Comments on: Cancer Danger From Dry Cleaning?

Tracy Smith Explores Possible Risk Of Commonly Used Chemical Called "PERC"

[peteym1]

I have been wet cleaning for 5 years and if you thinj it is just soap and plain old water you are sadly mistaken . Why do'nt you come in for a visit and I will show you what is used and how it is done. If done properly you will not have shrinkage and color fade. Just remember you only have 1 side of the story.

Perhaps the chemicals, viruses and bacteria present on clothing before processing are more significant than the process itself. It is Important to Read the following Information.

The dry cleaner housed in the establishment Ms. Smith refers to is highly atypical (not typical) of dry cleaners who use world-class, environmentally-friendly technology. In fact it is safe to say, that dry cleaner in Ms. Smith%u2019s story was/is using terribly antiquated technology which in no way should be confused with today%u2019s world-class technology, no matter what type of solvent is being used. Today%u2019s technology (including perchloroethylene), consumes a hugely significant decrease in solvent consumption, are dry-to-dry, (meaning go in dry, come out dry with a vacuum vent that does not allow the door to be opened until any vapors present are well-under established safe limits) are closed loop, come equipped with triple-safety control systems, do not contribute to air emissions, or ground contamination( are equipped with safety spill *****) do no emit waste water, and any waste deemed hazardous is contained, and shipped to a waste facility that, in turn, recycles and purifies the waste.

PERC: No dioxins, the EPA has not been able to classify perc as a human carcinogen, based on inadequate data and a NIOSH study subcohort among workers during longer duration with PCE exposure and limited in its ability to study health effects due to a). absence exposure for the workers and b.)lack of data on lifestyle factors such as smoking and drinking. %u201CPerc does not contribute to the formation of ground-level ozone, depletion of stratospheric ozone or global warming. Based on these considerations, it is concluded that this solvent does not constitute a danger to the environment on which human life depends, or to human life or health%u201D. Bibliography NCI, NTP, ACGIH, NCOEEB

PETROLEUM SOLVENTS: Classified as a hazardous chemical because its burn and flashpoint is well-below the threshold of 140 degrees, has no carcinogenic effects on human health, but can cause skin irritation, can leave a distinguishable odor or residue.

PETROLEUM SOLVENTS and CLASS IIIA SOLVENTS: EXXON DF2000 synthetic hydrocarbon, highly flammable, same classification as Petroleum Solvent.

California has placed restriction on solvents, (including perc), largely because Silicon Valley%u2019s computer industry (silicon wafers) has been abusing acids, solvents and other chemicals they use as a daily part of their industry, including solvents stored in massive underground tanks. They leaked into the ground, spreading as far as 300 feet and tainting groundwater around their facilities. Their government has %u201Cestablished a certain amount of cradle to grave liability and a high degree of chemical accounting.%u201D

Here are Pros and Cons on dry cleaning solvents and alternatives.

CO2 FINDINGS CLASS IIIA SOLVENT: This process appears to be supplemented either with wet cleaning and a solvent process or outsourcing and has not been used long enough to gauge public acceptance. The process operates at 800 lbs psi, the detergent used is a hydrocarbon compound, is not labeled hazardous by EPA standards but is labeled hazardous by OSHA standards.

WET CLEANING: Additives to detergent such as amyl acetate, tannic acid, hydrofluoric acid as a rust remover, glycol as a softener, etc which are flushed into municipal water systems. High risk of shrinkage, not suitable for wool, cashmere, acetate, silks.

[fearlesslee]

The Dry Cleaner shown was in violation of the health laws 10 years ago, the DOH issued violations. It is unfair to jump all over the hard working dry cleaners because of one bad operator. We don't ban all automobiles because of 1 bad driver. In fact NYS has the toughest environmental regulations (Part 232)in the entire country. I think this was an old story rehashed to fill air time. The story was poorly researched and sensationalized, therefore it did not give a fair and accurate assessment of the situation.

[ragdoll333]

My parents owned a small drycleaner for five years and used perchloroethylene. Several times a week my father scooped the lint out of the trap with his bare hands. Twenty years later he died of kidney cancer. Without a doubt he died from his exposure to perchloroethylene. But he never became part of the statistical history of the danger of this chemical because no one documented this connection. There are probably thousands of other small drycleaners that should be part of the statistics but never will be because there is no one taking note.

The debate goes on: According to: http://www.fabrics.net/fabricca.aspWet Cleaning is described as a new process by some cleaning establishments. They advertise that their process will replace dry cleaning and the environmentally dangerous solvents they use. However, until this process is perfected and proven to effectively replace dry cleaning, caution should be used by the consumer. Wet cleaning is accomplished by using water based chemicals. Some cleaning establishments actually claim to have this service but just hand wash the garment and then professionally press the garment. This process works well with some fabrics which have manufacturers labels stating "hand wash". Garments with labels printed "dry clean only" may shrink, fade, or wrinkle so badly that pressing does not restore then original look of the fabric. New "wet cleaning" stores are available in some areas. The "wet cleaning" process involves computer controlled machines, soap, conditioners and finishers. This new process is supposed to replace dry cleaning. However, until the wet cleaning process has been thoroughly tested, care should be taken before taking your favorite "dry clean only" garments to the new establishments. Outer fabric, interfacing, linings, shoulder pads, and finishes all react differently when washed. Some fabrics shrink or change shape when washed. Some shoulder pads are designed for dry cleaning only and may fall apart when washed.

[sheldonbray1]

CO2 cleaners still dispose of waste like a perc cleaner. Perc residue left in the clothes will be removed by the CO2 process and therefore to stay on the safe side any residue removed from the clothes is disposed of properly. If you were cleaning all new clothes you could dispose of the dirt in a landfill.
CO2 removes the soils wetcleaning can't and Wetcleaning removes the soils CO2 can't. The stains CO2 doesn't remove are the same stains Perc doesn't remove.

To find a CO2 cleaner near you, www.FindCO2.com

[co2cleaners]

Mrs.Tracy Smith; I am one first cleaners that have switch from (Perk) to a new cleaning method using CO2,to clean garments, my cliental are very happy. I would like to sit down with you and inform you about CO2 cleaning. I deal with the elite of clothing manufactures cleaning their garment from Armani through Zegna. we deal in high end client's that want the best. please call on us and I will be glad to speak to you about this. I AM ALSO ONE OF MANY,THAT HAD HELP TO BAN PERK IN CALIFORNIA BY HELPING TO INFORM AND EDUCATE THE E.P.A. so lets talk.
Bobby Smerling
Brentwood Royal Cleaners
Santa Monica, California

Here is more info I would love to talk about CO2 cleaning
What is the CO2 Cleaning Process?
The CO2 Cleaning Process is a carbon dioxide-based garment cleaning process that has been developed for use by commercial and retail dry cleaners. Carbon dioxide is a non-flammable, non-toxic, naturally occurring gas that, when subjected to pressure, becomes a liquid and is a very effective solvent. Since the solvent is recognized as being environmentally friendly, it is not subject to any environmental regulations or liability potential from soil or groundwater contamination. CO2 CLEANING PROCESS FACT SHEET
What is the Carbon Dioxide Cleaning Process?
How does the cleaning performance compare with Perc? How difficult is the process to operate and learn?Are there certain fabrics that cannot be run in the CO2 Cleaning process?Is wrinkling a problem with the CO2 Cleaning process?

Smokedaddy and Fido44: The art of rational debate is fading from public consciousness. Suggestion: Avoid argumentum ad hominem. These "attacks" are an admission of intellectual bankruptcy. Also, slurs directed at "the other side of the debate" are usually nonproductive. Try to keep attention centered on the objective problem itself.

[ctccoshawa]

I respected your presentation of the facts about dry cleaning. I was a perc cleaner for years and switched to 100% wet cleaning 6 years ago. I am in Ontario, Canada. I must say and feel so sorry for the spokeswoman from (NCA) Neighborhood Cleaners Assoc. She obviously has not inquired deep enough into wet cleaning. We clean absolutely everything in water and our HUGE customer base says the feel and smell is so superior to dry cleaning that they can't wait to get their items back to us should they have ever needed to have them cleaned elsewhere while travelling. Our detergents are citrus based and we use a banana oil degreasing agent. The labour and utility costs are substantially less than when we were a dry cleaner. The NCA spokeswomen is obviously not looking for a wet cleaning alternative, only a laundry alternative and there is a significant difference. I believe the issue is far more political. It is like finding a replacement for gasoline. Sure it is possible but so many other businesses will die along the way. The same thing will happen to all the subsidary businesses to the dry cleaning industry. The fix and cure is and has been here since the beginning of time. To all of the CBS audience, I urge you to find a 100% professional wet cleaner! To all existing PERC users, I urge you to heed the warnings of the well presented facts on todays CBS early morning show and explore Professional Wet Cleaning!

[fido44-2009]

Anyone can open and operate a CO2 cleaner. Hangers had one version, there are plenty of other CO2 machines available for purchase. Hanger's used ONLY CO2, no backups. They were founded on CO2. Sure, anything can give you cancer, but does that mean we shouldn't strive for non-toxic alternatives for everything we can? Finally, anyone can pull up Consumer Reports + CO2 dry cleaning, and find the results. But the comments ring true in many ways about the media and such.

RE: Jean's question, "Where do the impurities "removed" by CO2 & wetcleaning go?" C02, GreenEarth, DF2000,Stoddard solvent, are unregulated. Those impurities are disposed of in local landfills.

Perchloroethylene, as a regulated solvent, is safely disposed of employing the services of a certified waste handling management company approved of by the EPA.

Dry cleaning solvents, including perchloroethylene, pose miniscule risk when used in an environmentally responsible manner. Compiled %u201Cgreen%u201D dry cleaning research endorses liquid CO2 and wet cleaning. Research indicates liquid CO2 is NOT the best solvent- in fact, %u201CHangars%u201D franchises use wet-cleaning as back-up because of inability to remove stains effectively with CO2 however safe or stable it may be. And CO2 cleaning technology is proprietary to operating a Hangers franchise. There is questionable safety regarding GreenEarth technology siloxanewhich are combined organic/inorganic compounds.We keep hearing that yesterday's conventional wisdom is now %u201Cfalse%u201D, not because scientific investigation doesn't work; but because wisdom becomes conventional prematurely. The problem is a psychological, financial or prestige investment of researchers in their hypotheses and their earlier findings. This creates a bias of entrenched orthodoxies which are difficult to overturn. Another is the ill informed,sensationalist field of journalism, which gets hyper-excited over single studies. But we should look further. In fact,there is not a single thing in the world that cannot give you cancer.Health and science reporters,the FDA, the EPA need to have a better understanding of epistemological tangles and underpinnings. There isn%u2019t enough data available to make intelligent determinations on what really poses as cancer risk to humans other than life itself.

[conniejean4]

Sorry about that it is "Federal" being a drycleaner the perc has gone to my head and I cannot spell.

[conniejean4]

Looks life FIDO44 needs to do his research. Perc is recycled in the dry-cleaning system through filtration & distribution which remove the impurities from the dry cleaning process i.e. soil, fugitive dyes, etc. The spent filter cartridges and the still residue which contain small amounts of PERC are placed in sealed containers, like the one shown in the piece labled "Hazardous waste" and disposed of through licensed hazardous waste recyclers as mandated by Feral regulations. They do not go into landfills. Where do the impurities "removed" by CO2 & wetcleaning go?

[fido44-2009]

Another scary thought is, "where does all the used PERC go?" Into barrels, and then into landfills? Liquid CO2 and wet cleaning are the way of the future. The CO2 is recaptured, not created. No CO2 is being added to the system, and in fact is, at least temporarily, being removed. CO2 cleaners don't bake your clothes to death to remove the PERC. No heat is used. Gentler on fabrics, on the environment, and on people. Dry cleaning customers, do the research, and draw your own conclusions.

[smokedaddy2]

We clean wools, silks and structured garments all day long in water and liquid CO2...no problems. True "wet cleaning" does not shrink these types of fibers but inexperienced cleaners do.

[jamierf1]

As a consumer, this type of warning is great. I had heard about the dangers of perc many years ago. I am lucky that a cleaner near me in Excelsior, MN, called the Dry Cleaning Station uses a product that is not environmentally bad and poses no health risks. There is no smell at all and they are a cleaner I will stick with (for life!).

[bergit_olsen]

TRUE ORGANIC is GREAT! Blindly buying organically is VERY FOOLHARDY. All living organisms are organic. So is gasoline. So is dry-cleaning fluid, which is now advertised as "organic" by unscrupulous merchants capitalizing on the public perception that "organic" equals "safe." It doesn't mean healthy or fair. Take, for example, hydrocarbon "organic dry cleaning". DF-2000, is as organic as gasoline and every major dry-cleaning fluid since the creation of the industry. It is made by Exxon-Mobil, the "stewards of the environment" who dumped 30 million gallons of crude oil%u2014the precursor to gasoline and, yes, DF-2000%u2014onto the shoreline of Alaska in 1989 and are still in court today over the fine. How "DF-2000" could be construed as "organic" in the "all-natural" sense is beyond us all! Perc is organic, too. But here is the clincher: Wet Cleaning can cause severe shrinkage, color removal, may not remove but %u201Cset stains%u201D, promotes increased water consumption, and CANNOT SUCCESSFULLY BE USED on wools, satins, gabardines or highly-structured garments. Organic solvents don't bind to fibers the way water does and therefore don't wrinkle or ruin delicate fabrics. For now, there TRULY AREN%u2019T ANY BETTER ALTERNATIVES THAN THE TECHNIQUES USED TODAY, USING THE FINEST SOLVENT(PERC)IN THE SAFEST MANNER POSSIBLE.