France: Vive Les Nukes

Steve Kroft On How France Is Becoming The Model For Nuclear Energy Generation

(CBS)  To try and assuage those concerns the government is offering utilities financial incentives, risk insurance and a streamlined regulatory system, which has borrowed a page from the French by pre-approving four basic reactor designs from which the utilities can choose, knocking years off the process. And some of those new plants could be built on existing sites where reactors are already licensed and operating.

But apart from economics, there is the issue of public acceptance. The Chernobyl disaster, and one barely averted at Three Mile Island nearly 30 years ago when a reactor core suffered a partial meltdown, severely damaged the industry's reputation.

"Forget technology for the moment," Kroft says. "Forget energy. Forget greenhouse gases. A lot of the problems of this industry have been political. I mean, people are afraid of them. Fair statement?"

"It is a fair statement," Sell acknowledges. "There is some level of concern. But what we found out and what we have seen is the more educated the public is, the more they understand the technology, the more comfortable and the more accepting they are."

Americans, he says, tend to forget that there are 103 nuclear plants operating in the United States, that have produced 20 percent of the nation's electricity without major incident in the 28 years since Three Mile Island.

"And in fact, they have an outstanding record. There has never been a radiation-related death in the commercial nuclear sector in the United States, ever," Sell points out.

David Jhirad, the head of science and research for The World Resources Institute, an environmental think tank in Washington, acknowledges that the industry’s safety record has been pretty good.

Why are so many people afraid of it?

"When there's a small probability of a catastrophe people think about the catastrophe and not the small probability," Jhirad says.

"Then why have the French accepted it? And what is there about the two cultures that may influence that?" Kroft asks.

"The French love high technology. Whether it be nuclear power. Or supersonic airplanes. Or high-speed trains. They love that," Jhirad explains. "And they love, they accord huge respect and credibility to scientists and engineers. And scientists and engineers actually run these programs."

One of them is Anne Lauvergeon. She is an engineer, a onetime political aide to former French President Mitterrand and chairman of the nuclear giant AREVA, which dominates an industry that employs 150,000 people, and is a key exporter in the French economy. She may be the most powerful businesswoman in France, where everyone knows her as "Atomic Anne."

Asked what the safety record in France is, Lauvergeon tells Kroft, "The safety record in France is excellent. We have not known very important accidents. We are very, very careful."

"But one accident could change everything, right?" Kroft asks.

"Of course," Lauvergeon agrees. "One accident, one very serious accident could affect the nuclear industry as a whole."

"You must either be very good or very lucky," remarks.

"Maybe mix of both," she says. "You cannot bet on the luck. No luck in nuclear. Only work."

And right now she is working hard to convince the world that nuclear power can help solve some of the world’s environmental problems.

"One of the things the French tell us is that they consider nuclear power to be a green energy source. Accurate?" Kroft asks David Jhirad from The World Resources Institute.

"Accurate, except for one thing. Which is perhaps the Achilles' heel of nuclear power. It's certainly accurate that the plants emit no carbon dioxide," Jhirad says. "The one thing that needs to be solved is the issue of long term radioactive waste storage and management."

[harri183]

Answer to comment about French government running power plants instead of 'greedy coporations': The US government values keeping the government and the nuclear power generators seperate. This is for the same reason the Department of Energy (promotion of nuclear technology) and the Nuclear Regulatory Commission (regualtion of nuclear technology) were seperated into two agencies. The reason is to allow a seperate entity to do the regulating, and avoid having the fox watch over the hen house. In fact the US Nuclear Regulatory Commission is very well respected internationally and many other countries look to the US for insight into better regualtion.

[killaw]

@cbtdbn.
"What percentage of that is derived from uranium that is mined within the national boundaries of France?"

Sorry i missed your question!
But I don't know mate i would say around 0% lol. From what i have read over the Areva website, Areva is the world leader in natural uranium production with around 15% of market share (a position which ensure the so-called 'independance' that we were talking about), they stopped mining in France lately and operate mostly in Canada, Australia, Niger and Kazakhstan.

[killaw]

Another important project relating to nuclear fusion that will be researched in France:

http://www.iter.org/

[arnol_]

To begin with, the French example is irrelevant. As the report explains, it's a different situation there. They didn't have many choices.

But more importantly, in France it is a government program run by scientists. As that woman in charge there was saying, we are very very careful. No compromises.

Here it's in the hands of greedy and corrupt energy corporations whose only motive is profit. And why they are so enthusiastic about nuclear power? The report does not mention it, I guess Steve Kroft would not want to embarrass the government industry lobbyist he was interviewing, but new power plants would be built to a major extent on taxpayers dollars! Billions and billions of them. In France, given their situation, the country decided to invest in nuclear energy, for its people. Here it would be a government investment in corporate profits.

[nukesrbad]

Nuclear is so so so not the way to go. I will personally weed it out from the face of the earth.

"This aggression will not stand, man"

[organicg]

This story was far too one sided, but there is a bigger issue beyond the oblivious.

Say we do build several nuke power plants, which will take about 10 years to bring on line. These are profit motivated corporations, but they are also utilities which can petition for rate increases on future power. So if the country is successful over the next 10 yeas in reducing it dependence on fossil fuels through conservation and innovation the nukes will come on line just about the time they are least needed. So the price of the energy from these plants will the most expensive power offered for the next 30 years.

As for the claim that the US is developing a recycling program for spent fuel that does not create weapons grade plutonium, the correct term for that statement is Vapor Ware.

Solve the waste problem first, and then consider building a new power plant. Have we learned nothing from our current nuke waste problem?

[dan544]

I am very disappointed in 60 minutes and steve Kroft in particular. the story on Nuke engery did not even question alternatives. When the ceo said you can'nt relie on the sun Why did'nt you fall off your chair laughing. the Sun has'nt stop shining since before Christ. the only reason why anyone does'nt see solar as a viable alternative is because no-one can get rich on a natural resource like the sun or wind. your cost are paid for and few people make the amount of money you would if you had needed repairs and government givebacks to nuke indusrty. PLease Steve start acting like a inquistive person and not like your doing a entertaiment tonight fluff piece.

[jessedo]

"Wind and solar are you know, temporary sources of energy. It works when you have wind, it works when you have sun. No sun, no wind, no energy. You don't want watch TV only when you have wind."

I would question the motives of anyone who would make a statement like the one above. That it came from the C.E.O. of an atomic energy plant operator makes me even more suspect.

Last Summer, there was a major power outage in Europe that was only briefly mentioned in the US media. What happens when the water runs low or out and the nukes cannot be cooled without killing off the fish in the rivers?

[kcstan11]

Nuclear is the way to go ... at least for now. We need nuclear as a short term fix %u2026 40-50 years. However, long term, solar, wind and maybe even ocean turbines need to be developed. Solar and wind technology are simply too expensive for an individual. To make solar and wind affordable it will be necessary to change our lifestyle, but only a little. Communities of the future (everything from small sub-divisions to cities) will need to first be conscious of their source of energy (solar/wind) and then planned and developed around that energy source.

Right now there is a town in Alberta, Canada with a population of about 17,500 that is entirely powered by solar energy. So, as you can see, it is not necessary to live in the sun-belt to utilize solar energy.

[kcstan11]

Nuclear is the way to go ... at least for now. We need nuclear as a short term fix %u2026 40-50 years. However, long term, solar, wind and maybe even ocean turbines need to be developed. Solar and wind technology are simply too expensive for an individual. To make solar and wind affordable it will be necessary to change our lifestyle, but only a little. Communities of the future (everything from small sub-divisions to cities) will need to first be conscious of their source of energy (solar/wind) and then planned and developed around that energy source.

Right now there is a town in Alberta, Canada with a population of about 17,500 that is entirely powered by solar energy. So, as you can see, it is not necessary to live in the sun-belt to utilize solar energy.

[kcstan11]

canongate9:

Cute but ... true ...

[canongate9]

The sooner we start building new nukes, the better. The bad news is that we now need a bunch of French engineers. It%u2019s going to be interesting watching French engineers supervising illegal Hispanics building power plants out of Chinese parts on land owned by Arabs for us. We%u2019ll have to make sure they have the number of a consultant in Mumbai to call when they run into trouble.

We%u2019ll be watching it all on a Reality TV show.

[everhonest1]

AD Rossin does not seem to understand that Carter was reacting as did the rest of the country to the Three Mile Island incident. Contrary to the anti-Carter nuke industry whiners, Carter did not end the nuke industry in America. Three Mile Island and panic did. He just did what the public wanted. As far as the control of nuke material, he made a decision based on the feelings of the majority of Americans at the time, as any good leader would do (unlike current so-called leaders). There were concerns about dangerous re-processing of nuke material. If all controls are properly in place, the re-processing of material can start up again as they do in France. Once the Americans are guaranteed a safe, regulated, uniform, standardized and controlled nuclear industry -- as France already has and as the current administration is working against with their little deals with Bechtel, etc. to reduce regulation for expediency and obscene profits for corporations -- then let nuclear power begin. Let's follow the French. Vive la France!

[windex66]

Don't you folks just love the people who are against everything? We have a huge, great economy, that will continue to grow. We need a huge source of energy, and the solutions right now are coal, nuclear & conservation. Coal is horribly filthy, and these environmental wackos are against everything - do they just hate man? India even had a huge earthquake right under a reactor - no problem!

To the chap who mentioned John W. Gofman; why not look up Dr. Bill Wattenberg, a scientist, inventor, KGO radio host, & Lawrence Livermore Lab researcher, who also worked on the Apollo Mission & worked with Dr. Edward Teller. I'm sure he would punt-kick John W. Gofman any day of the week. (Newscasters, you should interview him sometime for some lively & informative discussions.)

Nuclear can be quite cheap, especially if we limited the endless, unending silly lawsuits by the lefties who hate mankind. And yes, open up Yucca Mountain, & look to reprocess the spent fuel rods. Wall Street loves nuclear, listen to Bob Brinker sometime on Moneytalk (radio).

Also, per the waste issue, "Dr. Bill", as he is known, says all the waste we have produced for the past 40 years could fit into ONE high school gymnasium!

[everhonest1]

This piece is very well written and accurate.
It is true that the French have a positive attitude but they also have something else, as you alluded to: they have a desire for their energy policy to be effective rather than a tool for big corporations to make a profit. The French place their country as the priority -- not the profits of their friends at companies like Westinghouse, Bechtel, or GE to line their pockets by designing competing plant types. They standardized for safety and made sure that plants were uniformly regulated and corrected as necessary. The US needs to focus on the needs of their people, not the profits of the corporations. No wonder the French enjoy life! Vive le France! We should use them as our model.

[blackkats4]

I was born in the early 50's and remember all the controversy over the waste generated by nuclear plants and what to do with it. If they can come up with a way to recycle it and not have to store it for a gazillion years that would be great. Otherwise I would rather have the greenhouse warming than sit around with a ton of nuclear waste buried who knows where and the possibilities that a couple of generations down the road someone would build housing on top of a dump site because no one remembered where the *** was.

I liked towards the end with the gentleman that had the small ball idea instead of the rods. Sounds like we may be on the right track for once instead of like in the 60's putting the cart before the horse as we tend to do with just about everything. No one looks ahead anymore, just at the now and the almighty dollar.

[blackkats4]

I was born in the early 50's and remember all the controversy over the waste generated by nuclear plants and what to do with it. If they can come up with a way to recycle it and not have to store it for a gazillion years that would be great. Otherwise I would rather have the greenhouse warming than sit around with a ton of nuclear waste buried who knows where and the possibilities that a couple of generations down the road someone would build housing on top of a dump site because no one remembered where the *** was.

I liked towards the end with the gentleman that had the small ball idea instead of the rods. Sounds like we may be on the right track for once instead of like in the 60's putting the cart before the horse as we tend to do with just about everything. No one looks ahead anymore, just at the now and the almighty dollar.

[alvdh1]

I challenge any who supports the building of more reactors in the United States or around the globe to do one thing. Go to your Browser and type in the name John W. Gofman. Read what ever you can find about what he is written on the nuclear power industry and the biological effects of ionizing radiation. If you still wnat this as a primary source of energy, then I would reccomend that you seek counseling.

His credentials are impeccable.
Ran the Lawrence Livermore Radiation Laboratory
from 1963 to 1970 on a $3.5 million grant per year for the Atomic Energy Commission under director Glen Seaborg. Was pro nuclear at the start.
Discovered 8 transuranium elements as graduate student while working on the Manhattan Project.
Holds the patent on two processes to separate Plutonium from spent fuel.
Discovered on uranium element.
Won the Stofurs award for being one of the top 25 cardiologists of the past quarter century.

When Bush's nuclear apologist was on 60 minutes last night and said no one has ever died from a nuclear power plant in the U.S., then read what Gofman has to say about what the real truth is.

[HandsomeWarren]

Mr. Kroft:
Nuclear energy generating costs are not cheap.
The cost at the "door" for nuclear generated electricity is 11.1-14.5 cents/kwh. This includes all forms of cost structures while coal is 4.8-5.5 cents/kwh. Wind is 4.0-5.0 cents/kwh and now accounts for 1.4% of global electric demand.
By end of 2006, the world had accumulated 14,904 MWe of wind power generating capacity. This is expected to increase to 160,000 MWe generating capacity or over 14.9% of the world's electric demand by end of 2010.
Ms. Lauvergeon was not aware that solar-hydrogen power plants operate 24/7 due to the night-time gas-turbine combustion of stored hydrogen to generate electricity. In 2007, a 200 MWe solar-hydrogen power plant is being planned.
Dr. Warren Reynolds

[alvdh1]

Absent from Steve's segment on nuclear power was any mention of conservation. The discussion centered only on the need to build more nukes.

Instead, they have made it convenient for the utilities to dictate to us large centralized power producing facilities like nuclear. We have been fortunate to only have had 3 Mile Island. All reactors of similar design were shut down in 1979 while the cause of the accident was being investigated.

Now the government wants to build 30-50 new reactors and become even more dependent on nuclear.The current fleet of 103 commercial reactors were designed for 30 years of operation, most of which have exceed that life span.

We are moving into uncharted territory with designs that wern't meant to operate past 30 years. One accident or terroist act at one of these aged reactors will bring the industry to screaching halt.

Instead, we should be funding wind, solar and conservation with every dollar we can throw at it. Ocean Power Wave Technology estimates that we can provide all of our electical needs by harvesting just 2% of the stored energy in the ocean.

Within one year, LED lighting will be available for home use that uses 1/15 of the energy that an incandescent light uses. Austarlia just banned the incandescent light. Replacing one incandescent light bulb in every Ameican home with a compact flourescent bulb would save 16 Billion in electric bills.