Pistol-Packin' Teacher Says It's Her Right

Fears Columbine-Style Attack, Ex-Husband; School District Goes To Court To Disarm Her

(AP)  High school English teacher Shirley Katz insists she needs to take her pistol with her to work because she fears her ex-husband could show up and try to harm her. She's also worried about a Columbine-style attack.

But Katz's district has barred teachers from bringing guns to school, so she is challenging the ban as unlawful, since Oregon is among states that allow people with a permit to carry concealed weapons into public buildings.

"This is primarily about my Second Amendment right and Oregon law and the simple fact that I know it is my right to carry that gun," said Katz, 44, sitting at the kitchen table of her home outside this city of 74,000.

"I have that (concealed weapons) permit. I refuse to let my ex-husband bully me. And I am not going to let the school board bully me, either."

In Oregon, a sheriff can grant a concealed-weapons permit to anyone whose criminal record is clean and who completes a gun-safety course.

Thirty-eight states, along with the District of Columbia, prohibit people from taking guns to school, according to the National Council of State Legislatures. But it's unclear how many offer an exemption for people holding concealed-weapons permits, since the council does not track such exceptions.

Superintendent Phil Long insists employees and students are safer without guns on campus at South Medford High School, where Katz teaches. The district plans to make that argument when the case comes before a judge on Thursday.

Katz's request appears to be rare. School security consultant Ken Trump, president of National School Safety and Security Services in Cleveland, said he has never heard of a similar case while working in 45 states.

Katz won't say whether she has ever taken her 9 mm Glock pistol to school, but she practices with it regularly and has thought about what she would do if she had to confront a gunman. She would be sure students were locked in nearby offices out of the line of fire, and she would be ready with her pistol.

"Our safety plan at our school now is that if somebody threatening comes in, you try to avoid eye contact, and do whatever they say, and that is not acceptable anymore," she said. Shootings at Virginia Tech University and the one-room Amish school in Pennsylvania, "reinforced my belief we have to take action, we can't just acquiesce as we have been taught to do."

Katz never owned a gun until she and her then-husband, commercial photographer Gerry Katz, moved to Oregon from Atlanta eight years ago and bought 20 acres on a gravel road in the foothills of the Cascade Range.

"Being out in the country, we just felt we needed to have a gun here for personal safety," she said.

In 2004, Gerry Katz, who had a concealed weapons permit, was arrested for pulling a .38-caliber revolver after a confrontation that began in a parking lot with two men whose car almost hit his.

According to the police report, he did not point the weapon at anyone. The police seized it, and the charges were later dismissed. Gerry Katz said he never went back for his gun.

Shirley Katz said she bought her own gun in 2004 after Gerry Katz grabbed her by the throat and threatened to kill her - an allegation he denies.

He argues that her desire to take her gun to school is about reopening their divorce to get exclusive custody of their 6-year-old daughter.

"She's just scamming everybody," he said. "As soon as this thing started ... I called the principal at her high school and told her ... I am not coming to your school. I am not a threat to her. I have no desire to hurt her."

Oregon had a school shooting in 1998, when student Kip Kinkel killed his parents at home, then drove to school and opened fire in the cafeteria of Thurston High School in Springfield, killing two and wounding 25 others.

Since then, the Legislature has considered barring people with concealed weapons permits from carrying guns in schools, but the bills have failed, said Dori Brattain, general counsel to the Oregon School Boards Association.

Some South Medford students say they are uncomfortable with the idea of a teacher carrying a gun, especially since they cannot bring even scissors to school.

"I totally understand she wants to protect herself," said Lauren Forderer, 16, a junior. "But I don't agree she should bring her problems around 2,000 other people."

Even if she wins, Katz said, she may not bring the gun to school.

"The whole point of carrying concealed is no one should know you're carrying," she said. "So I feel like my carrying concealed on campus now sets me up as a target."

[extremophil]

I think it''s a good idea for every teacher to carry a gun. That way, when a student comes to school without his homework....BAM!

[Krazcarl]

Yes I see fears post Colimbine{?} and Virgina Tech but nevertheless with a room full of children you don''t need a loaded gun in the room if you think you do join the military. She should be fired and jailed for bringing in a firearm to school like any student. This is stupid.

[Krazcarl]

Yes I see fears post Colimbine{?} and Virgina Tech but nevertheless with a room full of children you don''t need a loaded gun in the room if you think you do join the military. She should be fired and jailed for bringing in a firearm to school like any student. This is stupid.

[antoniof123]

Its a local matter let them handle it.

[eggy1620]

In Atlanta, they did not feel the need to own firearms. But they now do in rural Oregon? ***?

[mike71067]

Murderous little brats bring guns to school to harm others, but a lady is not allowed to bring one for personal defense. Sweet.

Incidentally, these "Columbine" type school shootings were unheard of 30 years ago - back when it was still acceptable to DISCIPLINE YOUR CHILD and teach them to respect the lives of others and to follow the Ten Commandments. These days, when a child disrespects others, we say, "Johnny, how did you FEEL when you shoved that pencil through your sister''s neck?" We''re so afraid of disciplining kids that we''d rather ask them how they "feel" then straighten them out.

[prolegomena]

I think the fundamental question revolves around threat (real or percieved) and preparation to deal with the threat. We pay police for a reason-- if there is really that kind of threat in the school, the cops should be everywhere, if they really value their children.

That being said, the Constitutional right to bear arms has always been interpreted to function within limits. If the police will not protect the schools, then someone has to... but this ought to be regulated by clear law, and a clear appreciation for the real risk and the real ability of those who wish to bear arms to use them appropriately for the circumstance.

[yankeerebel7]

Hell yeah, rock on Oregon...rock on.

[jshmks]

GunOwnerDan is taking too long, I''ll fill in.

**ITS YOUR RIGHT TO CARRY A GUN***

BLAH BLAH BLAH CLICK HERE
CLICK THIS LINK
CLICK THIS OTHER STUPID LINK
ITSAHUMANRIGHT.ORG
YEA DAWG HOW WOULD DAT PERSON GET HER
IF HE / SHE HAD A GLOCK 45 SON
CLICK HERE CLICK HERE
AND SIGN HERE

[gmcnally2]

Waiting for GunOwnerDan to make an appearance. Shouldn''''t be long now... :)

Posted by rafterman1

LOL

[ladyjaneg]

GunOwnerDan----waiting to see what you have to say, friend! :D

[eggy1620]

Look at her photograph. She%u2019s got those crazy eyes, like the runaway bride.

[killtheliars]

she is dangerous. I agree sane people should be allowed to carry, but this woman has a persecution complex. Everythign is "I won''t allow him, I won''t allow them" according to her everyone is bullying her.

[yoopermom]

These days, when a child disrespects others, we say, "Johnny, how did you FEEL when you shoved that pencil through your sister''''s neck?" We''''re so afraid of disciplining kids that we''''d rather ask them how they "feel" then straighten them out.
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Posted by mike71067 at 09:10 AM : Oct 09, 2007

This would be funny if it were not true.

[notblue]

Since liberals over tha past three decades have removed punishment, discipline, personal responsibility, and respect from our schools and society. The evil of columbine style killings, office shootings, Virginia Tech, etc. have surfaced. This new evil justifies the use of guns by law abiding for protection. If Teachers had the same choice as Airline pilots and others private citizens, it would certainly act as a deterrent in these masacres as these evil gunman would realize there potential victims might now be armed and can DEFEND themselves. It''s not the law abiding citizens with guns that should be feared it''s the cooks and the crooks!

[yoopermom]

You know, it might not be a bad idea to have some teachers ready to defend themselves and our children. I just don%u2019t think this teacher is the one to do it. She seems to be overly paranoid. *she fears her ex-husband could show up and try to harm her. She''s also worried about a Columbine-style attack*. Ok, the ex-husband MAY be legit, but to live in constant fear of another instance like Columbine is a bit much. I understand the need to be cautious and pay extra attention to your surroundings after this type of tragedy, but she seems to be taking it too far.

And before I get blasted violating her rights (blah, blah, blah), this is not about her right bear arms, it is about her doing it in a classroom setting. I think she is just a little too paranoid to have a loaded weapon around my children.

[bbailey642]

Guns for teachers? I like it!

[tomtomasters]

Commemorate Precept
So you are saying the Media is the power in America; not the process of Democracy. Therewith we can understand that there is good or bad. And so how does Democracy stand upon that scale? I truly think good is good and bad is bad. There is no such distinction that good is bad or bad is good. This is the hypocrisy our current lives are driven by through this Bush administration and the Media liars who drive it. The conclusion is that it is not really about Democracy but about the way the Media has created its own 4th branch of government called the Right to Incite Violence Branch, all neatly packaged according to the precepts of free speech. Mind you free speech in the days of early yore was toward escalating the decency and right to do the good, which was to never put War before the issues of morality and goodness. That goodness is the ability and wants to preach the end to conflicts, the urge to decommission and reduce military perceptions, and show the providence hand with its bounty and wheal. The foregone has accepted that freedom of speech connotes the disregard of law and civility, in order to nurture the carnal desires of the flesh of men...meaning the proverbial clause you''ve sold your soul to the devil and his profits.

[tomtomasters]

A time will come when the people who have caused this great harm to our nation, will seek the capes of retirement as a shelter toward the collapse of their said intended purpose. For what good is it to continue the guise of carnal sanguity when there is never the perception of its goal which is real peace? In fact they fail; and the test of Democracy because of that, and sadly perish with the sins they have claimed. While laws state the books, and books state the men wherewith knowledge is in conflict with the values of society, the society that wanders away from its core of benevolence is and always will be conquered, whether by the use of the gun and its violent intent, or by the absence of mans integrity.

[theusa1st]

Since liberals over tha past three decades have removed punishment, discipline, personal responsibility, and respect from our schools and society. The evil of columbine style killings, office shootings, Virginia Tech, etc. have surfaced. This new evil justifies the use of guns by law abiding for protection. If Teachers had the same choice as Airline pilots and others private citizens, it would certainly act as a deterrent in these masacres as these evil gunman would realize there potential victims might now be armed and can DEFEND themselves. It''''s not the law abiding citizens with guns that should be feared it''''s the cooks and the crooks!

Posted by notblue at 09:47 AM : Oct 09, 2007

Exactly...some people just can''t make the connection.

[tearsfallen]

Ok i aree with her being scared of violent ex hubby, but to carry a gun on school grounds would be insane, for instants what if a student twice her size and with a one track mind, for revenge, toward another student or teacher thinks "aww hell Ms.Katz has a gun i could take it from her and use it" then what would she do and say! "No weapons in schools"..If she fears for her own life then a stay away notice should be made up to keep her ex hubby off campus! We need more disupline!

[lochlan-2009]

Just hope this woman is your teacher the next time someone starts shooting people in your class.

"School shootings are a form of terrorism, and God help us if real and motivated terrorists attack a school as was done in Russia." Then we have got to do a better job in keeping weapons out of the hands of terrorists. Wny not register them every year? As a law-abiding gun-owner, I have no problem with that. If someone has purchased a thousand guns in the course of a year and can''t account for any of them, that person is a terrorist and should go to jail.

[kailumego1]

Considering the "violent mentality" of some students and the rash of school shootings, forearmed is better than being a "sitting duck".

As long as the gun is kept out of sight from students and why not teach self-defense classes to teachers along with enabling them armed protection.

If teachers had been armed then incidents like Columbine and Virgina Tech wouldn''t have reach such a "bloody" climax..

Why not arming teachers?

Maybe if students knew teachers were being armed, but, however, didn''t know which ones, then they would be less apt to plot elaborate schemes of mass murder...

[theusa1st]

Wny not register them every year? As a law-abiding gun-owner, I have no problem with that.

Posted by arkadian at 10:54 AM : Oct 09, 2007

I am also a law-abiding gun owner. I have no problems with law inforcement checking my background in order for me to by a gun. But I want the paperwork destroyed
after a certain timeframe so the government does not know. If the government is allowed to know which law-abiding citizens own guns it would be much easier for a corrupt government to take guns away from it''s citizens and then the citizens can''t defend themselves. It has happened throughout history.

[sevenveils]

twenty years ago many high schools had shooting teams. Target shooting was a high school sport and often the schools has practice ranges in a basement. Thanks to outlandish paranoia created by gun control lobbies children are suspended from school for even drawing a crude picture of just a gun!
These anti gun lobbies are worse than al Qaeda because they are indigenously chipping away at constitutional rights and a basic human freedom of expression. Theses lobbies have sing song feel good names and ganer the support of powerful politicians such as the Kennedy''s and the Clinton''s.

The American population needs to take back its congressional representation from lobbyists in general. Each day Americans are loosing their voice to corporate and minority groups with deep pockets and ulterior motives.

A teacher should be allowed to carry a pistol if she/he is licensed and trained in the use and handling of that weapon.

[gunownerdan]

"We live in a world where more and more women are unaccompanied at odd hours, or they are vulnerable in dangerous places - a world where restraining orders are often ineffective and the police cannot be counted upon to arrive in time, if at all. In such a world, women must be able to protect themselves. In terms of both deterrence and lethal force, guns are among the most effective tools available for self-defense." -- Mary Zeiss Stange, "Guns, like abortion, are a matter of choice"

"In being confronted by the reality that government cannot and will not guarantee my personal safety, I am infinitely thankful, both as a woman and an American, that the Bill of Rights still guarantees my right to defend myself with a gun. Any true feminist must support this position. Any woman who claims to be a feminist, but who supports disarmament of law-abiding citizens is simply a dangerous hypocrite."
-- Katherine von Tour, "My Transformation From Anti-Gun Feminist To Armed Feminist"

Self Defense - A HUMAN RIGHT
http://www.a-human-right.com

Second Amendment Sisters
http://www.2asisters.org/

Women To Arms
http://womentoarms.net/

[cryonbrian]

So this teacher does not feel safe in a suburban school full of wholesome intelligent White kids?

[gunnerv1]

Where do I donate money to her defense fund? You go woman! Stand up for your rights! Never back down!

[resqdiver4]

This is a sensitive issue with everyone I see on this posting but let''s put some sense to all of this.

First, for those who support the rights of the constitution she certainly has the right to carry the gun and is licensed to conceal it from view. No problem with that.

Second, carrying a gun on school property, there are pro''s and con''s for both sides of this argument, however, she has the leagl right to carry it as is given to her by the license she holds. Yes, it might bring some concerns for student safety, but I look at it like this: My kid would be safer in a school with the teachers armed to confront terrorists (Foreign or Domestic) invading the school and creating the bllodshed that was Columbine, Virg Tech, and the Amish School. I also believe that with something else, if one teacher is allowed to do it, then all teachers should be properly trained and licensed to handle and carry on school property. This would not only be a deterrent for the students in the school, but would be a big deterrent to anyone thinking of tryibng to attack the school.

In any case, whichever side you are on in this issue, always remember that it is our childrens safety that comes first and foremost. Not making eye contact, and sucumbing to the attackers does not work, read the transcripts of the Columbine shootings, these boys killed innocent people who were begging for their lives.

I say arm the teachers, and prepare to protect our most prized possession, our children.

[gunownerdan]

"How a politician stands on the Second Amendment tells you how he or she views you as an individual ... as a trustworthy and productive citizen, or as part of an unruly crowd that needs to be lorded over, controlled, supervised, and taken care of."
- Suzanna Gratia-Hupp

[ladyjaneg]

So this teacher does not feel safe in a suburban school full of wholesome intelligent White kids?


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Posted by cryonbrian at 11:27 AM : Oct 09, 2007

It says nothing about race. Stop trying to play the race card, it''s obvious that you''re trying to get people to argue and get mad. Really, it''s just pathetic.

[kailumego1]

cryonbrian, although many whites have surreptitiously tried to forge this problem unto others, i.e. blacks Hispanics, etc. "white folks do kill, murder, and maim", but inner-city schools also have a problem with gratuitous violent behavior, obviously not of this magnitude, however, student violence outside the school has been a haunting reality for many black communities..

So black, white, Asian, or Hispanic violence on and away from school property does exist, therefore it would be in the best interest of teachers to arm themselves...

[gunownerdan]

A sign that says "GUN FREE ZONE" to you and me also says "DEFENSELESS VICTIM ZONE" to violent criminals.

Self Defense - A HUMAN RIGHT
a-human-right.com

[abrnteach]

I am a teacher who has taught in many differenct situations - inner city to rural. The only teachers I have ever seen that "needed" to carry guns are the ones who would have them taken away by anyone threatening them. Anyone who is afraid to be in a classroom WITHOUT a gun should not be teaching.

[theseventh-2009]

She''s obviously afraid for herself. I think the husband''s a liar. Now that gun seems more of a danger because everyone knows about it. I can already imagine students thinking of ways to steal it. She has a right to protect herself yes, but it would make me nervous to know about it because of all the possibilities of what could happen. Why in the world did she tell anyone about it or does the school have a metal detector?

[prosperine-2009]

Personally, I think this woman''s private life has spilled over to her affect her work environment, and for that reason, she should be put on paid administrative leave, until she can get her private live in order. Although I am not for gun control, I can see so many ways this scenario of Ms. Katz''s could go wrong, wrong, wrong. How can she guarantee that the kids would be "Safely locked away" efore pulling her gun? She can''t. And if she''s so afraid of her ex storming in, then to be effective at all, the gun would have to be within her reach at all times. Which means in a purse or her desk. Frankly, that scenario doesn''t sit well with me. I wouldn''t want to be in a room where someone is expecting a nut job to come storming in (not saying the ex is a nut job, either; I personally don''t know). But would you want your kids in a room where the potential for that was even a remote possibility? I say she needs to get out iof the classroom, be placed on leave, or moved to an administrative job until she gains control over her personal problems.

[tucano2]

My children are a lot safer in a classroom with a pistol-packing teacher present than they are in a classroom with a defenseless buffoon in attendance having no means to defend herself or her charges against a nut-case. The world was a much safer place when everyone packed heat. At most an attacker might kill one person, but was instantly cut down by a hail of bullets shot by everyone else around, and there were no such things as a kid in college murdering 30+ others.

[hippychicky-2009]

Its true its her 2nd amendment right to bare arms, and even conceal that fact in her state...on that I agree..
But she seems like she has a victim complex...she seems unstable. Whether the threat she percieves is real or make believe.
I would not want my child walking into a school where the teachers are armed.

[pianoman42]

In the land of the unarmed the carrier is king.

[oleander8]

"I think the husband''''s a liar."[Posted by Theseventh]

What do you base your outrageous comment on? I think YOU are an ignorant putz.

[andor3]

why is it the most paranoid commenters seem to also be the most trusting and naive? Students go off, cops go off, mail carriers go off, but you assume an armed teacher is always going to be stable and protective?

If you feel safer with a gun in your home, go ahead. But statistics don''t back that up--packing heat, more likely to be dead meat is the saying I think.

No. Guns do not belong in schools.

[mbpfrance]

A long long time ago in a place called America, the worst thing that could happen to you at school was a snow pie in the face during recess! Times have changed!

As tragic as it is - this teacher is right! We now allow flight attendants and pilots to protect themselves why not teachers as well.

While the sheriff deputies huddled outside Columbine to discuss tactics the shooters killed. The shooter at Virginia Tech essentially had a sitting duck scenario in his hands- except he wasnt the sitting duck and there was NO ONE to challenge him.

Maybe now as part of a school saftey plan, along with posters and metal detectors every school should have weapons trained teachers on board with access to whatever they need to stop a shooter or at minimum uS Marshalls on campus.

Leave It to Beaver left along time ago and there are no lights shining in the hallways anymore.

[prosperine-2009]

After reading the comments of some of the posters, I wonder if some aren''t missing the point. The point, as I see it, is this teacher is bringing her personal problems to work. SHE is the problem. Why should the rest of the school get involved with her mariatal problmes? I mean, if her ex is so dangerous, and there''s a remote chance he''s going to storm in, would you want you kids caught in the crossfire? He pulls a gun, she pulls a gun, innocent lives are lost. This doesn''t have anything to do with bratty, dangerous kids or Columbine, or a race issue or a lack of classroom discipline. She''s arming herself against her own personal problems. While she may feel it is not her fault, or even that she has a right to pack heat, I say I would not want this problem teaching in my child''s classroom!

[Krazcarl]

gunownerdan...I lost my head the other day and quoted you though I''m a bleeding heart liberal I enjoy you perspective see we can all get alomg/

[andor3]

prosperine said: "... I wonder if some aren''''t missing the point. The point, as I see it, is this teacher is bringing her personal problems to work. SHE is the problem. "

Good point and thank you for stepping back and offering a fresh and valuable perspective!

Going further, maybe we should try to figure out WHY there is a risk of violence in schools in every case--whether from teachers personal lives or student issues or whatever. Seems like many people are ready to assume that gun violence in schools is a given and then try to have the teachers outgun the students. Bad idea.

[drywall41]

SPEAK SOFTLY AND CARRY A BIG STICK SOMEONE ONCE SAID..

[yoopermom]

So this teacher does not feel safe in a suburban school full of wholesome intelligent White kids?
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Posted by cryonbrian at 11:27 AM : Oct 09, 2007
Hello, do you not watch the news? Are you only here to stir the pot? To turn this into a *race thing*? Take a look at the school shootings in the past few years Columbine, the Amish School, etc. Most of these massacres are being done by white kids. So why would someone feel safer in a *white* suburban area?

[yoopermom]

Anyone who is afraid to be in a classroom WITHOUT a gun should not be teaching.
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Posted by abrnteach

Well said!

[hippychicky-2009]

Drywall: That was Theodore Roosevelt...he also said
"No man is above the law and no man is below it: nor do we ask any man''s permission when we ask him to obey it."