Will High Schools Be A Relic Of The Past?

North Carolina's 'Early Colleges' Combine High School And College Classes To Get Dropout Rate Down

(CBS)  We're often told that problems aren't always as big as they seem, and that a little creativity may bring a solution.

So when North Carolina's governor confronted his big problem — one of the worst high school dropout rates in the country — his creativity kicked into overdrive, CBS News correspondent Lee Cowan reports.

"One way to get the high school dropout rate down is to do away with high school," says Gov. Michael Easley.

Sound far-fetched? The Legislature didn't think so.

"When I put this in the budget for the first time, I thought there'd be a big fight over it. And everybody said 'this is a great idea, let's do it,'" the governor says.

North Carolina didn't actually eliminate high schools. It just put some of them on steroids. They're called "Early Colleges" — high schools located on college campuses where students can take high school history and college-level English on the same day. Before they know it, student not only get a high school diploma, but a two-year associate's degree — all by the time they're 18.

It's a jumpstart that saves time and resources, and here's the kicker: It's all free.

Student Chad Lewis says it's "not a bad deal at all."

Lewis wanted to work on big rig trucks, but said high school bored him. Now he can study history and hydraulics at the same time — and he already has a job.

"It really gives you a reason for getting up in the morning, something you want to do, something that you felt that a lot of people supported you through, that you really want to go do," Lewis explains.

The state needs all the help it can get to build a new labor force. In the last decade, 60 percent of North Carolina's low-skilled jobs have gone overseas. High-tech companies are hiring, but a high school diploma usually won't get you past the receptionist.

Ashley Williams was worried that she couldn't afford a degree, but at just 16 she's cruising through college English — about to become the first person in her family to get a college degree.

"I have a whole lot of people who look at me as being something big, and a whole lot of people who believe in me, so it's like, I want to do something big," Williams says. "I have to."

It's not without drawbacks. There's no prom, no locker gossip, no cheerleading tryouts at the school. They're all sacrifices to be made for that something big. In Williams' case, she wants to become a city manager.

And after? "A governor" — and "maybe president" after that.

"She's intimidating, she's so smart," Easley says.

If he has his way, North Carolina may eventually be the first state in the country where traditional high school is a quaint relic of the past.

[a8m3h]

IT IS ABOUT TIME, WHAT A WONDERFUL FUTURE THEY WILL HAVE... MOST FRESHMEN KILL OFF THE FIRST YEAR ANYWAY.... NO CHANCE OF THAT NOW.

WAY TO GO, GOVERNOR....

[cbelster]

I am in favor of the project. If a child does not have the aptitude, desire, and/or financial support to attend a college, it makes sense to have a socially responsible alternative (signed-off on by parents).

A two year core curriculum followed by two years of mixed specialized training could give many at-risk youth the boost they need to find gainful employment following high school graduation.

I think there is a place for Shakespeare, calculus, computer science, and physics%u2026 but let us reserve those places for students who have the interest. And, if that interest corresponds to a trade, so much the better.

[Bree26]

I am for the project. I think it's great that some one has finally stepped up, and realized there is a serious issue at hand. If this was in effect when I was in High School, I don't think as many kids would have dropped out. I was actually told by the teachers at my school, it would be in my best intrest to quit, so I did. Now a days, I regret listening to their opinion. I know the School to Work program gives some students the push in school, to want to stay in school. However, this would be a wonderful idea for all High Schools across the US. It will not only make them want to stay in school, but will help them in their College courses as well..KUDO'S for taking the time to care for the kids.

[wordland]

I don`t know about all this.
Why don`t we just change the way kids are taught.
Have you ever heard of Harry Lorayne.
He`s the genius memory guy.
If schools spent their resources to build an entire system based upon his methods.
We could really get kids smart...and fast.
We`re becoming an ignorant nation not because we don`t have the resources but because we just don`t try good things.
How many millions of people know about Harry Lorayne...and yet how many public schools use his methods...to my knowledge....nobody.
What a shame.

[sy2502]

When are we going to realize that not everybody is smart enough to get a college degree, or a high school diploma? But instead we dumb down education so that even the less than smart kids can get a diploma.
Let the dumb kids drop out of school, so they can do the jobs that now we give to illegal immigrants, while smarter kids go through their high school and college, and can actually be proud of having achieved real "higher education".

[aeasus]

Awesome idea!

[bluestardad]

does anyone care?

[ncgmcpherson]

As someone who lives in North Carolina I think this is great. We already have a program with concurrent learning here. My two oldest kids have been through it and it's terrific.

I know nobody is forced into the concurrent program currently. I'm a strong believer that if somebody wants to learn, we should ban together and help them do so. Having an educated society only makes us a stronger nation. Education is a good investment we can make with our tax dollars.

[rillifane]

I think sy2502 is absolutely correct.

We've built an educational system that pretends that somehow everyone is "above average."

The only way to do this was to lower standards to the point that, in my opinion, the average college graduate of today is about as educated as the average 10th grade student back in the 60's.

[sueneely]

GREAT IDEA!!! High School has a place, I just don't know where it is.
I think the old relic is perpetrated because of government funding systems. These will need to be changed.
The whole sports for dollars charade could come crashing down. High School is a time for young boys to develop into atheletes for big bucks.
I think it could be time to look at the European and English systems of education. It can never be too late to prevent students from the boredom
and lack of purpose that plaques our current system. On the down side, it is possible for students to be put in a niche that should not be their permanent home. Technical training could never be wasted, but there needs to be some provision for a change in tack if a student discovers a different interest or ability. It would also be necessary to try to insure that mandatory exposure to subjects that are vital like American history and languages are not relegated to the dust bin.
Education should be a life long pursuit which doesn't always have to do with earning power.
Education includes social reponsibility, fun and mostly any student's increased knowledge of himself and subsequent place in society.

[sbergman6]

There's a private school in Tennessee that provdies a similar program. At St. Andrew's-Sewanee (www.sasweb.org)students can take classes at the University of the South in their junior and senior years. The best part is that they don't have to give up the high school experience. They live on a high school campus complete with a prom, sports teams, school plays, and peers their own age.

[gangesdak]

I hope college education in North Carolina is not coming down to the level of High School education. There is no short cut to education. Pretty soon the industries would learn that a college graduate from North Carolina is really just a High School graduate. Then what? Will it stop the inflow of competent educated people from overseas? How long will the gimmicks work, and how long will the parents in N.Carolina be content with the education doled out by the state that has no resale value?

[grumpas]

In order to graduate high school in 1960 I had to have 4 years of English! I don't remember the other requirements but I think we had to have 2 years of science, 2 years of history, math and etc. As far as I can see the public school system started going down the tubes in 1970 (my children were in school in this era) when the teaching methods and requirements to graduate were changed! They were supposedly updated to meet the needs of the day! My kids were offered "Creative Basketweaving" and "Metal Shop" as a class options! They need to go back to the old requirements! They produced better results!

[bwright923]

grumpas,
That was a pretty elitist thing to say. I am a senior in college getting my degree in Biology, but I also had metal shop in high school. It was pretty hard. I guess you never worked with your hands.

[grumpas]

You missed the point I was trying to make completely bwright923! If you had taken something other than metal shop you might have a little insight! The point I was trying to make it was not a necessary ingredient to educate! Whereas English, math, science and history are! Metal Shop is something most people could live without, with no harm ever being done! There are more important things to take in order to get a well rounded education! After all isn't that why people like you spend your time in school is to be educated???? But, I guess I am just being an elitist!

[marcpcbs]

Managing the educational problems of a High School is like bailing the water out of a boat. There are two ways to stop the bailing. One is to fix the holes in the boat and the other is to let the boat sink. North Carolina has decided to let the boat sink and let all her students drowned. North Carolina has also inflicted a massive injustice to all of their students that worked hard for their High School Diploma.

In 1996 The United States decided to let some of it's states go into the business of growing and distribution around $35 Billion dollars worth of very strong mind numbing pot all across the nation. Over seventy percent of this pot ends up in this nations school system and is destroying our kids educations, health and futures. All of this because the pot lobby chose to push the lie of Med Pot. And we bought it.

To get our schools back on track we first of all have to vote to reverse the Med Pot Lie and employ drug testing on the students and the teachers to make sure our schools are clean. Secondly we have to remove all the popularity-seeking bureaucrats from running our schools and replace them with strong people who care more about education, kids and the level of learning excellence in this nations future than how popular they are.

If we don't do these things and soon, then the good ship USA will sink.

[olebd]

Will this give colleges MORE excuses to raise their tuitions???

I'm not sure this idea is the answer.

Kids do need more incentive and guidance to stay motivated in school.

These days it seems too much emphasis is being placed on problems other than the core of education.

1. No Child Left Behind is failing. It places teachers' focus solely on testing to achieve adequate passing grade numbers....causing the opposite effect of what it initially intended.

2. Runaway illegal immigration is draining the coffers for ESL (English as a Second Language)

3. More money is needed to improve facilities, update technologies and make sure teachers are given on-going training to improve their techniques. This is especially true in many rural schools.

As long as the current administration insists on digging us deeper and deeper in debt with Iraq, I don't foresee any miracle strides in providing for our public schools.

We have something called Running Start. We also have college in the high school, etc. Our child signed up for running start for his senior year. No, the classes are NOT dumbed down. They are regular college classes taught by college professors. Our kid's overall attitude is: "I was sick of being spoon fed. It's great to just get on with it!" Our student does not have a 4.0 gpa. He has a 3.3, and he had to work HARD for that. Many students with the 4.0 gpa are perfectly happy to stay in the high school atmosphere. My kid was not. BTW the college credits will allow a greater opportunity to take classes there would not have been time to take.

[marcpcbs]

kwood211

There are many ways that the education system is letting our kids down. One of them is "Dumbing Down" the lesson plan or just giving away grades. another is "whittling" what they learn which is doing away with all the support classes and just teaching one topic. This creates "One Trick Ponies" that have a BA in some area but they can't read, can't do basic math, can't write to save their live like fill in a job app. they don't know a thing about human history. You can't work successfully with people if you don't know the nature or history of the human beast. They have 100 word vocabularies. The well-rounded education that used to be available in the 50s has been traded in for a six week BA that can't deliver.

One of the reasons for this is, schools get paid by how many attend and how many graduate. Over the past 40 years, drugs in our schools and lack of support have made it so teachers almost have to give away grades as an act of self-preservation. This act serves no one. We need to change this.

[marcpcbs]

Will High Schools Be A Relic Of The Past?

Just how stupid do we want our young people to be?

We only ask this question because we don't understand how important a fully rounded education is and we think we can get away with cheating the system and our kids.

Oh well, this society doe's have a safety net for those who don't think they need an education.

It's called the Prison System

[marcpcbs]

Any high school student who thinks there doing great in their studies should go take a 1954 8th grade general ed test.

This could be humbling

marcpcbs - I totally disagree with you. I don't know what "6 week BA" program you are referring to. A BA takes 4 years (not including summers). Colleges and Universities require a general education along with all the classes relevant to a particular major.

General requirements include history (for example: western civ, US history, eastern studies, etc.), lab. sciences (chemistry, biology, physics, etc), foreign languages, math (calculus, statistics, etc.), social studies (political science, sociology, philosophy, psychology, etc.). Not to mention literature, writing (both informational and technical) as well as other English courses, and on and on. That%u2019s what you get to do before you commit to a major.

Instead of spending any more time looking down your nose at students, teachers, and the schools, go and see what is going on in the classrooms in your area.

It%u2019s so easy for all of us to mindlessly sit in our adult-good-old-days-ivory-tower-haze of self satisfaction, saying how much better "our education" was.

WE are responsible for the state of our schools. If you don%u2019t like the education kids are getting and are convinced there is a problem, as evidently you are, get off your soap box and attend school board meetings or get yourself elected to the school board and DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT. I dare you.

By the way, schools have always gotten paid for how many students are attending.

[catt42701]

This is wonderful. Education instead of cheer leading and football. What a concept and why hasn't it been thought of before, oh wait, it was. In the past school was education with a short recess for play in the middle of the day. Not many days off either, certainitly not for sports.

[marcpcbs]

kwood211

There are plenty of schools out there that offer what they call a BA and you can achieve it in sometimes as little as 6 weeks. Diploma and all.

People in personnel departments in charge of hireing have to be alot more careful to make sure their not getting one of these one trick pony grads.

[marcpcbs]

kwood211

My mother was with the SFUSD for thirty years and I have be with the district for 14 years.

I attend every school meeting

Before you start trying to tell me that things are wonderful in our schools, Go talk to anyone in charge of hiring at a major corporation and ask them how hard it is to find people that have even half a clue.

And talk to any JC or university that review SAT tests

They will tell you.

[sy2502]

The fact there is something wrong with the current high school system isn't an excuse to just do away with it altogether. In Europe high school teaches the basis of knowledge to go to university so that when you are in college you don't have to start with the 101 classes. I got a degree in both Europe and the US and in the US I learned close to nothing more than what I had learned in high school in Europe.

[zykracosmos]

Easley deserves credit for addressing a difficult issue. Ignoring the fact that 1/3 of NC kids drop out of high school and basically end their education at that point would be irresponsible. I personally think greater emphasis on trade school training at an earlier age for non-collegebound teenagers would be helpful (referring to the comment about challenges for employers finding qualified applicants). Money is a key factor. State funding should be available for financing any kind of education, not just college prep. The idea of the state financing education through an associate degree is bold, but the commitment for financing has to be there from legislators and voters. Georgia has the best system in the country. Every student in the state is guaranteed a free education through a 4-year state college, university, or trade school of his/her choice, for whatever program he/she qualifies for, as long as the student maintains a B average. The Hope Scholarship program remains today the best strategy for keeping kids in school. As long as they make the effort, they get a free education (tuition/books). Capable students are not denied extensive training simply because of financial constraints. Because the state mandates that all lottery proceeds go to education, the tax burden for these educational benefits are not excessive.