Iraq's New Danger: Armor-Piercing Grenades

U.S. Army Tells CBS News Al Qaeda Is Killing Soldiers With Grenades

(CBS)  An al Qaeda propaganda video dated Aug. 15, 2006, shows a brazen attack on U.S. soldiers with a hand grenade that's more deadly than any other. The explosion is huge, as three armor-piercing bombs find their target.

It's not a new weapon on the Iraqi battlefield, but CBS News has learned it's being used more now than ever. And for the first time, the Army has admitted this weapon is killing its soldiers.

Capt. Benjamin Jones, of the U.S. Army's 2nd Brigade, 2nd Infantry Div., led CBS News chief foreign correspondent Lara Logan to the place where he lost a young soldier, Jeremiah Vietch, to one of these hand grenades in June.

"The vehicle was right there, and they had thrown a grenade right over that wall," Jones says, pointing to a barrier.

Pfc. Vietch, 21, of Fort Carson's 2nd Brigade "Warriors," died after the explosive penetrated his armored vehicle in Baghdad's violent Dora neighborhood.

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Complete Coverage: America In Iraq: The Road Ahead

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So did "Warriors" Pvt. Steven Davis, less than two weeks later - on the July 4 holiday - also in Dora, a key strategic area al Qaeda desperately wants to take back from U.S. soldiers.

The terrorist group has been eager to take credit for the use of this lethal weapon.

Three months ago, their organization in Iraq announced the creation of a new "Thermal Brigade" and paraded men dressed in black and holding weapons in a video posted on the Internet.

They even used diagrams to show how this Russian-made weapon actually works.

Those diagrams matched military explanations obtained by CBS News: When the pin is pulled and the grenade is thrown, a small parachute is released. It stabilizes the grenade and ensures that it comes down vertically on its target.

The shape charge inside punches through the armor, and slow-burning explosives are released to ensure the deadliest effect.

During the battle in Dora, the Army says more and more of these hand grenades are being used.

In firefights, like the one that suddenly broke out during Logan's visit last week, it's yet another worry for the soldiers.

Capt. Jim Keirsey says the armor-piercing hand grenades were used against his men on a street corner in a massive complex attack that killed five soldiers at the end of July.

In another attack, Staff Sgt. Paul Crenshaw was almost killed by one just a few yards down the road when it was thrown over a wall into his vehicle, wounding him and his gunner.

The soldiers say it's impossible to know when ordinary-looking civilians at the side of the road will suddenly launch their deadly weapons - and that makes attacks like this just about impossible to stop.

[mediabrat60]

DAAAAMMMM!

[one_american]

This would mean that al-Qaeda terrorists would need to be within throwing distance of American troops.

Not a good long-term strategy by the terrorists.

They would more likely wind up shot dead, while their own grenade blows up next to their heads.

[incog-nito]

Since these grenades are Russian-made, I think it''s time to declare war on Russia too.

[forthepeopl1]

SO WHY DONT YOU TELL YOUR LEADER KING BUSH THANKS FOR KILLING YOU..

NOBODY HAS THE BALLS TO DO ANYTHING BUT BE A YES SIR TO THIS PIG.

I WOULD OF SPIT IN HIS FACE WHILE SHAKEING THE **** OUT OF HIM. IF I WAS OVER THEIR.

BUSH YOU ARE LUCKY SO FAR AND YOUR LITTLE TOTO CHENEY TO

[the_mirror]

Rumor: Is it true G.W. & K.C. having an affair (while in Iraq)?

[forthepeopl1]

SORRY BOYS THE WEAPONS THEY ARE USEING CAME FROM RUSSIA THRU THE HANDS OF SAUDIA ARBIA AND CHENEY/BUSH REGEIM..

ALL THIS IS BECAUSE OF THEM

[klifton2-2009]

... and the Bush/Cheney team have the American voting public believing it to be a milk-run! America occupies a country and expects a rousing welcome. You gotta be nuts to believe it!

[the_mirror]

forthepeopl1, isn''t that an oxyMORON?

[libsluvsuvs]

it would be everybody''s best interest that those borders are secured..that any suspicious vehicle is inspected and they dont cooperate..shoot it down.

I am looking towards Iran and Syria.

[ivandrago]

I don''t think Russia is directly supplying these new grenades (but I could be wrong). It''s more likely that Iran has reverse engineered the original. I''m sure the U.S. will have a version pretty soon. It must be terrifying to see a mini-MOAB (mother of all bombs)floating over you.

Now they''re going to have to put a ton of armor on the hummers roof. Everything will be low riders. Pretty the army tanks will be kicking up sparks from the fenders.

Also, even though it''s not really reported that much, the U.S. does kill more of them than they do of us. You''d think they (insurgents) were the only ones getting kills. It''s just that nobody really cares when the insurgents die. They''re quite expendable to people on both sides of the conflict.

[the_mirror]

"TUCK IT, tuck it and run"!!!

[searingtruth]

"Whenever you murder someones child, by hand, bullet, or bomb, their parents believe you are evil."
SearingTruth

"And so death begat death, and suffering begat suffering, until all had been consumed, and all cause lost."
SearingTruth

"Evil was discount, injustice blind to our eye, and deafness a feign of peace to the cries of torture and seal of loss.
Surely, we thought, this will save us."
SearingTruth


A Future of the Brave - www.searingtruth.com

[stevex47]

USAisdway98,

"Time to take off the kid gloves and nuke the place, something that godfather of the Democrats, Gutless, Bigoted, Peanut Boy Carter should have done back in ''''79."

Whoa! I thought things were now okay in Iraq? Your buddy Bush said so.

And um, maybe George Sr. shouldve taken care of business the first time around in Iraq.

Enough of the tough talk, look where it''s gotten you.

[feelfree1]

(2 of 2)

The bottom line remains clear: the war of aggression against Iraq is a heinous and criminal act, the number of individual war crimes committed by our troops is staggering and disgraceful, the penalties doled out by our military justice system have been a joke, and the Iraqi people have every right to defend themselves against the brutal and illegal invaders of their country, against collaborators, and against illegitimate puppet-officials.

There is no question about these realities. What the U.S. military commanders can never admit, is the indisputable fact that is the Iraqi people that we are fighting, torturing, and killing, and not any fictional boogey-men like %u201Cal-Qaeda-in-Iraq%u201D. They must try to maintain the %u201Cal-Qaeda-in-Iraq%u201D myth, in order to justify future atrocities, divide the Iraqi people, and continue to fool the American public into continuing on our present self-destruction course, ensuring the continued transfer of public wealth into the pockets of war profiteers like the Carlyle Group and Halliburton, terrorist-for-rent organizations like Blackwater and Triple-Canopy, and petro-terrorist organizations like Exxon-Mobile and BP, for years to come.

%u201Cal-Qaeda-in-Iraq%u201D is simply Ooga-Booga BS, aimed at justifying this horrible catastrophe, where no such justification exists.

[jowand]

"I WOULD OF SPIT IN HIS FACE WHILE SHAKEING THE **** OUT OF HIM. IF I WAS OVER THEIR".

...and then he did!!!!

BUSH YOU ARE BRAVE AND TRUE SO FAR AND YOUR LITTLE TOTO CHENEY TO
Posted by forthepeopl1 at 07:25 PM : Sep 05, 2007
Posted by The_Mirror at 07:50 PM : Sep 05, 2007

You are very insecure and desparate, it''s all about the 2000 election still; you need councelling before you do yourself some harm.

[billpl-2009]

Gee...Al Qaeda gets all these new weapons and plenty of places to use them

good going Bush
you''ve created the best training ground in the world for terrorists
...we''d been better off leaving them in Afghanistan

[feelfree1]

%u201Cal-Qaeda-in-Iraq%u201D Hoax (1 of 2)

Just a couple of days ago, I was noting the relative absence of fables about the non-existent group %u201Cal-Qaeda-in-Iraq%u201D, and predicting that we would again see an onslaught of %u201Cal-Qaeda-in-Iraq%u201D fairy-tales, as the anniversary of 9/11/01 approaches, and the %u201Cprogress%u201D report is due to explain why the illegal, disgraceful, and self-defeating debacle in Iraq should continue. And here we are, right on time, with a notable escalation of the USA contrived phantom known as %u201Cal-Qaeda-in-Iraq%u201D, just as we recently saw prior to the Democrats%u2019 tepid attempt at an all night debate on the Iraq debacle.

The ever-breathless and deadly war crime apologist known as Ms. Lara Logan, shows up just in time to tell us about an amazing new weapon called: a hand grenade. Ms. Logan attributes the use of this weapon to the imaginary group, %u201Cal-Qaeda-in-Iraq%u201D, and states, without any support at all, that %u201Csoldiers say it''s impossible to know when ordinary-looking civilians at the side of the road will suddenly launch their deadly weapons%u201D, paving the way for our soldiers to execute ever more civilians.

[seven-pesos]

poor, uneducated, ignorant christian south wanted to get bush into the white house...

so the south could get its hands on the treasury.

now, amerika is $8.7 trillion in debt.

the south doesn''''t care. the south has no money.

the rich, hardworking, educated blue states will pay.

the south provides the war and the debt.

war, hate, christian snakes, republican freaks...

nothing good comes out of the south.

[jowand]

al-Qaeda-in-Iraq%u201D, and states, without any support at all, that %u201Csoldiers say it''''s impossible to know when ordinary-looking civilians at the side of the road will suddenly launch their deadly weapons%u201D, paving the way for our soldiers to execute ever more civilians.

Posted by FeelFree1 at 08:17 PM : Sep 05, 2007

You got that right it is impossible to know when ordinary looking citizens in Iraq will suddenly shoot and kill people.
By the way Hillary "KFC Thighs" Clinton acknowledges what Al Quaeda is doing in Iraq.

[jowand]

nothing good comes out of the south.
Posted by seven-pesos at 08:19 PM : Sep 05, 2007

Hey one too many pesos, any wild parties going on in North Korean tonight?

[iceman_1960]

A very poor return on America''s 4+ year investment, no matter how Bush tries to spin it:

"September 5, 2007

WASHINGTON - Iraq''s security forces will be unable to take control of the country in the next 18 months, and Baghdad''s national police force is so rife with corruption it should be scrapped entirely, according to a new independent assessment.

The study, led by retired Marine Corps Gen. James Jones, is a sweeping and detailed look at Iraq''s security forces that will factor heavily into Congress'' upcoming debate on the war. Republicans see success by the Iraqi forces as critical to bringing U.S. troops home, while an increasing number of Democrats say the U.S. should stop training and equipping such units altogether."

Source:

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070905/ap_on_go_ca_st_pe/us_iraq

[feelfree1]

jowand,

Re: "You got that right it is impossible to know when ordinary looking citizens in Iraq will suddenly shoot and kill people."

As I have already established, it is the ordinary citizens of Iraq that we are fighting, torturing, and killing, and they have every right to defend themselves against the brutal and illegal invasion of their land.

Re: "By the way Hillary "KFC Thighs" Clinton acknowledges what Al Quaeda is doing in Iraq."

Are you implying that this would somehow add credibility to the "al-Qaeda-in-Iraq" fables?

[jowand]

The study, led by retired Marine Corps Gen. James Jones, is a sweeping and detailed look at Iraq''''s security forces that will factor heavily into Congress'''' upcoming debate on the war. Republicans see success by the Iraqi forces as critical to bringing U.S. troops home, while an increasing number of Democrats say the U.S. should stop training and equipping such units altogether."

Source:

http://news.y
ahoo.com/s/ap/20070905/ap_on_go_ca_st_pe
/us_iraq
Posted by Iceman_1960 at 08:27 PM : Sep 05, 2007

Congress should either vote to defund the war or shut up and get the job done

[iceman_1960]

RE: "Iraq''s security forces will be unable to take control of the country in the next 18 months"

For the math challenged, that''s a year and a half.

Clearly, war supporters don''t have that much time to put a happy face on this ugly quagmire.

[starleo146]

Subject: Ronald Reagan in his recently published diaries, May 17, 1986.

Quote:

"A moment I''''''''''''''''ve been dreading. George [Bush] brought his ne''''''''''''''''re-do-well
son around this morning and asked me to find the kid a job. Not the
political one who lives in Florida. The one who hangs around here all
the time looking shiftless. This so-called kid is already almost 40
and has never had a real job. Maybe I''''''''''''''''ll call Kinsley over at The New
Republic and see if they''''''''''''''''ll hire him as a contributing editor or
something. That looks like easy work."-- Ronald Reagan in his recently
published diaries, May 17, 1986.

I thought some of you would enjoy this just got it on a e-mail I died laughing he hasn''''''''''''''''t changed one bit.
Posted by starleo146 at 08:20 PM : Sep 05, 2007

[iceman_1960]

"Congress should either vote to defund the war or shut up and get the job done"
- Posted by jowand at 08:30 PM : Sep 05, 2007

It''s a job only Muslim Iraqis can get done.

What does it take to get into your thick skull, the idea that a big army of White Christian Westerners is not going to pacify Muslim Iraq ????

[iceman_1960]

RE: "What does it take to get into your thick skull, the idea that a big army of White Christian Westerners is not going to pacify Muslim Iraq ????"

jowand has the typical "Welfare State Mentality."

He thinks the answer to every problem is massive intervention by Big Government in Washington.

The problems in Iraq obviously cannot be solved by Big Washington Government intervention.

jowand''s beloved Welfare State is not the answer in Iraq.

[feelfree1]

Re: "al-Qaeda-in-Iraq%u201D is simply Ooga-Booga BS"

For anyone who honestly believes in the "al-Qaeda-in-Iraq%u201D fables, I will again point to the fact that they always appear just when the Bush regime needs them most, and I will ask you to note just how quickly and fiercely the Bush regime apologists show up to try to discount the possibility that this group is little more than a "Made-in-USA" psy-ops campaign.

[searingtruth]

Fellow Citizens,

For over six years Bush and his henchmen have told us that only three things were necessary for the success of America.

Inhumanity, lawlessness, and greed.

They were wrong.

About everything.

On September 15, 2007 tens of thousands of Americans from all over our nation are converging in Washington D.C. for an impeachment/anti-war march.

This day will start the beginning of a week of action to restore our Constitution to this land and end Bush''s war of aggression.

impeachbush.org has all the information you need to attend, and we need every loyal American who can make it to be there.

Do you want an end to this war?

Do you want our Constitution and the rule of law it embraces restored to this land?

Do you want to see those who have subverted our Constitution brought to justice, as a warning to all those who would think it possible again?

Then I will see you there fellow patriots, unless I''m illegally abducted and placed in one of Bush''s secret prisons forever, without charge or representation, during my journey to Washington D.C.

The time for complaining is over, the time for action is here.
ST


"When everything is secret, everything is legal."
SearingTruth

"My fellow citizens, the truth is that the Constitution fails to defend itself, enduring only in the brave hearts of those who would uphold it."
SearingTruth, A Future of the Brave

"Too often we have been caught between word, and action."
SearingTruth

A Future of the Brave - www.searingtruth.com

[seven-pesos]

the south will vote for the candidate that campaigns on christian values...

it doesn''''t matter if this candidate is the best qualified.

the south thinks that the most religious is the best qualified candidate.

that''s how america got bush...

ha,ha,ha.

what a bunch of christian creeps that control the politics in the south.

ha,ha,ha....anti-american confederate creeps.

that''s the south for you, folks!

[iceman_1960]

Re: "By the way Hillary "KFC Thighs" Clinton acknowledges what Al Quaeda is doing in Iraq."

Hillary Clinton is 60 years old.

I have never seen a woman that age, quite as attractive as Hillary is.

Not even Adrienne Barbeau, Connie Stevens or Condoleezza Rice.

[iceman_1960]

"That''s how america got bush...

ha,ha,ha."
- Posted by seven-pesos at 08:46 PM : Sep 05, 2007

He was born in New Haven.

It just proves what I''ve been saying for ages.

Nothing good comes out of Connecticut.

[seven-pesos]

southerners hope to elect another faith professing, conservative republican.

the south hopes to win the all time loser''s award.

jefferson davis lost his war...
johnson lost his war...
bush will lose his war...

if the south can lose just one more war,

they will beat the french for most wars lost... ever!

ha,ha,ha.

those idiot southern republican christian creeps ought to stay in church and out of politics

the south can''t be depended upon to do the right thing for america.

[the_mirror]

jowand,

just to be clear! This was posted by oxymoron - - forthepeopl1 -

you copied my rewrite of the post. i am perfectly ok with the 2000 election.

SO WHY DONT YOU TELL YOUR LEADER KING BUSH THANKS FOR KILLING YOU..

NOBODY HAS THE BALLS TO DO ANYTHING BUT BE A YES SIR TO THIS PIG.

I WOULD OF SPIT IN HIS FACE WHILE SHAKEING THE **** OUT OF HIM. IF I WAS OVER THEIR.

BUSH YOU ARE LUCKY SO FAR AND YOUR LITTLE TOTO CHENEY TO
Posted by forthepeopl1 at 07:25 PM : Sep 05, 2007

[seven-pesos]

everybody knows the south elected and supported that snake, bush.

now, america sees the south for what they are.

war making, bible thumping, flag waving, phony christian, crooked republican pieces of phony dixie *****.

yeah, southerners...america''s getting a good look at you dixie creeps...

and they don''t like what they see.

nothing good comes out of the south!

[feelfree1]

Ms. Logan has some work to do on her poopaganda production skills.

Re: "In another attack, Staff Sgt. Paul Crenshaw was almost killed by one just a few yards down the road when it was thrown over a wall into his vehicle, wounding him and his gunner."

a. Was it "just a few yards down the road", or was it "thrown...into his vehicle"?

b. If the grenades are "armor-piercing", why on earth would they need to be thrown "inside" of his vehicle? Did his vehicle have a sun-roof?

c. If these grenades were really something special, and as lethal as is being portrayed here, how could these soldiers have endured the detonation of one, from INSIDE their vehicle, and escaped with only wounds, when a run-of-the-mill "fragmentation" grenade would have almost certainly killed the victims of such a close-range, enclosed attack.

Can I get a witness?

[jowand]

Are you implying that this would somehow add credibility to the "al-Qaeda-in-Iraq" fables?

Posted by FeelFree1 at 08:29 PM : Sep 05, 2007

You tell me, she is your fearless leader not mine, is she a liar or a con artist?????

[iceman_1960]

Another item from Reagan''s Diaries:

Dated April 1996:

"I must say I''m impressed by this Hillary Clinton. She seems to be true Presidential material. I''ve always felt that Bill Clinton would have defeated me easily in any presidential race, but that goes double for Hillary. I''m sure I would have lost in a landslide to her.

Perhaps someday soon, if America is lucky, she will be known as President Hillary Clinton."

[j-whitman]

Hey anyone recognize these guys ??? They work in the White House, thier job is to follow Bush around ----- He doesn''t cast a shadow

[the_mirror]

Seven-pi55e5,

You are right the south elected Bush, now tellus who is your daddy?

[seven-pesos]

unfortunately for america, the south murdered abraham lincoln before he could reconstruct the south.

the civil war did nothing to change the south.

even to this day the south is not really part of america.

i guess you could call them our poor, reborn, belligerent, war making southern cousins.

ha,ha,ha.

war, hate, christian creeps, republican snakes.

nothing good comes out of the south.

[ksjeff-2009]

Its true, the Southern United States is full of a bunch of redneck idiots who put Bush in office. What a shame that a formerly Democratic region now supports a failed political ideology that is ruining democracy and the American way of life. I wonder if the swamp-runners have learned their lesson yet?

[iceman_1960]

seven-pesos is bitter about not being invited to participate in the "Redneck Games" in Georgia.

"Some events that are held during the Redneck Games include:

The cigarette flip

Bobbing for pig''s trotters

Seed spitting

Toilet seat throwing

Mud pit belly flop

Big-hair contest

Wet T-shirt contest

Armpit serenade

Bug zapping by spitball

Dumpster diving

Hubcap hurling

For each of the events, a trophy is awarded; a half crushed, empty mounted beer can."

Source:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Redneck_Games

[searcher911]

I sure am tired of reading all of the really stupid, defeatist, non-productive, stupid (worth repeating) garbage that seems to pass for commentary on any issue. I wonder what the liberal idiots will be talking about when Bush is out of office? My guess is that they most likely will continue to be all lathered up for quite a while as they will continue to blame him as being the cause of all evil in the world. (It being politically incorrect to even suggest that somehow it could be a problem with radical Muslims.)

[feelfree1]

jowand,

Re: "Are you implying that this would somehow add credibility to the "al-Qaeda-in-Iraq" fables?"

Posted by FeelFree1 at 08:29 PM : Sep 05, 2007

You tell me, she is your fearless leader not mine,"

Again you tap your bottomless well of stupidity for your information. She is certainly not my leader, and I would never accept a disgusting, war-mongering AIPAC-owned, former Wal-Mart Board member as my "leader".

Bush...Clinton...Bush...Clinton...give me a break!

Re: "is she a liar or a con artist?????"

Both, in my opinion. Why would you ask me to choose?

At any rate, you seem to be trying to distract from the fact that "al-Qaeda-in-Iraq" appears to be little more than a contrived hoax.

[seven-pesos]

any bad fortune that befalls the republican party is well deserved.

war, enormous debt, hypocrite christians, perverts, pedos, homos, evangelist creeps, 1000''''s and 1000''''s dead in the middle east, bush, cheney, abramoff...

the list goes on and on.

yeah, those republican creeps deserve the worst punishment.

christian snakes, republican creeps...

nothing good comes out of the south.

[iceman_1960]

"I sure am tired of reading all of the really stupid, defeatist, non-productive, stupid (worth repeating) garbage that seems to pass for commentary..."
- Posted by searcher911 at 09:13 PM : Sep 05, 2007

You mean "not worth repeating", don''t you ?

Not "worth repeating".

And I just repeated some of your trash.

D*amn.

[the_mirror]

It amazes me how 1/4 to 1/3 of the country controls all the rest.

Must be mind control on election day, then you are released so you can stay angry till next election.

[iceman_1960]

RE: Post by badaxmofo at 09:18 PM : Sep 05, 2007

Come on now, that was intended as satire.

You knew that.

[cbs_oliver]

Lara writes, "Those diagrams matched military explanations obtained by CBS News."

The use of passive tense always shows a desire to hide information - in this case the source of the military explanations and the diagrams.

Lara writes "Dora, a key strategic area al Qaeda desperately wants to take back from U.S. soldiers" and "the terrorist group has been eager to take credit for the use of this lethal weapon".

I never trust a story that reports what other people or groups want or think or are eager about rather than what they say.

Notice that Lara does not report what US command and US soldiers want or think or are eager about. She reports what they say.

Lara is a better propaganda person that intelligence analyst or news person it seems.

She often writes very well but this is not a good example. Maybe she didn''t write it herself.