Comments on: Obama's Secret Moves On Health Care

Marc Ambinder Provides A Behind-The-Scenes Look Into White House Maneuvering In The Health Care Debate

[incog-nito]

Normal progress:
1) Only the wealthy and powerful can have education and rights
2) Equal rights for everyone
3) Education for everyone
4) Financial safety net (Soc sec)
5) Health care for the elderly (Medicare)
6) Univeral health care
...

Conservative progress:

6) Get rid of Medicare
7) Get rid of Social Security
8) Get rid of public education
9) No more public libraries, parks, etc.
10) All roads will privately built toll roads
11) Everybody packs a gun
...

[forrestlayne]

I think his stance on 'everyone deserves proper health care' is a good one, especially for children who have no control.
Posted by Thalia-9 at 4:30 PM : Jun 12, 2009

"everyone deserves to make enough money to live comfortably"
"everyone deserves to have their dream job"
"everyone deserves to live healthy - not needing health care"
"everyone deserves to live life as long as they want"
"everyone deserves not to be killed in an automobile accident"
"everyone deserves not to be killed in an airpalne crash"

A lot of things sound good, but try as hard as we can - LIFE IS NOT FAIR
We can volunteer and contribute to help causes we believe in - but government mandated anything because "everyone deserves" is tyranny. Government decides what "everyone deserves" that equals loss of freedom - freedom to choose what is important to me or you or any individual. That's what was great about this country that the "people" have seemed to forgotten. Now they want soemone else to do all their thinking and decision making. Lazy Americans - ringing truer every day. Too lazy and triffling to think for themselves.

[incog-nito]

First, equal rights. Then public education. And then universal health care.

That's how civilization advances.

[honestindividual]

Uh, excuse me..."secret moves" on health care? Isn't this the same guy who wanted to be open, transparent, honest, etc., etc, etc.? So far, the only crud he's managed to divulge would indicate a new layer of "federal control" (read that as unnecessary gummint control over whatever piece of crap we have now), with about 30% more expenses (just to pretend they're serious, of course), and this will make all the phony leftists feel more "secure" about having a so-called "health care" system. I feel more secure already; I picture a country with an average annual income of $45,000 per family, if there's any such thing as a family with an average income anymore, and the basic annual cost for "health" care (look upon it as an extra very high "utility bill") shouldn't be much more than half of that amount..say, $2,000 per month. Now, there's a bargain. Sooner or later, Americans have to be talked out of their "something for nothing" act promoted by Nobama and his henchmen.

[jsd330]

skyk-2009 Sure medicare doesn't refuse to pay any of your claims, but talk to someone who works in billing for a doctor or hospital and see how far behind the government is in paying for your claims, another reason everyone elses healthcare costs are so high. As for the VA do you have any personal experiences with them ? I personally wasted two days trying to see a doctor there, I spent 2 hours just filling out forms and the other 10 veterans I talked to there told me this was normal procedure. I am not talking FEAR I'm talking FACTS. You're getting your medicare now, but what are you going to do when they cut benifits since even the Government says medicare is broke?

[velma179]

Thalia-9,

That was a very thoughtful comment. It is so refreshing knowing MOST of us actually DO agree to disagree and hold the country's best interest as numero uno.

You could become a "McCain Republican"! No, not John... Meghan! ;-)

[Thalia-9]

Did America elect a monarch? ? A President is still needed.
Posted by PacificGatePost

I dunno...I'm a republican - I didn't vote for him, but he is my President, and therefore, I hope for and wish him the best - any hope of failure during his tour is hoping for failure for the whole country...while I don't agree with a lot of his policies, there are some I do agree with, I think his stance on 'everyone deserves proper health care' is a good one, especially for children who have no control. And I will add that his sense of humor is a breath of fresh air, especially during this trying time...he (and his First Lady, I really do like her demeanor, class and devotion to children) have an amazing gift for genuinely caring and listening to 'the people' (Unlike Clinton who was like a 'tell you what you wanna hear' snake oil salesman) I do not ever remember a President going to small towns to hold "Town Hall meetings" that's extremely impressive to me. I think he really does want to do the right thing for everyone, and even tho I disagree with some, I do pray for his success...because that means success for all of us.

[Thalia-9]

oh...and even tho we did not get a bonus, we were ALL (bank wide to different cities) with the exception of our management team, officers included, given a hundred dollar bill along w/ a $50 gift card to walmart and other goodies - compared to the usual bonus $ it's shy, but compare that to taking care of your people, it shines and what makes a great company successful.

[PacificGatePost]

Obama continues to avoid the thorny details of assiduous analysis on the most critical problems facing America, and makes sweeping, but banal statements of obvious principals, while his appointees actually implement policies and programs inconsistent with the claims of the message. Now his methodology will be applied to Healthcare and no challenges from the MSM?

http://pacificgatepost.blogspot.com/2009/06/does-america-yearn-for-monarch.html

Did America elect a monarch? ? A President is still needed.

[Thalia-9]

You are full of it. I am a much better manager than the CEOs at AIG, GM and Merril Lynch and I do not make millions per year.
The reason I can say this is my company did not need a federal bailout! Only the strong survive...No.
Its called politics and these has beens should have been fired for lack of performance and yet they get reqarded with golden parachutes. You my friend have lost sight of what capitalism is and how America became a superpower.
Posted by the74blaster

Ahhhahahahahaaa!! Amen to that! Exact same reason the bank I work for did not require TARP Funds, bailout money and we're gloriously in the black...in fact, our ESOP shares actually gained $103.00 per share last quarter...Hooray for excellent management skills, excellent customer service and a whole lot of new customers bailing on their old banks, coming to ours for this exact reason...it's all in management and the quality of managers you select, who believe in 'doing the right thing' by the company and the customer...and no...I am not in management...and yes...we do get bonus' (first time we did not get a bonus, management included, was this year due to our managements decision to be frugal with the uncertainty of the economy...and that's fair) but when we do get bonus'...right down to the CSR, teller...everyone gets one...it's based on performance of the black at the end of the year...and everyone gets the same percentage...and no greater than 6% of your salary, which is also fair...larger banks should take note (does management get more based on salary? yep...but rightfully so as they are the ones keeping us brilliantly in the black)

[Thalia-9]

Otherwise let everyone worry about thier own healthcare. Just because I make more then someone else why does that mean I have to help support them. We are not in this together, in a capitalist system the strong prevail.
Posted by anti-global2 at 11:20 AM

Wow! that's kinda harsh...what about the little ones who have no control of their loser parents? We're fortunate and blessed enough to be in the same boat of not struggling as well, and I too am sick of paying for 'certain' others...but there are so many who are not sucking the system dry 'with intent', who are really struggling AND want to make it on their own...they and their children should not be punished because those who rape the system are nothing more than sponges on society, so it's not fair to catagorize them all in to the same boat! There's a lot of unemployed pain out there right now...and it's not because they 'want to be' unemployed...a lot of people have lost their jobs, savings, homes, sense of security from firms they've worked at for years...that ain't right!! These are the exact people we HAVE to help! They do not WANT to be a burden on society...all they want is to work, take care of their families and live!

[Thalia-9]

Put a cap on malprctice suits, you'll notice this has not been brought up since the majority of our senators and congressmen are lawyers, there's a big cost savings on healthcare. What healthcare professionals, hospitals and clincs save on malpractice insurance could be passed on to the patients.
Posted by jsd330 at 10:52 AM : Jun 12, 2009

I don't know about medicare and the VA...my Dad has them and seems to fair well with both. I think he's pleased w/ his coverage, like sky was saying about his.

As far as malpractice, you're right...too many people driving the costs up on top of the exisiting nightmare - If someone brings forth a frivolous suit, which there are a lot, I think if they lose, they should have to pay the damages they were asking for - to whom, I wouldn't know...maybe the system...sheesh, w/ all the greedy 'make a quick buck' people out there who sue, you'd think it could cover ins for alot of people! not that you'd ever see it...I dunno - LOL.
Insurance companies have turned in to the hugest scam - from what they charge the consumer, to what they charge the Doc for malpractice insurance - not saying Doc's don't overcharge by any means, but the private ins co's are the ones reaping the huge payoff.

[Thalia-9]

I know a few people who have been laid off due to the economic downturn, and are going without health insurance. They risk a financial catastrophe if they get sick, but cannot do anything about it. We need to get rid of the current employer-based health care system. It makes no sense whatsoever that your health care should depend on whether you're employed, whether your employer offers it, and how much coverage your employer decides for you. The illogic of this system is so blatant that one wonders how it came into being in the first place.
Posted by incog-nito

you are so right!! my friend is a Med Dr and said there has been such a huge lull in patients that the Docs have been rotating way more vacation time due to not enough people to see! And you're also right about the 'work ins'...I have to travel 5 hours to see a thyroid specialist who is "out of network"...of course...so I have to pay $250 out of pocket just for a friggin consult even tho I HAVE insurance!? It is complete and utter BS. Not that it matters much since my ins is always looking for reasons not to pay, increasing the cost by paperwork shuffle..."Oops! can't pay that one just yet...you didn't dot the 'i' or hmm...you forgot to 'cross that 't' in the word 'thyroid'...grrrr! it's so frustrating.

[Beyond-The-Spectrum]

I am soooo sick of hearing the oh-so predictable cry of "Here comes Socialism" whenever someone gets the progrssive-minded notion to help people by creating a system of affordable/universal health care. The notion of universal health care is no more "Socialism" that compulsory pubic education (which the government has a monopoly on)! The Post Office didn't put private carriers out of business, the police didn't put private security firms out of business, and a government/public health insurance plan wont do any harm to private insurers (and if private insurance/free market comptition works, then the private companies should have nothing to worry about from pubic competition). Please stop the political motivation and dogmatic thinking!!!

[ignorans]

Full and complete health care that is free to all citizens [..at the current outrageously high cost of health care..] will not happen. Correct, the out-of-control costs and for-profit motives have to be fixed before it can be affordable. But I'm not sure I see anyone asking for 'free', all we're asking for is accessible and affordable. Is the mighty US the only developed western country that can't control health costs?

[incog-nito]

Posted by mer16 at 1:49 PM : Jun 12, 2009

Obama has never said that he wants to replace the current system. He wants to offer people an alternative to the current employer-based system that is the cause of much financial and mental distress for a lot of people.

[mer16]

Full and complete health care that is free to all citizens will not happen. The tax base is not large enough to support such a plan. I don't think Obama will even try for this type of a plan and even if he did massive amounts of money would have to be borrowed to support it, more likely he will support a mixed plan between private enterprise and the government. There is also the possibility that a future congress would repeal any plan put forward.

[ignorans]

Full and complete health care that is free to all citizens [..at the current outrageously high cost of health care..] will not happen. Correct, the out-of-control costs and for-profit motives have to be fixed before it can be affordable. But I'm not sure I see anyone asking for 'free', all we're asking for is accessible and affordable. Is the mighty US the only developed western country that can't control health costs?

[incog-nito]

I know a few people who have been laid off due to the economic downturn, and are going without health insurance. They risk a financial catastrophe if they get sick, but cannot do anything about it. We need to get rid of the current employer-based health care system. It makes no sense whatsoever that your health care should depend on whether you're employed, whether your employer offers it, and how much coverage your employer decides for you. The illogic of this system is so blatant that one wonders how it came into being in the first place.

[the74blaster]

Otherwise let everyone worry about thier own healthcare. Just because I make more then someone else why does that mean I have to help support them. We are not in this together, in a capitalist system the strong prevail.
Posted by anti-global2 at 11:20 AM

You are full of it. I am a much better manager than the CEOs at AIG, GM and Merril Lynch and I do not make millions per year.

The reason I can say this is my company did not need a federal bailout! Only the strong survive...No.

Its called politics and these has beens should have been fired for lack of performance and yet they get reqarded with golden parachutes. You my friend have lost sight of what capitalism is and how America became a superpower.

[Vet_Turner]

Looking forward to system where everyone can buy into a descent health care plan. Government sponsored, no; government regulated, yes.