Former U.S. Officials Back Detainee Rights

Retired Military And Diplomats Join Foreign Dignitaries Supporting Rights For Gitmo Prisoners

(CBS/AP)  Two dozen retired diplomats, two rear admirals and a Marine general joined 383 current or former members of the European and British parliaments on Friday in urging the U.S. Supreme Court to grant detainees at Guantanamo Bay full access to the U.S. court system.

Lower court rulings supporting the Bush administration's opposition to full court access "were seized upon by repressive governments as a license to incarcerate their own citizens and others with impunity," wrote the 25 retired American diplomats.

In June, the Supreme Court agreed to take the detainees' case, reversing a decision in April not to hear arguments over whether the prisoners can use federal courts to challenge their confinement. Court filings by the Bush administration in the case are due on Oct. 9.

The 383 European politicians of divergent political views said it is important that even when faced with the threat of international terrorism, all states, including the United States, comply with the standards set by international humanitarian law and human rights law by granting full court access.

"The treatment of petitioners currently falls short of these standards," the European diplomats said.

Currently, the 355 detainees at the U.S. prison in Cuba have only narrowly structured appeal rights. They are entitled to a single civilian court review of their status as enemy combatants, a designation made by three-member military panels. The detainees have no legal counsel before the military panels, which rely largely on classified information that the detainees are not allowed to see.

The panels, called Combatant Status Review Tribunals, have been tainted by the permissible use of evidence obtained by torture, said a court filing by two former Navy judge advocates general and the former senior legal adviser for the U.S. Marine Corps.

"If the United States holds prisoners indefinitely — potentially lifetime imprisonment — based on sham CSRT proceedings and without providing meaningful judicial review of their imprisonment, enemies in current or future conflicts may use that as an excuse to mete out similar treatment to captured American military forces," the three wrote.

They are Brig. Gen. David M. Brahms, senior legal adviser for the Marine Corps from 1985-88; Rear Adm. Donald J. Guter the Navy's judge advocate general from 2000-2002; and Rear Adm. John D. Hutson, the Navy's judge advocate general from 1997-2000.

[undermyboot]

These Bush and Cheney fascism lovers like xzavierbrown see no limit to Presidential power and no depravity unworthy of our country. At every step they demand that the Congress be nothing more than a rubber stamp for every un-American policy they want. If they don''t get the rubber stamp then they just do it anyway under the false concept of "Unitary Executive". In other countries this is called "Dictatorship". Bush calls it being "the decider". Most Americans are awaking to this, but the dead-enders like xzavier have their monkey heads up their monkey master''s azz. The repug monkeys who support these dictators and fascists are not Americans. They think "American" means supporting anything the President wants- and scr*w the Constitution. Not Americans.

%u201CThat propaganda is good which leads to success, and that is bad which fails to achieve the desired result. It is not propaganda%u2019s task to be intelligent, its task is to lead to success.%u201D- Joseph Goebbels, Nazi Propaganda Minister

Looks like this is where xzavierbrown, Fake News, Rush, and the rest of the propaganda monkeys in the government zoo learned how to throw their own mindless sh*t and call it "brilliant". LMFAO

[oletafive]

I am a Native American and a Viet Nam Vet. The country I fought for, and believe we still are, allows all men the right to be heard in court. The executive branch of government is not allowed to assume the duties of judge and jury.

There are many laws I do not agree with but we agree to let the court decide their worth. Presidents who choose to operate outside of the law should be held accountable to the law. I hope that is the lesson we learned from Gerald Ford when he pardoned Nixon for going outside the law. We are the country that should be operating at the highest standards--George Bush has taken our honor I hope I am not alone when I say we want it back.

[j-whitman]

xzavierbrown,,,, Now you are issuing death threats on line against Americans, you want to pay 20 grand to cut our heads off ???

My military experiance ??? Just a measly 20 years in our Silent Service --- Price Runs Deep,, Death Before Dishonor

[j-whitman]

Here''''''''s the real story -
-- Iraqi deaths doubled,,, Congressmen went to Iraq on last visit for the usual Petreaus presentation & typical showboat guided tour all Rosey..
,, Iraq leaders say the US is still in charge of everything including appointing governemt & intel officials,
,, There still is not 1 Irarqi leading thier missions --
--- It is still the same "Wackamo" as it was 4 years ago,, & we have limited control of part of Bagdad & a few cities...
.. Our America''''''''s Own Republicans Are Sworn To Party Loyalty Rather Than Honor To America

[flreason]

xzavierbrown-Back to support your viewpoint through personal attacks, I see. Thought you had checked out. BTW, sorry to disappoint your stereotyping--I''m a female senior citizen with a daughter in the military. I don''t support terrorists and extremists of any persuasion, whether Muslim or homegrown fundamentalist Christians who support a Middle East war to hasten the second coming and rapture they anticipate. Fanatics are so self- and ideology-centered that they would sacrifice our freedoms, our economy and another generation of U.S. military for what they expect will be their moment(s) of glory. Ditto for fanatics in other countries. But we would surely appreciate your volunteering to go over there to protect our freedoms.

Also BTW-last count of prisoners at Gitmo-355. Hardly enough to wreak the kind of havoc with the judicial system that you suggest. In fact, if the government had to actually substantiate their claims in a court of law, probably most of the detainees would be repatriated to their homelands-the majority apparently not Iraqi, but rather Saudi. Go figure. Makes you wonder whether the Saudi royals might be a tad two-faced. But, hey, if they''re good pals of the Bush family they must be okay.

[rafterman1]

===The war in Iraq is a catasrophy for anti-war liberals EVEN BEFORE IT HAPPENED..this whole war is a catasrophy is a failure for anti-war people like you.===

That doesn''t even make sense. If anything, Iraq shows the anti-war people were right.

===but you are too stupid to understand that..for you we kill osama..the war is over..we get out of iraq or middle east..terrorist ends..we give money to live8 poverty ends in africa....ITS MORE COMPLEX THAN THAT..===

You are right, it is more complex than that. You think the US is going to go into Iraq and alter a thousand years of tribal warfare in five years because we bring democracy? In the last fifty years, history has shown that any interference from outside powers trying to impose a system of government and a way of life on an indigenous people has almost always failed. The French in Vietnam, the US in Vietnam, the Russians in Afghanistan, even the Israelis in Lebanon. All have failed and have been disasters.

[xzavierbrown]

xzavierbrown,,,, What the hell are you another Ted Nugent Coward Flag Waver who also ran from active duty ????
Posted by j-whitman at 06:06 PM : Aug 25, 2007
+ report abuse

******

dont tell me you served??were you under the "dont ask dont tell" policy?? part of the notorious pink 66th bridage??

[xzavierbrown]

xzavierbrown,,,, What part of Catistrophic Failure in Iraq Don''''t you understand, or for that matter even keeping the same idiot running around loose that lied to our nation & caused it ???



Posted by j-whitman at 06:15 PM : Aug 25, 2007

***************

The war in Iraq is a catasrophy for anti-war liberals EVEN BEFORE IT HAPPENED..this whole war is a catasrophy is a failure for anti-war people like you. Now..if you can open you eyes a little bit more pass that Micheal Moore poster..you can see that terrorists that are detained at Gitmo DID NOT JUST COME FROM IRAQ..but FROM ALL OVER THE GLOBE...but you are too stupid to understand that..for you we kill osama..the war is over..we get out of iraq or middle east..terrorist ends..we give money to live8 poverty ends in africa....ITS MORE COMPLEX THAN THAT..but of course you havent had any new materials from Micheal Moore to move forward with that "iraq is a disaster" at least the Micheal Moore himself is smart enough to move his fat arse out of that crusade. Even if we get out of Iraq..THERE WILL BE TERRORISTS becuase they are all over the globe..sh*t I would not be suprised if you are hiding one in your basement).
THAT OVERWHELMING AMOUNT OF CAPTURED TERRORISTS IN OUR CIVILIAN COURT SYSTEM WILL PRETTY MUCH MAKE IT MOVE TO A CRAWL

[j-whitman]

xzavierbrown,,,, What part of Catistrophic Failure in Iraq Don''t you understand, or for that matter even keeping the same idiot running around loose that lied to our nation & caused it ???

[j-whitman]

xzavierbrown,,,, What the hell are you another Ted Nugent Coward Flag Waver who also ran from active duty ????

[j-whitman]

xzavierbrown,,,, ENLIST GIRL, YOU CAN STILL GET 20 GRAND IF YOU HURRY..... EXCUSE ME, YOU''LL ONLY GET 10 GRAND, THE REST IN INSTALLMENTS IF YOU LIVE

[j-whitman]

xzavierbrown --- WHAT PART OF TAX CUTS IN WAR TIME THAT CAN''T PAY FOR AN ADEQUATE JUSTICE SYSTEM OR REPUBLICANS DESIRE FOR LESS ACCOUNTABILITY DON''T YOU UNDERSTAND ---- THE DAYS OF HANG EM HIGH ARE LONG GONE WITH JUDGE ROY BEAN

[xzavierbrown]

SORRY MY LIBERAL NEMESIS..I HAVE TO HAVE A LIFE NOW...so before your girls all get giddy that I am gone..remember..these people hate f aggots like you..THE THINGS THEY DO WITH QUE ers are amazing.

CANT THESE PEOPLE GET THIER WHATEVER THEY WANT OVER WITH??? WHO ELSE CAN CLEANSE THIS PLANET OF FA GS AND LIBERALS....BUT THE MUSLIM FAITH..HURRRRAHH!

[xzavierbrown]

xzavierbrown,,,, Are you one of those "Battle Cry" Christian terrorists that have declared war on America in God''''s name ?????
Posted by j-whitman at 03:20 PM : Aug 25, 2007
+ report abuse

**********

Listen, I am not a christian nor a catholic nor an athiest. I am seeing this at the point of our available resources we have..OUR CIVILIAN COURT SYSTEM does not have enough resources. WHAT PART OF ''WE DONT HAVE ENOUGH RESOURCES TO ACCOMODATE'' DO YOU NOT UNDERSTAND??? SO when you presumptious little friends are done acting like little *** King kids trying to hide behind the issue of terrorism to use against your true **** sexual agendas then you guys should THINK..if you care much about these so-called innocent muslims..THINK about that ones that will be dragged into a system that is already overwhelmed..it would take more time to get his/her day in court..NOT TO MENTION MORE OF MY TAXES...

[j-whitman]

Rafterman1,,, From what I saw of the Padilla trial,, You counld have convicted Mary Poppins, Bugs Bunny, & Elmer Fudd ------ TTTThat''s All Folks.

[j-whitman]

Rafterman1,,, I read the same wistle blower article..
.. In 1999 I blew the wistle on the Defense Reutilization & Marketing Office in San Diego for selling classified & controlled equipment to the public, from night vision goggles to test sets for the W-84 nuclear warheads..
.. Duncan Hunter refused to accept my evidence, it about drove me nuts.. 4 years later the FBI knocked on my door, I was being set up for theft...
. I gave the agent all my evidence & was he ever surprised ----- I think some of those people lost thier jobs finally, they all should have gone to federal prison.

[rafterman1]

===Rafterman1,,,, xzavierbrown was exposed,, She cut & ran from discussion.===

LOL. Yeah, and I know it''s a waste of time. Honor is subjective. You either believe our government has been acting dishonorably in regards to the detainees or you don''t. I can''t "prove" my point. On top of that, a number of guys have been released from Gitmo, apparently not guilty of anything. Yet we are being asked to trust the government on who''s guilty and innocent? Look at Padilla. Once he got a fair trial, he was found guilty. But what happened in the three years before that trial? He was not picked up on the battlefield, he was an American citizen picked up in Chicago, held in secret for three years and tortured. And few said anything about it. How this cannot scare anyone is beyond me.

[rafterman1]

I just finished reading the article about how whitleblowers lives are destroyed by the government and the corporations that are fleecing America. It''s shocking what has happened to people who show some integrity. Tell me xzavierbrown if those people are accurately reporting wrongdoing that is going on in the US government, did they deserve the treatment they got?

When it comes to losing our civil rights, don''t say "it can''t happen here". Because it is happening right here, right now.

[flreason]

xzavierbrown--Sweetie, you sound positively Jeffersonian when you call for a revolution. Seems to me that none of your buddies who are running the country now ever served in the military. You might be surprised whose side the military might take. There are still a lot of patriots on active duty, and even more who are vets, who would be glad to sweep this group of corrupt armchair warriors out on their keisters.

The military justice system, as practiced by Bush Inc., guarantees that the detainees won''t get a fair trial because they simply seal all of the charges against them and label them classified information. Their version of justice is: "You are guilty because we say you are." Who wouldn''t trust that system? ROFLMAO

[j-whitman]

Rafterman1,,,, xzavierbrown was exposed,, She cut & ran from discussion.