Tiny Caribbean Nation Feels China's Wrath

China Lashes Out At St. Lucia For Restoring Diplomatic Relations With Taiwan

(AP)  This tiny Caribbean island may have thought it was no big deal when it severed its 10-year relations with China and restored ties on Tuesday with rival Taiwan. Wrong.

China, which built a stadium and was finishing a psychiatric hospital here and considers Taiwan a renegade province, called the move a "brutal interference in China's internal affairs." In short order, one of the world's smallest nations has now made an enemy out of one of the largest.

Both Taiwan and China, which for more than 20 years have battled for diplomatic allies, brought out their big guns to curry favor with St. Lucia, a verdant, mountainous 240-square-mile island that is home to 168,000 people.

China, a vast nation of 1.3 billion people, sent its foreign minister for a two-day visit in September. Taiwan dispatched Foreign Minister James Huang in late April. On Tuesday, he and St. Lucian Foreign Minister Rufus Bousquet signed an agreement establishing diplomatic relations.

"We have been very careful about making this decision, and now that we have taken it, we do not expect the Chinese will love us any more for it," Bousquet said. "But we expect that they will conduct themselves in a manner that is acceptable to our government."

Bousquet had indicated that any decision would be based on which suitor could offer a better deal to St. Lucia, where some 20 percent of the population lives in poverty.

As he put it in April: "Support those who give you the most."

Nationalistic pride in St. Lucia, which won independence from Britain in 1979, also played into the equation.

"St. Lucia did not win its sovereignty from one power to be now dictated to by another as to who its friends should be," the weekly St. Lucia Mirror said in an editorial. It added that Beijing's One China policy cannot "be legally or diplomatically thrust on St. Lucia, as though we, too, were a colony of China."

St. Lucia indicated last week that if it resumed relations with Taiwan, it would still want to be friends with China. The Chinese Embassy sent a rebuff on Friday, saying China does not accept "double recognition."

China, which had established relations with St. Lucia 10 years ago, was apoplectic at Tuesday's reversal.

"We express indignation and opposition," Chinese Foreign Ministry spokesman Liu Jianchao said in a statement carried by the official Xinhua News Agency.

Shelley Rigger, a professor of East Asian politics at Davidson College in North Carolina, said the stakes are higher for Taiwan, but both China and Taiwan play fiercely.

"Every diplomatic setback and step forward for Taiwan is important," said Rigger.

He said China's foreign policy is based on the idea that "there's no space for Taiwan in the world."

That little St. Lucia has angered the colossus recalls the satirical movie and novel "The Mouse That Roared" — about a tiny country that tries to invade the U.S. so it can lose and accept foreign aid.

Only St. Lucia doesn't even have an army.

To retaliate, China cannot very well cart off the sports stadium, named last year for the late George Odlum, who courted China as foreign minister in 1997. Chinese workers also constructed several buildings for an industrial free-trade zone.

It is a given that the planned cultural center will not be built by China. And work has suddenly slowed on the nearly finished 104-bed psychiatric hospital.

Ties with China did not improve the lot of many St. Lucians. The last 10 years have seen a handful of Chinese businesses open on the island, mainly restaurants and shops. But St. Lucia has not seen the predicted influx of Chinese tourists.

For its part, Taiwan propagated new strains of fruits and vegetables and introduced agricultural techniques during its time here.

Bousquet said Taiwan has agreed to help St. Lucia diversify its agriculture sector, boost tourism, develop livestock and create information technology learning centers, all of which fit into the government's plans to combat poverty.

St. Lucia maintained diplomatic relations with Taiwan for 13 years under Prime Minister John Compton. His party was defeated in 1996, and the following year St. Lucia recognized China. Compton's return to power in December's elections also marked the beginning of Taiwan's comeback, even though China pledged more money and technical assistance.

St. Lucia's recognition of Taiwan is the first win for Taiwan in some time in its diplomatic rivalry with China. In 1969, Taiwan had full relations with 67 countries, including the U.S. and much of Western Europe. Until Tuesday, that number had dwindled to just 24.

[lorinkundert]

It's brings me back to the days of grade school every time I hear China whine like a child in kindergarten when they don't get their way, calling it interference in their internal affairs while they do the same to anyone who doesn't agree with them.

[lorinkundert]

I should add that if you put GW and the Chinese President together, you can bring back the days of preschool.

[nolalou]

So, at last St Lucia is standing up for it's pricipals, regardless of the motivation.

It is interesting that the USA has dipomatic relations with communist China (in fact they have 'most favored nation status') but we don't recognise Taiwan, with it's democratic goverment. Of course we also have a trade embargo against Cuba, since they are communist, but somehow it's OK for China to be communist. (and by very nature of it's size, China opresses millions more than Cuba ever will!)Oh, but I forgot, China dosn't have an active exile community in Florida that can dictate US foreign policy!

[honest_news]

I had an interesting and revealing chatroom conversation with a university student from the People's Republic of China a few years ago. Our discussion had ventured into the political arena, and I had expressed my displeasure with something President Bush had recently done -- I don't remember what it was. I asked my counterpart in China whether he was at liberty to criticize his government, and he said that he was completely free to do so.

To test this, I asked him to tell me something that the President of China (at that time Jiang Zemin) had done that he took issue with, and this was his response: he said that although he was free to criticize his leaders, in China he had the freedom to choose NOT to criticize.

Taken aback by this double-speak, I pressed him that surely there must be something that he was critical of. He then became very indignant, wrote something to the effect that we don't understand true democracy here in America, and he terminated our chat.

That unfortunately abbreviated conversation told me everything I needed to know about modern Communist China.

[mikechin2]

The American people just do NOT understand the other people and nations. They are probably the most ignorant in the world. Keep read my post if you would like to be less stupid. This St. Lucia things really **** my off. They have no pride in themselves. Whoever gives monery to them is their daddy, period.

The worse, I am so astonished to know people on this board do not know much international laws. Is it fine for China or Russia to recorgnize the full indepedence of Hawaii or California as a sovereignty nation (and establish official diplomatic relationship), yet the United States of America will happily accept this? There is no way this government allows Hawaii to occupy a seat in UN (and possibly vote against Uncle Sam).

[burneb]

I think r_bayless has it right. There is no compelling reason in history, culture, international law, or human rights why a country cannot recognize Taiwan and still have diplomatic relations with China, except for the Chinese communist government's intransigence. Neither St. Lucia nor Taiwan objects, so it's only China in a snit.

If the Taiwanese people want to be part of China, that's fine with me, but it's up to China to make that an attractive proposition. Based on the Chinese government's treatment of Hong Kong and Tibet, the Taiwanese have every right and reason to stay sovereign.

[agnim]

"This St. Lucia things really **** my off. They have no pride in themselves. Whoever gives monery to them is their daddy, period.
Posted by mikechin2 at 04:35 PM : May 02, 2007"

Mike, your argument is very very weak, Mr Chin. LOL

If "whomever gives money to St Lucia is their daddy", then it makes good sense to TAKE MONEY FROM THE BIGGER SUGAR DADDY, yes? LOL

And your comparison of China-Taiwan with USA-Hawaii (an UNQUESTIONABLE part of the US) is nonsensical.

If you are so p!ssed, why don't you get China to invade Taiwan and straighten things out once and for all? LOL

[fcia-2009]

I have to say this. Chinese people don't fight for their rights at all. When the British occupied HK, they just obeyed the Brits like a puppy. When the Manchus took over China, they just obeyed the Manchus like a puppy. When the Commies took over China, they just obey like puppies as well. They just obey, obey and obey like slaves. They don't want their representation government, they just obey whoever is in charge and believe whatever they tell them. They should have more confidence in themselves and not just follow orders from whoever is in charge.

[agnim]

"They don't want their representation government, they just obey whoever is in charge and believe whatever they tell them.
Posted by fcia at 08:43 PM : May 02, 2007"
How stupid is that statement?
The Chinese people have THEIR OWN "REPRESENTATION GOVERNMENT"!

Which of YOUR "representation government" can handle 1.3 billion people without filling jails with a lot of them, and make so few enemies around the world?

The US has one billion people less than China in your 'representation government'; yet the US has the highest incarceration rate in the world!

Can you imagine if the US had one billion more people? It wouldn't last a day!

[mikechin2]

I live in the States, but luckily I have more knowledge about Chinese history (not like you - a pity).

"Chinese people don't fight for their rights at all. When the British occupied HK, they just obeyed the Brits like a puppy."

When did this happen? Did you mean 200 years ago when "Great Brits" could kill Chinese at will as they did? Or 20 years ago the "Great Brits" agreed to retreat (without a second choice)?

"When the Manchus took over China, they just obeyed the Manchus like a puppy."

Manchus are Chinese too, unfortunately.

"When the Commies took over China, they just obey like puppies as well. They just obey, obey and obey like slaves."

Sometimes I think the rednecks in this country are more like "slaves" of this bu$h administration. Sometimes it is funny to see brain-washed people talking about freedom for other people.

[incog-nito]

China is imperialist and needs to be stopped. It had taken over Tibet, is threatening Taiwan, and had tried to invade Vietnam. Unfortunately the U.S. is too weak and dependent on trade with China to have much of an influence anymore. I predict the U.S. will renege on its pledge and Taiwan will fall.

[mikechin2]

"China is imperialist"

Are you kidding? Do not get me wrong please. In the 21-th century, there is only one imperialist in the world invading weak nations. We all know that is ourselves.

[tbweb]

The Chinese government in Beijing does not represent the voice of the Chinese people, it is the dictator voice of a few self appointed rulers! The Chinese government in Taiwan was put in place but the vote and is the voice of the Chinese people on Taiwan, a big difference. No one knows what the Chinese people on the Chinese mainland think because they are not allowed to speak or vote or think! People on the Chinese mainland want freedom but are scared to seek it or speak out. Maybe instead of Taiwan sitting back waiting for the inevitable invasion from mainland China, Taiwan should instead invade the Chinese mainland itself and install a true democracy for all of China and the Chinese people. Beijing may be shocked to learn the Chinese people will support a Taiwan invasion of mainland China and not fight back against Taiwan like they think. Beijing's support from the Chinese people is from the point of a gun and forced support based on fear is always shakey and unreliable!

[agnim]

"The Chinese government in Beijing does not represent the voice of the Chinese people, ..
Posted by tbweb at 12:32 AM : May 03, 2007"

Obviously the Chinese government does not represent the voice of the Chinese people; because the Chinese people have you representing their voice. LOL

We don't expect so many who miss out on the "no child left behind" to appreciate the truth about the Chinese people and their thousands of years of cohesive society.

The Chinese society is way too mature for the underdeveloped American minds to comprehend.

1.3 billion people living in one country and in an orderly and constructive manner is a miracle in these times of nation building.

No other country or system of governance present today can match the Chinese people. So get a grip!

Just think how filled and overflowing America's prisons are with 'extra Americans'.
Can you imagine the number of prisons America would have to build if they had 1 billion more people like the Chinese people do?

The US prison population would equal the population of a large country if America had a population of 1.3 billion citizens. LOL

[tbweb]

Agnim wrote:

Can you imagine the number of prisons America would have to build if they had 1 billion more people like the Chinese people do?

Posted by Agnim at 12:59 AM : May 03, 2007

China doesn't use prisons the way the U.S. does, China routinely executes its criminals and in a new twist use its prisoner populations body parts for profit. Many of the Chinese people are now complaining that their love one bodies are not being returned to them by the Chinese authorities after executions because the Chinese government is using and selling their body parts for profit! I agree with you China has many advantages with the way it runs its society, no argument there, but it comes at a price, the price of freedom, and I for one would take freedom and all its ills over living as a slave at the point of a gun!

[tbweb]

Yo Agnim!

The FDA is now reporting that the Chinese poison killing our pets has been fed to chickens and that U.S. citizens eating those chickens may be contaminated with possible side effects such as kidney failure or worst! The Chinese also mislabled the poison shipped to the U.S. so it couldn't be properly inspected. I love to eat chicken and maybe they got me! LOL That's one way to shut me up eh?

[tbweb]

--Agnim

Don't take my word for it! Google "china prison body parts" and read it for yourself!

[mikechin2]

"Don't take my word for it! Google "china prison body parts" and read it for yourself!"

Give me a break! A lie is told a million times, but only those brain-washed people believe. Do you know how notorious Falun Gong is by fabricating things?

[tbweb]

mikechin2 wrote:

Give me a break! A lie is told a million times, but only those brain-washed people believe. Do you know how notorious Falun Gong is by fabricating things?

Posted by mikechin2 at 03:12 AM : May 03, 2007

What is Falun Gong?
Falun Gong refers to five sets of movements, which include physical exercise and meditation, that practitioners believe heighten their physical well-being, spirituality, and moral awareness.

What does Falun Gong mean?
Falun means "law wheel," and Gong means "the cultivation of energy and capabilities." Falun Gong is the name for the actual practice; its followers and practitioners typically were called Falun Dafa. However, Falun Gong has come to refer to both the practice and the movement.

No wonder China's rulers are so hostile to Falun Gong. In it, they can see their demise. Wow! This Falun Gong really seems like a big threat to China's brainwashing, I see why they are so worried! Can't have any outside influence! LOL

[akrk33nnn]

mikechin2 - I'm surprised you can even get to this board from Beijing, mike. The PRC has gotten so far removed from reality lately, I propose we start calling it "Peking" again. Hey, Peking, DUCK!

FALUN GONG, CHINESE PRISON BODY PARTS, MELAMINE GLUTEN. There. Now the firewall will block you.

Peking is the new capital of China.

[agnim]

"--Agnim
Don't take my word for it! Google "china prison body parts" and read it for yourself!
Posted by tbweb at 02:50 AM : May 03, 2007"

Of course I won't take your word, TB. They are childish and IRRELEVANT!
Who the hell cares what is done with dead-body parts?

The more relevant and noteworthy point is that China has 1.3 billion people, over 4 times the US populaiton.

You "one child left behind mind" just cannot appreciate how staggering a number of citizens that is to contain cohesively in one country?
Yet the millennial-old Chinese culture is able to accomplish that gigantic task with relative ease.

A word to the unschooled: When things get terrible in a nation, the citizens vote with their feet!
Yet, like Americans, only ADVENTURERS are leaving the heavily populated China.
It means that it is true what is being said about China: The sleeping giant is rising.

And you know what all the intelligent people on the planet appreciate; BECAUSE THE WORLD FEELS NO THREAT FROM CHINA. The world won't say that about the SMALLER POWER-DRUNK US; will it?

[agnim]

"The FDA is now reporting that the Chinese poison killing our pets has been fed to chickens and that U.S. citizens eating those chickens may be contaminated with possible side effects such as kidney failure or worst!
Posted by tbweb at 02:44 AM : May 03, 2007"

Maybe Americans should be eating what the Chinese have been eating.
The Chinese have 1.3 billion citizens. And, unlike many western societies, the Chinese population is not on the decline without artificial means to stem the growth.

A few DISPERSIBLE pets die from the poisoning.

The MORE INDUSTRIALIZE SUPER POWER has had HUMAN DEATHS from ecoli and salmonella poisoning ON A REGULAR BASIS!

Please find a re-education camp, learn some good knowledge, make adult arguments, and cut out the childishness about a country, a people, and a culture you obviously know little or NOTHING about!

[bookwerm314]

All countries should follow this lead.
I personally would rather recognize Taiwan, a democracy, with human rights and a real government, over the racist abusive Lama chasing country that is China. We would have all been better off never opening the door to trade with China, and stuck with Taiwan. Taiwan should have a seat in the UN, and be recognized. If China messes with Taiwan, we will stop it.
China, screw you.

[akrk33nnn]

Peking detained the head of one of the poison wheat gluten factories today. This is shortly after declaring that: 1. China didn't ship any wheat gluten to the U.S. over the last year (factually incorrect), 2. Chinese gluten is NOT the cause of pet deaths worldwide (unknown at this point), 3. Banning melamine in food use (why ban it if it isn't the problem, according to #2.) 4. If numbers 1 OR 2 are true, why detain the head of the gluten factory?

BAN ALL CHINESE IMPORTS NOW!

http://www.iht.com/articles/2007/05/03/business/food.php

[akrk33nnn]

Agnim - seeing as you're trying to start a fight - BITE MY ***. Go back to Shanghai and suck betel nuts all day. I'm GANNING NI MA as I write this, and she's screaming so loud, it woke the neighbors!

SHUT DOWN CHINA'S INTERNET CONNECTION!
BAN ALL CHINESE PRODUCTS, NOW!
PORT OF LONG BEACH TEA PARTY!

[beanerman4]

Better watch your pet feed!

[tbweb]

Agnim wrote:

Who the hell cares what is done with dead-body parts?

Posted by Agnim at 12:25 PM : May 03, 2007

hmmm let me see, you think maybe the family? I'm sure if the family is lucky enough to get whats left of the chopped up body back it would be a closed casket funeral, won't be pleasant to look at. Look, maybe this is making a big deal out of nothing like you say, I guess as long as the Chinese don't mix BODY PARTS with the MELAMINE GLUTEN and start shipping that mix we should not be concerned.

[agnim]

"Look, maybe this is making a big deal out of nothing like you say, ...
Posted by tbweb at 04:17 PM : May 03, 2007"

EXACTLY!

The US has more than its fair share of IMPRISONING AND EXECUTING INNOCENT AMERICANS!

Seems to wiser minds that IMPRISONING AND KILLING INNOCENT Americans should be of far more concern than dam dead body of Chinese prisoners thousands of miles away, which the lowly bacteria will devour anyway!

It's far less likely that a Chinese prisoner is going to be railroaded into Chinese prisoners, as SO MANY INNOCENT AMERICANS are railroaded into American prisons!

Therefore, the family should see to it that their family member uphold the law of the land.
I'd only be concerned about the prisoner if he was likely to be innocent.

But the carcass of a murderer is being elevated if some STUPID AMERICANS will buy the Chinese dead body parts! And ARE alleged to be buying the body parts! So quit with the hypocrisy when Americans are themselves trading in Chinese body parts!

Who knows, you might be one of the cannibals who have devoured the dead Chinese body parts. Your logic is like its coming from a near corpse. LOL

[agnim]

"Agnim - seeing as you're trying to start a fight ...
Posted by akrk33nnn at 01:35 PM : May 03, 2007"

My arguments are that devastating, eh? LOL
That will teach you to tangle with someone when you are obviously going to be over matched! LOL

[tbweb]

Agnim wrote:

EXACTLY!

Seems to wiser minds that IMPRISONING AND KILLING INNOCENT Americans should be of far more concern than dam dead body of Chinese prisoners thousands of miles away, which the lowly bacteria will devour anyway!
Posted by Agnim at 05:30 PM : May 03, 2007

--Agnim

What do you mean EXACTLY! as if I was agreeing with you? I was not agreeing with you! I was being sarcastic! Dead body parts? Listen to you! Just saying dead body parts sounds nasty! You talk about the dead body parts the Chinese are selling for profit likes its normal or something. The idea of killing prisoners and using their body parts in any context without the permission of the prisoner or their family is disgusting. What a nasty topic, the next thing you'll be telling is someones a s s will taste better with hot sauce on it or something! Just shut up about it, it gives me the creeps! You nasty Agnim, you probably want to try some too! Eewwwww LOL