Dennis Kozlowski: Prisoner 05A4820

Morley Safer Speaks With The Ex-Tyco Chief Behind Bars

(CBS)  The prosecution accused Kozlowski of granting himself unauthorized bonuses and running hundreds of millions of dollars worth of personal expenses through interest-free Tyco loan programs. No expense was too great or too small to run through Tyco. None of this, claimed the prosecution, was authorized by the Tyco board.

"I am absolutely not guilty of the charges brought upon me," Kozlowski says. "There was no criminal intent here. Nothing was hidden. There were no shredded documents. Nobody was told not to say anything. All the information the prosecutors got was directly off the books and records of the company."

In the trial Kozlowski took the stand, and testified that everything he did was authorized. But he did not have a single document to prove it. He had already repaid many of the loans and claimed he was simply an overworked executive who left the details for underlings to handle.

"I was pushing the company, and growing the company and pushing all aspects of it to continue to grow and I just don't think we put enough infra-structure in place to support some of that growth," Kozlowski says.

"Yeah, but some of the lines got blurred, correct? Some of the lines between what was your money, what was Tyco's money became very fuzzy," Safer remarks.

"I think I did everything accordingly to you know, the way the programs were outlined, and the way it was done by my predecessors," he says.

Asked if there was a situation where the rules got lost, Kozlowski says, "Morley, as I said, you know, we're in appeal on this, and there's also civil litigation, so at this point in time I think we're crossing the line here."

The Tyco board had given Kozlowski virtual carte blanche and the one person Kozlowski said could clear it all up, the head of compensation, was dead.

Whatever Kozlowski did, it was clear that the Tyco board was not exactly meticulous in carrying out its oversight. But the jury believed that Kozlowski was guilty of grand larceny. Even so, Kozlowski believes he was a "dead duck" from the start.

"I was a guy sitting in a courtroom who made $100 million a year. And I think a juror sitting there just would have to say, 'All that money, he musta done somethin' wrong.' I think it's as you know, it's as simple as that," he says.

Kozlowski says he was done in by bad timing: the Enron and WorldCom catastrophes. He feels that most people believe that’s what happened to Tyco—that employees were left high and dry. But Tyco remains a thriving $60 billion company.

"The company went on after I left there. The company is alive today. It's doing well," Kozlowski says.

Asked if it makes him angry to be lumped together with Ken Lay and Bernie Ebbers, Kozlowski tells Safer, "That just frustrated me to no end. These are companies that had financial and accounting schemes, that had major scams, and that wasn't Tyco. You know, this was a major pay dispute."

But the jury didn’t see it that way. He was sentenced to eight to 25 years and ordered to pay restitution and fines of almost $200 million. It's unclear if he'll have any money left when he is released.

In the meantime, he spends much of his time in prison focused on his appeal. He can receive visitors on the weekends, but he says he has few friends left.

"In the final analysis, most of the people were close to you because of your power and your wealth?" Safer asks.

"That's correct. And they wanted to share in that. That was probably 90 percent of the people in my life," Kozlowski says.

And it is not just his friends who have left him – he and his wife Karen are divorcing.

Asked if the marriage was all about money, Kozlowski says, "Morley, we're in the middle of a divorce and agreement. I'm not going to say anything about that, you know, at this time."

He says he tries to stay positive. He's 60 years old now, but the harsh reality of his predicament is inescapable.

"When you're sleeping in jail, you wake up all the time because there's a light on all nigh. So you kinda wake up every hour, hoping and wishing and praying and hoping it was just a dream, you know. It's reality and it’s where you are," Kozlowski says.

"Often times, guys get religion inside. Has that happened with you?" Safer asks.

"There's a spiritual side that, you know, I think about and reflect on from time to time. But that's personal and private, you know, within me," he replies.

"Yeah. And you've got the time to do it now," Safer remarks.

"I have plenty of time," Kozlowski says. "Yes. That I have. Yeah."

[acajudi]

He deserved more than he took. He took that company from nothing to billions. He should have just been upfront on what he was spending. I do wish him the best.

[nvanliew]

morley safer acted like he was interviewing Bono from U2 or Eddie Murphy. 60 minutes presented Koz like his *** don't stink - they should be ashamed of themselves. white collar white guys get relatively little jail time because no one is physically hurt OR threatened during the crime. blue collar black guys get a lot of jail time because they strong arm. why should there be any difference, because white collar crime is a more-refined, country club-style of stealing. this country's felony laws are SAD!!!!!!

[brucebennet1]

Dear 60 Minutes Producers %u2013

C%u2019mon folks, help me understand the objective of the Dennis Kozlowski segment? I kept waiting for the %u2018uh-huh%u2019 that would give me a clue as to what I was supposed to derive out of this meaningless feature. With an appeal filed, Mr. Kozlowski wouldn%u2019t/couldn%u2019t comment on his convicted crime, motivation or rationale behind it any further than to talk of what life has been like since he%u2019s been serving his sentence. Further, I failed to see any remorse or discernable shift in his outlook on life by virtue of going through this which I doubt would have any impact on his appeal. Even Morley Safer tried to fish some interest out of this interview with his inviting comment about people in similar circumstance finding religion. Mr. Kozlowski replied little on the subject. I%u2019m sure that any planned segment of your show can fall short of meeting the intended objective. But after reviewing the raw footage, didn%u2019t anyone ask, %u2018what was that all about?%u2019 Contrary to your objective stance, next time we see a Dennis Kozlowski interview, please help the viewer leap for a conclusion. Not surprising that the title was merely his Prisoner ID versus a title w/ a point of view. You can and have done better than this. Dennis is convicted of corporate stealing and owes restitution. 60 Minutes and Dennis stole 15 minutes of my life last night and now you owe me.

[aldewitt-2009]

Boo hoo. Cry me a river. Tyco has a reputation for being a cut-throat competitor and it has been hit with a lot of judgments for patent infringement and unfair competition in the medical device industry. Deal a Day Dennis deserves a nice dank prison cell and a really long time to ponder his failings. He hurt a lot of people by stealing money from Tyco and acting like it was his own piggy bank. While CBS may feel sorry for Dennis, I feel sorry for his victims.

[ewvdt]

I saw you on 60 Minutes last night and I think you got a raw deal, Dennis.
You made TYCO into the company it is today. In no way must you be included in the crooks of Enron and Worldcom.
The board is guilty of giving you carte blanche on the way you spent the money and by their inaction.

I'm your age, a working stiff @$4300/month and I hope you're humbled, forget about all the superficial characters that used to cheer you on including your ex for who you threw that crazy party.

If I ever meet you in person I'll buy you a cup of coffee and I don't need any favors from you.
Remember where you came from; you don't have to impress the "upper echelon" snobs, be humble.

Good luck my friend, I hope your appeal works in your favor!

[ewvdt]

I saw you on 60 Minutes last night and I think you got a raw deal, Dennis.
You made TYCO into the company it is today. In no way must you be included in the crooks of Enron and Worldcom.
The board is guilty of giving you carte blanche on the way you spent the money and by their inaction.

I'm your age, a working stiff @$4300/month and I hope you're humbled, forget about all the superficial characters that used to cheer you on including your ex for who you threw that crazy party.

If I ever meet you in person I'll buy you a cup of coffee and I don't need any favors from you.
Remember where you came from; you don't have to impress the "upper echelon" snobs, be humble.

Good luck my friend, I hope your appeal works in your favor!

[ewvdt]

I saw you on 60 Minutes last night and I think you got a raw deal, Dennis.
You made TYCO into the company it is today. In no way must you be included in the crooks of Enron and Worldcom.
The board is guilty of giving you carte blanche on the way you spent the money and by their inaction.

I'm your age, a working stiff @$4300/month and I hope you're humbled, forget about all the superficial characters that used to cheer you on including your ex for who you threw that crazy party.

If I ever meet you in person I'll buy you a cup of coffee and I don't need any favors from you.
Remember where you came from; you don't have to impress the "upper echelon" snobs, be humble.

Good luck my friend, I hope your appeal works in your favor!

[ewvdt]

I saw you on 60 Minutes last night and I think you got a raw deal, Dennis.
You made TYCO into the company it is today. In no way must you be included in the crooks of Enron and Worldcom.
The board is guilty of giving you carte blanche on the way you spent the money and by their inaction.

I'm your age, a working stiff @$4300/month and I hope you're humbled, forget about all the superficial characters that used to cheer you on including your ex for who you threw that crazy party.

If I ever meet you in person I'll buy you a cup of coffee and I don't need any favors from you.
Remember where you came from; you don't have to impress the "upper echelon" snobs, be humble.

Good luck my friend, I hope your appeal works in your favor!

[ewvdt]

You got a raw deal, Dennis.
You made TYCO into the company it is today. In no way must you be included in the crooks of Enron and Worldcom.
The board is guilty of giving you carte blanche on the way you spent the money and by their inaction.

I'm your age, a working stiff @$4300/month and I hope you're humbled, forget about all the superficial characters that used to cheer you on including your ex for who you threw that crazy party.

If I ever meet you in person I'll buy you a cup of coffee.
Remember where you came from; you dont have to impress the "upper echelon" snobs, be humble.

Good luck my friend, I hope your appeal works in your favor!

[ewvdt]

You got a raw deal, Dennis.
You made TYCO into the company it is today. In no way you must be included in the crooks of Enron and Worldcom.
The board is guilty of giving you carte blanche on the way you spent the money and by their inaction.

I'm your age, a working stiff @$4300/month and I hope you're humbled, forget about all the superficial characters that used to cheer you on including your ex for who you threw that crazy party.

If I ever meet you in person I'll buy you a cup of coffee. Remember where you came from; you dont have to impress the "upper echelon", be humble.

Good luck my friend, I hope your appeal works in your favor!

[ewvdt]

I think you got a raw deal, Dennis, and I sincerely hope that your eventual appeal of your sentencing will bear fruit in your favor.
As I see it, you just made the mistake of being too showy and thereby creating envy.
You made Tyco corp. what it is today. The board gave you carte blanche.
In no way are you to be included in the crooks that ran Enron and Worldcom.

This working class stiff @$4300/month/61 years old would buy you a cup of coffee in a heartbeat.
All your buddies left you including that woman you had that crazy party for.
Shallow, superficial people!

Thank you for sharing your story and I wish you the best for the future!

[ewvdt]

I think you got a raw deal, Dennis, and I sincerely hope that your eventual appeal of your sentencing will bear fruit in your favor.
As I see it, you just made the mistake of being too showy and thereby creating envy.
You made Tyco corp. what it is today. The board gave you carte blanche.
In no way are you to be included in the crooks that ran Enron and Worldcom.

This working class stiff ($4300/month)would buy you a cup of coffee in a heartbeat. All your buddies left you including that woman you had that party for. Shallow people!
Thank you for sharing your story and I wish you the best for the future!

[mbpfrance]

Dennis, no matter how tough it gets....this too shall pass! Hang in there, you know in prison innocent or not you are still 'in prison'!

You are not alone.

For friends who passed you by there wil be others who dont care so much for the $ and simply share a cup of coffee!

[oakishpines]

see all my millionaire enemies, preaching expensive guns and drugs: go get them ... see all my friends, shopgifting grass and dirt for cures for cancer and other margaritas ... i'll worship my trillions and the weapons the best of best weapons they conjure and sell and i'll adore my poor destitute quality neighbors suffering their trifles while i give them foot ball and base ball and expensive pills most can't even afford to have shoved down their throats ... maybe giveng market share to normal folk is a bad idea because fascists would see it as fresh meat for the grinder and flock to the slave and slaughter ... see all my millionaire enemys preaching expensive guns and drugs ... i'll worship my trillions and all the fresh meat they buy for the fascists racing toward my slave and slaughter

[neoconrcrazy]

Taking someone else's money and adding it to your own does not create wealth, it redistributes it into fewer hands, and in doing so creates poverty for those who lost it.
Posted by brianbwb


or how about the LBO's ? Take a company over, by adding tremendous debt, financed by banks, then place the new shares on the market (AAA rating!)

the private equity sharks take the first bite, filling their pockets, the banks get another chunk, and the new shareholders get stuck with the losses! Great game!

or; the banks can't unload the debt on the market, get stuck with it on their books; what to do? Like a miracle, interet rates rise and everyone chips in to pay it off. What a great system!

[brianbwb-2009]

This is an argument that only those that are creating wealth would understand. I think before you judge from a poor persons mentality, you need to walk, deal with the trials and tribulations of a rich man gone through the storm!
Posted by sevanteX

Poor little rich man, maybe now that he is "broke", he will know what real problems are, how to get your next meal, how to pay this month's bills, how to have even a roof over your head.

Wealth "creation"? no such thing, son, the finite number of dollars means that it is a zero sum game. Taking someone else's money and adding it to your own does not create wealth, it redistributes it into fewer hands, and in doing so creates poverty for those who lost it.

[patricia2222-2009]

Yes, His wife should have been charged too, I am very compassionate for him & very sorry he let this happen to him, if ouI could have his address so I can send him some prayers, Thank You.

[neenga]

And Congress doesn't apporove increasing the rich's taxes and lowering taxes for the poor and middle-class citizens? We, as Americans, are idiots not to force this issue. People who make this much money (1) need a lot of oversight by the govt. and (2) should be paying taxes out their a$$es, considering all of the hardworking citizens who not only pay taxes but obey the freaking LAWS of this country.

[seavon]

i just like to say why you tend to put thiefs on your show.. just to boast about thier inmoral behavior, of thier lives,do you think i like seeing these crooks smile and boasting about thier life,, and all the money the stole,
,Dennis Kozlowski: Prisoner 05A4820
if you want to waste air time in M,F, PEOPLE like these,, them you need to give me the same amount of air time just to promote my business,, and all the good that we are doing here in RIO TINTO honduras,, but i know you're not going to waste your time on simple american people like me,, my story is useless you to,, so i challange you ,,,

being that i'm not a killer, or a theif, my story is useless.. but thank you..

seavon.com

[brucesmall]

"Martha Stewart case as I should be, my recollection is that she in no way looted her company, nor stole from anyone else."

Martha Stewart, with insider knowledge, sold her stock knowing the price would go down, and somebody out there, without that insider knowledge, bought that stock and promptly lost a good chunk of his or her money. She in effect stole from him, which is why insider trading is a crime.