Comments on: CBS Poll: Most Support Immigration Reform

Key Provisions Of Reform Bill Receive Wide Support From Both Republicans And Democrats

[Dennis Clifford]

I keep hearing we can't deport 12 million people. My only question is why can't we? Not all at once, Not all today,but every time we arrest one, every time one is stopped for a traffic offense, or a crime. We don"t have to do it all today. Today lets start with a 1,000 that we already have in jail for crimes. Tomorrows not so go as day say 850, day after tomorrows great 1275 and so on. Eventually, some of them are going to come to the realization that we are serious and will go home without being deported.I do not believe that the United States of America is unable to deport 12 million criminals. We may even need to bring the army back from to Presidents War in Iraq and have them help patrol the border to stop future criminals from returning. We have in the past removed and deported 3 million illegal immigrants. We now just need to do that 4 times. I find it unacceptable to say we cant enforce our laws except on legal citizens.

[makeafence]

The headline is misleading. It says most support immigration reform and that a majority support key provisions in the bill. That is different from actually supporting the bill, which is a $2.5 trillion do-nothing debacle. The survey never asks the direct question that Rasmussen asks: "Do you favor or oppose the bill?" Only 26% favor. 48% oppose. 26% not sure. Interestingly enough, look what's buried at the end of the article: "Sixty-nine percent think that illegal immigrants should be prosecuted and deported for simply being in the U.S. illegally; just one in four think they should not be. Majorities of both Democrats and Republicans share this view. "

Re: paying taxes ... illegals do pay some taxes, but they also consume public services. The net economic loss (taxes paid minus services consumed) is $20k/illegal household/year.

[equinek9]

I am still waiting for a few explanations....First, how do people assume that people who work here illegally don't pay taxes? If these people receive a check, they will have Federal, Social Security and Medicare withheld. If you are in a state that has personal income tax, this is withheld as well. Also, for those people that are working illegally, what happens to the money they pay in??? They can't claim a refund, can they? Where does the money go that is paid into Social Security and Medicare? Is it returned to them? No, I believe it must just "disappear into thin air". If that is just $1 per illegal person, $12 mil. is a big chunk of $$!!

[tucano2]

None of us can actually know where such a "poll" was taken but the results seem consistent with numbers obtained from a bottle of whiskey at the editor's desk. The real poll numbers secured by the actually independent rasmussen group clearly show 52 percent will not vote for a candidate who is soft on Illegal Aliens, 56 percent of Americans want only that current laws be enforced, 76 percent think government effort to eforce immigration laws on the books has been and continues to be completely inadequate, 51 percent want effective fencing built on our southern border from the Gulf to the Pacific, 64 percent want Illegals deported "now", and 79 percent of actual Americans support (1) increased and effective border enforcement, (2) hitting employers of Illegal Aliens with both heavy fines AND hard jail time, (3) more and far better cooperation between local police and ICE.
27 percent favor granting Amnesty (that is what it is), and 28 percent give Mr. Bush an "ok" approval rating.
So how is it that an impartial poll comes out with these results while your cbs "poll" simply reflects what your corporate owners demand you say?

[makeafence]

Using the wikipedia link provided by SouthMsDixon, I learned some interesting information as follows:

"Demographer Jeff Passell at the Pew Hispanic Center says illegal immigrants are surprisingly forthcoming when interviewed anonymously."

'Contrary to popular belief, Mexico is among the group of richer nations in the world'

'Of Mexican immigrants surveyed who had been in the United States for two years, only 5 percent said they were unemployed before venturing north of the border'

That link is: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Illegal_imm

igration_to_the_United_States
Posted by nottellin1 at 04:23 PM : May 26, 2007

Hah! Wikipedia! Give me a break! They only survey people wearing hoods or "Tailgunner Joe" t-shirts. Why just the other day I didn't actually see something that was mentioned in Wikipedia, so it obviously doesn't happen anywhere. Besides, this country was built on immigration, so ILLEGAL immigration must be encouraged. And, did I mention that I _feel_ you can't deport 12 million people so the only other option is to give them amnesty. The word "illegal" in the above link. It is racist! Racist, I tell you! Racist! ;)

[nottellin1]

Using the wikipedia link provided by SouthMsDixon, I learned some interesting information as follows:

"Demographer Jeff Passell at the Pew Hispanic Center says illegal immigrants are surprisingly forthcoming when interviewed anonymously."

'Contrary to popular belief, Mexico is among the group of richer nations in the world'

'Of Mexican immigrants surveyed who had been in the United States for two years, only 5 percent said they were unemployed before venturing north of the border'

That link is: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Illegal_imm
igration_to_the_United_States

[lestb35]

You have to wonder how complicit the Mexican govt. is in promoting criminals to enter the US kind of like Castro emptying the prisons and sending them to America. Let's face it if they become American citizens they're no longer Mexico's problem. I don't buy one bit of the rhetoric coming out of Wa. They would sell the entire country off for $ or votes. They are treasonous SOBs and should be sent to prison.

[klingon69]

Sorry, should've read Cheech and Chongs Nice Dreams

[klingon69]

Police in Mission Texas arrested Raymundo Flores , an illegal immigrant from Mexico, for selling marijuana. nHis clientel were 3rd, 4th & 5th graders. He used an icecream truck to pedal his wares. He had pictures of icecream treats on the vehicle but pot leaves hanging inside.
I guess he watched Cheech & Changs Nice Dreams.

Is this the kind of person we want to give amnesty to? Will he get amnesty for this offense too?

[jdweymouth]

By the way, the argument you're making for amnesty is so that a group of people
(not us) can do the dirty work. You're essentially advocating letting CRIMINALS become citizens so that they can do 2nd class citizen type work-at type of slave class. That, among other things, is what this bill would accomplish; is that what you want? A new slave class?

[makeafence]

I applaud the idealism and integrity of those who want a complete, warts and all, view of history. After muddling forward, we have advanced to a time where it is hoped the rule of law at least tries to stand up to anarchy. With no moral indignation whatsoever, if the Southwestern part of the U.S. was part of Mexico, no one would want to live there either. Mexico as it is today has an enormous amount of resources but because of their incompetent ruling class, it relies on remittances from illegals for social stability. I hang this on incompetence rather than corruption because "corrupt government" is pretty much redundant everywhere.

[jdweymouth]

Re: "From the very beginning of our history we've had immigrants do work that citizens would not"

Of course-every nation is like that. In Mexico, it's the native population that fills the category of 2nd class citizen, but I was referring to the period between the 20s and the 60s-when America was self-sufficient; especially during WW2.

Re: "You want to kick grandma and grandpa off social security to pick lettuce?"

I don't know what all this "pick lettuce" cr-p is. Farmers still do that-American farmers. But if you mean "working class labor", I say this: of course not. How about we not rely on the government to give us everything from a retirement fund to medical care-let's we ourselves be self-sufficient. One way we could do that is not spend every penny we make in a year. But anyhow, how about we leave the type of labor in question to those who are here legally-we don't need to grant amnesty to millions of illegals just to fill job. I don't see why you think so.

Re: "I do see someone performing work to feed me as being different than someone stealing from me."

I've already dispelled the myth that illegals are the farmers. But let's cover this, if they come here ILLEGALLY, then they've commited a crime; that makes them criminals. I don't see how you can't see this-if they've commited a crime, then they've commited a crime. A crime is a crime, and you don't excuse it simply because it is easier.

[bhappy2-2]

We need to stop these illegal people from entering in the first place. We, as citizens, need to do whatever it takes to protect our country. If it means taking up arms and gaurding our border ourselves then that is what we need to do. These people are taking over Amreica and WE are allowing it to happen. It's time to Take America Back from these illegal scum. It has become all too evident our illustrious "leaders" don't give a rosy red rats @ss what happens to America. We, as citizens, MUST care and MUST protect our country from such invasive actions by people who enter ILLEGALLY with their only intent being to FORCE AMERICA to do their bidding. They do not care about America, any more than our own "Leaders" care.

[realpatriot1]

jdweymouth,

Your point being?

[jdweymouth]

In regard to the Mexican War, their military was more powerful, and larger than ours because they had the support of a major European power: France. At every battle, our force was signifcantly smaller compared to theirs. Their force always outnumered ours, but we never lost a battle. Curious. But at any rate, we weren't the big bullies picking on poor innocent Mexico: they were signifcantly more powerful than us.

[realpatriot1]

jdweymouth,

From the very beginning of our history we've had immigrants do work that citizens would not. You want to kick grandma and grandpa off social security to pick lettuce? We ended welfare as we know it already, so there aren't too many folks that you can force into the fields just so you can deny an alien a job.

I do see someone performing work to feed me as being different than someone stealing from me.

Regarding the Brooklyn Bridge quip, you said we didn't steal the Southwest from Mexico because after we went to war for their land we offered to pay for it. My point was, just like with native Americans, we essentially held a gun to their heads and offered them a cheap price and said take it. I'm not proposing giving the Southwest back, just a little honesty about our role in history and that we get off our high horse of moral indignation.

[lostcountry1]

there are many problems in america,ending the irac re-election war, healthcare costs,and especially illegal immigration.if we allow our government to submit to a passive takeover by another country, what will we become then? the reason mexicans dont have a say in running their country is because they don't have a second ammendment. thats why they had to fight on the fifth of may with pitchforks, machetties and rocks.maybe the answer is another revolution in mexico?

[jdweymouth]

Re: "We paid for the Brooklyn bridge too."

I beg your pardon? What do you mean by that? Do you concede that the Mexican government has no viable claim to the southwestern United States? Perhaps the biggest question is this: would you support such a claim?

Re: "We have a law that's unenforceable,we're trying to male it enforceable and practical. There's a $5,000 penalty that these people who've been here contributing to society have to pay, so don't say that we're rewarding illegality because that's not so. What we're rewarding is hard work that Americans don't want to do but benefit from."

We cannot possibly punish all those guilty of theft, burglary, and home invasion; does that mean we grant them amnesty? It's the exact same principle with illegal immigration.

You say they do the jobs Americans don't want to do; in other words, they're a sub-social working class that will serve the rich?

I don't care what jobs they do; those jobs (housekeeping, construction, factory workers, ect) were done by Americans long before without the need of illegal immigrants. The problem is the Americans living off welfare, or social security. Here's the deal; abolish both, and force the drone of the American people to do work so that there is no excuse for illegal immigration. Which rings me to my last point: you say they've contributed to society. The first thing they did upon coming here is break the law (hence the term "illegal immigrant"); would you call that "contribution to society"?

[lostcountry1]

great points makeafence, i am new to this blogging thing but find it very interesting to see what's being said.i just read about the mexican news people telling mexicans how dissapointed they are with our immigration bill. it says they expected more money to come home than this would allow. in all reality are'nt we supporting a totally corrupt government here? they say they need our money for their families, but won't their government just take it from them as soon as they find out they have it?

[makeafence]

The $5K fine is ridiculous in a number of ways. It only comes into account if someone applies for citizenship. Illegals get legal status right away and can immediately receive social services. Also, even if someone does pay the $5K, they still burn a net of $20K/household/year in benefits over what they pay in taxes, so that seems like a pretty good "investment" rather than a fine. But the reality of the matter is why would anyone bother registering for a probationary visa in the first place if they are already getting the benefits fraudulently. Finally, without securing the border (and this bill does not secure the border), no matter what is done the next batch of illegals will be wanting another amnesty in a few years. This bill spends a lot of money and adds a lot of bureaucracy, but it solves nothing.