Iraq Military: 175 Killed By Suicide Bombs

U.S. Military Puts Death Toll At About 30; Meanwhile, 5 U.S. Troops Killed In Helicopter Crash

(CBS/AP)  Four suicide bombers hit Kurdish Yazidi communities in northwest Iraq with nearly simultaneous attacks on Tuesday, killing at least 175 people and wounding 200 others, the Iraqi military said.

However, the U.S. military says only about 30 people were killed, reports CBS News chief foreign correspondent Lara Logan. The attack happened so far north of Baghdad, in such a remote desert region, that it's very difficult to get exact information.

If the Iraqi count is right, this would be the highest death toll in a concerted attack since Nov. 23, when 215 people were killed by mortar fire and five car bombs in Baghdad's Shiite enclave of Sadr City.

Tuesday's bombs tore through the districts near Qahataniya, 75 miles west of Mosul, Iraq's third-largest city, said Abdul-Rahman al-Shimiri, the top government official in the area, and Iraq army Capt. Mohammed Ahmed.

The Yazidis are part of a tiny minority, with only about 500,000 people left in the world, reports Logan. The ancient, primarily Kurdish, religious sect worships an angel figure some that Christians and Muslims believe to be the devil.

Al-Shimiri and Ahmed said at least 30 homes were destroyed in the bombings.

Dhakil Qassim, mayor of Sinjar, a town near where the attacks occurred, said al Qaeda in Iraq was behind the bombings, citing what he said were Kurdish government intelligence reports.

"This is a terrorist act and the people targeted are poor Yazidis who have nothing to do with the armed conflict," Qassim said. "Al Qaeda fighters are very active in this area near the Syrian border."

U.S. helicopters swooped into the area to evacuate the wounded to hospitals in Dahuk, a Kurdish city near the Turkish border about 60 miles north of Qahataniya.

Civilians cars and ambulances also rushed the wounded to hospitals in Dahuk, police said.

Elsewhere on Tuesday, a U.S. transport helicopter crashed near an air base west of Baghdad, killing five troops, the military said.

The CH-47 Chinook helicopter was conducting a routine post-maintenance test flight when it went down near Taqaddum air base, said 1st Lt. Shawn Mercer, a Marine spokesman.

He said emergency response crews had sealed off the site and the cause was still under investigation. A military statement later said five American service members were killed in the crash.

The deaths raised to at least 3,700 members of the U.S. military who have died since the Iraq war started in March 2003, according to an Associated Press count.

The air base is about 45 miles west of Baghdad in restive Anbar province, a Sunni insurgent stronghold that has become calmer in recent months as tribal leaders have joined forces against al Qaeda in Iraq.

In Baghdad, Abdel-Jabar al-Wagaa, the senior assistant to Oil Minister Hussain al-Shahristani, was spirited away by more than 50 gunmen wearing security forces uniforms and driving what were believed to be military vehicles, said Assem Jihad, the oil ministry spokesman.

An Interior Minister official, speaking anonymously because he was not authorized to release the information, said a top official in the State Oil Marketing Organization and three directors general in the operation also were kidnapped.

The official said five bodyguards were wounded in the raid on the State Oil Marketing Organization complex in eastern Baghdad.

Five Britons were seized May 29 in a similar raid on Iraq's Finance Ministry, not far from the oil marketing office. They were taken by gunmen wearing police uniforms and have not been found.

Both government organizations are near the lawless Sadr City Shiite enclave, a stronghold of the Mahdi Army militia.

The raid also was reminiscent of an attack by Mahdi Army fighters, dressed as Interior Ministry commandos, who stormed a Higher Education Ministry office Nov. 14 and snatched away as many as 200 people. Dozens of those kidnap victims were never been found.

Jihad said the kidnappers Tuesday were an "armed gang" and took the deputy minister from his home in the compound. He said the gunmen stole a number of cars from the compound, most of them belonging to the marketing organization.

In other developments:

In June, U.S. and Iraqi soldiers rescued 24 starving orphans found emaciated, wounded and tied to beds in Baghdad. Lara Logan has the latest on the young orphans and the soldiers who rescued them.

16,000 U.S. and Iraqi troops began a new operation north of the Iraqi capital targeting insurgents who have fled a crackdown in the restive city of Baqouba, the military said Tuesday.

The Army's top general said Tuesday that lengthening U.S. tours of duty in Iraq and Afghanistan beyond the current 15 months would be too stressful and risky for troops. Gen. George Casey, the Army's chief of staff, also said he didn't know when officials would be able to cut the length of soldiers' tours back to 12 months. "I don't see going beyond the 15 months," Casey said. "I've been there in Iraq, I've watched the nature of the combat and the stresses and strains that it puts on these soldiers."

Iraq's most senior Sunni politician issued a desperate appeal for Arab nations to help stop what he called an "unprecedented genocide campaign" by Shiite militias armed, trained and controlled by Iran. Adnan al-Dulaimi said "Persians" and "Safawis," Sunni terms for Iranian Shiites, were on the brink of total control in Baghdad and soon would threaten the Sunni Arab regimes that predominate in the Mideast.

© MMVII, CBS Interactive Inc. All Rights Reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten, or redistributed. The Associated Press contributed to this report.

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by radiob-2009 August 13, 2007 6:17 AM PDT

But his fears of a Shiite takeover of Baghdad were not as farfetched. Mahdi Army militiamen have cleansed entire neighborhoods of Sunni residents and seized Sunni mosques. Day by day, hundreds have been killed and thousands have fled their homes, seeking safety in the shrinking number of majority Sunni districts.


Arabs, your brothers in the land of the two rivers and in Baghdad in particular are exposed to an unprecedented genocide campaign by the militias and death squads that are directed, armed and supported by Iran," al-Dulaimi said.



He is speaking in "present tense"? Meaning that the daily death tolls in Iraq specifically Bagdad are higher than what is being reported.

Reply to this comment

by tbweb August 13, 2007 6:22 AM PDT

Where has this guy been the last 5 years? Thousands of Iraqi's killed with the active assistance of Iran and now this guy speaks up! Adnan al-Dulaimi is so late he's absent! I've been saying this all along! A Shiite is a Shiite first and an Iraqi second. The reason there is no Political progress in Iraq is because of a Shiite conspiracy preventing it! The results speaks for itself, the Shiite's want total control.

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by brianbwb-2009 August 13, 2007 6:31 AM PDT

But what he calls "genocide" is not, it is simply the predictable power struggle that always occurs in a sudden power vacuum, such as Bush created.

Minutes before his lynching, Saddam warned "not to trust Iran", just another example of how he told the truth, while Bush was telling lies.

Genocide is elimination, by mass murder of an ethnic group, Shia and Sunni are of the same ethnic heritage in Iraq, and Iran.

Of course, the illiterati in Washington DC, and their sycophants will accept this redefinition of the word, and use it as excuse to invade Iran.

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by mcvet August 13, 2007 6:51 AM PDT

Oh not to worry! President Stupid will stick his head out of the White House and tell all his simple minded followers to Stay the Course and everything will be just fine. LOL So which side do we take there all you swastika huggers? After all you wouldn't listen to those of us who have been there before and now you have a situation where the Incompetent fuhrer has gotten us square in the middle of a war that's only been going on now for 2000 years. Don't all of you feel so proud, especially when it never had to be because there was NO REASON for it. Sieg Heil Y'all. Come on now all you Klan Members out there let's shout it out so the World can hear... SIEG HEIL BUSH!!

Reply to this comment

by prinzowhales August 13, 2007 6:57 AM PDT

No background on this guy other than "senior Sunni politician"...with an e-mail account. I am curious why he would choose AP to report--What?--a genocide in progress?...

Associated Press would be selected if he--and the people behind his 'plea'--were interested in presenting a raison d'etre to the American people for a continued presence in Iraq.

I suspect they will be kicking off a new and broader PR campaign to justify the war, rather like this..."We stepped on this ant hill, you see, and if we move our foot, the ants will stop biting us and start biting each other...so we got to stay, OK?"

The foreign fighters entering the country are from the Wahabi-land next door run by House Saud...our buddies who with ISI and CIA helped create al Qaeda...the guys we flew to safety in Pakistan when they needed to beat feet when the Taliban lost physical control of the cities in Afghanistan.

The idea that the Shia want to expand a reputed ethnic cleansing of Sunni beyond the borders of Iraq can be used as well as a justification for cross border terrorism against Iran on the Sunni front, while using the US protected terror-cult situated on the Iraqi-Iranian border in destabilization missions against Iran, trying to pit Sunni against Shia in Iran.

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by bluestardad August 13, 2007 7:03 AM PDT

THE SUNNIS ARE KILLING AMERICANS AND ARE BEING BACKED BY SAUDI ARABIA!

THE HOUSE OF SAUD ARE BUSH FAMILY FRIENDS!

15 OF THE 19 911 HIJACKERS WERE FROM SAUDI

BIN LADEN IS FROM SAUDI!

WHEN DO WE ATTACK SAUDI?

VOTE REPUBLICAN STAY THE COURSE!

DRINK MORE KOOL-AID!

Reply to this comment

by pastdue1 August 13, 2007 7:35 AM PDT

"At a news conference Sunday, al-Maliki defended his Iranian sojourn and said he would continue traveling to neighboring countries and asking for help to curb violence. He was expected to be in Syria next week, but the trip has not been announced.
"Iraq has turned into the center of terrorism. Iraq will only succeed through reconciliation," he said. "

It appears that the Bush administration has bet on the wrong horse again. Maliki is more afraid of Saudi Arabia than Iran and is going to turn to someone who can handle the situation.

Hopefully, with Rove leaving the scene, maybe the radical decisions can be mitigated. Additionally, perhaps it is time for the Congress to ask for an investigation into some of Cheney's dealings and issue him a subpoena, it's prudent to keep him busy now with something other than Iran.

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by brianbwb-2009 August 13, 2007 7:45 AM PDT

"Saddam Hussein's cousin known as "Chemical Ali" and 14 other defendants will face charges in the brutal crushing of a Shiite uprising after the 1991 Gulf War".

Almost funny, they face charges for doing what Bush is doing now.

..."and death squads that are directed, armed and supported by Iran,"

Just as Saddam said they would.

"The fighters, nominally loyal to radical Shiite cleric Muqtada al-Sadr, are believed to operate as death squads blamed for much of the country's sectarian slaughter."

These are the people Bush handed Saddam over to, to be lynched before he could snitch on Bush.

"apparently lured into an al Qaeda trap."

So now we know the political affiliations of a trap?

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by space_poet August 13, 2007 7:47 AM PDT

Regarding this article. Yea, so is Saudi Arabia, and Pakistan, and Turkey, and The United States for that matter, what's your frickin point?

They want to spread this war into Iran, cause they have the final reserves of oil we are looking for and to complete our entire hostile takeover of the middle east. If that happens, we will be paying for that mistake as well for generations to come.

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by brianbwb-2009 August 13, 2007 7:52 AM PDT

The troops were killed Saturday in Arab Jabour, a district just south of Baghdad where Shiite militiamen and al Qaeda linked fighters have battled for control and are now under attack by soldiers of the 3rd Infantry Division.

So let me get this straight, the US is anti Shia and also accuse the Sunni of being Al Qaeda. The two groups are fighting for control, and the US is killing both from the outside. In other words "kill all Iraqis, in order to protect Iraqis"

Time to come home soldiers, your commander in chief has proven himself unfit to command, now you're over there dying for absolutely nothing.

We will need your experience and help to take our country back from the sociopaths running it, don't waste any more of your lives defending your other enemies, come help us defeat your true enemy here.

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by prinzowhales August 13, 2007 9:19 AM PDT

bluestardad--How do you know where the alleged hijackers were from? The BBC reported that a minimum of seven of the alleged nineteen are still alive. The FBI has not changed the names of the accused.

On the morning of 9-11, Mr. Porter Goss of the CIA and Senator Graham, both then of their chambers respective intelligence committees were having breakfast with General Mahmoud Ahmad of the Pakistani ISI, who wired $100,000 to the alleged leader of the hijackers--Mohammed Atta.

9-11 was a crime planned and executed by Americans, who stood down NORAD and murdered over 3000 Americans on 9-11. I wish people would look at the evidence and stop accepting every lie that the Washington Regime and its propaganda arm tell.

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by fredgrad2000 August 13, 2007 11:00 AM PDT

To start - Prinzowhales is an idiot, period.

To the topic at hand - al-Dulaimi is of course correct; the Iranians from day 1 have been involved unconstructively (to put it mildly) in Iraq. And they have succeeded in their goals far more brilliantly than we have ours. Does anyone believe Iran WANTED a strong, stable, Shiite democracy next door that was an ally of the US and against terrorism!? COME ON!! IRAN is the central bank of terror and by far and away the leading STATE sponsor of terrorism. Their Shiites are repressed under a Mullah-cracy - so of course they don't want a Shiite-democracy next door stirring up democratic desires in their own repressed populace. And as the Mullahs view the US as the "great Satan", they also of course do not want an ally and 100k+ battle-hardened, victorious US troops next door, while having 20k on their easter border as well!! So what do you do if you're the mullahs - you do just what they have been and are now doing: fund, arm, and train Shiite fundamentalists and even other Sunni insurgents to ensure Iraq cannot become a model Shiite-majority democracy; this also prevents the US from re-positioning (keeping us bogged down) to face down their own terror activities and nuke desires!!

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by fredgrad2000 August 13, 2007 11:06 AM PDT

Cont'd...to the point I have made previously; our failures in Iraq are a result of an invasion that in hindsight we shouldn't have undertaken and mis-management of the post-war period once we had gone in, but it is clear as day, that if we leave now, if we "lose" formally, the WINNER is Iran...their allies will control Southern Iraq and the Rumailia (sp?) oilfield; giving the mullahs effectively a veto over almost 18% of the world's oil; which will make it even harder to stop their nuke ambitions due to the increased leverage this will give them to economically blackmail opponents and bribe supporters like China or Russia in the UN. They also will have bloodied the US enough that our politicians will never have the backbone to take out the mullahs even if they cross the nuke threshold or even step UP their terror activities thru Hezbollah, Hamas, Islamic Jihad. Iran de facto controlling Iraq and most of its oil, facing a bloodied, scared-to-pull-the-trigger US, with its proxies in "power" in Iraq, and them as the unchallenged regional power in the mideast as a result? I would call that a victory for them, and would be the result if we left in full from Iraq today.

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by grazinggoat August 13, 2007 11:54 AM PDT

Fredgrad, you%u2019re quite right about your vision. It%u2019s obvious that the target of every war is to take control of one%u2019s own resources. The idiots, who decided to invade Iraq dreaming that we (USA) would be able to control that area, were some real ones. This is Middle-East where all invaders ended up leaving or embedded into the local population by integrating to it and becoming themselves more resilient against newer invaders. The PNAC and AIPAC, their lack of vision and lack of knowledge are to blame. The greedy idiots at the Walking-Liar%u2019s administration are to blame too. Iran had a mission and they think they are more entitled to protect that area than we obviously are, and definitely they are a lot more intelligent as strategists than our flashy pink and yellow-tied politicians who sit on spend their afternoon golfing for better business relationship with their bosses.

PNAC and AIPAC have been on an adventure without exit strategy from Iraq. I regret to tell that we are losing the influence war in Iraq and in the Middle-East. This failure is a real shame on our administration but don%u2019t worry, it will be presented to the Americans as a shiny wrapped win over %u2018TeRRaRRRiSSSSSt%u2019.

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by prinzowhales August 13, 2007 2:24 PM PDT

fredgrad--I noticed you didn't try to refute what this "idiot" posted with regard to the seven (minimum of) living hijackers. Is the BBC an "idiot" as well? They, as well as other MSM sources reported on this as well...they all dropped the topic rather quickly...I'm guessing they didn't want to disturb the sheep...obviously, they didn't disturb you...

Iran does want stability on its frontiers. They worked with the Taleban in appreciation of their real Drug War (as opposed to the American faux-Drug War). They view Iraq as a market which they can supply. A stable, unified Iraq would deal with the American supported terrorists on its frontier and the Kurdish problem. If anyone opposes stability in the region, it is Bush/Cheney and their backers--that's pretty obvious...we even have Cheney arguing the case for not removing Saddam in the early 1990s. When they fired the Iraqi army and the police that was like a big neon sign blinking on and off in the night..."We don't want stability"...."We don't want stability"...."We don't want stability"...

Ahamadinejad's election was more honest than either of the Bush elections, and, as far as the mullahs go, nine un-elected bench monkeys and a host of other legislators on the bench are as bad as any mullahs. It was the mullahs on the Supreme Court who gave Bush his first election.

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by j-whitman August 13, 2007 2:46 PM PDT

fredgrad2000,,,, Speaking of Mullah'a, you've still got all the evangelist & Southern Baptist Mullahs to get rid of & thier Mega-Madrassa's.

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by j-whitman August 13, 2007 3:45 PM PDT

Funny,,,, Sunni's are fighting Bush's Proxy war against Iran, their historical enemy's -
-- The Bush & Sunni War aginst a democraticly elected Shiite government in a war started by Bush that is creating thier own Genocide of over 8 million Iraqi's facing starvation & disease, & another 4 million displaced in neighboring countries facing similar delima's.
---- KIND OF LIKE THE POT CALLING THE KETTLE BLACK ---

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by j-whitman August 13, 2007 7:26 PM PDT

This Sunni sounds like Bush,, Sunni's must be the middle eastern version of a republican,,,,, It's only genocide if your enemy does it..... Bush created a genocide in Iraq that will make Hitler's look like child's play.

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by navyretired2 August 13, 2007 8:33 PM PDT

"General Mahmoud Ahmad of the Pakistani ISI, who wired $100,000 to the alleged leader of the hijackers--Mohammed Atta."

I've heard that a few times, but haven't yet seen any substantial "proof" or solid evidence about it. You have any links?

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by grazinggoat August 13, 2007 9:54 PM PDT

CBS News: 'Al-Maliki's government %u2014 a shaky coalition of Shiites, Sunnis and Kurds %u2014 has been gutted by boycotts and defections. A full-scale disintegration could touch off power grabs on all sides and seriously complicate U.S.-led efforts to stabilize Iraq.'

-What else to expect? Can we force them to sit in Parliament and govern if they don't wanno? Walking-Liar now wishes he could revive SadDamm, doesn't he? He was a good governor after all, wasn't he?

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by sgtrds August 13, 2007 9:56 PM PDT

-What else to expect? Can we force them to sit in Parliament and govern if they don't wanno? Walking-Liar now wishes he could revive SadDamm, doesn't he? He was a good governor after all, wasn't he?

Posted by grazinggoat at 09:54 PM : Aug 13, 2007

You'll never get a right winger to admit it out loud, but even they have to realize that as far as American interests Iraq was better off under Saddam.

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by radiob-2009 August 13, 2007 10:15 PM PDT

In a hidden corner of Rome's busy Fiumicino Airport, police dug quietly through a traveler's checked baggage, looking for smuggled drugs. What they found instead was a catalog of weapons, a clue to something bigger. Their discovery led anti-Mafia investigators down a months-long trail of telephone and e-mail intercepts, into the midst of a huge black-market transaction, as Iraqi and Italian partners haggled over shipping more than 100,000 Russian-made automatic weapons into the bloodbath of Iraq.


Death for sale to the highest bidder.How many of these "partners" are KGB,CIA and Quds force?

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by jankebenz August 13, 2007 10:22 PM PDT

You are now with child and you will have a son. You shall name him Ishmael, for the LORD has heard of your misery.
He will be a wild donkey of a man; his hand will be against everyone and everyone's hand against him, and he will live in hostility toward all his brothers. (NIV, Genesis 16)

this text dates back some 5000 years and since all ******,sunnis,kurds, and other muslims are decendants of Ishmael we know why there is and always has been so much conflict in the east. The fighting amongst themselves is bad enough , but when the aggression spread to outside their borders something had to be done,and since they can't seem to live peacefully with each other they need baby sitting
High time for the US and other nations to quite fooling around, and exercise some real disipline there for everyones good

Reply to this comment

by red164 August 13, 2007 10:31 PM PDT

http://www.prisonplanet.com/articles/august2007/130807Cheney.htm

Video Surfaces of Cheney, in 1994, Warning That An Invasion of Iraq Would Lead to 'Quagmire'

Editor & Publisher
Monday Aug 13, 2007

Video Surfaces of Cheney, in 1994, Warning That An Invasion of Iraq Would Lead to 'Quagmire'

Editor & Publisher
Monday Aug 13, 2007

The transcript of this segment is below.

Here is the transcript. The YouTube address is at the end.
*

Q: Do you think the U.S., or U.N. forces, should have moved into Baghdad?

A: No.

Q: Why not?

A: Because if we'd gone to Baghdad we would have been all alone. There wouldn't have been anybody else with us. There would have been a U.S. occupation of Iraq. None of the Arab forces that were willing to fight with us in Kuwait were willing to invade Iraq.

Once you got to Iraq and took it over, took down Saddam Hussein's government, then what are you going to put in its place? That's a very volatile part of the world, and if you take down the central government of Iraq, you could very easily end up seeing pieces of Iraq fly off: part of it, the Syrians would like to have to the west, part of it -- eastern Iraq -- the Iranians would like to claim, they fought over it for eight years. In the north you've got the Kurds, and if the Kurds spin loose and join with the Kurds in Turkey, then you threaten the territorial integrity of Turkey.

It's a quagmire if you go that far and try to take over Iraq.

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by navyretired2 August 13, 2007 10:40 PM PDT

"You are now with child and you will have a son. You shall name him Ishmael, for the LORD has heard of your misery.
He will be a wild donkey of a man; his hand will be against everyone and everyone's hand against him, and he will live in hostility toward all his brothers. (NIV, Genesis 16)

Posted by jankebenz at 10:22 PM : Aug 13, 2007"

Firstly, you'd have to believe in the most widely printed fictional tale of all time...the bible...to be able to blame it for today's problems. I don't, and don't.

The reality is today's problems, as well as the world's problems for over the past century, can be directly contributed to international banker control. The proof is bountiful, the characters real, the conspiracy theory not a theory. The Federal Reserve Bank is owned by five British banks...how's that grab ya?

Jimmy Carter, Bill Clinton, Ronald Reagan, and various other "prominent" Americans have given control of this nation to these elites, and have perpetuated their control via money that is backed by nothing. THEY are the ones that decide who goes to war where, when, and how.

The latest sub-prime lending issue is directly relative as well. In their quest for complete control of Americans, these elites made financial controlling moves that directly effected this problem, and the resulting changes in bank activity regarding their requirements on these types of loans (more than half banks are now tighter on their requirements for approving these loans).

Reply to this comment

by j-whitman August 13, 2007 10:44 PM PDT

jankebenz-- Then you're talking about a draft,, We can't sustain with the troops we have...

But, republicans would oppose the draft & if called they wouldn't serve... The best example I can give you is George W. Bush, who ran from active duty..... Then boasted about being a National Guard fighter pilot.

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by j-whitman August 13, 2007 10:49 PM PDT

NavyRetired2,,, These Bush Lovers resort to religious rhetoirc to avoid reality... I agree, they 1st lowered the banking standards on loans to get thier so-called "Ownership Society" -
- When that bubble burst, what did they do ?? Weaken the allready weakened American dollar by putting more money in circulation ----- Who are they fooling ??? Looks like it's effecting the world markets too.

Reply to this comment

by aaabee-2009 August 13, 2007 10:50 PM PDT

"Iraq's prime minister appeared to clear the way Monday, with a last-minute push from the U.S. ambassador, for a crisis council that seeks to save his crumbling government."

Can anyone tell me WHAT the US is doing PUSHING anyone over in that newly DEMOCRATIZED country of theirs, with their FREE elections and other lies? Did we not know, going in, that Iraq has a triune of warring factions that have never agreed throughout history and did we not know that one or more of those factions would have to take over governmental duties once we rid the world of one Evil Dictator? Was that not mentioned in the pre-war intelligence?

The US is pushing? WHY!!! We liberated them, didn't we, for democracy? Isn't their government their business? Does anyone see any Iraqis over here, PUSHING for thing one in our government?

Doesn't anyone else find the gapping chasm between the words of Iraqi freedom, democracy, and free elections blathered at the US people and the actual actions of US representatives overseas to be at complete odds with each other?

Doesn't it **** anyone else off that we are taken for such idiots by these rich spoon-fed morons with caviar for brains and marble fixtures for hearts?

Phew, had to get that off my chest...thanks....:)

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by navyretired2 August 13, 2007 10:57 PM PDT

"Posted by j-whitman at 10:49 PM : Aug 13, 2007"

Indeed Sir.

1: Lower standards for approving loans to people, making MASS increases in floating mortgage monies owed to the banks.

2: Make financial moves that show discredit and distrust in this realm of sub-prime lending, showing no faith in the ability of middle class Americans to pay their house note.

3: Banks call in their debts, funnelling a big, quick chunk of cash directly to the international banks that already print and control over half of the world's money anyway.

Not hard to understand (obviously not hard, since a dumb dumb like me gets it).

Meanwhile, these same "Elites" are controlling world opinion through global media control, and are directly pulling the strings on governments acting agsinst other governments. It's SO HUGE! There's nothing the average Joe can do about it, except trudge on, hoping he'll be able to take care of his own. It's the illusion this country and the world has been under for centuries.

Until such time as these elites aren't making enormous profits off the Iraq war, unrest and destruction in the middle east will not stop.

Reply to this comment

by j-whitman August 13, 2007 11:03 PM PDT

NavyRetired2,,,, You seem smarter than me on these financial matters.... By the way, please don't call me sir, I retired an E-6. Go Navy

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by jankebenz August 13, 2007 11:20 PM PDT

Firstly, you'd have to believe in the most widely printed fictional tale of all time...the bible...to be able to blame it for today's problems. I don't, and don't.
Posted by NavyRetired2 at 10:40 PM : Aug 13, 2007

If its so fictional ,then how did the bible so accuratly foretell so many future events icluding the astonishing rebirth of Israel, after some 2300 years. It also predicts a very major war in the east involving nuclear warfare by many nations . Lo and behold that prediction is happening before our eyes. Sorry but that kind of writing is real to be fiction

Reply to this comment

by aaabee-2009 August 13, 2007 11:20 PM PDT

Rove shouted out: %u201CHey Kimsey, it must have been wonderful to see the happy faces on all those liberated Iraqis!%u201D

Kimsey was appalled. %u201CAre you nuts?%u201D he replied. He tried to tell the president%u2019s political guru that the Iraqis he saw were sullen and resentful

But Rove wanted to hear nothing of it. %u201CNice talking to you,%u201D Rove responded and walked away.

%u201CIraq will be in a better place,%u201D as the surge continues, he said.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/20251378/site/newsweek/site/newsweek/


Unless you are personally involved, The Surge to you is only what you are fed.

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by jankebenz August 13, 2007 11:57 PM PDT

jankebenz-- Then you're talking about a draft,, We can't sustain with the troops we have...
Posted by j-whitman at 10:44 PM : Aug 13, 2007

True perhaps but remember it took the combined efforts of many countries to finally stop hitler
jankebenz


Posted by j-whitman at 10:49 PM : Aug 13, 2007

Posted by NavyRetired2 at 10:57 PM : Aug 13, 2007


Firstly: I am not a Bush lover but I don't hate him either

Secondly j-whit and navy, you both talk about world finance controls and the ensueing monetary catastrophe, I agree , but since you both are anti bible I just have to point out the biblical prophesies made long ago regarding end time financial corruption and control Read it, you will be amazed

Reply to this comment

by navyretired2 August 14, 2007 12:07 AM PDT

"Posted by jankebenz at 11:57 PM : Aug 13, 2007"

I have read it, several times in fact. Ask yourself one question though. Are all of the predictions of previous civilizations and societies, that MIRROR what some of the prophecies detail in the bible, eventhough dated centuries BEFORE the bible, are they accurate as well?

Of course your answer will be no, since that will basically debase the entire foundation of christianity.

I won't say that the bible is 100% false, I just propose that it's not 100% correct. The most believable lies are the lies that have truth sprinkled in.

The current troubles in Iraq, I fear, are merely precursor to further, more widespread, almost global problems in the not so distant future. Doesn't matter WHO is president or PM of Iraq. Once the bankers have milked the Iraq cash cow, they'll move on.

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by navyretired2 August 14, 2007 12:10 AM PDT

"NavyRetired2,,,, You seem smarter than me on these financial matters.... By the way, please don't call me sir, I retired an E-6. Go Navy
Posted by j-whitman at 11:03 PM : Aug 13, 2007"

Hahaha no disrespect intended! The "Sir" has more to do with my upbringing than what I call the diaper dandies in the Navy (in most cases, I felt like I was saying a bad word when I addressed them...they simply hadn't earned it) :)

Reply to this comment

by navyretired2 August 14, 2007 12:16 AM PDT

"Posted by jankebenz at 11:20 PM : Aug 13, 2007"

My apologies if I offended, I would never presume to tell you what to believe, I'm simply stating what I think.

You could, however, do some research into previous basis for various foundational occurences in the bible (i.e. birth of christ, crusifiction and subsequent ascendancy and the cosmic basis for each) that happened centuries prior to Adam and Eve, and it would put a whole new spin on Genesis, if you looked at it open mindedly.

Reply to this comment

by sgtrds August 14, 2007 12:26 AM PDT

"NavyRetired2,,,, You seem smarter than me on these financial matters.... By the way, please don't call me sir, I retired an E-6. Go Navy
Posted by j-whitman at 11:03 PM : Aug 13, 2007"

Hahaha no disrespect intended! The "Sir" has more to do with my upbringing than what I call the diaper dandies in the Navy (in most cases, I felt like I was saying a bad word when I addressed them...they simply hadn't earned it) :)


Posted by NavyRetired2 at 12:10 AM : Aug 14, 2007

Someone addressed me as "sir" one time on here and I told them that I was a Sgt (E4 when I got out), not an officer, which meant I worked for a living. He got all over me because he said he had been an officer and that if he'd heard me say something like that in the service he'd have written me up on an Article 15. I told him he was full of sh*it and that that most officers couldn't find their own as*s without a NCO showing them how. That didn't sit well with him either. I wonder why?

:-)

Reply to this comment

by micma-2009 August 14, 2007 12:30 AM PDT

Iraq is crumbling, even as they say the surge is working.

Reply to this comment

by navyretired2 August 14, 2007 12:40 AM PDT

"I told him he was full of sh*it and that that most officers couldn't find their own as*s without a NCO showing them how. That didn't sit well with him either. I wonder why?

:-)
Posted by SgtRDS at 12:26 AM : Aug 14, 2007"

Truth hurts :)

Reply to this comment

by gramto7 August 14, 2007 12:59 AM PDT

Someone addressed me as "sir" one time on here and I told them that I was a Sgt (E4 when I got out), not an officer, which meant I worked for a living. He got all over me because he said he had been an officer and that if he'd heard me say something like that in the service he'd have written me up on an Article 15. I told him he was full of sh*it and that that most officers couldn't find their own as*s without a NCO showing them how. That didn't sit well with him either. I wonder why?

:-)
Posted by SgtRDS

Sgt Randal
You and my late husband would have gotten along just fine!! He felt the same way about officers. He retired MSgt USAF. Unfortunately I lost him 4 years ago... MAN do I miss that wicked sense of humor!

Reply to this comment

by gramto7 August 14, 2007 1:02 AM PDT

"General Mahmoud Ahmad of the Pakistani ISI, who wired $100,000 to the alleged leader of the hijackers--Mohammed Atta."

I've heard that a few times, but haven't yet seen any substantial "proof" or solid evidence about it. You have any links?
Posted by NavyRetired2

http://melbourne.indymedia.org/news/2004/08/76366.php

http://www.cooperativeresearch.org/timeline.jsp?timeline=complete_911_timeline&the_isi:_a_more_detailed_look=mahmoodahmed

http://www.btinternet.com/~nlpwessex/Documents/SheikhMahmood.htm

http://www.infowars.com/articles/sept11/biden_admits_post_911_meeting_with_hijackers_financier.htm

http://crimesofthestate.blogspot.com/2007/05/pakistani-smoking-gun-of-911.html

Reply to this comment

by sgtrds August 14, 2007 1:31 AM PDT

You and my late husband would have gotten along just fine!! He felt the same way about officers. He retired MSgt USAF. Unfortunately I lost him 4 years ago... MAN do I miss that wicked sense of humor!
Posted by gramto11 at 12:59 AM : Aug 14, 2007

I am sorry to hear of your loss. I know I was taught in Basic Training that the USAF would fold up and fall over without the NCO's and when I went to my first duty station I found out all the good officers thought so too. Or sure once in awhile we had to "break in" some young Lt fresh out of the Academy who thought otherwise, but the Col usually pulled him aside before we were too rough on him and let him know he should drop the attitude a bit.

:-)

Reply to this comment

by sgtrds August 14, 2007 1:34 AM PDT

Truth hurts :)

Posted by NavyRetired2 at 12:40 AM : Aug 14, 2007

All the best officers knew that they needed to lean on their Sgt's if they were to have any kind of a successful career in the military. Some just never got that message and ...well...they never made it past O3. I guess some of those type still carry the scars. LOL!

;-)

Reply to this comment

by brianbwb-2009 August 14, 2007 1:47 AM PDT

The scenario is unfolding exactly as Saddam predicted, just before George Bush and Moqtada Al Sadr lynched him.

Think he knew something George didn't?

Reply to this comment

by jankebenz August 14, 2007 2:06 AM PDT

I have read it, several times in fact. Ask yourself one question though. Are all of the predictions of previous civilizations and societies, that MIRROR what some of the prophecies detail in the bible, eventhough dated centuries BEFORE the bible, are they accurate as well?
Posted by NavyRetired2 at 12:07 AM : Aug 14, 2007


Respectfully: which civilizations predated genisis and what prophesies mirrored bibical ones

Reply to this comment

by neoconrcrazy August 14, 2007 3:30 AM PDT

It's was a sure thing this phony bush war would open Pandora's box;

Maliki will fall, Al-Sadr's shias will take control of iraq and the alliance with iran will be cemented. The sunnis will be beaten to submission, and the kurds will bring in the turks in the north, intentionally or not. oil from iraq & iran will flow east to china,india,japan. Calls for war against iran will increase. global terror against America will rise, forcing us to spend more and more to protect ourselves -

thank you bushit, the phony leader.

Reply to this comment

by feelfree1 August 14, 2007 3:57 AM PDT

"Why we stand for immediate withdrawal of all U.S. troops from Iraq"

"THE U.S. occupation of Iraq has not liberated the Iraqi people, but has made life worse for most Iraqis."

"Tens of thousands of U.S. service people have been killed or maimed, and hundreds of thousands of innocent Iraqis have lost their lives as a result of the U.S. invasion in 2003, the ongoing occupation, and the violence unleashed by them."

"Iraq's infrastructure has been destroyed, and U.S. plans for reconstruction abandoned. There is less electricity, less clean drinking water, and more unemployment today than before the U.S. invasion."

"All of the justifications initially provided by the U.S. for waging war on Iraq have been exposed as lies; the real reasons for the invasion %u2014 to control Iraq's oil reserves and to increase U.S. strategic influence in the region %u2014 now stand revealed."

"We call on the U.S. to get out of Iraq %u2014 not in six months, not in a year, but now."

www.ipetitions.com/petition/Out
Now/

Reply to this comment

by feelfree1 August 14, 2007 4:12 AM PDT

Re: "U.S. military officials earlier in the day announced a third major operation since additional U.S. troops arrived earlier this year. The targets of this operation are said to be al Qaeda in Iraq and Iranian-allied Shiite militia fighters."

It almost sounds like these unnamed, unknown, officers of some branch or another of the military, would have us "believe" that the imaginary and fabled "al-Qaeda-in-Iraq" network, is now "linked" with "Iranian-allied Shiite militia fighters".

See how that works? "al-Qaeda"..."Iraq"..."Iran"..."al-Qaeda"..."Iraq"..."Iran"...Oh, and it's nearly 9/11...."al-Qaeda"..."Iraq"..."Iran"..."9/11"...TERRA...Bombs away...Mission Accomplished!!!

CBS is doing a fairly good job of promoting an illegal and suicidal war of aggression against Iraq.

Will we fall for it, again?

Reply to this comment

by darknico84 August 14, 2007 4:25 AM PDT

Hello world,

You cannot say that your governement wasn't aware about what going to invade Iraq could result in. Remember the harsh and rude campaign America made against France in these times ! Remember the speech of Dominique DeVillepin in the United Nations Assembly warning you about going there. Caus of its arrogance, USA has thrown the whole world into a big mess ... lighting a match in a room full of black powder.
Lets hope things will finally get better ... but for now we can only have hopes nothing more !

Reply to this comment

by feelfree1 August 14, 2007 4:28 AM PDT

"Fatigue Cripples US Army In Iraq"

"But it is in the soldiers themselves - and in the ordinary stories they tell - that the exhaustion of the US military is most obvious, coming amid warnings that soldiers serving multiple Iraq deployments, now amounting to several years, are 50 per cent more likely than those with one tour to suffer from acute combat stress."

"The army%u2019s exhaustion is reflected in problems such as the rate of desertion and unauthorised absences - a problem, it was revealed earlier this year, that had increased threefold on the period before the war in Afghanistan and had resulted in thousands of negative discharges."

www.commondreams.org/archive/2007/08/12/3129


"It's not individual atrocity," Specialist Garett Reppenhagen, a sniper from the 263rd Armour Battalion, said. "It's the fact that the entire war is an atrocity."

http://news.independent.co.uk/world/americas/article2758829.ece


"I do not know with what weapons World War 3 will be fought, but World War 4 will be fought with sticks and stones." Albert Einstein

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[radiob-2009]

But his fears of a Shiite takeover of Baghdad were not as farfetched. Mahdi Army militiamen have cleansed entire neighborhoods of Sunni residents and seized Sunni mosques. Day by day, hundreds have been killed and thousands have fled their homes, seeking safety in the shrinking number of majority Sunni districts.


Arabs, your brothers in the land of the two rivers and in Baghdad in particular are exposed to an unprecedented genocide campaign by the militias and death squads that are directed, armed and supported by Iran," al-Dulaimi said.



He is speaking in "present tense"? Meaning that the daily death tolls in Iraq specifically Bagdad are higher than what is being reported.

[tbweb]

Where has this guy been the last 5 years? Thousands of Iraqi's killed with the active assistance of Iran and now this guy speaks up! Adnan al-Dulaimi is so late he's absent! I've been saying this all along! A Shiite is a Shiite first and an Iraqi second. The reason there is no Political progress in Iraq is because of a Shiite conspiracy preventing it! The results speaks for itself, the Shiite's want total control.

[brianbwb-2009]

But what he calls "genocide" is not, it is simply the predictable power struggle that always occurs in a sudden power vacuum, such as Bush created.

Minutes before his lynching, Saddam warned "not to trust Iran", just another example of how he told the truth, while Bush was telling lies.

Genocide is elimination, by mass murder of an ethnic group, Shia and Sunni are of the same ethnic heritage in Iraq, and Iran.

Of course, the illiterati in Washington DC, and their sycophants will accept this redefinition of the word, and use it as excuse to invade Iran.

[mcvet]

Oh not to worry! President Stupid will stick his head out of the White House and tell all his simple minded followers to Stay the Course and everything will be just fine. LOL So which side do we take there all you swastika huggers? After all you wouldn't listen to those of us who have been there before and now you have a situation where the Incompetent fuhrer has gotten us square in the middle of a war that's only been going on now for 2000 years. Don't all of you feel so proud, especially when it never had to be because there was NO REASON for it. Sieg Heil Y'all. Come on now all you Klan Members out there let's shout it out so the World can hear... SIEG HEIL BUSH!!

[prinzowhales]

No background on this guy other than "senior Sunni politician"...with an e-mail account. I am curious why he would choose AP to report--What?--a genocide in progress?...

Associated Press would be selected if he--and the people behind his 'plea'--were interested in presenting a raison d'etre to the American people for a continued presence in Iraq.

I suspect they will be kicking off a new and broader PR campaign to justify the war, rather like this..."We stepped on this ant hill, you see, and if we move our foot, the ants will stop biting us and start biting each other...so we got to stay, OK?"

The foreign fighters entering the country are from the Wahabi-land next door run by House Saud...our buddies who with ISI and CIA helped create al Qaeda...the guys we flew to safety in Pakistan when they needed to beat feet when the Taliban lost physical control of the cities in Afghanistan.

The idea that the Shia want to expand a reputed ethnic cleansing of Sunni beyond the borders of Iraq can be used as well as a justification for cross border terrorism against Iran on the Sunni front, while using the US protected terror-cult situated on the Iraqi-Iranian border in destabilization missions against Iran, trying to pit Sunni against Shia in Iran.

[bluestardad]

THE SUNNIS ARE KILLING AMERICANS AND ARE BEING BACKED BY SAUDI ARABIA!

THE HOUSE OF SAUD ARE BUSH FAMILY FRIENDS!

15 OF THE 19 911 HIJACKERS WERE FROM SAUDI

BIN LADEN IS FROM SAUDI!

WHEN DO WE ATTACK SAUDI?

VOTE REPUBLICAN STAY THE COURSE!

DRINK MORE KOOL-AID!

[pastdue1]

"At a news conference Sunday, al-Maliki defended his Iranian sojourn and said he would continue traveling to neighboring countries and asking for help to curb violence. He was expected to be in Syria next week, but the trip has not been announced.
"Iraq has turned into the center of terrorism. Iraq will only succeed through reconciliation," he said. "

It appears that the Bush administration has bet on the wrong horse again. Maliki is more afraid of Saudi Arabia than Iran and is going to turn to someone who can handle the situation.

Hopefully, with Rove leaving the scene, maybe the radical decisions can be mitigated. Additionally, perhaps it is time for the Congress to ask for an investigation into some of Cheney's dealings and issue him a subpoena, it's prudent to keep him busy now with something other than Iran.

[brianbwb-2009]

"Saddam Hussein's cousin known as "Chemical Ali" and 14 other defendants will face charges in the brutal crushing of a Shiite uprising after the 1991 Gulf War".

Almost funny, they face charges for doing what Bush is doing now.

..."and death squads that are directed, armed and supported by Iran,"

Just as Saddam said they would.

"The fighters, nominally loyal to radical Shiite cleric Muqtada al-Sadr, are believed to operate as death squads blamed for much of the country's sectarian slaughter."

These are the people Bush handed Saddam over to, to be lynched before he could snitch on Bush.

"apparently lured into an al Qaeda trap."

So now we know the political affiliations of a trap?

[space_poet]

Regarding this article. Yea, so is Saudi Arabia, and Pakistan, and Turkey, and The United States for that matter, what's your frickin point?

They want to spread this war into Iran, cause they have the final reserves of oil we are looking for and to complete our entire hostile takeover of the middle east. If that happens, we will be paying for that mistake as well for generations to come.

[brianbwb-2009]

The troops were killed Saturday in Arab Jabour, a district just south of Baghdad where Shiite militiamen and al Qaeda linked fighters have battled for control and are now under attack by soldiers of the 3rd Infantry Division.

So let me get this straight, the US is anti Shia and also accuse the Sunni of being Al Qaeda. The two groups are fighting for control, and the US is killing both from the outside. In other words "kill all Iraqis, in order to protect Iraqis"

Time to come home soldiers, your commander in chief has proven himself unfit to command, now you're over there dying for absolutely nothing.

We will need your experience and help to take our country back from the sociopaths running it, don't waste any more of your lives defending your other enemies, come help us defeat your true enemy here.

[prinzowhales]

bluestardad--How do you know where the alleged hijackers were from? The BBC reported that a minimum of seven of the alleged nineteen are still alive. The FBI has not changed the names of the accused.

On the morning of 9-11, Mr. Porter Goss of the CIA and Senator Graham, both then of their chambers respective intelligence committees were having breakfast with General Mahmoud Ahmad of the Pakistani ISI, who wired $100,000 to the alleged leader of the hijackers--Mohammed Atta.

9-11 was a crime planned and executed by Americans, who stood down NORAD and murdered over 3000 Americans on 9-11. I wish people would look at the evidence and stop accepting every lie that the Washington Regime and its propaganda arm tell.

[fredgrad2000]

To start - Prinzowhales is an idiot, period.

To the topic at hand - al-Dulaimi is of course correct; the Iranians from day 1 have been involved unconstructively (to put it mildly) in Iraq. And they have succeeded in their goals far more brilliantly than we have ours. Does anyone believe Iran WANTED a strong, stable, Shiite democracy next door that was an ally of the US and against terrorism!? COME ON!! IRAN is the central bank of terror and by far and away the leading STATE sponsor of terrorism. Their Shiites are repressed under a Mullah-cracy - so of course they don't want a Shiite-democracy next door stirring up democratic desires in their own repressed populace. And as the Mullahs view the US as the "great Satan", they also of course do not want an ally and 100k+ battle-hardened, victorious US troops next door, while having 20k on their easter border as well!! So what do you do if you're the mullahs - you do just what they have been and are now doing: fund, arm, and train Shiite fundamentalists and even other Sunni insurgents to ensure Iraq cannot become a model Shiite-majority democracy; this also prevents the US from re-positioning (keeping us bogged down) to face down their own terror activities and nuke desires!!

[fredgrad2000]

Cont'd...to the point I have made previously; our failures in Iraq are a result of an invasion that in hindsight we shouldn't have undertaken and mis-management of the post-war period once we had gone in, but it is clear as day, that if we leave now, if we "lose" formally, the WINNER is Iran...their allies will control Southern Iraq and the Rumailia (sp?) oilfield; giving the mullahs effectively a veto over almost 18% of the world's oil; which will make it even harder to stop their nuke ambitions due to the increased leverage this will give them to economically blackmail opponents and bribe supporters like China or Russia in the UN. They also will have bloodied the US enough that our politicians will never have the backbone to take out the mullahs even if they cross the nuke threshold or even step UP their terror activities thru Hezbollah, Hamas, Islamic Jihad. Iran de facto controlling Iraq and most of its oil, facing a bloodied, scared-to-pull-the-trigger US, with its proxies in "power" in Iraq, and them as the unchallenged regional power in the mideast as a result? I would call that a victory for them, and would be the result if we left in full from Iraq today.

[grazinggoat]

Fredgrad, you%u2019re quite right about your vision. It%u2019s obvious that the target of every war is to take control of one%u2019s own resources. The idiots, who decided to invade Iraq dreaming that we (USA) would be able to control that area, were some real ones. This is Middle-East where all invaders ended up leaving or embedded into the local population by integrating to it and becoming themselves more resilient against newer invaders. The PNAC and AIPAC, their lack of vision and lack of knowledge are to blame. The greedy idiots at the Walking-Liar%u2019s administration are to blame too. Iran had a mission and they think they are more entitled to protect that area than we obviously are, and definitely they are a lot more intelligent as strategists than our flashy pink and yellow-tied politicians who sit on spend their afternoon golfing for better business relationship with their bosses.

PNAC and AIPAC have been on an adventure without exit strategy from Iraq. I regret to tell that we are losing the influence war in Iraq and in the Middle-East. This failure is a real shame on our administration but don%u2019t worry, it will be presented to the Americans as a shiny wrapped win over %u2018TeRRaRRRiSSSSSt%u2019.

[prinzowhales]

fredgrad--I noticed you didn't try to refute what this "idiot" posted with regard to the seven (minimum of) living hijackers. Is the BBC an "idiot" as well? They, as well as other MSM sources reported on this as well...they all dropped the topic rather quickly...I'm guessing they didn't want to disturb the sheep...obviously, they didn't disturb you...

Iran does want stability on its frontiers. They worked with the Taleban in appreciation of their real Drug War (as opposed to the American faux-Drug War). They view Iraq as a market which they can supply. A stable, unified Iraq would deal with the American supported terrorists on its frontier and the Kurdish problem. If anyone opposes stability in the region, it is Bush/Cheney and their backers--that's pretty obvious...we even have Cheney arguing the case for not removing Saddam in the early 1990s. When they fired the Iraqi army and the police that was like a big neon sign blinking on and off in the night..."We don't want stability"...."We don't want stability"...."We don't want stability"...

Ahamadinejad's election was more honest than either of the Bush elections, and, as far as the mullahs go, nine un-elected bench monkeys and a host of other legislators on the bench are as bad as any mullahs. It was the mullahs on the Supreme Court who gave Bush his first election.

[j-whitman]

fredgrad2000,,,, Speaking of Mullah'a, you've still got all the evangelist & Southern Baptist Mullahs to get rid of & thier Mega-Madrassa's.

[j-whitman]

Funny,,,, Sunni's are fighting Bush's Proxy war against Iran, their historical enemy's -
-- The Bush & Sunni War aginst a democraticly elected Shiite government in a war started by Bush that is creating thier own Genocide of over 8 million Iraqi's facing starvation & disease, & another 4 million displaced in neighboring countries facing similar delima's.
---- KIND OF LIKE THE POT CALLING THE KETTLE BLACK ---

[j-whitman]

This Sunni sounds like Bush,, Sunni's must be the middle eastern version of a republican,,,,, It's only genocide if your enemy does it..... Bush created a genocide in Iraq that will make Hitler's look like child's play.

[navyretired2]

"General Mahmoud Ahmad of the Pakistani ISI, who wired $100,000 to the alleged leader of the hijackers--Mohammed Atta."

I've heard that a few times, but haven't yet seen any substantial "proof" or solid evidence about it. You have any links?

[grazinggoat]

CBS News: 'Al-Maliki's government %u2014 a shaky coalition of Shiites, Sunnis and Kurds %u2014 has been gutted by boycotts and defections. A full-scale disintegration could touch off power grabs on all sides and seriously complicate U.S.-led efforts to stabilize Iraq.'

-What else to expect? Can we force them to sit in Parliament and govern if they don't wanno? Walking-Liar now wishes he could revive SadDamm, doesn't he? He was a good governor after all, wasn't he?

[sgtrds]

-What else to expect? Can we force them to sit in Parliament and govern if they don't wanno? Walking-Liar now wishes he could revive SadDamm, doesn't he? He was a good governor after all, wasn't he?

Posted by grazinggoat at 09:54 PM : Aug 13, 2007

You'll never get a right winger to admit it out loud, but even they have to realize that as far as American interests Iraq was better off under Saddam.

[radiob-2009]

In a hidden corner of Rome's busy Fiumicino Airport, police dug quietly through a traveler's checked baggage, looking for smuggled drugs. What they found instead was a catalog of weapons, a clue to something bigger. Their discovery led anti-Mafia investigators down a months-long trail of telephone and e-mail intercepts, into the midst of a huge black-market transaction, as Iraqi and Italian partners haggled over shipping more than 100,000 Russian-made automatic weapons into the bloodbath of Iraq.


Death for sale to the highest bidder.How many of these "partners" are KGB,CIA and Quds force?

[jankebenz]

You are now with child and you will have a son. You shall name him Ishmael, for the LORD has heard of your misery.
He will be a wild donkey of a man; his hand will be against everyone and everyone's hand against him, and he will live in hostility toward all his brothers. (NIV, Genesis 16)

this text dates back some 5000 years and since all ******,sunnis,kurds, and other muslims are decendants of Ishmael we know why there is and always has been so much conflict in the east. The fighting amongst themselves is bad enough , but when the aggression spread to outside their borders something had to be done,and since they can't seem to live peacefully with each other they need baby sitting
High time for the US and other nations to quite fooling around, and exercise some real disipline there for everyones good

[red164]

http://www.prisonplanet.com/articles/august2007/130807Cheney.htm

Video Surfaces of Cheney, in 1994, Warning That An Invasion of Iraq Would Lead to 'Quagmire'

Editor & Publisher
Monday Aug 13, 2007

Video Surfaces of Cheney, in 1994, Warning That An Invasion of Iraq Would Lead to 'Quagmire'

Editor & Publisher
Monday Aug 13, 2007

The transcript of this segment is below.

Here is the transcript. The YouTube address is at the end.
*

Q: Do you think the U.S., or U.N. forces, should have moved into Baghdad?

A: No.

Q: Why not?

A: Because if we'd gone to Baghdad we would have been all alone. There wouldn't have been anybody else with us. There would have been a U.S. occupation of Iraq. None of the Arab forces that were willing to fight with us in Kuwait were willing to invade Iraq.

Once you got to Iraq and took it over, took down Saddam Hussein's government, then what are you going to put in its place? That's a very volatile part of the world, and if you take down the central government of Iraq, you could very easily end up seeing pieces of Iraq fly off: part of it, the Syrians would like to have to the west, part of it -- eastern Iraq -- the Iranians would like to claim, they fought over it for eight years. In the north you've got the Kurds, and if the Kurds spin loose and join with the Kurds in Turkey, then you threaten the territorial integrity of Turkey.

It's a quagmire if you go that far and try to take over Iraq.

[navyretired2]

"You are now with child and you will have a son. You shall name him Ishmael, for the LORD has heard of your misery.
He will be a wild donkey of a man; his hand will be against everyone and everyone's hand against him, and he will live in hostility toward all his brothers. (NIV, Genesis 16)

Posted by jankebenz at 10:22 PM : Aug 13, 2007"

Firstly, you'd have to believe in the most widely printed fictional tale of all time...the bible...to be able to blame it for today's problems. I don't, and don't.

The reality is today's problems, as well as the world's problems for over the past century, can be directly contributed to international banker control. The proof is bountiful, the characters real, the conspiracy theory not a theory. The Federal Reserve Bank is owned by five British banks...how's that grab ya?

Jimmy Carter, Bill Clinton, Ronald Reagan, and various other "prominent" Americans have given control of this nation to these elites, and have perpetuated their control via money that is backed by nothing. THEY are the ones that decide who goes to war where, when, and how.

The latest sub-prime lending issue is directly relative as well. In their quest for complete control of Americans, these elites made financial controlling moves that directly effected this problem, and the resulting changes in bank activity regarding their requirements on these types of loans (more than half banks are now tighter on their requirements for approving these loans).

[j-whitman]

jankebenz-- Then you're talking about a draft,, We can't sustain with the troops we have...

But, republicans would oppose the draft & if called they wouldn't serve... The best example I can give you is George W. Bush, who ran from active duty..... Then boasted about being a National Guard fighter pilot.

[j-whitman]

NavyRetired2,,, These Bush Lovers resort to religious rhetoirc to avoid reality... I agree, they 1st lowered the banking standards on loans to get thier so-called "Ownership Society" -
- When that bubble burst, what did they do ?? Weaken the allready weakened American dollar by putting more money in circulation ----- Who are they fooling ??? Looks like it's effecting the world markets too.

[aaabee-2009]

"Iraq's prime minister appeared to clear the way Monday, with a last-minute push from the U.S. ambassador, for a crisis council that seeks to save his crumbling government."

Can anyone tell me WHAT the US is doing PUSHING anyone over in that newly DEMOCRATIZED country of theirs, with their FREE elections and other lies? Did we not know, going in, that Iraq has a triune of warring factions that have never agreed throughout history and did we not know that one or more of those factions would have to take over governmental duties once we rid the world of one Evil Dictator? Was that not mentioned in the pre-war intelligence?

The US is pushing? WHY!!! We liberated them, didn't we, for democracy? Isn't their government their business? Does anyone see any Iraqis over here, PUSHING for thing one in our government?

Doesn't anyone else find the gapping chasm between the words of Iraqi freedom, democracy, and free elections blathered at the US people and the actual actions of US representatives overseas to be at complete odds with each other?

Doesn't it **** anyone else off that we are taken for such idiots by these rich spoon-fed morons with caviar for brains and marble fixtures for hearts?

Phew, had to get that off my chest...thanks....:)

[navyretired2]

"Posted by j-whitman at 10:49 PM : Aug 13, 2007"

Indeed Sir.

1: Lower standards for approving loans to people, making MASS increases in floating mortgage monies owed to the banks.

2: Make financial moves that show discredit and distrust in this realm of sub-prime lending, showing no faith in the ability of middle class Americans to pay their house note.

3: Banks call in their debts, funnelling a big, quick chunk of cash directly to the international banks that already print and control over half of the world's money anyway.

Not hard to understand (obviously not hard, since a dumb dumb like me gets it).

Meanwhile, these same "Elites" are controlling world opinion through global media control, and are directly pulling the strings on governments acting agsinst other governments. It's SO HUGE! There's nothing the average Joe can do about it, except trudge on, hoping he'll be able to take care of his own. It's the illusion this country and the world has been under for centuries.

Until such time as these elites aren't making enormous profits off the Iraq war, unrest and destruction in the middle east will not stop.

[j-whitman]

NavyRetired2,,,, You seem smarter than me on these financial matters.... By the way, please don't call me sir, I retired an E-6. Go Navy

[jankebenz]

Firstly, you'd have to believe in the most widely printed fictional tale of all time...the bible...to be able to blame it for today's problems. I don't, and don't.
Posted by NavyRetired2 at 10:40 PM : Aug 13, 2007

If its so fictional ,then how did the bible so accuratly foretell so many future events icluding the astonishing rebirth of Israel, after some 2300 years. It also predicts a very major war in the east involving nuclear warfare by many nations . Lo and behold that prediction is happening before our eyes. Sorry but that kind of writing is real to be fiction

[aaabee-2009]

Rove shouted out: %u201CHey Kimsey, it must have been wonderful to see the happy faces on all those liberated Iraqis!%u201D

Kimsey was appalled. %u201CAre you nuts?%u201D he replied. He tried to tell the president%u2019s political guru that the Iraqis he saw were sullen and resentful

But Rove wanted to hear nothing of it. %u201CNice talking to you,%u201D Rove responded and walked away.

%u201CIraq will be in a better place,%u201D as the surge continues, he said.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/20251378/site/newsweek/site/newsweek/


Unless you are personally involved, The Surge to you is only what you are fed.

[jankebenz]

jankebenz-- Then you're talking about a draft,, We can't sustain with the troops we have...
Posted by j-whitman at 10:44 PM : Aug 13, 2007

True perhaps but remember it took the combined efforts of many countries to finally stop hitler
jankebenz


Posted by j-whitman at 10:49 PM : Aug 13, 2007

Posted by NavyRetired2 at 10:57 PM : Aug 13, 2007


Firstly: I am not a Bush lover but I don't hate him either

Secondly j-whit and navy, you both talk about world finance controls and the ensueing monetary catastrophe, I agree , but since you both are anti bible I just have to point out the biblical prophesies made long ago regarding end time financial corruption and control Read it, you will be amazed

[navyretired2]

"Posted by jankebenz at 11:57 PM : Aug 13, 2007"

I have read it, several times in fact. Ask yourself one question though. Are all of the predictions of previous civilizations and societies, that MIRROR what some of the prophecies detail in the bible, eventhough dated centuries BEFORE the bible, are they accurate as well?

Of course your answer will be no, since that will basically debase the entire foundation of christianity.

I won't say that the bible is 100% false, I just propose that it's not 100% correct. The most believable lies are the lies that have truth sprinkled in.

The current troubles in Iraq, I fear, are merely precursor to further, more widespread, almost global problems in the not so distant future. Doesn't matter WHO is president or PM of Iraq. Once the bankers have milked the Iraq cash cow, they'll move on.

[navyretired2]

"NavyRetired2,,,, You seem smarter than me on these financial matters.... By the way, please don't call me sir, I retired an E-6. Go Navy
Posted by j-whitman at 11:03 PM : Aug 13, 2007"

Hahaha no disrespect intended! The "Sir" has more to do with my upbringing than what I call the diaper dandies in the Navy (in most cases, I felt like I was saying a bad word when I addressed them...they simply hadn't earned it) :)

[navyretired2]

"Posted by jankebenz at 11:20 PM : Aug 13, 2007"

My apologies if I offended, I would never presume to tell you what to believe, I'm simply stating what I think.

You could, however, do some research into previous basis for various foundational occurences in the bible (i.e. birth of christ, crusifiction and subsequent ascendancy and the cosmic basis for each) that happened centuries prior to Adam and Eve, and it would put a whole new spin on Genesis, if you looked at it open mindedly.

[sgtrds]

"NavyRetired2,,,, You seem smarter than me on these financial matters.... By the way, please don't call me sir, I retired an E-6. Go Navy
Posted by j-whitman at 11:03 PM : Aug 13, 2007"

Hahaha no disrespect intended! The "Sir" has more to do with my upbringing than what I call the diaper dandies in the Navy (in most cases, I felt like I was saying a bad word when I addressed them...they simply hadn't earned it) :)


Posted by NavyRetired2 at 12:10 AM : Aug 14, 2007

Someone addressed me as "sir" one time on here and I told them that I was a Sgt (E4 when I got out), not an officer, which meant I worked for a living. He got all over me because he said he had been an officer and that if he'd heard me say something like that in the service he'd have written me up on an Article 15. I told him he was full of sh*it and that that most officers couldn't find their own as*s without a NCO showing them how. That didn't sit well with him either. I wonder why?

:-)

[micma-2009]

Iraq is crumbling, even as they say the surge is working.

[navyretired2]

"I told him he was full of sh*it and that that most officers couldn't find their own as*s without a NCO showing them how. That didn't sit well with him either. I wonder why?

:-)
Posted by SgtRDS at 12:26 AM : Aug 14, 2007"

Truth hurts :)

[gramto7]

Someone addressed me as "sir" one time on here and I told them that I was a Sgt (E4 when I got out), not an officer, which meant I worked for a living. He got all over me because he said he had been an officer and that if he'd heard me say something like that in the service he'd have written me up on an Article 15. I told him he was full of sh*it and that that most officers couldn't find their own as*s without a NCO showing them how. That didn't sit well with him either. I wonder why?

:-)
Posted by SgtRDS

Sgt Randal
You and my late husband would have gotten along just fine!! He felt the same way about officers. He retired MSgt USAF. Unfortunately I lost him 4 years ago... MAN do I miss that wicked sense of humor!

[gramto7]

"General Mahmoud Ahmad of the Pakistani ISI, who wired $100,000 to the alleged leader of the hijackers--Mohammed Atta."

I've heard that a few times, but haven't yet seen any substantial "proof" or solid evidence about it. You have any links?
Posted by NavyRetired2

http://melbourne.indymedia.org/news/2004/08/76366.php

http://www.cooperativeresearch.org/timeline.jsp?timeline=complete_911_timeline&the_isi:_a_more_detailed_look=mahmoodahmed

http://www.btinternet.com/~nlpwessex/Documents/SheikhMahmood.htm

http://www.infowars.com/articles/sept11/biden_admits_post_911_meeting_with_hijackers_financier.htm

http://crimesofthestate.blogspot.com/2007/05/pakistani-smoking-gun-of-911.html

[sgtrds]

You and my late husband would have gotten along just fine!! He felt the same way about officers. He retired MSgt USAF. Unfortunately I lost him 4 years ago... MAN do I miss that wicked sense of humor!
Posted by gramto11 at 12:59 AM : Aug 14, 2007

I am sorry to hear of your loss. I know I was taught in Basic Training that the USAF would fold up and fall over without the NCO's and when I went to my first duty station I found out all the good officers thought so too. Or sure once in awhile we had to "break in" some young Lt fresh out of the Academy who thought otherwise, but the Col usually pulled him aside before we were too rough on him and let him know he should drop the attitude a bit.

:-)

[sgtrds]

Truth hurts :)

Posted by NavyRetired2 at 12:40 AM : Aug 14, 2007

All the best officers knew that they needed to lean on their Sgt's if they were to have any kind of a successful career in the military. Some just never got that message and ...well...they never made it past O3. I guess some of those type still carry the scars. LOL!

;-)

[brianbwb-2009]

The scenario is unfolding exactly as Saddam predicted, just before George Bush and Moqtada Al Sadr lynched him.

Think he knew something George didn't?

[jankebenz]

I have read it, several times in fact. Ask yourself one question though. Are all of the predictions of previous civilizations and societies, that MIRROR what some of the prophecies detail in the bible, eventhough dated centuries BEFORE the bible, are they accurate as well?
Posted by NavyRetired2 at 12:07 AM : Aug 14, 2007


Respectfully: which civilizations predated genisis and what prophesies mirrored bibical ones

[neoconrcrazy]

It's was a sure thing this phony bush war would open Pandora's box;

Maliki will fall, Al-Sadr's shias will take control of iraq and the alliance with iran will be cemented. The sunnis will be beaten to submission, and the kurds will bring in the turks in the north, intentionally or not. oil from iraq & iran will flow east to china,india,japan. Calls for war against iran will increase. global terror against America will rise, forcing us to spend more and more to protect ourselves -

thank you bushit, the phony leader.

[feelfree1]

"Why we stand for immediate withdrawal of all U.S. troops from Iraq"

"THE U.S. occupation of Iraq has not liberated the Iraqi people, but has made life worse for most Iraqis."

"Tens of thousands of U.S. service people have been killed or maimed, and hundreds of thousands of innocent Iraqis have lost their lives as a result of the U.S. invasion in 2003, the ongoing occupation, and the violence unleashed by them."

"Iraq's infrastructure has been destroyed, and U.S. plans for reconstruction abandoned. There is less electricity, less clean drinking water, and more unemployment today than before the U.S. invasion."

"All of the justifications initially provided by the U.S. for waging war on Iraq have been exposed as lies; the real reasons for the invasion %u2014 to control Iraq's oil reserves and to increase U.S. strategic influence in the region %u2014 now stand revealed."

"We call on the U.S. to get out of Iraq %u2014 not in six months, not in a year, but now."

www.ipetitions.com/petition/Out
Now/

[feelfree1]

Re: "U.S. military officials earlier in the day announced a third major operation since additional U.S. troops arrived earlier this year. The targets of this operation are said to be al Qaeda in Iraq and Iranian-allied Shiite militia fighters."

It almost sounds like these unnamed, unknown, officers of some branch or another of the military, would have us "believe" that the imaginary and fabled "al-Qaeda-in-Iraq" network, is now "linked" with "Iranian-allied Shiite militia fighters".

See how that works? "al-Qaeda"..."Iraq"..."Iran"..."al-Qaeda"..."Iraq"..."Iran"...Oh, and it's nearly 9/11...."al-Qaeda"..."Iraq"..."Iran"..."9/11"...TERRA...Bombs away...Mission Accomplished!!!

CBS is doing a fairly good job of promoting an illegal and suicidal war of aggression against Iraq.

Will we fall for it, again?

[darknico84]

Hello world,

You cannot say that your governement wasn't aware about what going to invade Iraq could result in. Remember the harsh and rude campaign America made against France in these times ! Remember the speech of Dominique DeVillepin in the United Nations Assembly warning you about going there. Caus of its arrogance, USA has thrown the whole world into a big mess ... lighting a match in a room full of black powder.
Lets hope things will finally get better ... but for now we can only have hopes nothing more !

[feelfree1]

"Fatigue Cripples US Army In Iraq"

"But it is in the soldiers themselves - and in the ordinary stories they tell - that the exhaustion of the US military is most obvious, coming amid warnings that soldiers serving multiple Iraq deployments, now amounting to several years, are 50 per cent more likely than those with one tour to suffer from acute combat stress."

"The army%u2019s exhaustion is reflected in problems such as the rate of desertion and unauthorised absences - a problem, it was revealed earlier this year, that had increased threefold on the period before the war in Afghanistan and had resulted in thousands of negative discharges."

www.commondreams.org/archive/2007/08/12/3129


"It's not individual atrocity," Specialist Garett Reppenhagen, a sniper from the 263rd Armour Battalion, said. "It's the fact that the entire war is an atrocity."

http://news.independent.co.uk/world/americas/article2758829.ece


"I do not know with what weapons World War 3 will be fought, but World War 4 will be fought with sticks and stones." Albert Einstein