This is: An attempt by the powers to create income inside of the system through Prison Bonds. The cost of the arrest, jail, attorney, court, etc far exceeds the amount owed. Understand the reason behind the issue. DO NOT FEED anger, fear, disgust~ and all other negative vibrations into the ETHER - the QUANTUM field where ALL is created. The POWERS understand how the REAL world operates- most humans do not. Namaste and Lak'ech all beautiful BE'ings. Know that not one deliberately designed spiritual organization has ever brought peace to this world. That was the design. Look beyond your reality. WE are waiting for you. Shieena Glistening Living Water
I work with crime victims who Judges order criminal defendants to reimburse for financial losses they cause such as medical bills, funeral bills, damaged/stolen property, deceptive business practices, identity theft, etc. Many victims are hard working upstanding members of the community for whom these losses create a huge financial burden. Most victims never see a dime from their defendants who have no idea of the long ranging impact of their crimes. But you should see how fast defendants come up with some cash when threatened with jail time for not paying.
Debtors prisons are alive and well in all 50 states, filled with "Deadbeats Dads", ie mostly disenfranched men who are unabled to pay crippling support payments even if unemployed.
The problems are interrelated horizontally and vertically, among all issues, local- global. Clerks of the Circuit Court (Montgomery County, Md.) Loretta Knight, Bettie Skelton, Molly Rhul; District Court Clerk Jeffrey Ward, Administrative Judge Cornelius Vaughey, Sheriff Elliot Tolbert, etc. government attorney John McCarthy, Kristen Bender, court personnel, attorneys (public, private), law enforcement (FBI, sheriff, police, fire/rescue, etc., contractors) are part of the ":fraud- crime- networks: with spying, surveillance, harassment, unlawful search, stealing, robbery, injuries; false arrest, imprisonment, citation, trespass, testimony; withholding witnesses; destroy information, documents, evidence, etc. Further include: sheriff: R. Lewis (Female, White, Montgomery Countym Md.), K. Naff (white, male, Montgomery County, Md); fire and rescues (abuse, even no fire; conspiracy).The problems are interrelated horizontally and vertically, among all issues, local- global. Clerks of the Circuit Court (Montgomery County, Md.) Loretta Knight, Bettie Skelton, Molly Rhul; District Court Clerk Jeffrey Ward, Administrative Judge Cornelius Vaughey, Sheriff Elliot Tolbert, etc. government attorney John McCarthy, Kristen Bender, court personnel, attorneys (public, private), law enforcement (FBI, sheriff, police, fire/rescue, etc., contractors) are part of the ":fraud- crime- networks: with spying, surveillance, harassment, unlawful search, stealing, robbery, injuries; false arrest, imprisonment, citation, trespass, testimony; withholding witnesses; destroy information, documents, evidence, etc. Further include: sheriff: R. Lewis (Female, White, Montgomery Countym Md.), K. Naff (white, male, Montgomery County, Md); fire and rescues (abuse, even no fire; conspiracy). False/ unjust/ frivolous levies, liens, garnishment, guardianship, power of attorneys, foreclosure, tenant-hold-over- eviction, etc. Thousands of cases are pending in the court systems for years or even decades; believed to be filed by "fraud- crime- networks" to victimize people; without due process, proper services, proceedings; cause homelessness, poverty; not because of the problems of homeowners/citizens, but because of unjust judicial/court/legal personnel, court auditor Robert Romero as part of "official misconduct- government gang- fraud- crime- injustice networks". Judges (unjust, irresponsible, judicially disabled) include Warren Donohue, John Debelius, Durk Thumpson, Ann Harrington, Louise Scrivener, Lawrence De Beard, Eric Johnson, James McKenna; District Judge Gary Everngam, Judge Gary Crawford; court personnel/ sheriff, attorneys, affiliated law firms; Sheriffs Earnest Turner, R. Lewis, K. Naff, etc. Problems of privatization, irresponsibility, disabilities of government attorneys and judicial/legal/court personnel are very serious, expanding, local- nationwide- global; exporting injustice overseas; Rockville city, Montgomery County, Maryland state; New Jersey Monmouth County, Judge Robert McLeod (private attorney), Judge Patricia Bueno Cleary, Prosecutor (private attorney) Patrick Healy, police David D'Arcy. Other people committed, conspired with police and fraud- crime- networks: Private attorneys: Robert McCarthy (Bethesda, Md.), Olivia Cammack (Silver Spring, Md.), David Slacker (Bethesda Md.); Ria Rochvarg (assigned as legal assistance provider to certain counties by Md. Department of Health and Mental Highgiene, but she went around the state for various abuses with Sherry Davis, Police Davis, etc. attorneys (public and private), Timonthy Adelman, Esq., (?) and law firms Adelman, Sheff and Smith(?, in Annapolis, Md), Robert McCarthy, Suburban Hospital, etc. Landlord/ landladies e.g., Jiewen Tan (Rockville, Md.) and Chia Yao (Gaithersburg, Md.) had been unjustly influenced/ conspired. MURDER-FRAUD- CRIME- INJUSTICE NETWORKS inc. Montgomery County Council, Md, Nancy Floreen, Roger Berliner, Valerie Ervin; Sonya E. Healy, Esq. Legal counsel/Chief of staff (any relation to Patrick Healy, esq. in New Jersey??), Jackie Steward, council hearing coordinators/substitute; Md General Assembly, Jamie Raskin; U. S. Congress, Senate, legal staff; American U, administrative staff, security guard, students (4801 Massachusetts Ave., NW, DC); Catholic U; US Institute of Peace, conference organizers/ speakers.
PROMOTE FAIRNESS, FREEDOM, JUSTICE, PEACE, HUMANITY, PRODUCTIVITY, WELL-BEING OF GENERAL PUBLIC.
RESOLVE SOCIO- POLITICAL ISSUES, BALANCING BUDGET. OPPOSE SO CALLED "FAIR ELECTION ACT" PUBLIC FINANCE MATCHING SMALL DONORS FUND- DO MORE HARM THAN GOOD, RESOUCES BENEFIT "BAD GUYS" AS USUAL. TASKS: TOP PRIORITIES: Society in vicious cycles as in need of revolution, we MUST act: ACTION: PROSECUTE/ELIMINATE "MURDER-fraud- crime- injustice networks" (inc. officials, judges, developers, lawyers, employees, etc.); expand further unjust operation; endless unlawful- immoral acts; rob/destruct resources (rights, land, properties, home, buildings, assets, accounts, income, pension, documents, evidences; public, private; business, civic, political); frivolous litigation, levies, foreclosures, garnishment, guardianship, power of attorney; improper processing of complaints, procedures, proceedings, docketing, bookkeeping, accounting; cause vicious cycles: socio- political- election-media- budget- legislative- system problems; civil-human rights backwards; people-slave. Frequent recommendations/petitions to officials, agencies, law enforcement, local - federal; as individuals or with civic organizations. ** EXAMPLES OF PROBLEMS - "MURDER- FRAUD- CRIME- INJUSTICE NETWORKS"- with official misconduct, government gang- endless unlawful immoral acts: Example of MURDER- FRAUD- CRIME- INJUSTICE NETWORKS: Leslie Gradet, Tamera Jones, William D Roessler; Offices of Treasury, Comptroller, Attorney Gneral: Joel Jacob/Jacobson, Gail Malle-Davis, Sylvia J. Brokos, Mary Hawse, Linda Tanton, Gerald Langbaum, John Barry, Pamela Porter, Leo F. Partridge, Mark Vulcan, Jamis Riley, James Britt, Audrey Thomas, Jeanne Lippy, Jesse Rosenburger, Ralph Lepson; transcribers Margaret Bauer, Senators: Walter Baker, Barbara Hoffman, Thomas Middleton, Trooper: Marty Sealey, Vincent Mass, State Election Board Ross Goldstein; Maryland DOEd Susan Page, Barbara Smith(?), SSA employees and supervisors (especially in Rockville, Md), and Bullivant (?, probably in N. J.; or other states). Lobbysts/ municipal attorneys/lawyers/affiliates, Paul Glasgow, David Venable, Joseph Stoltz, Jr., Barry Gordon, Stephen Perouka, David Steinberg, Wolpoff & Abramson, Richard D. Mirsky, Poppleton, Garrett & Polott, P.C., accountant Hilda K. Matijevic; More 'MURDER- FRAUD- CRIME- INJUSTICE NETWORKS: Marc Sliffman (Silver Spring, Wheaton area), Samuel White and his law firm and lawyers Shawn Bartley, Daniel Pesachowitz, Laura Jolly (phony person, named as "substitute trustee", but can never be found or contacted even through official agencies); many court personnel and judges (District Court - Court of Special Appeals). Court Auditor Robert Romero. State, county health services organizations/ agencies, Department of Health and Human Services, Montgomery County Crisis Center, Jean Burgess (white, female), Marsha Aaron; Department of Aging; Adult Protective Services, Sherry Davis, Suzanne Lord (?), Odick Esq., Bonnie Klem, etc.; Suburban Hospital, physicians, emergency staff; social worker Jody Crecensi (?), case manager Patricia Grafferty (?), Robert Rothstein, M. D. (?), Tipp Woodward; Manor- Care in Potomac Maryland: Cheryl Paulson (?, administrator) and nurses, etc.; forensic services, Md Dept of Health and Mental Hygiene: More of 'MURDER-FRAUD- CRIME- INJUSTICE-NETWORKS include: Maryland Department of Health and Mental Hygiene: Jolie Smith; numerous psychologists, psychiatrists, social workers, etc.: Potomac Ridge Steven Israel, Collin, Gabriel (?); social worker Tracy Lewit; Springfield Hospital Center: forensic services, Kevin Knight, Dr. Valadez (refused to give full name, despite repeated requests); Carla Craville, Francoise Reynolds, Roxanne Heyman, Amy True; Judges James Sasfield, Gary Crawford, Cheryl McCally, etc., prosecutors/government attorneys, e.g., John McCarthy, Nunylny (?), Peter Mitchell (Montgomery County Office of Human Rights); District Court Commission (Rockville, Md) M. Dickerson; Court Personnel T.M. (only initials, no full name available); many judges, clerk of the courts (Jeffrey Ward, Loretta Knight, Bettie Skelton, Molly Rhul, etc.), other court personnel, various counties, states; local - federal; law enforcement, FBI; police e.g., in Rockville, Md. Sgt. Cowell
As someone who is disabled and just had a stroke I think it is typical of the conservatives and haves or 1% to loft themselves on the high horse that they think putting folks in jail for owing money is OK. In the early days of America when this became an issue the US signed into law a bill to prohibit folks from going to jail just for owing money. Let me be clear I am not a minority or someone saying poor me. I am a middle class person who has now got a lofty $38,000 medical bill. I am doing the best I can but let's add the pressure of going to jail over my head and increase my stress level so I will likely have another stroke with an even high medical bill to the mix. WOW! What a country. It is ridiculous to put someone in jail over debt. Oh but wait you can't even file bankruptcy to help because the republican congress and president passed a bankruptcy reform bill sponsored by corporations and lobby groups to make it harder for a person to discharge debt even if at all. I am tired of states going against the nation law to have their way because of different sectors lobbying on their behalf when the average person does not have a say. Politicians just do what they want and let corporations and interest groups rule this country.
Back to the subject, I am sure my father n law who was a deputy sheriff prediction that this country would go down by 2030. So far every other prediction he made was right. Sorry he passed away and will not live to see the demise of America because everyone will either be in jail or on probation. Oh wait the rich will still be free. Sure the states get more money and best of all the companies that own private jails will now make more money from those who just owe a debt which they simply cannot afford.
Dear Mr. Sherter: The article was written with a sensationalistic slant. I'm in California, and I enforce civil money judgments. Although many of the rules that apply to debt collectors also apply to my business, I am *not* a debt collector. If *I* call you, it's because a judge has already ruled that you owe money. Every 120 days, I have the right (as a judgment creditor) to hale you into court to answer questions about your financial condition. I can ask you where you work, where your spouse works (if you have one), where you bank, your account numbers, stock brokerage account information, other assets (e.g. cars, motorhomes, etc.) and anything else that can be levied on in order to satisfy the judgment. As was stated in the article, if you answer the questions truthfully and completely, then we are done. You won't be hearing from me for at least another 120 days (or never, if the information you gave me enables me to enforce the judgment). As a judgment enforcer, I have the ability to levy on the contents of your bank accounts, take up to 25 percent of your disposable income (and your spouse, too), all in the service of satisfying the judgment. Now, having said all this, you can also voluntarily call my office and agree to make a payment of approximately 4 percent a month, and I'll pretty much leave you alone. (On a $2,000 judgment, that's about $100 a month.) Here's what you can't do: You can't lie to me. You cannot call my office and tell me that you don't have money (if you do) or a job (if you do) because I'll find out the truth. Also, if I hale you into court to examine you, you should show up. If you don't, I'll send my process server to your place of employment and serve you there in front of all your co-workers. (Your boss has to let my registered process server into your building in order to serve you.) Then, on the day of the examination, you have to show up in court (like jury duty) with all the documents that I requested. After you show them to me, you can go back to work. It only takes about 45 minutes if you have all the information that I request, and only once every 4 months, until you pay the judgment in full. My point is, if you show up, all will be well. If you don't have any money, I'll know. If you're hiding from me, I'll figure that out, too. The point is, if you're honest about your financial condition (good or bad), then I'll be able to prove it. Just don't ignore the system that's designed to give judgment creditors information about their judgment debtor. That's all I'm saying. This isn't about being a good person or a bad person. It's about telling the truth. I'm a pretty reasonable person. I don't judge people as being bad simply because they owe money. This is very much a "Golden Rule" business: I treat others the way I would want to be treated. Doesn't everybody? Hey, thanks for listening. Brian C., Hayward, California
Dear Mr. Brian I happen to have relatives that do another process you seem to be involved in, this is called skip tracing. I'm sure your aware of it and maybe even used it on occasion? While it sounds like you're just trying to do your job and hey it sounds perfectly reasonable to just tell the truth and make afew payments and you know 4% doesn't sound bad. That is until I got to the $100 dollars a month part, That's easily a weeks worth of food. possibly stretched out you could double it if you go and hit up discount food stores like Aldi or whatever you have there in cali. Have you noticed with this recession going how many places have now hiring signs out but then look at the people working there? I have and noticed either just out of high school or some of them having one foot practically in the grave. The only people in the middle age wise are management and that's' about it. Remember hearing about the old chocolate retailer 'Fannie May' ? They got bailed out with the banks and are trying to make a comeback, which sounds great I grew up with them a presence in my neighborhood. My own mother used to love the Chocolate Turtles they sell. Recently in my searches for employment I came across an ad for them, they were opening up a location near where I moved to. At first I thought this is great, maybe I can throw an ap at them and work close to home because I don't have a car and have never been paid enough to be able to save up for one much less afford one. Where am I going with this line? well basically I didn't bother because they placed a line at the bottom of the ad saying 'recent retail experience only' which you know reminds me alot of what your saying in your little paragraph. You see Brian there's cause and effect, everything you listed sounds reasonable and yes it even sounds fair. That being said though, The biggest booming jobs of the past 5 years has been low paying ones like retail, do you really think that a 'simple' medical bill couldn't send most of us spiraling downwards? Private prisons are a booming business or hadn't you heard about it? if not look into it. Sometimes they even toss troubled teens in rather then any other kind of program, From then on they disappear from the public eye with only their family if lucky to try to fight for them. You speak of a golden rule, why don't you take a long hard look at this process that your involved in and you tell me if your enabling people that are abusing the system for private gain or not. Alot of these prisons are just in it to fill them and make a profit not unlike a nursing home. How often has a person told a court that they were just following orders? Its' about being honest to yourself and to others brian. No matter how reasonable you may be and going by just some of the comments here most don't sound like they could be any different then you or I but you have to ask yourself if your feeding the beast that is the problem. Time you took a hard truthful look at what it is your doing brian. Hey thanks for listening. Foamy Darkale SomewhereupNort' ,Wi
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I'm in favor of debtors' prisons for this reason.
RESOLVE SOCIO- POLITICAL ISSUES, BALANCING BUDGET. OPPOSE SO CALLED "FAIR ELECTION ACT" PUBLIC FINANCE MATCHING SMALL DONORS FUND- DO MORE HARM THAN GOOD, RESOUCES BENEFIT "BAD GUYS" AS USUAL. TASKS: TOP PRIORITIES: Society in vicious cycles as in need of revolution, we MUST act: ACTION: PROSECUTE/ELIMINATE "MURDER-fraud- crime- injustice networks" (inc. officials, judges, developers, lawyers, employees, etc.); expand further unjust operation; endless unlawful- immoral acts; rob/destruct resources (rights, land, properties, home, buildings, assets, accounts, income, pension, documents, evidences; public, private; business, civic, political); frivolous litigation, levies, foreclosures, garnishment, guardianship, power of attorney; improper processing of complaints, procedures, proceedings, docketing, bookkeeping, accounting; cause vicious cycles: socio- political- election-media- budget- legislative- system problems; civil-human rights backwards; people-slave. Frequent recommendations/petitions to officials, agencies, law enforcement, local - federal; as individuals or with civic organizations. ** EXAMPLES OF PROBLEMS - "MURDER- FRAUD- CRIME- INJUSTICE NETWORKS"- with official misconduct, government gang- endless unlawful immoral acts: Example of MURDER- FRAUD- CRIME- INJUSTICE NETWORKS: Leslie Gradet, Tamera Jones, William D Roessler; Offices of Treasury, Comptroller, Attorney Gneral: Joel Jacob/Jacobson, Gail Malle-Davis, Sylvia J. Brokos, Mary Hawse, Linda Tanton, Gerald Langbaum, John Barry, Pamela Porter, Leo F. Partridge, Mark Vulcan, Jamis Riley, James Britt, Audrey Thomas, Jeanne Lippy, Jesse Rosenburger, Ralph Lepson; transcribers Margaret Bauer, Senators: Walter Baker, Barbara Hoffman, Thomas Middleton, Trooper: Marty Sealey, Vincent Mass, State Election Board Ross Goldstein; Maryland DOEd Susan Page, Barbara Smith(?), SSA employees and supervisors (especially in Rockville, Md), and Bullivant (?, probably in N. J.; or other states). Lobbysts/ municipal attorneys/lawyers/affiliates, Paul Glasgow, David Venable, Joseph Stoltz, Jr., Barry Gordon, Stephen Perouka, David Steinberg, Wolpoff & Abramson, Richard D. Mirsky, Poppleton, Garrett & Polott, P.C., accountant Hilda K. Matijevic; More 'MURDER- FRAUD- CRIME- INJUSTICE NETWORKS: Marc Sliffman (Silver Spring, Wheaton area), Samuel White and his law firm and lawyers Shawn Bartley, Daniel Pesachowitz, Laura Jolly (phony person, named as "substitute trustee", but can never be found or contacted even through official agencies); many court personnel and judges (District Court - Court of Special Appeals). Court Auditor Robert Romero. State, county health services organizations/ agencies, Department of Health and Human Services, Montgomery County Crisis Center, Jean Burgess (white, female), Marsha Aaron; Department of Aging; Adult Protective Services, Sherry Davis, Suzanne Lord (?), Odick Esq., Bonnie Klem, etc.; Suburban Hospital, physicians, emergency staff; social worker Jody Crecensi (?), case manager Patricia Grafferty (?), Robert Rothstein, M. D. (?), Tipp Woodward; Manor- Care in Potomac Maryland: Cheryl Paulson (?, administrator) and nurses, etc.; forensic services, Md Dept of Health and Mental Hygiene: More of 'MURDER-FRAUD- CRIME- INJUSTICE-NETWORKS include: Maryland Department of Health and Mental Hygiene: Jolie Smith; numerous psychologists, psychiatrists, social workers, etc.: Potomac Ridge Steven Israel, Collin, Gabriel (?); social worker Tracy Lewit; Springfield Hospital Center: forensic services, Kevin Knight, Dr. Valadez (refused to give full name, despite repeated requests); Carla Craville, Francoise Reynolds, Roxanne Heyman, Amy True; Judges James Sasfield, Gary Crawford, Cheryl McCally, etc., prosecutors/government attorneys, e.g., John McCarthy, Nunylny (?), Peter Mitchell (Montgomery County Office of Human Rights); District Court Commission (Rockville, Md) M. Dickerson; Court Personnel T.M. (only initials, no full name available); many judges, clerk of the courts (Jeffrey Ward, Loretta Knight, Bettie Skelton, Molly Rhul, etc.), other court personnel, various counties, states; local - federal; law enforcement, FBI; police e.g., in Rockville, Md. Sgt. Cowell
Back to the subject, I am sure my father n law who was a deputy sheriff prediction that this country would go down by 2030. So far every other prediction he made was right. Sorry he passed away and will not live to see the demise of America because everyone will either be in jail or on probation. Oh wait the rich will still be free. Sure the states get more money and best of all the companies that own private jails will now make more money from those who just owe a debt which they simply cannot afford.
Aint freedom great.
The article was written with a sensationalistic slant. I'm in California, and I enforce civil money judgments. Although many of the rules that apply to debt collectors also apply to my business, I am *not* a debt collector. If *I* call you, it's because a judge has already ruled that you owe money. Every 120 days, I have the right (as a judgment creditor) to hale you into court to answer questions about your financial condition. I can ask you where you work, where your spouse works (if you have one), where you bank, your account numbers, stock brokerage account information, other assets (e.g. cars, motorhomes, etc.) and anything else that can be levied on in order to satisfy the judgment. As was stated in the article, if you answer the questions truthfully and completely, then we are done. You won't be hearing from me for at least another 120 days (or never, if the information you gave me enables me to enforce the judgment). As a judgment enforcer, I have the ability to levy on the contents of your bank accounts, take up to 25 percent of your disposable income (and your spouse, too), all in the service of satisfying the judgment. Now, having said all this, you can also voluntarily call my office and agree to make a payment of approximately 4 percent a month, and I'll pretty much leave you alone. (On a $2,000 judgment, that's about $100 a month.) Here's what you can't do: You can't lie to me. You cannot call my office and tell me that you don't have money (if you do) or a job (if you do) because I'll find out the truth. Also, if I hale you into court to examine you, you should show up. If you don't, I'll send my process server to your place of employment and serve you there in front of all your co-workers. (Your boss has to let my registered process server into your building in order to serve you.) Then, on the day of the examination, you have to show up in court (like jury duty) with all the documents that I requested. After you show them to me, you can go back to work. It only takes about 45 minutes if you have all the information that I request, and only once every 4 months, until you pay the judgment in full. My point is, if you show up, all will be well. If you don't have any money, I'll know. If you're hiding from me, I'll figure that out, too. The point is, if you're honest about your financial condition (good or bad), then I'll be able to prove it. Just don't ignore the system that's designed to give judgment creditors information about their judgment debtor. That's all I'm saying. This isn't about being a good person or a bad person. It's about telling the truth. I'm a pretty reasonable person. I don't judge people as being bad simply because they owe money. This is very much a "Golden Rule" business: I treat others the way I would want to be treated. Doesn't everybody? Hey, thanks for listening. Brian C., Hayward, California
I happen to have relatives that do another process you seem to be involved in, this is called skip tracing. I'm sure your aware of it and maybe even used it on occasion? While it sounds like you're just trying to do your job and hey it sounds perfectly reasonable to just tell the truth and make afew payments and you know 4% doesn't sound bad. That is until I got to the $100 dollars a month part, That's easily a weeks worth of food. possibly stretched out you could double it if you go and hit up discount food stores like Aldi or whatever you have there in cali. Have you noticed with this recession going how many places have now hiring signs out but then look at the people working there? I have and noticed either just out of high school or some of them having one foot practically in the grave. The only people in the middle age wise are management and that's' about it. Remember hearing about the old chocolate retailer 'Fannie May' ? They got bailed out with the banks and are trying to make a comeback, which sounds great I grew up with them a presence in my neighborhood. My own mother used to love the Chocolate Turtles they sell. Recently in my searches for employment I came across an ad for them, they were opening up a location near where I moved to. At first I thought this is great, maybe I can throw an ap at them and work close to home because I don't have a car and have never been paid enough to be able to save up for one much less afford one. Where am I going with this line? well basically I didn't bother because they placed a line at the bottom of the ad saying 'recent retail experience only' which you know reminds me alot of what your saying in your little paragraph. You see Brian there's cause and effect, everything you listed sounds reasonable and yes it even sounds fair. That being said though, The biggest booming jobs of the past 5 years has been low paying ones like retail, do you really think that a 'simple' medical bill couldn't send most of us spiraling downwards? Private prisons are a booming business or hadn't you heard about it? if not look into it. Sometimes they even toss troubled teens in rather then any other kind of program, From then on they disappear from the public eye with only their family if lucky to try to fight for them. You speak of a golden rule, why don't you take a long hard look at this process that your involved in and you tell me if your enabling people that are abusing the system for private gain or not. Alot of these prisons are just in it to fill them and make a profit not unlike a nursing home. How often has a person told a court that they were just following orders? Its' about being honest to yourself and to others brian. No matter how reasonable you may be and going by just some of the comments here most don't sound like they could be any different then you or I but you have to ask yourself if your feeding the beast that is the problem. Time you took a hard truthful look at what it is your doing brian. Hey thanks for listening. Foamy Darkale SomewhereupNort' ,Wi