Comments on: Clinton: Mexico Violence Could "Mushroom"

Secretary Of State Tells CBS News War On Border May Escalate If Arms, Drugs Trafficking Not Stopped

[omega39-2009]

The easy availability is driving the demand. Prices for cocaine are dropping dramatically (source: Discovery Channel - Cocaine Nation) beacause the supply is immense. Securing our border, and I mean actually and correclty securing our border would limit supply and dry up demand. Demand would still exist but not like it is now.
Posted by endpcnow

In economic hard times more people are willing to deal to supplement their incomes. The economic times we are heading into don't bode well for the prohibitionists.

[DoubleHappiness88]

America has forgotten its history. Current gang wars are the result of Drug Prohibition. Alcohol Prohibition caused similar gang wars and corruption. If the gang wars are to be ended, Drug Prohibition must be ended. Drugs should be legalized, controlled and taxed.

The alternative is continued gang wars, corruption of The US Justice System and foreign governments.

America can no longer afford the foolish, failed, corrupt and never ending War On Drugs.


"Prohibition will work great injury to the cause of temperance. It is a species of intemperance within itself, for it goes beyond the bounds of reason in that it attempts to control a man's appetite by legislation, and makes a crime out of things that are not crimes. A Prohibition law strikes a blow at the very principles upon which our government was founded." -Abraham Lincoln

Drug Prohibition has failed for the same reason Alcohol Prohibition failed. Prohibition does not work.

[honestabe8]

jimmyc: in the whole scope of drug distribution, pot may be a fraction (how big of a fraction), but of the drug arrests in the united states, 80% are for pot.

[omega39-2009]

Perhaps if Congress would have considered building a wall between the US and Mexico - then we could more readily defend our borders and create jobs, stimulate the economy and actually have an immigration deterrent. But I guess that made too much sense and we would rather have a high speed rail between LA and Las vegas.
Posted by TruePirate09

You're never getting your wall, get over it...

the Manager's Amendment (SA 4188), offered by Sen. Arlen Specter (R-PA), to S. 2611, the Comprehensive Immigration Reform Act of 2006. The Manager's Amendment made many minor changes to S. 2611, none of have significant numeric impacts on the overall bill. However, the Manager's Amendment included a provision that requires consultation with the government of Mexico concerning the construction of additional fencing and related border security structures along the international border between the United States and Mexico. This would virtually guarantee that the fence along the U.S.-Mexico border would never be completed. The Manager's Amendment passed by a vote of 56 to 41 to 1 (the 1 denotes a "present" vote).

[DoubleHappiness88]

Harvard economist: Prohibition creates violence, legalize all drugs
By David Edwards and Stephen C. Webster
Published: Tuesday March 24, 2009

Because of his title as a Harvard economist, people tend to listen to Jeffrey Miron. And, if the old principle holds true and controversy always creates interest, expect a lot of people to be talking about Miron's latest volley into the mainstream media.

"Prohibition creates violence because it drives the drug market underground," he wrote in an essay published by CNN on Tuesday. "This means buyers and sellers cannot resolve their disputes with lawsuits, arbitration or advertising, so they resort to violence instead.

"Violence was common in the alcohol industry when it was banned during Prohibition, but not before or after."

Miron's proposed solution to ending the cartel war along the US-Mexico border is both simple and enormously complex.

"Violence is the norm in illicit gambling markets but not in legal ones. Violence is routine when prostitution is banned but not when it's permitted," he wrote. "Violence results from policies that create black markets, not from the characteristics of the good or activity in question.

"The only way to reduce violence, therefore, is to legalize drugs."

In 2005, Miron published a study titled, "The Budgetary Implications of Marijuana Prohibition" (PDF link), funded by the Marijuana Policy Project. Over 500 professional economists, including Milton Friedman, signed on to the report, which was sent to then-President George W. Bush.

Miron's report found that "marijuana legalization would save $7.7 billion per year in state and federal expenditures on prohibition enforcement and produce tax revenues of at least $2.4 billion annually if marijuana were taxed like most consumer goods."

He also discovered a potential for $6.2 billion or more, were marijuana taxed similarly to alcohol and tobacco.

However, during a CNN appearance on Tuesday, he took the anti-prohibition sentiment of his prior study on marijuana and applied it universally, telling anchor Kiran Chetry, "A lot of the violence we're seeing and a lot of the underground market is not related to marijuana but related to the other drugs.

"If we only did marijuana we would only have a small impact on the violence and corruption and disruption of other countries that is caused by U.S. prohibition of drugs and the U.S. forcing prohibition of drugs on other countries."

http://rawstory.com/news/2008/Harvard_economist_Legalize_all_drugs_to_0324.html

[pwbeadle]

I have to agree with Senator Clinton; Americans enjoying their recreational drugs are directly fueling the illegal drug industry and the war that is now plaguing Mexico and threatening to spill over our borders. Meanwhile, Craigslist is an "open air market" of illicit drug sellers and users. As of 10 am this morning in the Casual Encounters section, there were 738 postings involving "420" - a term referring to the use of marijuana; 253 postings for "ski" - cocaine; another 40 posting for "snow" - more cocaine; and 9 for "Tina" - methamphetamine. And there are many more for Ecstacy and others. So in the past week over 1000 ads were posted in the Casual Encounters section alone for illegal drug use, much of which can ultimately be traced back to the drug war in Mexico, let alone drug trafficking and related violence in the U.S.

I encourage everyone to go to their local Craigslist [ie: newyork . craigslist . org], go to the Casual Encounters section and run searches for drug terms. Click on each posting. When it opens you will see options for flagging each posting in the top right corner. once a posting has been flagged by several people it is removed. This is one way we can fight this drug war ourselves.

[honestabe8]

jimmyc: what effect does prohibition have on prices?

[omega39-2009]

We buy their drugs, they by our guns, could this be the reason it just rolls on.
Posted by patriot2381

Lets just call it "free trade"!

[jimmyc1955]

honestabe8 - Dope is not the issue. Marijuana is a fraction of the overall money spent. Your pissing out the great Chicago fire. It is meaningless in the overall drug issues.

Why are you missing the point over and over?

Illegal drugs cocaine specifically fund monsters to our south. We do NOTHING to reduce demand. You want to make life for stoners easier - I don't see the connection??

Get a grip and either get on the topic or get off the board - your not making any sense.

Hillary Clinton says drugs flow over the border - guns go the other way. Drugs supply the money to buy the guns. Run a full court press in national media outlets against drugs and specifically cocaine and you can reduce the flow of money and reduce the violence.

It is the violence that has to end. If you want to roll a few fat ones with your bro's without worrying about getting busted that is your issue - but not relevant to this topic.

[honestabe8]

"It is called 'the gateway drug' simply because most of its users don't stop there. They move on to harder drugs." - tj217

tj217: can you support your allegation?

"I have trained and been educated thoroughly in illegal drugs and drug abuse"

Really? Can you describe your training? Are you a substance abuse counselor did you simply attend a D.A.R.E class?

[patriot2381]

We buy their drugs, they by our guns, could this be the reason it just rolls on.

[honestabe8]

'The point is one is legal one is not" - Exactly

"I want the flow of money going south to stop" - Then allow people to grow their own

"I want the people in this country to stop using illegal drugs that fuel the crime in the US, Mexico and that fund terrorist in South America" - But it is the prohibition that makes these drugs fantastically lucrative.

"It is legal to sell marijuana in small quantities for on site use. Hash is also legal." That is simply not true. It is illegal, but the illegality is not enforced.

If you want to focus on the damage caused by drugs, why limit it illegal ones?

[perceptions5]

************ BREAKING NEWS **************************

"Rahm Emanuel's profitable stint at mortgage giant

Short Freddie Mac stay made him at least $320,000

By Bob Secter and Andrew Zajac | Tribune reporters
March 26, 2009

Before its portfolio of bad loans helped trigger the current housing crisis, mortgage giant Freddie Mac was the focus of a major accounting scandal that led to a management shake-up, huge fines and scalding condemnation of passive directors by a top federal regulator.

One of those allegedly asleep-at-the-switch board members was Chicago's Rahm Emanuel?now chief of staff to President Barack Obama?who made at least $320,000 for a 14-month stint at Freddie Mac that required little effort."

...................... Well the foxes (Democrats) certainly are in the hen house, apparently been there awhile.....................SAD.

[abdul91-2009]

I agree with Secretary of State about the promotion of terrorism by drug cartels and I would like to add that what is more sinister is the profiteering by these same corporate businesses.
abdul91-2009

[jimmyc1955]

honestabe8 - It would be a regulated market like alcohol - taxed heavily and restricted. So pricing will be high.

And you keep fixating on alcohol. The point is one is legal one is not. Not which is more harmful - the both are. I don't care about that issue and you can't seem to get that point.

I want the flow of money going south to stop. I want the people in this country to stop using illegal drugs that fuel the crime in the US, Mexico and that fund terrorist in South America. that can be done by ads on TV showing real consequences to drug usage.

You just want some kind of feel good public saftey program about drugs and acohol.

Dude - please pay attention.The article is about drugs and how money fuels murder. Alcohol has NOTHING to do with that.

[honestabe8]

tj217: the fact of the matter is that prohibition takes simple agricultural products and makes their manufacture and distribution fantastically lucrative.

[jimmyc1955]

honestabe8 - That is simply not true. It is legal to sell marijuana in small quantities for on site use. Hash is also legal.

But regardless of that - the legal turning a blind eye to drug usage creates a much bigger issue over time. Eventually all forms of drugs will be for sale. If you walk the red light district you will notice no police presence at all. I asked a restaurant owner who had a great Italian restaurant on the end of district what happens if a riot breaks out. His answer was - they do and the cops usually let them fight it out because by the time anybody gets there is is pretty much out of control. Gangs of drunken stoned kids wander the streets pushing and shoving.

Legalizing dope won't solve social ills. It won't do much to slow down the cross border drug traffic either. It is a pure red herring in this debate.

[honestabe8]

If smugglers can beat government pricing they will remain in business. - jimmyc

jimmyc: government pricing? why do you feel it will be the government doing the pricing rather than producers in the free market?

[gunownerdan]

Al Capone is alive and well!
And living in Mexico!!
Prohibition can NEVER WORK.
It's as simple as that.

[joel178]

IF you want to stop all this
start putting them to work in the inner citys all over the united states when they get caught
cleaning streets and highways painting sweeping side walks dumping garbage
watch the stop coming over