I love CBS trying to trash the fire fighters and the officials that helped orginized the fire fighting! This not Katrina, we are civilized her in SD. I am proud of all the people who helped evcauate 500,000 people in a civil manor and all the Fire fighter who risk thei life, we need to pat ourselves on the back here in SD, quit trying to politicize these fires! My only Question is where is Hillary? She won''t spend the time in california because she believes that the state is hers no matter what in a general election she can''t come to California because doesn''t want to spend the money from China! She has not even asked how the people who lost their homes or friends and animals are, what compasion what a ***! If Bush had done this you would have ruined his chance to win the election it would been on TV 24/7! Instead Ried, Boxer try to make it political, we here work together and we hate PINHEAD MEDIA and Politicians that just want blame Bush and don''t want help the local community in crisis. 08 California will reject democrats including the uncaring ugly fat butted Hillary go to f--ken Hell! It''s not Katrina, It''s not global warming, it''s not because of Iraq (Boxer the biggest moron senator in the the world) it''s because demonicrats are in power, in 08 good bye to all liberal pinhead elitist lefties political hacks like Hillary!! It''s a big monster fire stupid!

[nottellin1]

The differance is he declared the emergency after California burned not before the storm hit as in the case of New Orleans.


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Posted by cbscrash07 at 11:51 AM : Oct 25, 2007

I believe that you meant to say that in California, our Govenator requested that it be declared an emergency promptly. Many of the problems after Katrina were a direct result of the actions of the NO major and LA Govener

[nottellin1]

Most of those who were fully aware of the risks of living in CA have moved to Las Vegas. This is why our population has quadrupled in the last 20 years, and housing costs have skyrocketed. I''''m sure that many people who lost everything in these fires will be moving here soon, as well.


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Posted by LVslotdoc at 06:07 AM : Oct 25, 2007

One can only hope that they do.

[jumkey]

papapc:

YOU are the one who declared that liberals were blaming Bush for the everything under the sun even though no one said that.

I guess when your cult leader is an incompetent idiot you have to preemptively deflect ANY criticism, even ridiculous assertions that no one made, simply to protect yourself from the real world.

It is kind of funny though, after listening to you whiners spend 15 years blaming Clinton for everything you now assert Bush has no responsibility for ANYTHING.

[nottellin1]

So I guess the Chocolate City was not the only city not prepared for such disasters. We can''''t blame Nagin for this one! Karma is a MOTHER!


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Posted by cryonbrian at 03:06 PM : Oct 24, 2007

You are correct. So Cal, good Karma, New Orleans, bad Karma. However, the response from regular Californians, both the ones effected and the ones not is how we keep our good Karma.

[poopusbuttus]

PAPABC -- It''s called "The Election Year"....that''s why they do it.

[marcodele]

Make that miles, not acres. 700 square miles in California.

[marcodele]

I guess I''m considered a liberal Democrat since I don''t advocate war and I think Bush, Rove, Cheney, Rice, Coulter and Limbaugh are a bunch of hypocrites.

But frankly I think the response to the fires was great on all sides from federal down to local.

There''s a big difference between a storm devastating 9,000 square miles, and some arsonists burning 700 acres.

And this time around, the FEMA response wasn''t managed by an old Bush buddy whose only experience was raising Arabian horses.

So yes, great response in California by all parties. None of those people deserved that fate, nor did the people in the Gulf Coast. Shat happens.

[toolmangler-2009]

These are the same people that know that So Cal is going to slide off into the ocean, what do you expect? They haven''t prepared for that so why should they prepare for anything else. Que Sara, Sara!!!

[netadmin1-2009]

papabc -

I like your way of thinking and am with you --

[papabc]

When the first were burning a few years ago they were just fires to fight. Did not matter if Reagan, Bush1, Clinton or, Bush2 was in office.

Wildfire were either caused by human accident, Arson or natural. We didn''t blame them on the President.

Now, why do liberals want to pin everything on the President?
Ant get stepped on in Kansas - Bush''s Fault
Car hit woman crossing street - Bush''s Fault
Arson and Natural fire in a forest - Bush''s Fault
It pick you nose and the dried snot falls on your food - Bush''s Fault.

What is with you Radical Democrats?

[jumkey]

Hey notblue, if you can find a Dem politician in California you let me know. All of my State and Local Reps are rightwing free-spending, big government, war loving America haters. Not a competent one in the bunch.

And ddhinnyc? You listen up. Those of us who actually love this country have had it with you failed conservatives and your crazy leader cults. Bush is a failure, his policies are failures and his party is a failure. Time to move out and let the adults back in charge.

And you want me to "credit" to Bush for flying in an airplane? That''s about all he''s good at, sitting on his butt whining about how everyone hates him. What a crybaby.

[notblue]

The Dem politicians in California need to keep up the political bloviating and blame game but the truth obvious to everyone is this disaster support was a complete success. It''s too bad the demiocratic party has turned into the "blame and critisize" party. It''s truly become an extension of the "screaming child" called the leftwing in this country.

[Syndicate]

It burns every year. How many times has Malibu burnt in the last ten years? Ten times. I live a few hundred miles north of this fortunetly this time we don''t have to breath the smoke and ash from these fires. Anyways sounds to me like the local fire cheif dropped the ball. The funny thing about Bush''s visit is the time line is similar to new orleans. The differance is he declared the emergency after California burned not before the storm hit as in the case of New Orleans.

[jumkey]

Most of San Diego County is CONSERVATIVE.

The areas that burned are Republican areas which have consistently and repeatedly voted against taxes for firefighters and equipment.

San Diego county is the ONLY county in California without a county fire department. During the height of the Harris fire on Monday (the second largest in the county and the fifth in equipment priority for state resources) there were TEN engines fighting the blaze. The chief said they needed ONE HUNDRED to adequately fight it.

Conservatives and their mindless, knee-jerk anti-tax policies are directly responsible for the severity and duration of these fires. They CHOSE to under-equip and under staff fire resources and now all of us again must again shoulder the burden of their failed party.

[talkingham]

OK, Mc-idiot, no one criticized Bush for going to New Orleans too late, just the federal relief effort that couldn''t get into the city until nearly a week after the storm hit. In fact, I''m surre most liberals would have preferred not to ever see his smirking face saying "great job Brownie" to his FEMA director who had never done little more than running horse shows before he was given his big appointment in the Bush Admin. I would prefer not to see him getting his photo ops at scenes of disaster anyway. His whole admin is a disaster for most people unless they are employed by firms that get his no bid billions of dollar contracts.

So if you want to spray this discussion with your warped neo-con politics I''m sure there are plenty of people to take you on. Great job Bushie, the price of gas and heating our homes has tripled in your 6 years in office, we''ve poured a trillion dollars into Iraq and gotten what?, Bushie and his team were either asleep at the switch or simply watched 9111 transpire as thousands of Americans died - you have to wonder why there was no air cover on the East coast that day- Bush and his defense department allowed a jet liner to fly into the pentagon killing hundreds in what should be one of the most secure locations in the country-- once again, great job Bushie! I could go on for hours.