U.S. Fails To Curb Baghdad Violence

Attacks Up 22% During Ramadan Despite U.S.-Iraqi Efforts

(CBS/AP)  The 2-month old joint U.S.-Iraqi bid to crush violence in the Iraqi capital "has not met our overall expectations," as attacks in Baghdad rose by 22 percent in the first three weeks of the Muslim holy month of Ramadan, the U.S. military spokesman said on Thursday.

Despite that 22 percent, General William Caldwell insisted violence and progress exist side by side, rattling off statistics such as more that 700 weapons caches discovered since July.

But the fact that the insurgency can take loses like that and still step up its attacks against American troops in what it believed to be an attempt to influence the November elections in the United States is also a measure of its strength and resilience, reports CBS News national security correspondent David Martin.

"The enemy knows that killing innocent people and Americans will garner headlines and create a sense of frustration," Caldwell said.

---

Listen to CBS News correspondent Cami McCormick's report on the military's assessment.

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The spike in violence during the month of fasting was "disheartening" and the Americans were now working with Iraqi authorities to "refocus" security measures, Caldwell said.

"In Baghdad, Operation Together Forward has made a difference in the focus areas but has not met our overall expectations in sustaining a reduction in the level of violence," Caldwell said at a weekly news briefing.

Meanwhile, the White House is emphatically rejecting two proposals aimed at ending the war in Iraq. Press Secretary Tony Snow says the idea of dividing Iraq into Sunni, Shiite and Kurdish regions is a "non-starter." He also says a phased withdrawal of U.S. troops — perhaps by five percent every two months — is not under consideration. "You withdraw when you win," Snow said.

Snow was commenting on ideas reportedly being looked at by a blue-ribbon panel chaired by former Secretary of State James Baker. The commission is to report its findings after the elections. But Baker has said there are alternatives other than "stay the course and cut and run."

In other developments:

Military doctors say it's become common practice to recycle soldiers with mental disorders back into combat, reports CBS News correspondent Sharon Alfonsi. One study estimates that about 16 percent of soldiers returning from Iraq have PTSD. But military officials say they don't keep tabs on how many troops still fighting have been diagnosed.

Iraq's prime minister says Saddam Hussein's execution would help undermine the insurgency, as the ex-president's genocide trial heard more testimony Thursday of poison gas attacks on Kurdish villages two decades ago. "Definitely, with his execution, those betting on returning to power under the banner of Saddam and the Baath (Party) will lose," Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki told reporters Wednesday in Najaf.

Two more U.S. soldiers were killed in combat, one in restive Anbar province and a second near Balad, the U.S. military reported Thursday. The deaths raised the American toll for October to 72, putting the month on course to be the bloodiest month for U.S. forces in nearly two years.

With U.S. troop levels stuck at 140,000 and no end in sight to the war, the Marines have decided they will have to activate 600-man reserve combat battalions and send them back for a second tour in Iraq, reports CBS News national security correspondent David Martin. It will be the first time a reserve combat unit has had to go back a second time and it's one more sign of the stress the military is under.

The family of the murdered chief of police intelligence in the southern Maysan province struck back Thursday against his suspected killers, kidnapping the teenage brother of a local militia commander and vowing not to free him unless the culprits turned over, police said. The showdown between the two Shiite militias has the potential to develop into an all-out conflict between the heavily armed groups.

The gloomy assessment of the Baghdad operation, which was set in motion with the deployment of an extra 12,000 U.S. and Iraqi troops on Aug. 7, was issued at a time of perceived tension between the U.S. military and administration and the nearly five-month-old government of Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki.

Caldwell said, for example, that U.S. forces had been forced to release a captured top organizer for radical Shiite cleric Muqtada al-Sadr on Wednesday, a day after he was detained on suspicion of "illegal" activities.

He said Mazin al-Sa'edi, a top organizer with the Sadr Movement political party in western Baghdad, was set free on the demand of al-Maliki. Al-Sa'edi had been detained along with five of his aides for suspected involvement in Shiite militant violence.

Continued

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©MMVI, CBS Broadcasting Inc. All Rights Reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten, or redistributed. The Associated Press contributed to this report.

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by rharrin1 October 19, 2006 8:49 AM PDT

SECRET PLAN now another idiot steps forward maybe he should start using his plan so we can get the hell out of there.Bush runs his job now like he ran his oil company it only stayed afloat because the BINLADEN family kept throwing money into it.What was the only plane allowed to take off on 911 a plane load of BINLADENS from florida.You conservatives the only way you are going to be able to see is to open your eyes stop marching blindly behind this FAILURE.

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by bsheff2 October 19, 2006 9:10 AM PDT

There you go Republicans. They have a plan but they won't tell us what it is. We are suppose to believe that some idiot who thinks he can control space now????? has a gut feeling about things in Iraq. He has a plan but won't tell us what it is. He has no plan.....If one of us were saying and doing the things this administration is doing and saying, we would be in a strait jacket locked up somewhere. Geeezzz!!

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by frankly6 October 19, 2006 9:12 AM PDT

Had enough? Vote for change.

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by October 19, 2006 9:32 AM PDT

I wonder who came up with this "plan" for Bush. He's too stupid to think up anything of his own.

I wonder what Cheney has been telling him now?

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by peterbaldwin-2009 October 19, 2006 9:39 AM PDT

Thomas "the shill' Friedman is really stretching it claiming that the tet offensive in 1968 was intended to undermine the will of the American people, though it is widely believed to have done just that. The offensive had been planned for years, was launched in January and not in October, and was in truth a major military defeat for the North Vietnamese who sustained extremely heavy losses (out of 84,000 attackers 50,000 were killed) and gained little militarily, though it was a total surprise.Ground commander General Giap (in later interviews) has never said that its purpose was political, but rather only to defeat the American forces. The current insurgent offensive by the Mahdi Army is to drive out the Americans and retaliate for Bush have al-Sadr's aides arrested. Bush backed down yesterday and released al-Sadr's top aide.

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by meboard October 19, 2006 9:47 AM PDT

They're counting on 51 percent of the stupid people believing they have a "plan". If they keep saying they have a plan...then a plan really exists! We can only hope 2 percent of that 51 percent come out of their Rove induced coma by Nov 7! But 51 percent can really be stupid when they want to be. See the results?

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by gladetryst October 19, 2006 9:51 AM PDT

"But as everybody says correctly, we've got to win." --- Uh huh, go Read Joseph Goebbel's quotes about "Every German says..." You speak the white house, not me.

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by meboard October 19, 2006 9:53 AM PDT

I'm just waiting for good'ol Pat Robertson to chime in with one of his "God will smite America if the Congress goes to the Democrats." threat.

Change the course folks!

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by meboard October 19, 2006 9:59 AM PDT

I wonder if our wise Pentagon planners have calculted at what point every Iraq civilian is murdered and the coutry is left empty? Is that when our troops get to come home? Wait! THAT'S THE SECRET PLAN!!! Oops...I let the cat out of the bag! Now we need another secret plan. ***! Sorry America?

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by armymom813 October 19, 2006 10:09 AM PDT

Bush says he realizes that a victory means losses but our men and women of the military want to stay the course and finnish the job. No, they don't WANT to they HAVE to or they face military desertion charges. They are told they WANT to by Bush and Rumsfield...the two biggest idiots running this operation. Would Bush feel the loss of the lives of his twins was worth it if they were over there and died fighting a war for whatever the reason of the day is. Everyday the reason and plan is different. Why don't we try a new plan...get out of there and let them run their Country however they want. Live in peace or kill each other. Why doesn't Bush put all his efforts into running this Country better and practice peace-keeping amoung us all here in the USA instead of every other country.

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by grumpas October 19, 2006 10:16 AM PDT

I imagine the next President will inherit the mess George has made out of the Middle East. Unless James Baker comes up with a way of exiting it before then. Which I seriously doubt! George has made such a mess out of it with his naivete its a lost cause! But, he has succeeded in doing what he set out to do! Make a name for himself in the annual's of American history! He will no doubt go down in the history books as our first "Fascist President"!

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by cathaleen October 19, 2006 10:21 AM PDT

I've got a great idea how to get our troops home quick. Pass a law making it mandatory for all 18 year olds who are children of all politicians from the president down to the Mayors serve in the armed forces in Iraq and Afghanistan.

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by bluestardad October 19, 2006 10:33 AM PDT

cathaleen, Great Idea GOD's Speed.

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by clestes-2009 October 19, 2006 10:41 AM PDT

Well, blow me over with a feather! gw actually mentioned Vietnam and Iraq in the same sentence. Has reality possibly made a dint into his fantasy world??

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by cbs_oliver October 19, 2006 10:42 AM PDT

The article says: "Muslim tenets hold that fighting a foreign occupation force during Islam's holy month puts a believer especially close to God."

An unqualified statement like that which will likely be taken by most readers as a description of the tenets of all Muslims everywhere requires some references and discussion. Maybe it doesn't belong.

CBS and AP journalists should be more responsible. What they write can have significant impact.

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by mjv2944 October 19, 2006 10:45 AM PDT

I just read where some Senator Burns said Dubya has a plan for Iraq, hell the man doesn't have a clue let alone a plan. The plan is so secret that no one knows what it is. The secret is we are up to our as*es in crocodiles with no leadership in the White House or the military. GET OUT NOW. Let them fight it out or turn Saddam lose, he knew how to handle them. We destroyed Iraq on a lie.

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by meboard October 19, 2006 10:55 AM PDT

I read a bumpersticker the other day, "The Rapture is not an exit strategy!"

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by rharrin1 October 19, 2006 11:11 AM PDT

The bush plan is soooooo secret he will never use it because he doesn't want the enemy to know what it is.

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by bluestardad October 19, 2006 11:12 AM PDT

Remember to Vote Republican and get a free gift, Mr. Foley%u2019s %u201CSoap on a Rope%u201D guaranteed to help you achieve Mission Accomplished, especially made for those of you who are having trouble Staying the Course.

Special Note: This product will be discretely delivered in plain brown paper wrapping complete with plausible deniability and I do not recall disclaimer instructions.

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by drgoodwin12 October 19, 2006 11:12 AM PDT

If you really want a more in depth story of what is occurring in Iraq then read this http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/10/18/AR2006101801865.html
The path to civil war is almost unavoidable.There is no one in the current adminstration that will play hardball with the Iraqi Goverment which has to many ties to the militias,insurgents and terrorist.Until someone does play hardball with them we are left with few options.Operation Sweep in Bagdad has failed as soon as we leave an area the militias and insurgents move back in.Our own military anonyomously admits that they do not have the manpower to control the situation in Bagdad let alone the rest of the country.STAY THE COURSE is as bad as CUT AND RUN and unless we start playing hardball with the Iraqi goverment then will end up with a Islamic state like Iran and Syria.We are at a crucial point in Iraq and time is being wasted with THE STAY THE COURSE policy.If we are to ever hope of this not turning into another Vietnam completely then we get off our butts fast.A failed Iraq will become a haven to extremist.As far as the so called secret plan,it is so secret that Bush does not even know what it is.Does anybody ever catch that smile in his eyes as he talks about the death toll?

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by osidebear October 19, 2006 11:20 AM PDT

It's so frustrating to know that the President seems to now understand that there is an apt comparison between Iraq and Vietnam, and yet he appears not to have noticed how that previous conflict turned out.

Bush correctly says that al Qaeda (which did not have a presence in Iraq before the bungled US occupation began) and the insurgents (NOT the same thing)are determined to inflict enough casualties to make us leave. That is the strategy of EVERY insurgency - and it works. Eventually, the occupier will realize that the occupation is not worth the cost. That will happen in this case, too.

There may have been no chance to avoid this situation once the ill-advised decision to invade Iraq was taken. However, whatever opportunities there might have been to have a successful, short-term US occupation were destroyed by the arrogance and incompetence of the President, Cheney, Rumsfeld, Rice, and the rest of the corrupt cast of characters in this administration, as Bob Woodward makes plain in his book State of Denial.

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by brianp55 October 19, 2006 12:22 PM PDT

Osidebear captures the essence of this fiasco in a nutshell. The only missing component is a reference to the egregious lies foisted upon the American public by Bush et al., regarding the Iraqi threat and hence, the justification for this invasion. To date, 3,000 soldiers killed unnecessarily and god knows how many Iraqis. Bush now has his place in history.

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by ellygumera October 19, 2006 12:29 PM PDT

It's time to use Gen. Sherman's formula in Iraq:

William Tecumseh Sherman is the U.S. Civil War General who famously said, "war is hell" -- and proved it with a destructive campaign through the South that burned the cities of Atlanta, Georgia and Columbia, South Carolina. A graduate of the military academy at West Point Class of 1840.
In the spring of 1864 Sherman, who commanded the Union armies of the Cumberland, the Tennessee and the Ohio. Sherman ordered the city evacuated and razed, part of his strategy to economically cripple and psychologically intimidate the rebels. After the Atlanta campaign he began his "March to the Sea," a property-destroying drive that began in November and ended with the occupation of Savannah on 21 December (his "Christmas present" to President Lincoln). Sherman then marched up through the Carolinas and received Johnston's surrender in North Carolina on 26 April 1865, just after Robert E. Lee surrendered to U. S. Grant at Appomattox (9 April). His policy of expanding warfare beyond the battlefield and into the civilian infrastructure, called "total warfare" and "scorched earth" strategies, has led to him being known as one of the fathers of modern warfare. He is considered by some to be one of the Civil War's greatest heroes, but residents of the American southeast, especially Georgia, pretty much still hate him.

It worked before, it is GUARANTEED TO WORK AGAIN!

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by mjv2944 October 19, 2006 12:33 PM PDT

Is this b-u-s-h-i-t or what. Disheartening and they were the ones that got us in there. Its criminal that our brave young men & women are being lead by such incompetent leaders. We do not need to "stay the course", as it will lead to bigger disasters. Its civil war at its finest, let them duke it out. We need to JUST LEAVE

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by emtak1 October 19, 2006 12:34 PM PDT

Like it or not, it is possible that we elected a
fool as commander-in-chief in the biblical sense of the word

If that is true (not saying it is) any American who expects leadership from the white-house to be of the "non-fool" variety, would be only being foolish themselves.

I kinda wish we had the British Prime-Minister system right now, where there would be a vote of " no confidence" and the excutive leader could be removed from the post. 2008 seems awfully far away. A lot of time for George Jr. to get us into even more hard times.

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by shutupmurtha October 19, 2006 12:40 PM PDT

clestes, Where did you get your info from CBS and CNN headlines...lol. "GW" responded to a question that refered to a specific event in Vietnam....the tet. Which marked a rise in violence in the Nam as a kind of "LAST PUSH" by the enemy to get the Americans out and sieze control of the area. We did eventually win the area back, but it cost many lives. What W meant (what the said latter) was that he was refering to the attempts of the terrorist to try desperate measures to kick us out and he assured them that that would not happen. He said we will win the war. I knew the libs were gonna have and *** over this. I do agree with you that this is not even close to vietnam. We are demoralizing the enemy in Iraq which is why they have resorted to homicide bombings and sniper attacks.

To comment on the actual story at hand, Yes, the violence is disheartening. Only when it is directed against our soldiers...and Civilians.

It is time we use some SHOCK AND AWE! When they encorce the curfue. They should just say anyone who is not in their houses will be ARRESTED. Then they can carpet bomb ANY suspected terrorist hideouts.

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by laurieleemoo October 19, 2006 12:41 PM PDT

keep it up----just exactly how much blood DO YOU WANT on your hands anyway?????

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by tejasdemo October 19, 2006 12:45 PM PDT

Look what the Republicans have done to our country and the world in just 6 short years ! We need to leave Iraq completely. A complete withdrawl. Then, send all the Republicans who keep trying to smear veterans WHO ACTUALLY WENT TO WAR over there and throw away their passports.

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by laurieleemoo October 19, 2006 12:51 PM PDT

jh6379--so what........you think BEING UNPLEASANT AND NASTY-----is only reserved for the liberals to do!

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by laurieleemoo October 19, 2006 12:52 PM PDT

You back off---and I'll back off. UNTIL THEN, IT YOU CAN'T TAKE IT----------------------------------------------DO NOT DISH IT OUT LIBERALS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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by laurieleemoo October 19, 2006 12:56 PM PDT

tejasdemo---why is it that you can not lay ANY RESPONSIBLITY on the DEMOCRATS WHO ALSO VOTED TO GO TO WAR. At least, the REPUBLICANS did not vote to go to war and then decide to QUIT RIGHT IN THE MIDDLE. Do you even know what would happen if we pulled out now----well, lets see, then IRAN would invade and take over IRAQ. Quit burying your head in the sand and PAY ATTENTION will you???

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by osidebear October 19, 2006 12:57 PM PDT

My guess would be that the one causing blood to spill from Iraqis is the one who continues to fight a war started under false pretenses. Remember it was either incompetence or outright dishonesty (or a dazzling combination of both) that got us into this mess in the first place.

Now we are left with this war from which there is, admittedly, no easy extrication. But "stay the course" is no solution when the ship of state is hopelessly grounded.

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by tejasdemo October 19, 2006 12:57 PM PDT

Lauriemoo....how do you feel about the death in Iraq ?

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by laurieleemoo October 19, 2006 12:57 PM PDT

Democrats are QUITTERS! I guess you are proud or something to be aligned with QUITTERS????? HOW PATHETIC!!!

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by tejasdemo October 19, 2006 1:00 PM PDT

I have little respect for anybody who voted for the war. However, I have even less respect for those who refuse to admit that it was a horrible mistake and that by staying we are literally killing our young people.

Lauriemoo, did you forget to take your meds this morning ?

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by laurieleemoo October 19, 2006 1:01 PM PDT

All the death taking place in Iraq is very disheartening to me. I do not want to see ANYMORE IRAQ'S OR OUR SOLDIERS KILLED. Everytime you open your mouths with your HATE CAMPAIGN against our president-----THE INSURGENTS KILL ANOTHER ONE. The violence has increase every since your hate campaign started and the blood of these people ARE ALL OVER THE LIBERALS HANDS. this hate campaign is just FEEDING THE INSURGENTS AND IT GIVES THEM A CAUSE. You people need to sit back---look at the BIG picture and see what you have done I hope you are VERY PROUD OF YOURSELVES!

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by osidebear October 19, 2006 1:02 PM PDT

Plenty of us do lay blame at the feet of Democrats who voted to go to war. However, their mistake was one of trusting the President. He presented reasons for going to war that turned out to be patently false. Whether he lied or just blundered is still something of an open question, but those are the only two choices.

It is not a weakness to change one's mind when presented with new information. It is a weakness to blindly follow one course when all the evidence says it's not working.

The U.S. will begin to pull out of Iraq fairly soon. The public will demand it. And rightfully so.

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by osidebear October 19, 2006 1:03 PM PDT

I will be proud of standing up for peace and against a poorly planned and badly mismanaged occupation. Put the blood on the hands of the man who deserves it: George W. Bush. All of the ranting in the world will not change that.

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by laurieleemoo October 19, 2006 1:04 PM PDT

TEJASDEMO------that medication statement is getting old----you really need to increase your vocabulary---so that maybe you can come up with something better than that!

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by laurieleemoo October 19, 2006 1:05 PM PDT

oh and the respect thing----well guess what, I look at all you people as the "Baby Jane's" of the world (Jane Fonda). That shows you how much respect I have for you!!!!!

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by tejasdemo October 19, 2006 1:10 PM PDT

You just always seem so upset all the time Lauriemoo. George W. Bush and the repubs got us into Iraq. You know it and I guess you just cant figure out a way around it. Maybe that's why you are so angry. Good thing you are not running foreign policy. We'd all be scramblin for the bomb shelters, right ?

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by laurieleemoo October 19, 2006 1:12 PM PDT

oh osideobear----just so you know----Osama Bin Laden started this whole thing and he started planning it on Clintons watch----before GW was ever even imagining becoming president. Osama Bin Laden takes 5 years to plan his attacks--that means he was planning the 9/11 attack while Clinton was in office. So.....what did Clinton do to provoke this attack. Obviously you idiots like to blame the american president---why not blame Clinton then. Oh and what would have been your GRAND PLAN in dealing with Sadaam Hussein. You obviously have a better idea---since all you can do is complain

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by missingamerica October 19, 2006 1:13 PM PDT

Quote: Maj. Gen. William B. Caldwell said it may be an attempt to influence the U.S. elections, reports CBS News correspondent Cami McCormick (audio). End Quote. I hate it when military personnel say things like that - they're not only entering the political arena, they are admitting they failed to consider the possibility in advance, did not plan for it, and inadequately reacted to its becoming a reality. Mission planning that does not include "worst case scenarios" is an example of the "Rum-think" that got us into this mess.

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by osidebear October 19, 2006 1:17 PM PDT

When all else fails, blame Clinton.

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by laurieleemoo October 19, 2006 1:18 PM PDT

hey jeasdemo -----You have just figured that out???? Just now, with all I have said for the past few days---and I know you've been there---I've seen you everyday---so this can not be anything new to you----THAT I AM HIGHLY UPSET at what you liberals who also happen to be PATHETIC EXCUSES FOR AN AMERICAN. However, at least I am not a MISERABLE DEMOCRAT.

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by laurieleemoo October 19, 2006 1:20 PM PDT

osideobear---i think you have that wrong----because when all else fails all YOU DO IS BLAME BUSH. This is so funny that you people actually think you can say whatever you want---yet if someone sticks up for our president you CAN'T HANDLE IT!!!!!!

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by osidebear October 19, 2006 1:20 PM PDT

And by the way, laurieleemoo, just so YOU know. Osama bin Laden and 9/11 had nothing to do with Iraq and Saddam Hussein. Even your beloved President Bush has, belatedly, admitted that.

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by laurieleemoo October 19, 2006 1:23 PM PDT

No---tejasdemo---you have that so backwards----WE WOULD BE RUNNING FOR BOMBSHELTERS----if you were president----'cause then that would mean that Sadaam would have his WMD's for sure---'cause you would not have stopped him would you have? God, i just llove the liberal spin on things!

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by laurieleemoo October 19, 2006 1:28 PM PDT

osideobear---oh says who?......your liberal leaders? Actually, they did prove that Sadaam met with a top al-qaida leader who who ended up being in Iraq. How did he get there----and who invited him---Oh right---I guess it was all a figment of our imagination and he was not really there---even thought we just killed him IN IRAQ. So come again- how are al-qaida and IRAQ not related?????

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by laurieleemoo October 19, 2006 1:29 PM PDT

Gawd you liberals ARE SO *** BRAINWASHED.

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[rharrin1]

SECRET PLAN now another idiot steps forward maybe he should start using his plan so we can get the hell out of there.Bush runs his job now like he ran his oil company it only stayed afloat because the BINLADEN family kept throwing money into it.What was the only plane allowed to take off on 911 a plane load of BINLADENS from florida.You conservatives the only way you are going to be able to see is to open your eyes stop marching blindly behind this FAILURE.

[bsheff2]

There you go Republicans. They have a plan but they won't tell us what it is. We are suppose to believe that some idiot who thinks he can control space now????? has a gut feeling about things in Iraq. He has a plan but won't tell us what it is. He has no plan.....If one of us were saying and doing the things this administration is doing and saying, we would be in a strait jacket locked up somewhere. Geeezzz!!

[frankly6]

Had enough? Vote for change.

I wonder who came up with this "plan" for Bush. He's too stupid to think up anything of his own.

I wonder what Cheney has been telling him now?

[peterbaldwin-2009]

Thomas "the shill' Friedman is really stretching it claiming that the tet offensive in 1968 was intended to undermine the will of the American people, though it is widely believed to have done just that. The offensive had been planned for years, was launched in January and not in October, and was in truth a major military defeat for the North Vietnamese who sustained extremely heavy losses (out of 84,000 attackers 50,000 were killed) and gained little militarily, though it was a total surprise.Ground commander General Giap (in later interviews) has never said that its purpose was political, but rather only to defeat the American forces. The current insurgent offensive by the Mahdi Army is to drive out the Americans and retaliate for Bush have al-Sadr's aides arrested. Bush backed down yesterday and released al-Sadr's top aide.

[meboard]

They're counting on 51 percent of the stupid people believing they have a "plan". If they keep saying they have a plan...then a plan really exists! We can only hope 2 percent of that 51 percent come out of their Rove induced coma by Nov 7! But 51 percent can really be stupid when they want to be. See the results?

[gladetryst]

"But as everybody says correctly, we've got to win." --- Uh huh, go Read Joseph Goebbel's quotes about "Every German says..." You speak the white house, not me.

[meboard]

I'm just waiting for good'ol Pat Robertson to chime in with one of his "God will smite America if the Congress goes to the Democrats." threat.

Change the course folks!

[meboard]

I wonder if our wise Pentagon planners have calculted at what point every Iraq civilian is murdered and the coutry is left empty? Is that when our troops get to come home? Wait! THAT'S THE SECRET PLAN!!! Oops...I let the cat out of the bag! Now we need another secret plan. ***! Sorry America?

[armymom813]

Bush says he realizes that a victory means losses but our men and women of the military want to stay the course and finnish the job. No, they don't WANT to they HAVE to or they face military desertion charges. They are told they WANT to by Bush and Rumsfield...the two biggest idiots running this operation. Would Bush feel the loss of the lives of his twins was worth it if they were over there and died fighting a war for whatever the reason of the day is. Everyday the reason and plan is different. Why don't we try a new plan...get out of there and let them run their Country however they want. Live in peace or kill each other. Why doesn't Bush put all his efforts into running this Country better and practice peace-keeping amoung us all here in the USA instead of every other country.

[grumpas]

I imagine the next President will inherit the mess George has made out of the Middle East. Unless James Baker comes up with a way of exiting it before then. Which I seriously doubt! George has made such a mess out of it with his naivete its a lost cause! But, he has succeeded in doing what he set out to do! Make a name for himself in the annual's of American history! He will no doubt go down in the history books as our first "Fascist President"!

[cathaleen]

I've got a great idea how to get our troops home quick. Pass a law making it mandatory for all 18 year olds who are children of all politicians from the president down to the Mayors serve in the armed forces in Iraq and Afghanistan.

[bluestardad]

cathaleen, Great Idea GOD's Speed.

[clestes-2009]

Well, blow me over with a feather! gw actually mentioned Vietnam and Iraq in the same sentence. Has reality possibly made a dint into his fantasy world??

[cbs_oliver]

The article says: "Muslim tenets hold that fighting a foreign occupation force during Islam's holy month puts a believer especially close to God."

An unqualified statement like that which will likely be taken by most readers as a description of the tenets of all Muslims everywhere requires some references and discussion. Maybe it doesn't belong.

CBS and AP journalists should be more responsible. What they write can have significant impact.

[mjv2944]

I just read where some Senator Burns said Dubya has a plan for Iraq, hell the man doesn't have a clue let alone a plan. The plan is so secret that no one knows what it is. The secret is we are up to our as*es in crocodiles with no leadership in the White House or the military. GET OUT NOW. Let them fight it out or turn Saddam lose, he knew how to handle them. We destroyed Iraq on a lie.

[meboard]

I read a bumpersticker the other day, "The Rapture is not an exit strategy!"

[rharrin1]

The bush plan is soooooo secret he will never use it because he doesn't want the enemy to know what it is.

[bluestardad]

Remember to Vote Republican and get a free gift, Mr. Foley%u2019s %u201CSoap on a Rope%u201D guaranteed to help you achieve Mission Accomplished, especially made for those of you who are having trouble Staying the Course.

Special Note: This product will be discretely delivered in plain brown paper wrapping complete with plausible deniability and I do not recall disclaimer instructions.

[drgoodwin12]

If you really want a more in depth story of what is occurring in Iraq then read this http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/10/18/AR2006101801865.html
The path to civil war is almost unavoidable.There is no one in the current adminstration that will play hardball with the Iraqi Goverment which has to many ties to the militias,insurgents and terrorist.Until someone does play hardball with them we are left with few options.Operation Sweep in Bagdad has failed as soon as we leave an area the militias and insurgents move back in.Our own military anonyomously admits that they do not have the manpower to control the situation in Bagdad let alone the rest of the country.STAY THE COURSE is as bad as CUT AND RUN and unless we start playing hardball with the Iraqi goverment then will end up with a Islamic state like Iran and Syria.We are at a crucial point in Iraq and time is being wasted with THE STAY THE COURSE policy.If we are to ever hope of this not turning into another Vietnam completely then we get off our butts fast.A failed Iraq will become a haven to extremist.As far as the so called secret plan,it is so secret that Bush does not even know what it is.Does anybody ever catch that smile in his eyes as he talks about the death toll?

[osidebear]

It's so frustrating to know that the President seems to now understand that there is an apt comparison between Iraq and Vietnam, and yet he appears not to have noticed how that previous conflict turned out.

Bush correctly says that al Qaeda (which did not have a presence in Iraq before the bungled US occupation began) and the insurgents (NOT the same thing)are determined to inflict enough casualties to make us leave. That is the strategy of EVERY insurgency - and it works. Eventually, the occupier will realize that the occupation is not worth the cost. That will happen in this case, too.

There may have been no chance to avoid this situation once the ill-advised decision to invade Iraq was taken. However, whatever opportunities there might have been to have a successful, short-term US occupation were destroyed by the arrogance and incompetence of the President, Cheney, Rumsfeld, Rice, and the rest of the corrupt cast of characters in this administration, as Bob Woodward makes plain in his book State of Denial.

[brianp55]

Osidebear captures the essence of this fiasco in a nutshell. The only missing component is a reference to the egregious lies foisted upon the American public by Bush et al., regarding the Iraqi threat and hence, the justification for this invasion. To date, 3,000 soldiers killed unnecessarily and god knows how many Iraqis. Bush now has his place in history.

[ellygumera]

It's time to use Gen. Sherman's formula in Iraq:

William Tecumseh Sherman is the U.S. Civil War General who famously said, "war is hell" -- and proved it with a destructive campaign through the South that burned the cities of Atlanta, Georgia and Columbia, South Carolina. A graduate of the military academy at West Point Class of 1840.
In the spring of 1864 Sherman, who commanded the Union armies of the Cumberland, the Tennessee and the Ohio. Sherman ordered the city evacuated and razed, part of his strategy to economically cripple and psychologically intimidate the rebels. After the Atlanta campaign he began his "March to the Sea," a property-destroying drive that began in November and ended with the occupation of Savannah on 21 December (his "Christmas present" to President Lincoln). Sherman then marched up through the Carolinas and received Johnston's surrender in North Carolina on 26 April 1865, just after Robert E. Lee surrendered to U. S. Grant at Appomattox (9 April). His policy of expanding warfare beyond the battlefield and into the civilian infrastructure, called "total warfare" and "scorched earth" strategies, has led to him being known as one of the fathers of modern warfare. He is considered by some to be one of the Civil War's greatest heroes, but residents of the American southeast, especially Georgia, pretty much still hate him.

It worked before, it is GUARANTEED TO WORK AGAIN!

[mjv2944]

Is this b-u-s-h-i-t or what. Disheartening and they were the ones that got us in there. Its criminal that our brave young men & women are being lead by such incompetent leaders. We do not need to "stay the course", as it will lead to bigger disasters. Its civil war at its finest, let them duke it out. We need to JUST LEAVE

[emtak1]

Like it or not, it is possible that we elected a
fool as commander-in-chief in the biblical sense of the word

If that is true (not saying it is) any American who expects leadership from the white-house to be of the "non-fool" variety, would be only being foolish themselves.

I kinda wish we had the British Prime-Minister system right now, where there would be a vote of " no confidence" and the excutive leader could be removed from the post. 2008 seems awfully far away. A lot of time for George Jr. to get us into even more hard times.

[shutupmurtha]

clestes, Where did you get your info from CBS and CNN headlines...lol. "GW" responded to a question that refered to a specific event in Vietnam....the tet. Which marked a rise in violence in the Nam as a kind of "LAST PUSH" by the enemy to get the Americans out and sieze control of the area. We did eventually win the area back, but it cost many lives. What W meant (what the said latter) was that he was refering to the attempts of the terrorist to try desperate measures to kick us out and he assured them that that would not happen. He said we will win the war. I knew the libs were gonna have and *** over this. I do agree with you that this is not even close to vietnam. We are demoralizing the enemy in Iraq which is why they have resorted to homicide bombings and sniper attacks.

To comment on the actual story at hand, Yes, the violence is disheartening. Only when it is directed against our soldiers...and Civilians.

It is time we use some SHOCK AND AWE! When they encorce the curfue. They should just say anyone who is not in their houses will be ARRESTED. Then they can carpet bomb ANY suspected terrorist hideouts.

[laurieleemoo]

keep it up----just exactly how much blood DO YOU WANT on your hands anyway?????

[tejasdemo]

Look what the Republicans have done to our country and the world in just 6 short years ! We need to leave Iraq completely. A complete withdrawl. Then, send all the Republicans who keep trying to smear veterans WHO ACTUALLY WENT TO WAR over there and throw away their passports.

[laurieleemoo]

jh6379--so what........you think BEING UNPLEASANT AND NASTY-----is only reserved for the liberals to do!

[laurieleemoo]

You back off---and I'll back off. UNTIL THEN, IT YOU CAN'T TAKE IT----------------------------------------------DO NOT DISH IT OUT LIBERALS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[laurieleemoo]

tejasdemo---why is it that you can not lay ANY RESPONSIBLITY on the DEMOCRATS WHO ALSO VOTED TO GO TO WAR. At least, the REPUBLICANS did not vote to go to war and then decide to QUIT RIGHT IN THE MIDDLE. Do you even know what would happen if we pulled out now----well, lets see, then IRAN would invade and take over IRAQ. Quit burying your head in the sand and PAY ATTENTION will you???

[osidebear]

My guess would be that the one causing blood to spill from Iraqis is the one who continues to fight a war started under false pretenses. Remember it was either incompetence or outright dishonesty (or a dazzling combination of both) that got us into this mess in the first place.

Now we are left with this war from which there is, admittedly, no easy extrication. But "stay the course" is no solution when the ship of state is hopelessly grounded.

[tejasdemo]

Lauriemoo....how do you feel about the death in Iraq ?

[laurieleemoo]

Democrats are QUITTERS! I guess you are proud or something to be aligned with QUITTERS????? HOW PATHETIC!!!

[tejasdemo]

I have little respect for anybody who voted for the war. However, I have even less respect for those who refuse to admit that it was a horrible mistake and that by staying we are literally killing our young people.

Lauriemoo, did you forget to take your meds this morning ?

[laurieleemoo]

All the death taking place in Iraq is very disheartening to me. I do not want to see ANYMORE IRAQ'S OR OUR SOLDIERS KILLED. Everytime you open your mouths with your HATE CAMPAIGN against our president-----THE INSURGENTS KILL ANOTHER ONE. The violence has increase every since your hate campaign started and the blood of these people ARE ALL OVER THE LIBERALS HANDS. this hate campaign is just FEEDING THE INSURGENTS AND IT GIVES THEM A CAUSE. You people need to sit back---look at the BIG picture and see what you have done I hope you are VERY PROUD OF YOURSELVES!

[osidebear]

Plenty of us do lay blame at the feet of Democrats who voted to go to war. However, their mistake was one of trusting the President. He presented reasons for going to war that turned out to be patently false. Whether he lied or just blundered is still something of an open question, but those are the only two choices.

It is not a weakness to change one's mind when presented with new information. It is a weakness to blindly follow one course when all the evidence says it's not working.

The U.S. will begin to pull out of Iraq fairly soon. The public will demand it. And rightfully so.

[osidebear]

I will be proud of standing up for peace and against a poorly planned and badly mismanaged occupation. Put the blood on the hands of the man who deserves it: George W. Bush. All of the ranting in the world will not change that.

[laurieleemoo]

TEJASDEMO------that medication statement is getting old----you really need to increase your vocabulary---so that maybe you can come up with something better than that!

[laurieleemoo]

oh and the respect thing----well guess what, I look at all you people as the "Baby Jane's" of the world (Jane Fonda). That shows you how much respect I have for you!!!!!

[tejasdemo]

You just always seem so upset all the time Lauriemoo. George W. Bush and the repubs got us into Iraq. You know it and I guess you just cant figure out a way around it. Maybe that's why you are so angry. Good thing you are not running foreign policy. We'd all be scramblin for the bomb shelters, right ?

[laurieleemoo]

oh osideobear----just so you know----Osama Bin Laden started this whole thing and he started planning it on Clintons watch----before GW was ever even imagining becoming president. Osama Bin Laden takes 5 years to plan his attacks--that means he was planning the 9/11 attack while Clinton was in office. So.....what did Clinton do to provoke this attack. Obviously you idiots like to blame the american president---why not blame Clinton then. Oh and what would have been your GRAND PLAN in dealing with Sadaam Hussein. You obviously have a better idea---since all you can do is complain

[missingamerica]

Quote: Maj. Gen. William B. Caldwell said it may be an attempt to influence the U.S. elections, reports CBS News correspondent Cami McCormick (audio). End Quote. I hate it when military personnel say things like that - they're not only entering the political arena, they are admitting they failed to consider the possibility in advance, did not plan for it, and inadequately reacted to its becoming a reality. Mission planning that does not include "worst case scenarios" is an example of the "Rum-think" that got us into this mess.

[osidebear]

When all else fails, blame Clinton.

[laurieleemoo]

hey jeasdemo -----You have just figured that out???? Just now, with all I have said for the past few days---and I know you've been there---I've seen you everyday---so this can not be anything new to you----THAT I AM HIGHLY UPSET at what you liberals who also happen to be PATHETIC EXCUSES FOR AN AMERICAN. However, at least I am not a MISERABLE DEMOCRAT.

[laurieleemoo]

osideobear---i think you have that wrong----because when all else fails all YOU DO IS BLAME BUSH. This is so funny that you people actually think you can say whatever you want---yet if someone sticks up for our president you CAN'T HANDLE IT!!!!!!

[osidebear]

And by the way, laurieleemoo, just so YOU know. Osama bin Laden and 9/11 had nothing to do with Iraq and Saddam Hussein. Even your beloved President Bush has, belatedly, admitted that.

[laurieleemoo]

No---tejasdemo---you have that so backwards----WE WOULD BE RUNNING FOR BOMBSHELTERS----if you were president----'cause then that would mean that Sadaam would have his WMD's for sure---'cause you would not have stopped him would you have? God, i just llove the liberal spin on things!

[laurieleemoo]

osideobear---oh says who?......your liberal leaders? Actually, they did prove that Sadaam met with a top al-qaida leader who who ended up being in Iraq. How did he get there----and who invited him---Oh right---I guess it was all a figment of our imagination and he was not really there---even thought we just killed him IN IRAQ. So come again- how are al-qaida and IRAQ not related?????

[laurieleemoo]

Gawd you liberals ARE SO *** BRAINWASHED.