April 29, 2007
Armed And Dangerous
Law Bans Sale Of Firearms To People With A History Of Severe Mental Illness
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Play CBS Video Video Kroft's Reporter's Notebook Only On The Web: Steve Kroft discusses his upcoming "60 Minutes" report on gun control and the mentally ill in the wake of the Virginia Tech shootings.
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Interactive Guns In America State-by-state gun laws and death rates, maps of recent school and workplace shootings and facts on who's at risk.
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Photo Essay Virginia Tech Massacre Gunman opens fire in dorm and classroom, killing at least 32 before killing himself.
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Interactive In Your Head A look at the human brain and diseases and disorders that can plague it.
However, after the broadcast Dr. Shern had more to say. Mental Health America is opposed to the current legislation and contends that it will further marginalize the mentally ill, while will not decreasing the rate of gun homicides, as this violence is mainly not perpetrated by the mentally ill.
The following is an excerpt from the letter we received from Dr. Shern: "The stigma of mental illnesses and barriers to treatment can lead to tragic results for individuals and families. In fact, there are 30,000 suicides each year in the U.S. (nearly twice the number as homicides), with most related to untreated mental illnesses. ... Finally, the current legislative proposal is obscenely expensive - $375 million. Imagine spending almost as much for a database as the $430 million the Federal Government currently spends on state grants to fund community mental health services!")
As the smoke clears from the massacre at Virginia Tech, a couple of things have become apparent. First, the gunman, who had a history of mental illness, should have been prohibited under federal law from buying the guns he used in the attack, and second, as horrific as the tragedy was, it is not that uncommon.
It is estimated that every year in the U.S., 1,000 homicides are committed by people with mental illness. It’s not supposed to be that way.
As correspondent Steve Kroft reports, the first federal gun control law ever passed in the U.S., way back in 1968, banned the sale of firearms to people with a history of severe mental illness, but the law has never been properly enforced. Seung-Hui Cho is but the latest deranged gunman to shoot up a school or a church or an office for no logical reason.
"Every person who came in contact with him thought he was insane or dangerous," says Jim Kessler, a co-founder of Americans for Gun Safety.
Kessler says the erratic behavior of Virginia Tech killer Seung-Hui Cho was so pronounced, a judge ordered him to a psychiatric facility for evaluation.
"I have a copy of a temporary detention order for Mr. Cho," Kroft remarks. "It was written in 2005. Signed by a judge. And it says that Mr. Cho represents an imminent danger to himself as a result of mentally illness. Should that have been in the computer?"
"That absolutely should have been in the computer," Kessler argues. "I believe what we're seeing is the modern version of a suicide bomber in America, which is, you know, in the past you had someone who was depressed and maybe took their own life. But, now, you're seeing that they're taking lives with them. Now that it's becoming a copycat crime."
There’s no shortage of examples. 60 Minutes first reported on this problem five years ago, not long after Michael McDermott showed up for work at Edgewater Technology in Wakefield, Mass., with a bag full of guns. He then went on a murder rampage. One of the first officers inside the building was Stephen Doherty, who was Wakefield's chief of police. He found seven victims, all dead, and McDermott sitting quietly in an office chair.
"And he had at his feet a 12-gauge shotgun. And cradled very similar near his legs, or knees, was an assault rifle," Doherty remembers.
What was his state of mind?
"He only made one statement: 'I don't speak German,'" Chief Doherty remembers. "That was his only statement."
McDermott had been saying and doing irrational things for 15 years, and had twice been hospitalized in psychiatric wards. Chief Doherty says that should have disqualified him from getting a firearms permit, but he got one anyway from his local police department in Rockland, Mass., 30 miles from Wakefield, where the shootings occurred.
"If someone came in with a mental health history like Michael McDermott's, someone who was repeatedly hospitalized for mental illness, would you have issued him a firearms permit?" Kroft asks Doherty.
"Under the present state of the law, I wouldn't know that because that information is private. I'm not allowed to know that," the police chief replies. "I can't get it."
Massachusetts is one of 28 states that doesn’t supply any information on people with severe mental illness to the FBI database. That was supposed to change after President Reagan and his press secretary, James Brady, were shot and nearly killed by John Hinckley, a man with a history of mental illness.
Congress passed the Brady Bill, which created a system of instant background checks to screen all gun buyers and prevent sales to anyone barred by federal law from owning a firearm. The system relies on an FBI database that is supposed to have the names of fugitives, felons, and people that have been involuntarily committed to a mental hospital.
But Jim Kessler says the system doesn't work when it comes to the mentally ill. "This isn't something that shows up every couple years at Virginia Tech," he says. "I mean, this happens."
Asked if this is a recurring problem, Kessler tells Kroft, "Look, we could be back here two years from now having this exact same conversation."
Produced By Trevor Nelson, Dana Miller Ervin, Andy Court and Ira Rosen
© MMVII, CBS Interactive Inc. All Rights Reserved.
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See all 107 Commentshttp://blog.myspace.com/brandoncjones
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The reality is that people can and do recover from mental illness Stop the myths about mental health issues and know the facts. Your report stated %u201C in the U.S., 1,000 homicides are committed by people with mental illness.%u201D According to Fox news report in New York City, they reported 579 homicides in 2006. The number of 1,000 seems high when it stands alone but not when you start comparing it to the national average. Please help stop this stigma and help encourage people to seek help not punishment. Recovery is possible and why should we be punished for a few years of medical treatment?
After a tragedy like Virginia Tech, people want to %u201Cfix%u201D it. Why don%u2019t you look into the Virginia Mental Health system and see what failed to help Seung-Hui Cho. The system that was to help him failed him, how can they prevent this from happening again? Change that system not target all of the mental ill like we are all criminals waiting to go on a rampage!!!
Shelly Woods
John Warmath
John Warmath
And here is a great link to a summary of state by state gun control with regards to the mentally ill : http://pn.psychiatryonline.org/cgi/content/full/41/17/6
Okay, now I'm not feeling like quite the smart alec any more . . that's a tough call because we want to honor all you guys and that includes not just your coworker, but you. Also tough because the situations you guys face are just so stressful, it's hard to maintain that balance of respect and safety and everything. Wow . . .
Actually I was just about to post some additional info about how some vets have had some ongoing concern that some of those returning from combat might ironically be deprived of the right to bear arms if they are found to be suffering from PTSD (http://www.opednews.com/articles/opedne_larry_sc_051218_tsa_looks_to_va_and_.htm). I mean like that kind of adds a new dimension to the issue . . .
Tough situation . . . glad to hear everybody's safe in your work environment though . . .
Posted by SamTheTVCat"
Sure, if that is all that occurred. We were active duty military and I won't go over each and every detail of the situation. This solitary event was not the only indication of a deeper problem and when he was removed, he was analyzed, treated and dismissed. He returned to our work place to chat with us afterwards and did not seem threatening in the least while on medication. My point is that soon afterward he was issued a Federal Firearms License to buy and sell virtually any firearm. He himself stated that any time he did not take the medication his actions could have again returned to abnormal Only now (not his words) he had access to more weapons. Either he did not reveal his history on the application or it did not ask for it and when I called somewhat concerned, they tried initally to just blow it off like it was not an issue. I do not know how I feel yet with mental illness being a blanket denial for gun ownership but owning guns (and in this case the owning the license to sell and own virtually any weapon) should carry with it a level of responsibility that the ability to fulfill does not depend on whether or not I felt like taking my medication.
Look, here's what seems to be at stake with regards to this issue:
public safety
right to bear arms
right to privacy
equal protection
state sovereignty
personal liberty
The Brady bill was found to be Unconstitutional by the US Supreme Court to the extent that it required States to collect data and report it to the Federal Justice Dept as violative of 10A (State sovereignty) - even if Congress ever offers funding, it's not clear states can be compelled to comply with the reporting aspect.
A waiting period is not required because of the Federal database.
Now the Brady bill is still law and States must refuse licenses to certain types of people - felons, fugitives, current drug addicts, illegal aliens, dishonorably discharged troops, US traitors, and those "adjudicated as a mental defective or been committed to a mental institution" (18 U.S.C. 922 (g)).
A 'mental defective' is defined as "a person, as a result of marked subnormal intelligence, or mental illness, incompetency, condition, or disease is a danger to himself or to others or lacks the mental capacity to contract or manage his own affairs. Also included are people if there has been "a finding of insanity by a court in a criminal case and those persons found incompetent to stand trial or found not guilty by reason of lack of mental responsibility"
'Committed to a mental institution" "includes commitments for other reasons, such as for DRUG USE. The term DOES NOT include a person in a mental institution for observation or a voluntary admission to a mental institution."
The governor of Virginia just passed a law which would include those not committed, but this is NOT law in the other 49 states.
States determine who gets involuntarily committed, but they're limited by 5A liberty concerns. Typically this only includes people who are "gravely disabled" (inability to take care of self puts him in danger of serious harm, will suffer serious distress/impairment if not treated), or "present a likelihood of SERIOUS harm to self or others" (as shown by his BEHAVIOR AND is likely in the NEAR FUTURE, or shows a current intent to carry out PLANS)
My point is that this isn't Nazi Germany - people have Constitutional rights. If the definition of 'mentally ill' starts expanding to anybody who is temporarily ill that shows not threat of violence (like women with post-partum depression), it's going to face a Constitutional challenge that is likely to go in favor of individual rights to liberty, equal protection and 2A. I think the way to increase public safety with regards to at-risk mentally ill people is to develop greater social consciousness for the different types of mental illness and their manifestations and treatments and actually get rid of the stigma, not foster it.
In the 60 Minutes show "Armed and Dangerous":
1. Why not talk to any mental health consumer or psychiatric survivor organization about their point of view?
2. Why not discuss what happens in an "involuntary commitment."
Typically a poor and powerless individual sees a court-appointed attorney for just a few minutes, not long before the hearing
3. What is it like in the USA when "lists" are made of citizens and rights taken away? Let's hear from Japanese Americans about the hysteria that swept the USA only a generation ago.
4. How about going deeper? America itself is "sick" with violence. Humanity is "sick" with violence toward one another and our planet. Let's apply far better gun laws to *all* Americans, equally.
5. Why do so many journalists lose skepticism when it comes to the mental health system? Why not question the ability of psychiatrists to predict dangerousness? Why not cover what it is like for people to be forcibly drugged for decades with high-dosage psychiatric drugs that are now known to structural brain damage.
Four years ago we watched CBS and other huge media march toward Iraq and non-existent weapons of mass destruction. Corporate media domination is part of the sickness in the soul of America
Sincerely, David Oaks, Director, MindFreedom International
www.mindfreedom.org
Posted by nielklot
Ummm . . . if that describes exactly how things went down, then that's a death threat and it's a felony. The correct course of action in this circumstance would have been to call the police and get him arrested, don't you think??
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