Clinton, Obama Take Heat At AFL-CIO Forum

Hoping For Endorsement, Democrat Front-Runners Withstand Barbs On Terrorism, Corporate Influence

(CBS/AP)  Democratic rivals accused Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton of being too cozy with lobbyists and Wall Street Tuesday, but the party's presidential front-runner portrayed herself as a champion of working people and commonsense policies, drawing cheers from a crowd of union activists.

Illinois Sen. Barack Obama, running second to Clinton in most polls, leveled some of the criticism but was forced to defend his own recent statements on Pakistan during the 90-minute debate sponsored by the AFL-CIO at Chicago's Soldier Field.

“You will never see a picture of me on the front of Fortune magazine,” said former senator John Edwards of North Carolina, a dig at Clinton, who recently was featured on the business publication's cover.

Obama said U.S. trade agreements have tilted against workers because “corporate lobbyists” have had too much influence, a theme he has developed in recent days, especially when alluding to Clinton, the New York senator and former first lady.

Clinton, who appeared content with her front-runner status, replied: “The other campaigns have been using my name a lot.

“For 15 years, I've stood up against the right-wing machine,” she said, as many in the crowd cheered. “If you want a winner who knows how to take them on, I'm your girl.”

Obama's turn in the bull's-eye came when Connecticut Sen. Chris Dodd chided him for recently suggesting he would strike terrorist targets in Pakistan if he had information about the location of al Qaeda terrorists, even without the permission of President Pervez Musharraf.

“General Musharraf is no Thomas Jefferson,” Dodd said, but he is an ally in the war on terror.

Clinton joined in, saying to Obama, “you should not always say everything you think if you're running for president, because it has consequences across the world.”

Obama shot back: “I find it amusing that those who helped to authorize and engineer the biggest foreign policy disaster in our generation are now criticizing me.”

Dodd, Clinton, Edwards and Delaware Sen. Joe Biden voted to authorize the Iraq war in 2002. Obama, who was in the Illinois legislature at the time, spoke out against the invasion.

Although much of the heat was focused on Obama and Edwards, “every candidate on stage came under fire from one of their opponents, making this one of the more feisty events yet,” said CBSNews.com senior political editor Vaughn Ververs.

The seven candidates praised organized labor lavishly, seeming to jockey to portray themselves as the most committed to the cause.

“Edwards, who has energetically courted labor support, found himself defending his length of devotion to the causes important to the movement, while Obama was again taken to task for recent foreign policy statements and Clinton criticized as the favorite of insiders and powerful interests,” Ververs added.

Edwards twice told the crowd of some 15,000 that he has walked 200 picket lines in the past two years. “Who was with you in crunch time?” he asked. “Who will stand with you when it really matters?”

The stadium crowd was raucous and loud at times, cheering some candidates and interrupting others.

“Tonight’s forum didn’t do much to change the overall dynamics of the race, but it’s sure going to give these campaigns plenty to talk about going forward,” said Ververs.

At the debate's start, the candidates largely agreed that the nation should invest more money in infrastructure and less in the Iraq war, citing the Minneapolis bridge collapse as a symptom of neglect.

[edjohn66]

I'll never understand why some union members vote Republican when that party hates them and everything they stand for. A union member in the Republican party is like a Jewish person at a Nurnburg rally: they just don't belong.

[rushlimpdrug]

"What we see going on now leads us to believe that this will probably be the most ambitious mobilization in the history of the labor movement."
AFL-CIO president John Sweeney

John must be looking at chart of chineeze labor.

[ioweign]

Now it is cheaper to send steel, cotton, and other raw materials to China, then ship the finished goods all the way back across the ocean (a round-trip to the other side of the earth!), than it is to hire union members to manufacture cars, clothing, and other goods! The unions are almost gone, and I say GOOD RIDDANCE!!!!
Posted by S_Temper at 02:54 PM : Aug 07, 2007

You are sooo ignorant.

[ioweign]

IOWEIGN, why don't you educate me, professor? But first, ARE YOU A UNITED STATES CITIZEN (I refuse to discuss US domestic issues with foreigners)?
Posted by S_Temper at 03:11 PM : Aug 07, 2007

I have been a citizen for 60+ years - how about you?

Do you work? How many days a week do you work? Have you ever belonged to a Union? I have for 20 years and then went into management. I worked WITH the Union, next to the Union and found that the Union actually helped me more than anything else. It is not all about MONEY. People have problems and are sometimes reluctant to discuss and that is where the Union comes in. If you want to go back to the working conditions of the Dark Ages then go for it - move to China!!

[diverinnl]

IOWEIGN, where the Unions have done themselves in is in effectively holding industry, employement, and productivity hostage to their own bottom line. If I went to a store owner and demanded that they pay me money in order to be allowed to open for business and thet they could only hire workers that I provided them and they had to pay them wages that I demanded, it would be called extorsion. A union does it and it's called collective bargaining. They have strong armed American industry overseas. Look at the textile, automotive, airline, and steel industries.

[ioweign]

IOWEIGN, where the Unions have done themselves in is in effectively holding industry, employement, and productivity hostage to their own bottom line. If I went to a store owner and demanded that they pay me money in order to be allowed to open for business and thet they could only hire workers that I provided them and they had to pay them wages that I demanded, it would be called extorsion. A union does it and it's called collective bargaining. They have strong armed American industry overseas. Look at the textile, automotive, airline, and steel industries.
Posted by diverinnl at 03:25 PM : Aug 07, 2007


What kind of collective bargaining agreement existed? If you had a stalemate in bargaining would it go to binding arbitration? As you can see, this can get complexed. Basically if you have a greedy company, the employees get that way too!

[ioweign]

Many former union members told me their horror stories about union leaders holding out for pennies or other meaningless concessions, while the members suffered and lost wages. And for your info, labor unions are a socialist concept, so if anyone is moving to China, it's you IOWEIGN.
Posted by S_Temper at 03:32 PM : Aug 07, 2007

Well - there are good Unions and there are bad Unions - just like there are good companies and bad companies. I feel I was fortunate and
from all appearances, you and I won't have to move to China, it is moving and coming here!!

[diverinnl]

IOWEIGN, If all unions did was ensure that the rights of the workers were protected over the profitability of the company, I could see your point. Unfortunatly, hey go further than that. They extort money out of both worker and employers. They are not subject to anti-trust laws nor are they subject to the same labor laws that they throw against every company that has to deal with them. They hold productivity and profitablity hostage and they hold the least productive worker as equal in compensation to the most productive thus destroying free market competition.

[ioweign]

IOWEIGN, If all unions did was ensure that the rights of the workers were protected over the profitability of the company, I could see your point. Unfortunatly, hey go further than that. They extort money out of both worker and employers. They are not subject to anti-trust laws nor are they subject to the same labor laws that they throw against every company that has to deal with them. They hold productivity and profitablity hostage and they hold the least productive worker as equal in compensation to the most productive thus destroying free market competition.
Posted by diverinnl at 03:45 PM : Aug 07, 2007

The Unions have political restrictions just like companies. Unions have financial reports to register with the DOL. Where I live, workers do not have to belong to a union but if the employee requests it, the Union still has to represent the Employee. Like I mentioned in an earlier post, I belonged to a Union for 20+ yrs and just paid dues. The Union was non-profit. The Company did not pay the Union anything. As for a Union being Socialist, alot of thing in our society is socialistic. Your local police and fire depts. are. Or do you have private police and fire where you live. There are professional unions too. Doctors and dentists belong to Unions - they call them Associations.

[grumpas]

After reading most of the ignorant posts here. It is obvious the ignorance about unions still reins supreme. My husband worked union for 45 years of his working career. Retired with a good union pension and health care insurance. So, all of you whiners who are anti-union go right ahead and whine. If you aren't smart enough to join a union you get exactly what you deserve...nothing! Most of you have been brain-washed by Republican's to believe unions are terrible. You don't have a clue what you are even talking about. So spend the rest of your sorry lives working your *** off for nothing and voting Republican!

[realpatriot1]

First of all let's give the union movement its due for fighting for the working conditions and wages which to this day set us apart workers in the rest of the world.

I worked in several unions when I was younger(UAW,AFL-CIO. IAM, SEIU,etc.) and I know that even a strong and effective national union can be plagued by corruption at the local level. I used to work in a metal-working factory where my dad was head engineer and friends with the CEO. He told me that the union reps were taking kickbacks from the company to go easy on wage demands. Like everything else in life there's corruption to deal with.

Unions may have played a part in jobs moving to lower wage countries but I don't think it's reasonable to put that all on unions, corporate greed has a dynamic all its own.

I now work in a right to work state and I would love the opportunity to be forced to pay union dues to corrupt officials if it meant that a company couldn't fire me because they don't like my age or race or hair color. Anyone who thinks right to work laws are great doesn't understand how they work..they mean they don't have to have a good reason for firing you and you have no rights whatsoever.

[diverinnl]

IOWEIGN, if your union was just as what you say, an association that you pay membership dues to and if there is a grievence between you and the company, they assist in arbitration, etc., I have no issue with that. That makes perfect sense to me. You yourself admit that there are good and bad unions. You were fortunate enough to have belonged to a good one. They problem arises where the bad unions have more bargaining power than the employer which seems to be the case most of the time. The demands are not realistic to either the profitability of the company or the competative cost in the market. Eventually, a company will do business in the friendliest enviroment.

[infidel_us]

if it meant that a company couldn't fire me because they don't like my age or race or hair color.
Posted by realpatriot1 at 04:02 PM : Aug 07, 2007

GA is a right to work state. For the reasons you state, you don't need a union. THere are federal laws to protect you.

[diverinnl]

S_Temper, good point. Why do you think that little Chevy cost $30K and is worth $12K as soon as you drive it off the lot? The consumer, Mr and Mrs Joe American are eating the cost of Mr. Grumpas's retirement. Chevy isn't going to pay it.

[billpl-2009]

"...Chevy isn't going to pay it."
Posted by diverinnl

Chevy CAN'T pay for it, even if the wanted to.
...they don't got that kind of money

[ioweign]

Posted by S_Temper at 04:03 PM : Aug 07, 2007

The cheaper goods are not being locked out - they are coming in by the very companies that may or may not have factories making the same thing here.

In the 50s, 60s and early 70s, cheap Japanese cars were imported and American autos were made to compete against them. Now those Japanese companies have factories here in the states.



I worked for an electronic communication company (non-Union)and we had profit-sharing. The Japanese started exporting and the US started importing and my company did nothing to keep their product up-to-date. They ran to the Fed gov't and wanted protection. They then used our profit sharing money to keep their stock up. Lost my profit sharing and because of BAD managemnet the company went belly-up. The free market and no union involved.

[billpl-2009]

...psss, hey unions
...got a little secret to tell ya


"The Fat Lady?...she already sang"

[forthepeopl1]

they are all part of gw's mafia

[billpl-2009]

OMG!! I missed this part

"...Organized labor played a large role in Democrats taking over Congress in the midterm elections, Sweeney said, and is trying........ "

..and people THINK Bush can dish out B.S.??!!!!????

[ioweign]

realpatriot1, you make a good point that US labor unions played an important historical role in the development of federal laws to guarantee basic human rights for workers. But as infidel_us stated, current federal laws make labor union protections obsolete.
Posted by S_Temper at 04:28 PM : Aug 07, 2007

How are you going to enforce it?
Are you going to take them to court?
How much are court fees?
Are you going to represent yourself?


Who is going to prove that you were discriminated against?

[gslinger3]

Here is a secret for all you left wing, global warmed, union riddled nuts.

SERVE GOD, YOUR CHURCH, YOUR FAMILY AND YOUR PLACE OF EMPLOYMENT AND YOU WILL NO HAVE ANY CHOICE BUT TO SUCCEED!

Unions just create complacency and cause jobs to get moved offshore!

Death to ABORTION and unions!

[ioweign]

IOWEIGN, you have the same problems as a union member. A friend of mine told me that when he was a union member, he had a problem that union leaders would not help him with because it did not affect a large group of people. Unions do not "go to the mat" for individual members, unless the dispute involves a class of workers. My mother-in-law was a proud union member her whole life, but admitted that union leaders were more interested in fighting for racial equality and other political goals than actually protecting members. She also said her union usually ignored problems reported by white members.
Posted by S_Temper at 04:49 PM : Aug 07, 2007

I had no Union problems and I had no company or management problems. I am retired now after 31+ years of Federal Service.

[diverinnl]

IOWEIGN, the federal employees union is just whet we discussed earlier, an association that helps to ensure that employer commitments to the employee are met as promised and that the employees civil rights are protected at all times. Like before, no issue there. I'm against unions such as the AFL-CIO and the UAW. These goons are just glorified, legalized mobsters.

[ioweign]

Here is a secret for all you left wing, global warmed, union riddled nuts.

SERVE GOD, YOUR CHURCH, YOUR FAMILY AND YOUR PLACE OF EMPLOYMENT AND YOU WILL NO HAVE ANY CHOICE BUT TO SUCCEED!

Unions just create complacency and cause jobs to get moved offshore!

Death to ABORTION and unions!
Posted by gslinger3 at 04:48 PM : Aug 07, 2007

I did - I trusted God and my Church and my Family but not my employers, that's why you Union, to keep them honest. And sometimes that doesn't work.

[diverinnl]

Anyway folks, it was great to actually have a healthy, honest debate instead of the typical name calling and rhetoric we get on this board sometimes. Thanks to all and have a great day.

[mcvet]

Of all the screw ups the Reich has made, this may turn out to be the biggest. They used the exploitation of cheap labor in Central and Latin America to Bust Unions and take away their membership. Organized Labor didn't just go away though, they continued to bring in new members and are still alive and kicking. That's bad news for the Reich. I'm telling you folks Organized Labor is going to kick some Corporate Butt in the near future and as Hitler found out, if you are going to Kill Organized Labor you'd better kill every worker.

[ioweign]

IOWEIGN, the federal government is a LOT different than a US corporation in the free market. If the government needs more money to pay your benefits, they just raise the tax rate or shift funding away from other programs like Social Security. Corporations don't have that luxury - they just have to raise prices and hope they stay in business.
Posted by S_Temper at 04:57 PM : Aug 07, 2007

My wages never came from the US Taxpayer and there is competition. The Union was a member of the AFL-CIO and run as a corporation.

[mcvet]

Here is a secret for all you left wing, global warmed, union riddled nuts.

SERVE GOD, YOUR CHURCH, YOUR FAMILY AND YOUR PLACE OF EMPLOYMENT AND YOU WILL NO HAVE ANY CHOICE BUT TO SUCCEED!

Unions just create complacency and cause jobs to get moved offshore!

Death to ABORTION and unions!
Posted by gslinger3 at 04:48 PM : Aug 07, 2007

How do you propose to do that Swastika Breath? Bigger men than you have tried to kill the right of people to be free and to associate in a Labor Union. It's as American as the Constitution itself. Stinky little fascist like you have always wanted to kill workers rights even to the point of supporting Hitler against your own country. God you fascist are disgusting little creatures! Absolutely disgusting. Sieg Heil Bush! Come on Sparky, get out that hood and sheet and help me out here!! SIEG HEIL!! SIEG HEIL!! "God Bless the Working Man and God Bless his Union", Rev. Ben Worth, 1939

[diverinnl]

I was going to go but I can't resist this one:

IOWEIGN, you were a federal employee for 31+ years and never figured out where the US Government got the money to pay your wage? Please tell me you mis-quoted something there! You may have payed your union dues to a corporation, that's true but the US Government is not a corporation.

[ioweign]

IOWEIGN: "They then used our profit sharing money to keep their stock up. Lost my profit sharing and because of BAD management the company went belly-up. The free market and no union involved."

I feel for you, but how would a union have prevented your loss? As I said before, nothing is guaranteed in this life except for death and taxes, but unions are not the solution.

Posted by S_Temper at 05:03 PM : Aug 07, 2007

That is my point - do not blame unions for every problem a company may have.

[mcvet]

IOWEIGN, you have the same problems as a union member. A friend of mine told me that when he was a union member, he had a problem that union leaders would not help him with because it did not affect a large group of people. Unions do not "go to the mat" for individual members, unless the dispute involves a class of workers. My mother-in-law was a proud union member her whole life, but admitted that union leaders were more interested in fighting for racial equality and other political goals than actually protecting members. She also said her union usually ignored problems reported by white members.
Posted by S_Temper at 04:49 PM : Aug 07, 2007

Wow! You know so very little about Labor and the Law. A Union MUST represent all employees regardless. The problem is the same as it is with people in general, every worker thinks they are right and their position is right. The WHOLE thing is determined by the National Labor Relations Act and THAT Employee's Collective Bargaining Agreement. Your Mother had MORE rights than ANY non-union worker the minute she walked through the door. She COULD NOT be fired with Cause. Her Hours of Work and Conditions of Employment could NOT be changed without negotiating with her Union on those changes. She could Not be layed of except by the conditions and terms of her Agreement. I could go on for an hour but anyone who say's a Union Member is no better off than an Non Union one is simple blowing smoke... Sieg Heil Bush!!

[ioweign]

I was going to go but I can't resist this one:

IOWEIGN, you were a federal employee for 31+ years and never figured out where the US Government got the money to pay your wage? Please tell me you mis-quoted something there! You may have payed your union dues to a corporation, that's true but the US Government is not a corporation.
Posted by diverinnl at 05:10 PM : Aug 07, 2007

The "Postal Service" does not receive Tax Dollars and I had a typo it should say The Postal Service is run as a corporation and it is.

Does that help?? Postal employees are Federal employees and their wages come solely from the services provided by the Postal Service. the Postal Service is mandated by law to be non-profit.

[diverinnl]

IOWEIGN, I stand corrected. Thanks for clearing it up for me.

[ioweign]

IOWEIGN, the US Postal Service is a very unique case. The USPS has its own unique problems, also. The USPS has had a virtual monopoly for most of its existence, but today it faces increasing competition from FedEx and UPS. Another unique aspect of the USPS that is that the jobs cannot be outsourced to people in other countries. The USPS is in the service sector, and it has a union because it is part of the federal government. The only way that labor unions can possibly survive in the US is to move dramatically into the service sector. But if that happens, you can expect to pay a hell of a lot more for a Big Mac.
Posted by S_Temper at 05:31 PM : Aug 07, 2007

USPS is mandated by Congress to have universal service - so in a sense it is a monopoly but also means that the Post Office can't pick and choose the profitable routes as UPS and FEDEX. In fact, they use USPS sometimes for the last leg of the delivery. Jobs can be outsourced (in the US) only if it does not hinder or infringe on the sanctity of the mail.

[perception5]

Talking about "friends and family.

.......you have America's mob-run union the AFL-CIO together with one of America's most corrupt liberal wolfpack press in MSNBC.....together with the "weakest" bunch of Dems for President in American history.

None of these candidates are even "qualified" to be president.

FYI in all of American history only (2) Senators of been elected president......................and it won't be (3) in 2008. Not with this bunch of "left-wing" candidates............... boo......bad

[j-whitman]

perception5,,, In the words of Karen Hughes, Bush's confidant & ambassador - "Take a Prozac" --- Then start watching the news

[perception5]

Hey I justed looked the word "mobster" up in the dictionary and there is a picture of George Sweeney.

Has anyone seen Jimmy Hoffa? I haven't seen him since lunch.

[randalds]

The golden years of the labor movement would seem to have passed,. However if we keep electing neoconservatives into national office then there'll be a need for it once again. The movement toward deregulation does have some good results, but the conservative republicans want to push it back to business's golden years of the pre-McKinley era when there were few labor, child-labor and safety laws at all, which is why the unions rose to power in the first place. If they are not careful in their push for deregulation and the removal of worker protections in order to favor big business, they'll restart the labor movement again.

[prinzowhales]

The AFL-CIO is the worst thing that ever happened to American Labour. The UAW, Teamsters, Steelworkers...all of the "I've got mine, now, devil take the rest of Labour!" that found its home in the Party of Finance Capital...the two-headed monster...the 'Demopublican' Party.

Instead of pursuing Industrial Unionism, higher paid workers (who, amusingly, fancy themselves 'middle class') adopted bourgeois values and attitudes and began to look down on the more humble Joneses. The minimum wage in America is the best argument in the world against craft unionism whose members--with their fellow bourgeoisie (hahaha!) the bankers, the lawyers, the rentiers and the financiers--now excercise 'prudence' and 'concern' regarding the wages paid to the mere proles below them.

The International Workers of the World must have been doing something right...the Capitalists hated them and the Communnists did to!

[prinzowhales]

The AFL-CIO was used by US intelligence to sabotage and infiltrate labour movements abroad on behalf of international Capital under the guise of 'fighting communism.' Dues from workers were used to give to politicians who betrayed the American working man, supporting the fascist international, free trade and wars in which the American Working Man bled and the Capitalist beast fed.

Now, its the craft unions that are being bled white by the Corporations in the name of competition...competition with sweated labour in Mexico, Latin America and East Asia. Labour that is locked into their factories--like the Hamlet North Carolina workers at the Imperial Chicken plant who were locked into the plant with thousands of gallons of hot grease, natural gas leaking and an open flame...use your imagination if you are not familiar with that proud moment in the history of American Capitalism.

Its way past time for real unions, fighting unions, good unions...Industrial Unions!

[feelfree1]

Re: "Hillary Clinton defended the pact, saying the nation needs "broad reform" of trade. "NAFTA is a piece of it, but it's not the only piece," she said. Obama and Edwards also stopped short of saying NAFTA should be scrapped."

NAFTA should be scrapped!!! The end!!!

These three AIPAC-stained candidates are clearly unqualified to lead our country.

[pepperp1]

Whooo sluggers, now thats a debate.

[radiob-2009]

Lot of light swings but no direct hits and none of them actually addressing the issues instead doing a typical dance around the issues. No one has suggested to place some TEETH in trade agreements like a living wage, enviromental protection etc., no one is stating that they will campaign for legislature to bar lobbyist, no one suggesting that all campaign financing should be public and no one addressing the destruction of the middle class by outsourcing our jobs. No one suggesting to repeal the tax breaks that Bush gave to corporations to move overseas. So where is the party of the common man, the middle class the democrats have lost it and the republicans were never in favour of either.

[tuckerndfw]

Doctors are unionized; lawyers are unionized; government employees are unionized; but average Joes trying to feed their families by slaving over picks, shovels, saws and hammers are not supposed to be unionized?

What's wrong with that picture?

Why doesn't the federal government demand all workers qualify with a union before they can become employed in any profession, such as they do with doctors, lawyers, animal doctors, dentists and other "professions"?

Both political parties cater to the rich and powerful to the exclusion of everyone else.

Hillary supports war profiteers, special interest groups, homosexuals and feminists having superior "rights," illegal immigrants, unnecessary wars, Israel, and government intrusion into our daily lives.

If you want another George Bush, vote for Hillary.

But, Democrats and Republicans are the same party wearing different disguises. Both represent the rich and powerful above all else.

[feelfree1]

Prinzowhales,

Excellent points about the AFL-CIO.

[pepperp1]

labor unions have been a major part of the problem

Baloney, labor unions drove prosperity and created the middle class in this country, and then lost their way fighting for bad actors, non competitive change they refused to flex and so they became diminished as should happen, but they did not harm this country. Another RNC propaganda sound bite cause union folks do not vote Repug generally.

[v_1618]

WE ARE IN THE HANDS AND THE DOMINATION OF A
FEW CORRUPT PEOPLE WHO ARE THE OWNERS OF THE
INTERNATIONAL BANKS OR THE FEDERAL RESERVE
BANK. WHO MADE MONEY BACKING BY NOTHING WE ARE SLAVES
FROM THIS CORRUPT PEOPLE ....BUT TO KEEP
THEIR POWER THEY INVENT US ALL AROUND EUROPE
AND AMERICA THAT WE ARE IN WAR. TO KEEP THEIR
POWER MADE FROM NOTHING THEY ARE THE EVIL IN
THIS WORLD..LIKE HITLER FOR THE FEDERAL
RESERVE BANKS THE MOST LUCRATIVE THING !!!!IS WAR!!!
FORCES THE COUNTRY TO BORROW MORE MONEY AT INTEREST
THEY ARE THE MOST KIND OF THIEFS IN ALL TIMES OF
HUMANKIND. THE MONEY PAPER IS THE MOST ASTOUNDING
PIECE OF SLEIGHT OF HAND THAT WAS EVER INVENTED.
USURY IS THE MOST EVIL THING THAT MANKIND HAS INVENTED
IS THE DESTRUCTION OF ALL CIVILITATIONS.
USURY IS THE MONSTER AGAINST THE KINGDOM
OF GOD. AND THE U.N. IS MADE BY THE INTERNATIONAL
BANKERS. WHO CONTROL EVERYTHING AND CONTROL THE WAR
IN IRAQ AND IRAN SOONER. OUR RULERS ARE A BUNCH OF CRIMINALS
THE TRILATERAL COMMISSION IS THE WAY THAT ALL THE
PEOPLE AROUND THE WORLD WE'LL BE SOONER IN COMPLETE
SLAVERY UNTIL SOME REAL POWERS DEFEAT THIS EVIL ON EARTH.

WATCH.. WWW.ZEITGEISTMOVIE.COM

[tcoleman12]

"You'll never see me on the cover of Fortune magazine," said former senator John Edwards...

But you could see him on the cover of "Women's Journal", "Woman's Digest", "Men-o-Pause",...

Clinton takes "barbs" for her ties to lobbies??? What do these guys think the AFL-CIO is?

[processor2]

YAWN

...

[fascistusa]

The debates go on... who cares??

I don't.

America is a FASCIST NATION ruled by the American/Israeli Elite.

Our Government DOES NOT CARE ABOUT US.

OUR GOVERNMENT DOES NOT LISTEN TO US.

OUR GOVERNMENT WORKS FOR THE ELITE AND THE ELITE ONLY.

ZEITGEISTmovie.com.