U.S. And Iran Fighting Proxy War In Iraq

President Says U.S. Will "Respond Firmly" If Iran Escalates Military Actions In Iraq

(CBS/AP)  Outright war between the United States and Iran remains only a remote possibility, but the two countries already are fighting a proxy war inside Iraq, reports CBS News national security correspondent David Martin.

U.S. officials tell CBS News that serial numbers on parts used to make advanced explosive devices powerful enough to breach the armor on an American tank have been traced directly back to Iran. These officials also say rocket-propelled grenade launchers and assault rifles found in Iraq bear Iranian factory markings. Last May, a British helicopter was shot down by an anti-aircraft missile supplied by Iran.

Middle East expert Jon Alterman says Iran's strategy is paying off.

"What they would like is a country that is in some low level of turmoil, where they have lots of influence with all the major political players," Alterman tells Martin. "That's exactly the direction that Iraq is headed."

Raids on Iranian offices in Iraq have turned up computer discs which contain inventories of small arms Iran has provided to Shiite militias and records of payments made to key militia members, adds Martin.

Earlier Monday, President Bush said that "we will respond firmly" if Tehran escalates its military actions in Iraq and threatens American forces or Iraqi citizens.

Mr. Bush's warning was the latest move in a bitter and increasingly public standoff between the United States and Iran. The White House expressed skepticism about Iran's plans to greatly expand its economic and military ties with Iraq. The United States has accused Iran of supporting terrorism in Iraq and supplying weapons to kill American forces.

"If Iran escalates its military actions in Iraq to the detriment of our troops and — or innocent Iraqi people, we will respond firmly," Mr. Bush said in an interview with National Public Radio.

The president's comments reinforced earlier statements from the White House.

"If Iran wants to quit playing a destructive role in the affairs of Iraq and wants to play a constructive role, we would certainly welcome that," National Security Council spokesman Gordon Johndroe said. But, he said, "We've seen little evidence to date (of constructive activities) and frankly all we have seen is evidence to the contrary."

Sharply at odds over Iran's suspected nuclear weapons program, Washington and Tehran are arguing increasingly about Iraq. American troops in Iraq have been authorized to kill or capture Iranian agents deemed to be a threat. "If you're in Iraq and trying to kill our troops, then you should consider yourself a target," Defense Secretary Robert Gates said last week.

Iran's plans in Iraq were outlined by Iranian Ambassador Hassan Kazemi Qumi in an interview with The New York Times. He said Iran was prepared to offer Iraqi government forces training, equipment and advisers for what he called "the security fight," the newspaper reported. He said that in the economic area, Iran was ready to assume major responsibility for the reconstruction of Iraq.

"We have experience of reconstruction after war," the ambassador said, referring to the Iran-Iraq war in the 1980s. "We are ready to transfer this experience in terms of reconstruction to the Iraqis."

Johndroe said the Bush administration was looking at what the ambassador had to say.

The White House says there has been growing evidence over the last several months that Iran is supporting terrorists inside Iraq and is a major supplier of bombs and other weapons used to target U.S. forces. In recent weeks, U.S. forces have detained a number of Iranian agents in Iraq.

"It makes sense that if somebody is trying to harm our troops or stop us from achieving our goal, or killing innocent citizens in Iraq, that we will stop them," Mr. Bush said on Friday.

[dogband]

So if an American president declares war on say Great Britian babies....then our soldiers because they signed A CONTRACT TO be a soldier, should just go to London and kill babies? No? Yes?

How about when your leader tells you to invade Poland with a blitzkreig? Just obey? {Great consequences there.]

How about when your leader tells you to shove people of one ethnic origin into an oven? No or yes? Just follow orders?

Just do the job NO MATTER WHAT THE JOB WAS/IS?

Follow orders w/out thinking? After all they signed up to be soldiers. No?

Perhaps the deserters have a different perspective on what is right and wrong than do you. They made their choice and will now need to deal with the consequences as defined by the law. Don't like the lawful consequences...? Change the law. Last time I checked this is how we operated.

[hsmagst]

To MoonBeam461: You are a perfect example of why I consider Canada a parasite and why I think the USA should stop all economic contact with Canada. Giving aid and comfort to American deserters is just one example of how Canada spits in the face of American citizens. The cowards that desert the military are criminals. The signed a contract and accepted money to do the job, no matter what that job was. Nobody held a gun to their heads, nobody rounded them up and shipped them off......they joined voluntarily with full knowledge of what may be required of them. They are just jerks that wanted to suck up the good, as they saw it, without wanting to maybe do the bad. Life doesn't work that way and I hope they get what they deserve, which is at the very least incarceration for a long time...in my mind death......and I hope Canada gets what it deserves in the long run.......overrun and destroyed.

[jms_cheung]

If the US does nothing as it is now to stop Iranian supply of terrorists and weapons to the Shiites militias & Mehdi Army, then the conclusion is obvious...soon Iraq will be a puppet-government of Iran once the US left the country! The evil and hypocritical offer by the Iranian ambassador to offer Iraq `forces training, equipment and advisers' is outright evidence that Iran wants to `Iranize' Iraq so it can dominate Iraq. No one can deny that almost ALL Islamic terrorists around the world, be it the Hisbollahs in Lebannon, or the Hamas in Gaza, or the Laskar Jihad/Jemaah Islamiah, etc...have their tacit or clear SUPPORT from the Iranian government dominated by Islamic extremists led by the Ayatollahs. Like the Chinese says, `Cut the grass, must cut the roots!' The answer to stop car-bombs,human bombs and Islamic insurgency worldwide is to WIPE OUT the Iranian military arsenal (plus its nuclear reactors) NOW or it will be too late! Only the US & NATO have the capability to do it now!

[jbhoyt2002]

Instead of confronting Iran by arresting or capturing it's operatives, why not just blocade Iraq. lock Iraq up tighter than a drum, that is, nobody gets in and nobody gets out by air or land. Of course, we will need a million more troops to do this.
I am amazed that all the "think tanks" that we have in our government couldn't forsee Iran's and Syria's temptation for involvement and dealt with it right from the start!
Everybody is yelling "get out of Iraq". They are just as stupid as G.W. To lose face in the middle east would be disastrous. Loss of respect in the world would follow. Then, when we really need to respond with the military to a world crisis that threatens our lives or lifestyles, we will have no support at all from any other country. There are many more consequences if we just THINK about it!
George Bush has really screwed things up in the world! He is an incompetent driveling moron and needs to be severly sensured for his incompetency. Get him out of the white house!!!

[duckswill]

Lets not be fooled by these fools again. Iran is not supporting terrorists, they are supporting the Iraqi shiites. Terrorists is the mental smoking gun this time. Of course Iranians are in Iraq trying to kill Americans, they remember that we helped Iraq fight them in the eighties.

[skyk-2009]

Is there some way we could get Sir Lies-A-Lot to just go away? To just fade off into nothing and allow someone who is NOT a fascist to take over? But then there's the God Awlful leader of the Gestapo, Fieldmarshall Cheney! Ugghhh Never mind.

[tibu987]

The U.S. should leave the Middle East and let those countries settle their own problems.
We do not belong in Iraq or Iran. If the supply of oil becomes a problem for the U.S., up the supply from OPEC, Mexico, et al, drill in the Artic and put a higher tax on gasoline.
Under no circumstances, short of a physical attack on the U.S. or it's properties throughout the world, should we invade or attack any country.
With time democracy and capitalism will win out as it has in Germany, Japan, Russia, et al.
It is human nature to desire a better life with all the good things that come with it. Education will be the deciding factor in solving the world's
problems. The deaths of millions of people and the spending of trillions of dollars to kill them
does not make much moral or economic long term sense.
Of course, many people do not believe in this long term view and that problems can be solved with warfare.
Nope, does not work that way.
Naive, perhaps, but look at the alternatives.

[bm6005]

Remember the old saw " Better to be thought a fool than to open your mouth and remove all doubt"!! That applies to all Neoconartists.

[clestes-2009]

"It makes sense that if somebody is trying to harm our troops or stop us from achieving our goal, or killing innocent citizens in Iraq, that we will stop them,"

Why doesn't someone remind dubya that the overwhelming violence in Iraq is civil in nature and Iran has very little to do with it. Everytime Bush opens his mouth about Iran he sounds like a fool. He would do better to keep it shut, that way people might forget what an idiot he is. He is constantly reminding them with his shaking his fist at Iran and uttering dire warnings, both of which are meaningless.

He is trying to work up a non-existent reason to support attacks against Iran to save his failed and failing war policy in Iraq.

Got news for you Bushie, it is toooo late.

[bm6005]

lieberwoman18:
So here's where you've been hiding today. I thought maybe you just remembered to take your meds! Say the address you want to meet me at is 55 Lakeview Dr, Nederland, Colorado. Haven't you joined the Disraeli army yet!!!

[dallison7]

karlimhof-
The screen name is stupidpeople not person


LOL karlimhof

[stupidpeopl3]

karlimhof-
The screen name is stupidpeople not person and yes it has just been proven, thank you for pointing it out. i wasn't sure I would make it through the day without your help! The post was not intened to provoke anger. People are being killed. My point was focusing on the story and that it doesn't matter what country these people are from. They cover their heads with "towels" or "scrafs" or whatever they call them (see above picture) and they run around the streets with "AK-47s" "rocket lunchers" or whatever else they have to kill (see above picture). If they are doing this then they should be stoped (killed) no matter who backs them or what country they are from. I wasn't aware I needed to write a book to state a point! Sorry if I offended someone with the towel and Ak-47 comment!!! I'm not for people to be killed but if your going around looking like that you probably should get shot. Not too sure when the last time I seen someone look like that in any US city...pretty sure you would be shot!!!

[random_radar]

"It makes sense that if somebody is trying to harm our troops or stop us from achieving our goal, or killing innocent citizens in Iraq, that we will stop them,"

President Bush said this, but it could have come from the mouth of an Iraqi Militia leader discussing their reasons for fighting against the American occupation.

Notice that there is no rationale given for why we are in Iraq killing people or why our goals are justified. We are supposed to believe that we are inherently right to do whatever we please and kill anyone who gets in our way.

Yes, it makes sense that America should stop them by killing them in the same way that it made sense for the Nazis to kill Jews, the Ku Klux Klan to kill blacks, and, gosh, the Americans to exterminate the Native Americans. Yes, I see the connection now.

[katarina7-2009]

tibu987

YES Iran has threatened America! Did you not see all the photos on yahoo about the "wait til you see the next holocaust" !! Down with Israel, Down with America !! They are also in Iraq killing american soldiers and Iraqis as I write this !!

How did you miss that ??

[katarina7-2009]

It matters to America because we were not supposed to be in a war with Iran, and now that they have started it, and been seen with their equipment in Iraq, I have no sympathy for Iran that our ships our there. I do however, feel sorry for the people in Iran because if they blow up those nuclear plants, nuclear fallout is a possibility. They said they do NOT even have energy problems, so why else would Iran want this ? It can only later come back and hurt those in the country if an earthquake dislodges the nukes. I do NOT like having nuclear plants in America. I will always be against such a massive danger to the public. Irregardless of the country, the government should not put the people in such danger.

[davek455]

stupidpeopl3 - you just have so much love in you, quite impressive!

[karlimhof]

stupidperson

what fitting online name you have - and you've proved it too!

[stupidpeopl3]

If there's a towel on their head and they are wlking around Iraq clutching an AK-47, Shoot 'em.

[davek455]

Rusty50 - the bi-partisan Iraq study group recommended that we talk to the Iranians and Syrians. Your characterization that the Deomcrats are the only ones wanting to talk is not correct and is not founded in a sincere desire to solve the Iranian problem, it seems to be founded in a desire to continue to divide Americans into good (Republicans) and bad (Democrats). How does that help America? And why not talk to Iran and Syria? I'd talk to anybody if it helped save lives.

[frankly6]

Rusty50

We have always had a dialogue with China and Russia and we've fought cold wars and proxy wars with bothe of them. Dialogue is what kept us from full scale war with them. Now they are our trading partners as is Viet Nam. The Iranians have said that they want to talk so what do we have to lose by talking? We can "stay the course" and slowly bleed ourselves to death or we can think outside the box. I agree that it's less than ideal to have to negotiate with a nation like Iran but we have put ourselves in this situation. We have run out of good options and will soon run out of bad ones too.