The Age Of Mega-Fires

Expert: Warming Climate Fueling Mega-Fires

(CBS)  Professor Swetnam wanted to show 60 Minutes just how much has changed, so he brought Pelley to the top of Arizona's Mount Lemon. Two mega-fires there killed everything, even the Ponderosa Pines.

"You know, I was always taught that Ponderosas were big, robust trees that were built to withstand fire," Pelley remarks. "And that when everything else burned off, the Ponderosas were still standing. But look at them."

"The Ponderosas are able to withstand the low severity fires where you get flames of maybe one to two or three feet high. But now the behavior of these fires is off the scale," Swetnam says.

Asked how much things have changed, Swetnam tells Pelley, "Well, we're seeing century-old forests that had never sustained these kinds of fires before, being razed to the ground."

Back at the battle to save Ketchum, Idaho, the day shift was coming off, and the night shift going on.

How long does it take to bring a fire like this under control?

Says Tom Boatner, "This particular fire is about 45,000 acres and they’ve been working on it for about 11 or 12 days and they've got it about 50 percent contained and with any luck they will finish containing this fire in another five or six days something like that."

Containing it meant fighting fire with fire. Using drip torches, they started a controlled burn around the town, creating a barrier, so that when the forest fire hit there'd be nothing left to burn. These pre-burns are risky though. Trees can torch suddenly and explosively, sending embers up to a mile away.

By daybreak on the 18th day, the gamble had paid off. The blaze came within 100 feet of some homes, but not one home was lost. It will take years for this forest to recover, but Tom Swetnam told Pelley with these new super hot fires some forests may never grow back.

"We used to have forest soil here that might have been this deep," he says, indicating about a foot of depth, "but now we're just down to rock."

"So you're down to mineral and sort of a rock, sort of armored soil. And that is not a good habitat for trees to re-establish," Swetnam says.

"Where do you think all this is headed?" Pelley asks,

"As fires continue to burn, these mega-fires continue to burn, we may see ultimately a majority, maybe more than half of the forest land converting to other forest, other types of ecosystems," Swetnam says.

"Wait a minute. Did you just say that there's a reasonable chance we could lose half of the forests in the West?" Pelley asks.

"Yes, within some decades to a century, as warming continues, and we continue to get large scale fires," Swetnam replies.

Swetnam says that this is what we have to look forward to. He estimates, in the Southwest alone, nearly two million acres of forest are gone and won't come back for centuries. The hotshots are already planning for the next fire season. In 2006, the feds spent $2 billion on fire fighting, seven times more than just ten years ago.

"You know, there are a lot of people who don't believe in climate change," Pelley remarks.

"You won't find them on the fire line in the American West anymore," Tom Boatner says. "'Cause we've had climate change beat into us over the last ten or fifteen years. We know what we’re seeing, and we're dealing with a period of climate, in terms of temperature and humidity and drought that's different than anything people have seen in our lifetimes."

[mike71067]

Another pro-global warming article by liberal Time Magazine. Has anyone noticed that they libs don''t even call it "global warming" anymore? Now it''s called "climate change". That''s because the warming that has been taking place since the end of the ice age is no longer happening. There hasn''t been a measurable increase in the earth''s temperature in the past 9 years.

[talkingham]

idot

[au_fait]

I understand your point about the change of the name. There is climate change, but there has always been climate change. I do have to throw in that the planets around us have undergone a warming trend due to solar activity. I guess the change here cannot be affected by this same activity, it has to be due to humankind (what a joke). I really cannot wait to see what the next purpose the liberals choose to champion.

[jcr103]

It''s time to pull your head out guys! You can reiterate all of the silly, juvenile, and moronic "counter-arguments" all you want. What you cannot do is change the facts on the ground. Those facts illustrate near surface and ocean surface temperatures are rising and the overwhelming evidence highlights the burning of fossil fuels is the primary cause.

[rudy654-2009]

Another pro-global warming article by liberal Time Magazine. Has anyone noticed that they libs don''''t even call it "global warming" anymore? Now it''''s called "climate change". That''''s because the warming that has been taking place since the end of the ice age is no longer happening. There hasn''''t been a measurable increase in the earth''''s temperature in the past 9 years.
Posted by mike71067 at 12:19 PM

That''s funny, I thought that was the Limbogg term for it. Several times the very scientific Limbogg has stated that it is climate change. And I know how so many just love to wait until the Limbogg tells them what''s what.

[rushlimpdrug]

Stupid is as stupid does.
So the retards start to sense that the name has changed.
Like calling a drunk an alcoholic.
It is the same problem.
Fortunately for these idiots they will never wake from their stupor.
They don''t have to admit the problem if they are too stupid to see it.
Just proves: "Ignorance is bliss."

If you want to see how to kill megafires, take a look at my article about PCADS on Military.com''s Defense Tech website www.defensetech.org/archives/003783.html and you can see a video I shot at a demo outside of Kingman, AZ, at www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fc3fOhfXu1o
I know the video doesn''t look very impressive, but imagine 70 of these cascading out of a C-17 and you get some idea of the punch this system packs!

[tburzio]

There was an article about a decade ago on how the Smokey Bear drive in the 50s-80s left the forests dangerously overgrown with brush. I like CBS News, no one remembers anything!

[forestwmn]

Let''s get back to the science here and stop talking politics! The fire triangle is all about topography, weather and fuels. Us piddly humans have virtually no control over topography (unless you want to bulldoze all the hills to valleys) and the weather (some fire seasons have worse weather than others in the regionally context). The only thing we can do is reduce the fuel and change the type of fuel. Wildfire, when it is intense, instantly reduces the fuel but at the same time it changes the fuel that will be there when vegetation grows back. During this period of growback the forest is so much more susceptible to fire than ever! If we thin before we have an intense fire and follow it up with prescribed fire we may have an impact on future fire. That''s if the weather and topography don''t line up just right one year and take it all out again. Bottom line: take care of the one thing we have control over-vegetation

[latree1-2009]

Hey, Mike--time to do some research, guy.
http://www.ncdc.noaa.gov/oa/climate/research/anomalies/anomalies.html
Wake up, people!

[ubrew12]

Along with rising sea levels, this will probably turn into the ''other'' major issue with Global Warming. It''s not a ''major'' issue. Fires can be fought when necessary, otherwise its a matter of allowing species to slowly adapt by moving northward out of newly desertified regions. Nevertheless, its time we took steps against the worst possibilities of Global Warming. No one knows how bad (or good) it could get. It behooves us, on behalf of the next generation, to take prudent steps to slow the pace of warming change so people have the time to react to any changes (if any) thay may come on the horizon.

[brianbwb-2009]

American West could lose half its forests by the end of the century.

No big loss, the only remaining forest land is in relatively small preserves. The industrialist capitalists wanted this, unchecked logging until the areas were bare, they desertified large areas and created dust bowls, as if the planet''s resources were infinite. They polluted all the lakes and rivers, now we live with shortages of drinking water.

Even now there are idiots who deny that we have had a negative impact on our environment. The rich, who profit from it I can understand somewhat, but I have no sympathy or respect for the intelligence of the middle and poorer classes who suffer most, yet still believe the advocates of the status quo.

[biostock]

Let''s focus on solutions rather than run around fanning the flames.
Instead of healthy trees sequestering carbon, megafires and decay of the charred remains are releasing tree carbon in the form of greenhouse gases. That should be your lead story. NASA data demonstrates that the ghg emissions of American wildfires exceed all the emissions of all the autos in the U.S. each year. I write extensively on my blogs and give presentations about this subject and the potential of the emerging bioconversion technologies to help solve it - see http://biostock.blogspot.com/2007/09/woody-biomass-fuel-for-wildfires.html .
Our forests can''t be preserved. We need to garden our forests. "forestwmn" has it right. Thinned forests don''t burn. The problem of megafires is relegated almost entirely to public lands. The USDA Forest Service is so strapped fighting fires and environmentalist litigation (729 cases in 13 years!) they can''t deploy preventative thinning measures. They are looking to private industry to provide use for the fuelwood they thin to help increase economic and environmental sustainability of their efforts. With the decline of the forest products industry that new demand will likely come from biorefineries that conver woody biomass (understory, not trees) to cellulosic ethanol. Think of it - reducing wildfires by reducing our dependence on foreign oil!

[biostock]

Let''s focus on solutions rather than run around fanning the flames.
Instead of healthy trees sequestering carbon, megafires and decay of the charred remains are releasing tree carbon in the form of greenhouse gases. That should be your lead story. NASA data demonstrates that the ghg emissions of American wildfires exceed all the emissions of all the autos in the U.S. each year. I write extensively on my blogs and give presentations about this subject and the potential of the emerging bioconversion technologies to help solve it - see http://biostock.blogspot.com/2007/09/woody-biomass-fuel-for-wildfires.html .
Our forests can''t be preserved. We need to garden our forests. "forestwmn" has it right. Thinned forests don''t burn. The problem of megafires is relegated almost entirely to public lands. The USDA Forest Service is so strapped fighting fires and environmentalist litigation (729 cases in 13 years!) they can''t deploy preventative thinning measures. They are looking to private industry to provide use for the fuelwood they thin to help increase economic and environmental sustainability of their efforts. With the decline of the forest products industry that new demand will likely come from biorefineries that conver woody biomass (understory, not trees) to cellulosic ethanol. Think of it - reducing wildfires by reducing our dependence on foreign oil!

[bombadil4]

There are several reasons for so much human denial about disturbing events amd ideas, whether it be evolution, global warming, holocosts, etc. Some of the denial is based on superstition--sometimes called religion, some of it is based on greed, and some of it is based on fear of change and the unknown. The best tool we have, as fallible human beings who have not that long ago come down from the trees, is good science. It''s not perfect, but the best method we have to make rational decisions to insure a decent future for our children and beyond. The preponderance of good science tells us we are dwelling on a planet that shows definite signs of massive human abuse which may render it hostile to our own existence. It really doesn''t matter that you can google up dozens of articles denying it or that the the spate of 24 hour "news" stations, hungry to prlong controversy, can find some "scientist" to deny it. Along with all the positive things you can say about the Internet and Information Age, the negative is that arguments are seldom settled any more and therefore action can be delayed indefinitely. For example, you can stil hear ******** Cheney still claiming that he is "entirely persuaded" that Iraq had WMDs or at least had plans for them, or at least had preliminary discussions of plans, or at least drew up plans to have plans for preliminary plans to plan for WMDs...etc.

[shanev137]

I''m really surprised there''s anything left to burn out west.

[donbl1]

We have had El Nino''s for a long time........ they cause droughts, hurricanes and rain.

Some parts of the country are experiencing 100yr droughts - CA and SE. Others are experiencing 100 yr rain fall....... North Texas

Global temperature has risen .7C. Not that much and probably not the cause.

Arctic ice retreat? Yes....

Sea rise? Not yet measurable.

Do we have smog and global air contamination? Absolutely and most of it comes from Chinese coal mine fires that they can not extinguish and put more into the air than all US cars.

This was supposed to be a BIG hurricane season. Didn''t happen for the second year in a row.

So, what does that tell us? The Global Warming forecasters are just as good as the weekly forecasters on the TV....... not so good.

[cmjens]

After living "out west" all of my life and watching what is actually happening we can thank the enviromental waccos like Al Gore for what it happening to our forests. I knew when I saw the story that was going to be done that the truth would again be pushed aside to advance the cause of global warming. The facts are that since we have stopped logging there are more fuels to burn therefore more megafires. The fires used to be relegated to a few small areas that had not been logged for various reasons but since we have all but bancrupt the logging industry there is no one to manage the forests and they are becoming overgrown and choked with dead fall. We need to get off our proverbial ***** and start looking at the truth instead of blaming things that we can not change. The "global warming" is cyclical thousands of years ago there were palm trees in Minnesota it is oh so easy to only look back far enough to back up what we want to push as the reason for something. Pull your heads out of your butts and start thinking for yourselves.

[cs4466]

"The facts are that since we have stopped logging there are more fuels to burn therefore more megafires." Pathetic, circular argument. If you cut down all the trees there won''t be any fires at all now will there? Moron.

[pulaski21]

Climate change is only one piece of this puzzle. The lack of funding for preventive and preparedness activities (these budgets are being cut every year), the frivolous prosecution of fire managers for fatality fires, and the associated policies, rules, and checklists with which firefighters are encumbered have led to an "ultra cautious" firefighting force, even to the point of absurdity.

Climate change is definitely a piece of the puzzle, but don''t fool yourselves, the federal land management agencies are as much to blame as the climate!

[pulaski21]

Climate change is only one piece of this puzzle. The lack of funding for preventive and preparedness activities (these budgets are being cut every year), the frivolous prosecution of fire managers for fatality fires, and the associated policies, rules, and checklists with which firefighters are encumbered have led to an "ultra cautious" firefighting force, even to the point of absurdity.

Climate change is definitely a piece of the puzzle, but don''t fool yourselves, the federal land management agencies are as much to blame as the climate!

[pulaski21]

Climate change is only one piece of this puzzle. The lack of funding for preventive and preparedness activities (these budgets are being cut every year), the frivolous prosecution of fire managers for fatality fires, and the associated policies, rules, and checklists with which firefighters are encumbered have led to an "ultra cautious" firefighting force, even to the point of absurdity.

Climate change is definitely a piece of the puzzle, but don''t fool yourselves, the federal land management agencies are as much to blame as the climate!

[pulaski21]

Climate change is only one piece of this puzzle. The lack of funding for preventive and preparedness activities (these budgets are being cut every year), the frivolous prosecution of fire managers for fatality fires, and the associated policies, rules, and checklists with which firefighters are encumbered have led to an "ultra cautious" firefighting force, even to the point of absurdity.

Climate change is definitely a piece of the puzzle, but don''t fool yourselves, the federal land management agencies are as much to blame as the climate!

[pulaski21]

Climate change is only one piece of this puzzle. The lack of funding for preventive and preparedness activities (these budgets are being cut every year), the frivolous prosecution of fire managers for fatality fires, and the associated policies, rules, and checklists with which firefighters are encumbered have led to an "ultra cautious" firefighting force, even to the point of absurdity.

Climate change is definitely a piece of the puzzle, but don''t fool yourselves, the federal land management agencies are as much to blame as the climate!

[pulaski21]

Climate change is only one piece of this puzzle. The lack of funding for preventive and preparedness activities (these budgets are being cut every year), the frivolous prosecution of fire managers for fatality fires, and the associated policies, rules, and checklists with which firefighters are encumbered have led to an "ultra cautious" firefighting force, even to the point of absurdity.

Climate change is definitely a piece of the puzzle, but don''t fool yourselves, the federal land management agencies are as much to blame as the climate!

[pulaski21]

Climate change is only one piece of this puzzle. The lack of funding for preventive and preparedness activities (these budgets are being cut every year), the frivolous prosecution of fire managers for fatality fires, and the associated policies, rules, and checklists with which firefighters are encumbered have led to an "ultra cautious" firefighting force, even to the point of absurdity.

Climate change is definitely a piece of the puzzle, but don''t fool yourselves, the federal land management agencies are as much to blame as the climate!

[mcv57]

Pulaski21, throwing money at the problem is a stradegy long, gone failure (look at the school system - more money more corruption). If you want to blame something or someone, blame the U.S. Government.

The U.S. Government had the power to force automakers and build alternative energy vehicles long ago (actually the technology was available since after world war II). BUT, the corrupt U.S. Government was hand picked to turn the other cheek by automakers and oil company Guras around the world. To completely overall the transporation industry would cost trillions (something that would not send Corporate CEOs retire super rich), and the oil companies wouldn''t be able to get there CEO rich and their Arab power grabbers happy. No your government sold you out decades ago - they got to be rich too and own a ranch out in Texas.

[mh4cbs1]

cjmens,

You are right. The best solution is to log all the forests so that they can''t burn. Brillant!

[ubrew12]

"You know, there are a lot of people who don''t believe in climate change," Pelley remarks.

"You won''t find them on the fire line in the American West anymore," Tom Boatner says. "Cause we''ve had climate change beat into us over the last ten or fifteen years. We know what we''re seeing, and we''re dealing with a period of climate, in terms of temperature and humidity and drought that''s different than anything people have seen in our lifetimes."

I''m sure he''s just a cheese-eating liberal, right cons?

[tiddsanbeer]

OH MY GOD!!!! SINCE BUSH TOOK OFFICE THE WORLD''S TEMPERATURE IS RISING!!!

IF BOATNERS GBONER STATEMENT IS TRUE, THEN 10 YEARS AGO,UNDER CLINTON, THESE HUGE FIRES WERE RARE....

WHAT A FU KKKIING CROK O CHIT!!!! YOU SUCKERS AREN''T REALLY GONNA BELIEVE THIS HORSEDUNG DINNER BELL ARE YOU?

WHILE THERE IS NO DOUBT THAT SOME SORT OF NATURAL CLIMATE CYCLE IS HAPPENING, WHY HAS IT BECOME SUCH A BIG ISSUE SINCE BUSH SHOWED UP?

DID YOU KNOW MORE OF THOSE GAS GUZZLING SUVS WERE SOLD UNDER CLINTONS WATCH THAN ANY OTHER PRESIDENT IN HISTORY?

DOESN''T THAT MAKE HIM MORE RESPONSIBLE THAN BUSH...ACCORDING TO YOUR OWN LEFT LOGIC??

JEEEESUSS.

LOL

[kkemper1]

climate change has nothing to do with it. IT is a coverup and I have proof. The supervisors have sent ME letters indicating they DO NOT care what burns--
as long as they have bodies on the ground and
large payrolls! WE showed them how to put out
fires in 6 hours and they said "we are not interested.
The system is a slight modification of what they already have. NO municipal body cares about
the effectiveness of fire fighters--as long as the
payroll is large and supports lots of fire fighters!

[ubrew12]

tiddsandbeer said: "DOESN''T THAT MAKE HIM [Clinton] MORE RESPONSIBLE THAN BUSH...ACCORDING TO YOUR OWN LEFT LOGIC??" The only ones responsible are the deniers. And those are your pals in the republican party. Too much money be made. Scr*w the West, scr*w the little guy. Pump more oil.

[omega39-2009]

Posted by cmjens

Cmjens, you stick to your guns and let them heathen liberals know that us God fearing republicans don''t believe anything unless it appears unsubstantiated in a two thousand year old book. Well I need to saddle up the dinosaur for the ride to church so I will see you all later.

[ubrew12]

omega39 said: "Well I need to saddle up the dinosaur for the ride to church so I will see you all later."

Wish I had a ''57 Chevy...

[tiddsanbeer]

You di kcheesecake libs should just stay in the big city and watch your sensationalized news on hi definition tvs with "close-ups" of those burnin forests....scares you so, doesn''t it..pus sssiies.

That''s why we who live in the forest love to laugh when we see your millionair tv ANCHORMAN wearing a thousand dollar business suit or your ANCHORWOMAN wearing a bright blue outfit that looks like it glows in the dark professing to be an expert on everything, yet all the while asking dumb questions to the "victims" in trouble...."Duh..how does it feel to have lost your home in this terrible fire...?? duh..uh...

These empty skirts have never even stepped in bear cr ap nor cleared brush or even layed in bed at night with the window open letting that pure oxygen in letting you get that good nights sleep only a mountain man could get. (after a quick bone with the ol'' lady first of course...)

Folks...wake up. Make a note to self, the next time you watch your alphabet news, count how many times the words "I THINK" or "DO YOU THINK" pop up in the conversation....it''s truly astonishing.

Nobody really knows anything for sure should be your logical deduction, if not, keep voting left...your days are numbered!!

[sharncedar]

This is an interesting new big lie. It looks like the press is now creating a new bogeyman to fascinate that intelligent American public.

What is great about the "climate change" scare story is that it has happened in the past in America, for example there have been extensive droughts which depopulated whole native american cities in the southwest. So it makes a great story. The idea that we ourselves are somehow responsible is very Catholic, very ominous like the slasher movies where the people who get killed are somehow bad people.

We did something wrong, we will be punished. We can have this wonderful, engaging story told to us, without the need for a God or external entity or any postulation of a spiritual world at all. "Climate change" the movie is cast as entirely based on something called science. It gives all the chills and thrills of Sunday morning preachers while still denying there is any spiritual world, still acting like capitalistic nilhism is a valid point of view.

[foolishru]

This was the worst news report I have ever seen on wild fires. 1. Hotshots aren''t the only crews out fighting fires. There are Engines, helitac crews and Hand crews. 2. Tom Boatner?? ***!?!?! Nice made up title! He is NOT "chief of fire operations for the federal government" Maybe for his forest or district. But those are usually called, AFMO''s or FMO''S. 3. It is so convenient that the 20 year drought was not mentioned in this program. This is a large reason for the amount of fires added to the neglegant acts of campers.

Kkemper, you don''t have to lie to be cool. Not every fire has the capability of being put out in 6 hours. I would like to know just exactly what your title is and your affiliation with the Forest Service / BLM is. Also, I would like to know if you are aware of just how little $ these guys actually make given the risk of the job? Are you aware of the "seasonal" vs "permanant" employess. Are you familiar with the large amount of Lay Off''s at the end of Fire Season? For you to state that this is a money scandal of sorts is a large embelishment on your part and seems to be a cry for attention.
Sign me,
Wife of a WildLand Firefighter

[tiddsanbeer]

AGAIN, I say, With the IQ of a dirty set of dognuts, you LIBS drank the koolaid, started comparing cat terds and tootsie rolls out in the sandbox, found a little diversity in them and found them to be "equal"....

You saw AL GONES "INCONVIENIANT TRUTH" and sucked up all the lies that were portrayed as fact with no regard to historical facts. You sucked it ALL UP....LIKE A BELUSHI HAIRBALL...and you feel good inside....isn''t that ALL that matters to you folks??

Isn''t that what it means to be a liberal is these days?? If it feels good, just do it?? Just believe it?? Just say yes?? Just put the condom on the cucumber?? Just give the little girl BIRTH CONTROL PILLS?? ...YAY!! SALLY''S ON THE PILL!!! AFTER SCHOOL, WHEN SHE''S FINISHED PLAYING WITH HER DOLLS, WE CAN HAVE SOME REAL FUN NOW!!

YOU LIBS:
JUST
DONT
GET IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

YEAH

LOL

[myidoncbs]

"Swetnam found recent decades have been the hottest in 1,000 years."

But the repugs keep on denying the obvious. I have to wonder, how could they be that stu/pid? Bush tells them to doubt global warming, so they do! Apparently there isn''t a single one of them who can think for himself.

The GOP: ********* Obnoxious Peabrains!!!

[foolishru]

Ya''ll are plain stupid! Since when is this about the president or political parties?

[omega39-2009]

And now a reading from the Hitchhikers guide to Republican science.

4. Population

It is known that there are an infinite number of worlds, simply because there is an infinite amount of space for them. However, not every one of them is inhabited. Therefore, there must be a finite number of inhabited worlds. Any finite number divided by infinity is as near to nothing as makes no odds, so the average population of all the planets in the Universe can be said to be zero. From this it follows that the population of the whole Universe is also zero, and that any people you may meet from time to time are merely the products of a deranged imagination.

[ubrew12]

foolishru,SharnCedar, tiddsandbeer:
The desertification of the West and SE has begun, due to climate change. When several-century old Ponderosa''s start dying by fire, the times have changed. Get on board and realize it ''could'' be a big deal, cuz even if American''s decide to do something about it (which probably would NOT require much sacrifice), convincing the future''s REAL polluters (Chinese, Latin, Indian) is going to be VERY difficult.

As someone who has backpacked extensively in the Sierra Nevada, I can tell you the high country has changed (its gotten ALOT drier). This is NOT natural climate warming (10,000 yr wavelength). This is global warming (200 yr wavelength).

[tiddsanbeer]

Speak for yourself on that one, SHARNCEDAR. Your analogy is flawed and flakey, but if it works for you..enjoy it! One bit of advice, if you can''t handle it, you should

LAY OFF THE HUSTLERS AND 12 PACKS!!

LOL

[myidoncbs]

Mr. t-i-t-s and beer says, "YOU LIBS: JUST DONT GET IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"

Interesting! That''s exactly what we think about you mo/rons who, when faced with the fact that the world is heating up and the fact that human activity significantly contributes to that temperature rise, coupled with the fact that even a few degree average increase in temperature will cause massive disruption in the world, just keep their heads buried in the sand and hope it will all just "go away" if we do nothing about it.

The level of stu/pidity that is required to be a practicing Bushite is astounding!

(BTW, ONE single exclammation point is usually sufficient. Perhaps you can use 2 or 3 if you REALLY want to be enthusiastic. But, using 22 just makes you appear to be spastic.)

[myidoncbs]

Some firefighter''s wife pointed out, "the 20 year drought was not mentioned in this program."

That is just more evidence of global warming. It reinforces the central point of the story, rather than negating it. So yes, he should have included that info in this story.

[oregonlivin]

Megafires WAS NOT accurate reporting - I knew they would bring up global warming as the cause. These megafires can be blamed "in part" to ALL the environmental issues out there.......... we have to leave the forests "natural"....... we can''t harvest burned timber....... this is NOT managing our forests.... and by the environmentalist NOT WILLING to work with the timber management and lock everything up in the courts ..... that people is where the BIG blame lies. In Central Oregon we had the Biscuit Fire a few years ago...... guess what ..... it is bug-infested and a tenderbox waiting to explode AGAIN....... thanks to the environmentalists..... if they TRULY cared about the forest they would leave their EGOS at the door and come to valid logical agreements with all timber industry.......... something else to think about..... when Mt. St Helens blew...... one side of the road was left natural and the other side of the road was planted and managed by the timber industry..... which side do you think is THRIVING..... the planted side....... people THINK !!

[lochlan-2009]

Wow, the people in control have a lot of influence on main stream media, and for that part control over certain "distinct" organizations, I''m curious what else they control. When they want the topic to be global warming they make it global warming, huh?

Anyway, on the flip side of that. I was reading a Times article about the global warming actually melting a hole so ships could make a shipping lane across the artic Atlantic to the Pacific. Now, I am curious, if that is where the gulf stream cools and the down current spot for the ocean currents that determine our weather, what happens when the Gulfs water can flow through to the Pacific? They didn''t touch on that scenario for my information.

[ubrew12]

curse914:
when SharmCedar says past droughts "depopulated whole native american cities in the southwest" he''s talking about the warming associated with the end of last ice age and the retreat of the glaciers. We already know that, TODAY, the SW is largely a desert, incapable of supported agrarian subsistence populations in large numbers. Too bad the Anasazi didn''t know it when it was happening.

What does this have to do with Global Warming?... nothing, which SharmCedar already knows. We''re talking about places as far north as Idaho becoming desertified due to CO2. That''s a different problem, with a different solution.

[tiddsanbeer]

UBREW...HELLOOOOOOOOOOOO.....TIME TO WAKE UP...HEY,HEY HEY...ARE YOU OK, WOW, THOUGHT YOU HAD A STROKE OR SOMETHING....

HOW NICE OF YOU to let us know that 10 thousand years ago, your sweet sierra mountains were bristling with dew....C''mon, chief...were you there??? I guess if your real name was a little more biblical I could believe you, but seriously....

Those who put too much faith in science leave no room for faith in "the man" (GOD for dognut libs).

You should have a healthy balance of BOTH to allow your brain to grow...INTERESTING CONCEPT, EH CHIEF?

"SCIENCE" can''t cure the common cold...but they can tell you the size of the nipples on a bronto babeasouras 10 million years ago?

Helloooooooooo....just till (relatively)recently the "scientists" discovered asbestos causes cancer....uh oh...they let billions get exposed in the mean time...

How many years you been given your child cold medicine??? Uh oh....maybe you shouldn''t...

My point is, don''t believe everything you hear, chief, next thing you know the "scientists" will find something wrong with VIAGRA!!!

LOL

[myidoncbs]

foolishru asks, "Since when is this about the president or political parties?"

Maybe you haven''t been paying attention. One of the political parties REQUIRES you to believe that global warming is a "myth", because it might cut into those humongous oil company profits if we did anything to fix it. So, rather than being an issue that is discussed rationally, by scientists, it becomes a chance for the rabid Bushies to spout more of their lies.

Despite the political overtones, scientists HAVE been discussing this matter rationally for many years. The overwhelming consensus is that global warming is real, not just something made up by Al Gore. A very small number of well-paid pseudo-scientists disagree. If you''re a member of the Repugnant party, you are required to ignore the consensus, and believe the radical nut jobs who deny global warming.

Everything''s political to a political tool.
Everything''s religious to a believer.
Reality be dammed!