Comments on: Turkish Officials: Troops Enter Iraq

Security Sources Say Soldiers Crossed Border In "Hot Pursuit" Raid; Foreign Minister Denies It

[grazinggoat]

AJMarine1, ToolMangler, really said something to be proud of both you. Keep the fort, guys, guard it well, stay the course.

For once this muslim2k8 says it right, but not totally true. He is just trying to induce a position stiffening between the bloggers.
America is powerful but the power is not well used. Mismanagement of this war which is not a real war, being an occupation based on a lie.

Saddam has ordered his army to dislocate, disappear in the sand, to regroup and transform into an insurgency, that we see is very effective, and damaging to our forces. After four years we're still slowly moving into the Iraqi war mud.

-The fact that Turkish army enters into Iraq, means absolutely nothing. The insurgents will take care of the Turkish Army the same way they do with ours.

-That will only regroup the Kurdish and Sunni Iraqis under one wing. Similar situation which Kurdish did not suffer previously. Resistance will be emboldened and get stronger.

[toolmangler-2009]

BTW, I'm still a crack shot, Now where's that joker, muslim2k8. :)

[toolmangler-2009]

Sorry AJ, I tried but was rejected as 4F (only had one eye. I told them I was a crack shot with any thing that would shoot, but no deal. I'd a gone career too if I could have gotten in.

[mh4cbs1]

AJ Marine:

Seems you agree that going into Iraq helped Osama recruitment, but now that we are there what to do...

In the long run it is much better if we leave. Put yourself in their place (in McNamara's film 'Fog of War', his #1 rule is that you must empathize with you enemy (not sympathize!), meaning UNDERSTAND your enemy. How would you feel if some Muslim superpower, who had a history of installing/supporting dictators and taking the wealth of their nations, invaded the US and was building permanent military bases in 14 states. Our major cities have been bombed and much of them lie in ruins. Citizens are stopped at checkpoints and sometimes are killed or taken to a prison like Abu Ghraib. You may feel like fighting back, right? But once they are gone for some time there is no longer a reason to hate them (look at the example of Vietnam!). Don't believe the propaganda slogan that they "hate our freedom" - it is nonsense! Osama didn't just pop up from nowhere.

The only long term way to "fight" terrorism is to seek peace. Remove the causes. Fundamentalism stems from fear and insecurity. Like it or not, their hate stems from a feeling of oppression and victimization. There is no reason that our world needs to be in the mess it is in.

We need to, and we can, create a world that is secure, just, and sustainable. History will show that these Bush years have been a disaster - heading us in exactly the opposite direction that we need to move towards.

[ajmarine1]

ToolMangler,

I think I remeber, sometime back, you saying you had been in the service.

I heard we were a "paper tiger" during the Viet Nam war, and people think we are one now.

You are right, we are to PC to fight wars. If I'm going to war, I want my enemies to know, "I'm coming, and hell is coming with me, do you here me, HELL is coming with me.

[ajmarine1]

mh4cbs1,

You have facts and dates and names just like everybody that posts on here. You seem very passionate just like the other people, but you will get the other side of it from people who have different facts and names also. This one is lieing, that one is lieing, and on it goes.

I feel Saddam and his sons needed to go. I feel the Middle East needed a kick in the butt to try and bring them into the 21th Century. When the dust settles, history will judge if this was a visionary plan to bring them into the 21th Century or a stupid plan by a stupid man.

As far as containing Saddam, after 12 years of doing the "dance" with him and his weird sons, I was tried of it. The oil for food program was a joke just like the UN. We were losing our allies that supported us because they were tried of it, and sooner or later, Saddam would be right back doing whatever he wanted to or his sons would. It's deal with them now, or deal with them later. I don't have kids, but if I did, I wouldn't want to leave this mess for them to clean up someday.

I've grown up, for 57 years, listening to the cr*p coming out of the Middle East. I'm sick of it. Finish it now and be done with it.

[rafterman1]

===They use the media to do their backstabbing and at the same time smile at the camera just like haoni jane.===

Thank God for a free media. They keep us from becoming a dictatorship because they don't goosestep in line like you guys do.

[toolmangler-2009]

Posted by AJMarine1 at 09:46 PM : Jun 06, 2007
AJ, You and I both know that no country can take America on in a real war, They know it to. They use the media to do their backstabbing and at the same time smile at the camera just like haoni jane.
They are the same ones behind this 'immigration reform' thing that will add 12 million people to the already depleted Soc. Sec. rolls for more freeby's.

[mh4cbs1]

AJMArine:

It sound like you may have already bought into the Saddam hype, but here goes... Just what is the big cost and problem to "containment"? It was dirt cheap compared to what we have now. With containment, 3,500 US troops did not die, nor did 800 contractors, nor did it cost $500 Billion. Nor did it destabilize the region or fuel terrorism. The UN and all the nations were with us after 9-11. Bush/Cheney and the salivating NeoCons got greedy and used 9-11 to lie their way into Iraq.

The corporate media cheered the way to War, but it was clear that Iraq was no real threat, Saddam was no friend of Islamic extremists --his goal was simply to hold on to power. Even the NIE said IF he had any WMDs, that he would not use them unless attacked. Read ex-marine, Republican former UN inspector Scott Ritter. He was absolutely opposed to the Iraq invasion because he knew that it was all a pretext based on Lies. Read former officials accounts. Richard Clarke. Tyler Drumheller CIA head in Europe. Larry Wilkerson chief of staff to Colin Powell called it a hoax. etc etc etc

Don't just buy into what you hear on corporate media. One pattern of deception: Cheney leaks "intelligence" to Judith Miller of NY Times, then goes on Sunday news show to say that "according to the New York Times..."

The American people were the victims of a huge NeoCon FRAUD. This is why our middleclass troops are dying in Iraq.

[toolmangler-2009]

Posted by muslim2k8 at 09:26 PM : Jun 06, 2007

When we fought Hitler, we waged 'WAR' not this namby-pamby 'don't kill the civilians' farce. IF we ever get a real president you might just learn what a real 'WAR' is. Keep on spitting in the face of America for having been mistaken about your wanting freedom and you might get a real education or not live to be a muslim2k9.

[ajmarine1]

muslim2k8,

"In four years you have only managed to show the world you are paper tigers, too weak, too complacent and entirely too ignorant to know you are your own worst enemy."

I have an idea, why doesn't everyone that doesn't like use just declare war on us and lets get this s***t over with, let's have a "real" war, winner take all. How does that sound to you?

[ajmarine1]

mh4cbs1,

Also, how long did you want to "contain" Saddam?

[ajmarine1]

mh4cbs1,

"It is clear that their actions in Iraq have FUELED terrorism, giving a tremendous boost to Osama's recruitment efforts."

If you think this has given a tremendous boost to Oasma's recruitment efforts, what do you think it will do to them if we let them run us out before we our ready to go? They will be dancing in the streets and high fiving, saying, "We have defeated the Great Satan, come join us, Allah is with us.

You talking points are just the same things that have been said over and over; people either believe them or they don't. I don't believe them.

However, I will wait until September to see how things are going. If nothing changes for the better, I will add my voice to the others calling for our troops to come home.

[mh4cbs1]

AJMArine1:

Don't be a chump for Bush and Cheney. Don't you realize that our leaders could care less about the troops? Do you see them sacrificing? No. Tax cuts for the rich. War Profits for Haliburton.

The people of the Middle East recall 1953, when our CIA overthrew elected leader Mossadeq to install a brutal dictator (the Shah of Iran) and secure oil for our corporations. The rise of Islamic fundamentalism and the 1979 revolution was the result. We supported Saddam while he was "killing his own people" - no problem.

It is CLEAR now that Cheney and Bush LIED us into this Iraq disaster, with fake WMDs, fake Aluminum tubes, fake Niger uranium, fake intelligence sources.

It is CLEAR that they EXPLOITED 9-11 with lies about Al Qaeda ties to Saddam and with fake color coded terror alerts.

It is CLEAR now that they seek a PERMANENT US military presence in Iraq, and Iraqi laws to open up their $21 TRILLION Oil Reserves to US corporations.

It is clear that they let Osama off the hook in Tora Bora to pursue their Iraqi plan (see the PNAC papers).

It is clear that their actions in Iraq have FUELED terrorism, giving a tremendous boost to Osama's recruitment efforts. Endless Hate. Endless Fear. Endless War.Just what the Bush/Cheney agenda thrives on.

When will America WAKE UP and JAIL Cheney and Bush for their Crimes against our nation!

[mh4cbs1]

AJMArine1:

Don't be a chump for Bush and Cheney. Don't you realize that our leaders could care less about the troops? Do you see them sacrificing? No. Tax cuts for the rich. War Profits for Haliburton.

The people of the Middle East recall 1953, when our CIA overthrew elected leader Mossadeq to install a brutal dictator (the Shah of Iran) and secure oil for our corporations. The rise of Islamic fundamentalism and the 1979 revolution was the result. We supported Saddam while he was "killing his own people" - no problem.

It is CLEAR now that Cheney and Bush LIED us into this Iraq disaster, with fake WMDs, fake Aluminum tubes, fake Niger uranium, fake intelligence sources.

It is CLEAR that they EXPLOITED 9-11 with lies about Al Qaeda ties to Saddam and with fake color coded terror alerts.

It is CLEAR now that they seek a PERMANENT US military presence in Iraq, and Iraqi laws to open up their $21 TRILLION Oil Reserves to US corporations.

It is clear that they let Osama off the hook in Tora Bora to pursue their Iraqi plan (see the PNAC papers).

It is clear that their actions in Iraq have FUELED terrorism, giving a tremendous boost to Osama's recruitment efforts. Endless Hate. Endless Fear. Endless War.Just what the Bush/Cheney agenda thrives on.

When will America WAKE UP and JAIL Cheney and Bush for their Crimes against our nation!

badaxmofo wrote:

"Kurdish guerillas more likely foreign insurgents trying to incite problems on the northern border..."

Clearly you have no idea about what has been happening with the Kurdish "guerillas" (they are in fact terrorists known as the PKK) and Turkey for the past 37 years.

Perhaps you should do some reading and become familiar with what the article is about.

[grazinggoat]

Samthecat, would you classify daily suicide bombings of innocent civilians and other attrocities committed by the militants that are too numerous to list a form of "sabre rattling"???? or is it just all "Bush's fault"???

-It's not even Walking-Liar fault here. He's just an executive officer to the PNAC orders and agenda.

-As I mentioned about a month or two ago, telling ya that the sharing of the corps of Iraq is going to happen.

-Shiite Iraqis to Iran, it's quite a fait-accompli.

-Kurdistan to Turkey and then to be left to Israel, so Israelis/Jews (those who flew to Isarel at its creation in the late 1940's till the 1960's) can resettle in the Mosul and Kirkuk area.

-The Sunnis are to be put under governance of Saudi Arabia, shared with Syria, in exchange of the Golan Heights, that is to be kept with Israel...
Time will tell.

[ndjam]

The Kurds have been brutally oppressed by Turkey for a century now, and now they are trying to completely eliminate them. NOT this time, the Kurds are ready for this mickey mouse military that Turkey has. The PKK,and The Peshmerga are awaiting your rotten incursion. Power to the Kurds, Power to Kurdistan.

[emrerdinc]

Fisrt of all US and Bush has nothing to do with this...
Turkey had 2 major operations to Northern Iraq in 1992 and in 1997...
Kurdish Terrorists( not reabels, as if you kill people just for the idea of scaring them and getting what you want by force, it is called terrorism) killed more than 80,000 people in last 20 years, last attack which was two days ago they killed 7 Turkish soldiers in Turkish lands and that's why Turkey has the right to get in Northern Iraq to stop terrorism against Turkish nation, just like US does...

[ajmarine1]

acauble1,

"THE WORLD WOULD BE BETTER OFF IF THE U.S. DID NOT INVADE IRAQ, AND LEFT SADDAM HUSSEIN UNDER CONTAINMENT!"

We had already been "containing" him and his sons for 12 years. How much longer did you want to do that? Your childrens lifetime, your grandchildrens life time?